Electrify America is enraging EV owners

[hydbob]

Totally agree and also limit charging to 80% in peak charging periods. Tesla Superchargers do that too and that works really well. No reason that EA should not be doing that stuff.

So you force a range limited bolt to 80% only so they can't make their next destination? Seems harsh

 

[DBV]

So you force a range limited bolt to 80% only so they can't make their next destination? Seems harsh

Nah - not harsh at all. We want to improve charging - right, when there are already waits at CCS chargers, so copy what Tesla does. No one should be charging to 90% or 100% at peak charging times. Works for Tesla really well and should be copied.

Question should be if a Bolt or other EV’s can only can travel a little ways on a charge, maybe they should not be traveling at all and be only used in your home location.

Also - eliminate all free charging and bet that opens up more chargers too.

 

[Knucklehead]

Nah - not harsh at all. We want to improve charging - right, when there are already waits at CCS chargers, so copy what Tesla does. No one should be charging to 90% or 100% at peak charging times. Works for Tesla really well and should be copied.

Question should be if a Bolt or other EV’s can only can travel a little ways on a charge, maybe they should not be traveling at all and be only used in your home location.

Also - eliminate all free charging and bet that opens up more chargers too.

There was one time on a trip when I really, really needed a full charge. So what would I have done if the charger wouldn't let me do it? Oh well, so sorry, you can't complete the trip you have planned?

If this happens, it will just be another reason why public charging sucks.

 

[Sandvinsd]

I think increasing the price stepwise after 80% is good solution. The Bolt owners can still charge, but will pay for it. The closer you get to 100%, the more it costs - mainly because of the time you are tying up the station at low charging speeds. That will also cause consumers to demand a car that has a longer range than 250 miles. That range is just not workable for long trips. I would agree that a Bolt (and others at that range) should only travel locally. If you want to travel long distance, you can but it should be expensive. We have a Leaf. It is only used locally and does very well with that range. I bought the Lucid so I have a car for trips.

 

[st50maint]

Tesla will set your charge limit to 80% at high usage stations.
But, you can easily set it back to any percentage you need up to 100%.

 

[DBV]

There are many places where that Bolt won’t be able to get to another station along the trip. That’s the point.

Heck, there are spots in Wyoming and Montana where my Lucid can’t make it between chargers in winter. Even when charging to 100%. A Bolt would stand no chance.

It’s a chicken and egg situation. We need far more chargers and far more affordable cars with better range before we can ask the public to not charge to 100%.

In the meantime, all we can do is encourage folks to be considerate and only charge that high when it’s absolutely necessary. And yes, I’d be fine with higher prices for charging in those situations.

And idle fees should be at least $1 per minute.

(Tesla does not limit you to 80%, by the way. It just sets your car to 80%. You can easily override it.)

When I have charged my Tesla in Canada it does limit you to 80% at peak times. Not sure how you would override it. Get rid of free charging will stop a lot of these issues. Makes no sense that mfg’s even do that.

 

[joec]

When I have charged my Tesla in Canada it does limit you to 80% at peak times. Not sure how you would override it. Get rid of free charging will stop a lot of these issues. Makes no sense that mfg’s even do that.

I was always able to override it by setting my charge limit on the car back to 85 or whatever. Maybe it’s different in Canada?

In any case, we are in complete agreement about ending free charging. Looks like Lucid and Hyundai already have. More will soon, I’m sure. No one is going to be giving away free Tesla Supercharging time, that’s for sure.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

Nah - not harsh at all. We want to improve charging - right, when there are already waits at CCS chargers, so copy what Tesla does. No one should be charging to 90% or 100% at peak charging times. Works for Tesla really well and should be copied.

Question should be if a Bolt or other EV’s can only can travel a little ways on a charge, maybe they should not be traveling at all and be only used in your home location.

Also - eliminate all free charging and bet that opens up more chargers too.

While conceptually that makes sense, that’s like saying trucks should only be driven off road or for contractor hauling, etc. If someone in a Bolt at 10% pulls up to EA and the only free charger is a 350kw it’s kind of a dick move to begrudge them the right to charge their EV just because it doesn’t charge fast.

