DreamDrive Megathread

[Bunnylebowski]

I thought that 9-3 was considered superior now? Anyways, more like resting your hand on the 7 position works.

I read Ben Collins book and I thought he said 10-2 but maybe I’m misremembering. I’ll try 7 though! I do like the HA, it’s pretty smooth and graceful, just could do with less warnings telling me to do what I’m already doing.

 

[HariK]

GM has an interesting business model for their SmartCruise. $2500 upfront and $25 monthly subscription. In future, they could increase the subscription price and probably convince a lot of people to buy. I think their Chevy Equinox and Blazer will appeal to the budget conscious folks. I wonder if Lucid did the same with DDP and SSP as a package with say $5k upfront how the reaction would be.

 

[Gandalf]

The problem for me isn’t in resting my hand on the wheel. I also have to apply just enough torque to let it know I care but not so much that it deactivates dream drive when going around a curve. It’s just really inconvenient currently. I hope we get a better mechanism later.

To echo what others have said here- on long stretches, HA mostly worked fine, and as long as I kept my hand(s) on the bottom of the wheel in the 5/7 positions. But I did mention in another thread that HA will disengage on curvy stretches (often midway through a curve that HA initiated just fine), and therefore you REALLY need to keep your attention focused to complete the curve. It's pretty disconcerting, but you eventually get used to preparing (and then taking over) on curvy stretches- even on divided highways.

 

[maazymaaz]

does adaptive cruise control work in stop and go traffic?

 

[borski]

does adaptive cruise control work in stop and go traffic?

Yes.

 

[momoskier]

DreamDrive will include Highway Assist and Traffic Jam Assist. Highway Assist is lane centering, adaptive cruise control, steering, on highways (GPS-controlled). Off highways, Adaptive Cruise Control is available, but you are responsible for steering. None of this is hands free, and you will be warned if your hands are not on the wheel for six seconds or longer (sometimes it may take a few extra seconds, but six seconds is the intent