I 100% agree with eliminating free charging though. I’m not a fan of congestion pricing to charge over 80% though until there’s actually a good enough charging infrastructure so that drivers don’t have to worry about charging above 80% to make it to their destination or next charger. Had I not charged to 96% on my recent road trip to start out I would have actually been stranded as I made it to my first charging stop at 11% SOC.

 

[dsherris]

Today at the EA in Rocklin CA people were FURIOUS. out of about 10 stations 2 or 3 were working. A woman pulled up on a beautiful Mercedes, tried a few and screamed "I hate my car.". I tried to explain it wasn't her car it was EA. Another lucid was there, owner on the phone trying to sell his car back to lucid because so impossible to charge, and yes Bob, like me 3 years of free juice means "I will not pay for it! This is just unacceptable." VW owns E A and it feels like they are single handedly trying to keep ICS cars in sales. Most of the expensive EVs come with some EA fast charging (no other chargers match the speed, promised anyway). EV owners are enraged, flipping off EA chargers. LUCID YOU HAVE A PR PROBLEM WITH YOU PARTNERSHIP WITH ELECTRIFY AMERIKA! at least I have solar but not so ok for people paying PGE through the nose. Wake up lucid (and Mercedes et al). Electrify America is 90% unreliable and there is not an alternate fuel service on every corner. In California charging is very difficult to almost impossible. Not good at all for the industry.. Crippling infact

When I find a EA station not working, I call EA phone number listed on station. They promptly get it working.

 

[menodude]

Today at the EA in Rocklin CA people were FURIOUS. out of about 10 stations 2 or 3 were working. A woman pulled up on a beautiful Mercedes, tried a few and screamed "I hate my car.". I tried to explain it wasn't her car it was EA. Another lucid was there, owner on the phone trying to sell his car back to lucid because so impossible to charge, and yes Bob, like me 3 years of free juice means "I will not pay for it! This is just unacceptable." VW owns E A and it feels like they are single handedly trying to keep ICS cars in sales. Most of the expensive EVs come with some EA fast charging (no other chargers match the speed, promised anyway). EV owners are enraged, flipping off EA chargers. LUCID YOU HAVE A PR PROBLEM WITH YOU PARTNERSHIP WITH ELECTRIFY AMERIKA! at least I have solar but not so ok for people paying PGE through the nose. Wake up lucid (and Mercedes et al). Electrify America is 90% unreliable and there is not an alternate fuel service on every corner. In California charging is very difficult to almost impossible. Not good at all for the industry.. Crippling infact

Agree. I quit taking my lucid on long distance drives. Pathetic charging options. Unfortunately ended up buying another Tesla for distance just for the charging convenience

 

[EXOTIC2]

When I find a EA station not working, I call EA phone number listed on station. They promptly get it working.

You must spend all day on the phone

 

[borski]

Nah - not harsh at all. We want to improve charging - right, when there are already waits at CCS chargers, so copy what Tesla does. No one should be charging to 90% or 100% at peak charging times. Works for Tesla really well and should be copied.

Tesla lets you override it, because sometimes you *need* to charge to 90 or 100. I have done this, because the model 3 had a relatively short range, and I needed to make it where I was going.

From their supercharger support page: “To reduce congestion at high-use Superchargers, your vehicle’s charge limit may be automatically adjusted to 80%. You can manually increase the charge limit after plugging in by using the vehicle touchscreen or Tesla app.”

Question should be if a Bolt or other EV’s can only can travel a little ways on a charge, maybe they should not be traveling at all and be only used in your home location.

That’s absurd. Absolutely absurd. Someone not being wealthy enough to buy a super long range car should not preclude them from charging at a public utility.

Also - eliminate all free charging and bet that opens up more chargers too.

Agreed.

 

[Mmauer]

Today at the EA in Rocklin CA people were FURIOUS. out of about 10 stations 2 or 3 were working. A woman pulled up on a beautiful Mercedes, tried a few and screamed "I hate my car.". I tried to explain it wasn't her car it was EA. Another lucid was there, owner on the phone trying to sell his car back to lucid because so impossible to charge, and yes Bob, like me 3 years of free juice means "I will not pay for it! This is just unacceptable." VW owns E A and it feels like they are single handedly trying to keep ICS cars in sales. Most of the expensive EVs come with some EA fast charging (no other chargers match the speed, promised anyway). EV owners are enraged, flipping off EA chargers. LUCID YOU HAVE A PR PROBLEM WITH YOU PARTNERSHIP WITH ELECTRIFY AMERIKA! at least I have solar but not so ok for people paying PGE through the nose. Wake up lucid (and Mercedes et al). Electrify America is 90% unreliable and there is not an alternate fuel service on every corner. In California charging is very difficult to almost impossible. Not good at all for the industry.. Crippling infact

I’ve had my Lucid since May. I’ve noticed that the 2 charging stations near my house always have one charger down. The number of vehicles using the EA stations have also increased dramatically. I never had an issue going to charge my Lucid. It is now a challenge finding a working charger without having to wait behind one or two other EVs waiting before me. The closest EA station to where I live is only
1/2 miles away. Every time I drive by, every charging station is being used unless it’s broken. I had to get my Lucid charged at 1:30 AM on a Sunday because of this. Will be moving into a house in 4 months. The first thing I’ll be doing is to get a charger installed in the garage so that I don’t have to put up with the crap.

 

[Adnillien]

The first thing I’ll be doing is to get a charger installed in the garage so that I don’t have to put up with the crap.

This will make your EV experience much much better. No hassle no crap, takes 10 seconds at the most to plug in.

 

[Ampere]

Two items:
1. I know the precise range of my Lucid, When I reach my destination in Rockford, IL I need to charge to 90 percent to get home with 20 percent left. On Christmas the weather was so adverse I still had to stop for a second charge 3/4 of the way home. At that charger I only charged to 53 percent and the darn 350 charger still throttled me to 50-70 kw. At least it worked.

2. One solution that EA (and most of us overlook) is that if EA delivered the output (charging speed) it advertises on its chargers, two to three times more cars could charge at a single charger during a fixed period of time. If my Lucid (and a few other 700-900 volt brands) could actually charge at 150 or, better yet, 350, they'd be there and gone in 10-20 minutes, not 40-50 minutes, since EA throttles them to 50-100. I don't begrudge a Bolt for being at the 350 charger if that's the only one available when it pulled in. Anyway, when I use the same charger after the Bolt pulls out, I don't charge much faster in my Lucid Touring than the Bolt did.

At some point the government must step in to regulate what charging companies promise. States test the purity and octane of gasoline, so when you pay for premium, you get the promised 93 octane. They also test the accuracy of the pump, so when you pay for one gallon you receive precisely one gallon. What can't this be applied to EV chargers? It is not rocket science.

Finally, when my free charging expires, I have no objection to paying for guaranteed speed. If I want 350kw then I would pay 10 percent more than 150, or whatever the standards become down the road. . .

 

[DBV]

Tesla lets you override it, because sometimes you *need* to charge to 90 or 100. I have done this, because the model 3 had a relatively short range, and I needed to make it where I was going.

From their supercharger support page: “To reduce congestion at high-use Superchargers, your vehicle’s charge limit may be automatically adjusted to 80%. You can manually increase the charge limit after plugging in by using the vehicle touchscreen or Tesla app.”


That’s absurd. Absolutely absurd. Someone not being wealthy enough to buy a super long range car should not preclude them from charging at a public utility.


Agreed.

Did not mean to apply that they should not (although no way would I), but only be limited to 80% in peak charging periods. You have to do something make this better if more public will adopt. Otherwise EV’s will just fail.

There is so much negative attention to CCS charging lately from the media/press that I think it is already really hurting, which is probably why hybrid sales are very strong. Amazing to me at Christmas gatherings I have attended, how many people are so negative about EV’s. Yet, they have never owned one or driven one.

 

[DeaneG]

...At some point the government must step in to regulate what charging companies promise. States test the purity and octane of gasoline, so when you pay for premium, you get the promised 93 octane. They also test the accuracy of the pump, so when you pay for one gallon you receive precisely one gallon. What can't this be applied to EV chargers? It is not rocket science....

Federal NEVI funding does require that each charging station is capable of its rated output. If not, it is considered down and the operator subject to penalties. However, this does not apply to current EA installations.

 

[MorganB]

2. One solution that EA (and most of us overlook) is that if EA delivered the output (charging speed) it advertises on its chargers, two to three times more cars could charge at a single charger during a fixed period of time. If my Lucid (and a few other 700-900 volt brands) could actually charge at 150 or, better yet, 350, they'd be there and gone in 10-20 minutes, not 40-50 minutes, since EA throttles them to 50-100. I don't begrudge a Bolt for being at the 350 charger if that's the only one available when it pulled in. Anyway, when I use the same charger after the Bolt pulls out, I don't charge much faster in my Lucid Touring than the Bolt did.

the throttling is either due to load balancing between two cars or equipment with issues. They don’t just throttle because they can. Of course they are horribly slow to repair throttled chargers which is on EA.

 

[Knucklehead]

Two items:
1. I know the precise range of my Lucid, When I reach my destination in Rockford, IL I need to charge to 90 percent to get home with 20 percent left. On Christmas the weather was so adverse I still had to stop for a second charge 3/4 of the way home. At that charger I only charged to 53 percent and the darn 350 charger still throttled me to 50-70 kw. At least it worked.

2. One solution that EA (and most of us overlook) is that if EA delivered the output (charging speed) it advertises on its chargers, two to three times more cars could charge at a single charger during a fixed period of time. If my Lucid (and a few other 700-900 volt brands) could actually charge at 150 or, better yet, 350, they'd be there and gone in 10-20 minutes, not 40-50 minutes, since EA throttles them to 50-100. I don't begrudge a Bolt for being at the 350 charger if that's the only one available when it pulled in. Anyway, when I use the same charger after the Bolt pulls out, I don't charge much faster in my Lucid Touring than the Bolt did.

At some point the government must step in to regulate what charging companies promise. States test the purity and octane of gasoline, so when you pay for premium, you get the promised 93 octane. They also test the accuracy of the pump, so when you pay for one gallon you receive precisely one gallon. What can't this be applied to EV chargers? It is not rocket science.

Finally, when my free charging expires, I have no objection to paying for guaranteed speed. If I want 350kw then I would pay 10 percent more than 150, or whatever the standards become down the road. . .

The charging speed is also limited by the car. The Lucid can only accept 300 kW up around 15-20% SoC. After the SoC exceeds around 50%, the car limits the speed even on a 150 kW charger.

 

[joec]

Two items:
1. I know the precise range of my Lucid, When I reach my destination in Rockford, IL I need to charge to 90 percent to get home with 20 percent left. On Christmas the weather was so adverse I still had to stop for a second charge 3/4 of the way home. At that charger I only charged to 53 percent and the darn 350 charger still throttled me to 50-70 kw. At least it worked.

2. One solution that EA (and most of us overlook) is that if EA delivered the output (charging speed) it advertises on its chargers, two to three times more cars could charge at a single charger during a fixed period of time. If my Lucid (and a few other 700-900 volt brands) could actually charge at 150 or, better yet, 350, they'd be there and gone in 10-20 minutes, not 40-50 minutes, since EA throttles them to 50-100. I don't begrudge a Bolt for being at the 350 charger if that's the only one available when it pulled in. Anyway, when I use the same charger after the Bolt pulls out, I don't charge much faster in my Lucid Touring than the Bolt did.

At some point the government must step in to regulate what charging companies promise. States test the purity and octane of gasoline, so when you pay for premium, you get the promised 93 octane. They also test the accuracy of the pump, so when you pay for one gallon you receive precisely one gallon. What can't this be applied to EV chargers? It is not rocket science.

Finally, when my free charging expires, I have no objection to paying for guaranteed speed. If I want 350kw then I would pay 10 percent more than 150, or whatever the standards become down the road. . .

Again, I’d suggest reading up on how charging speeds actually work.

Your car will never get 350kw speeds. That’s not EA’s fault.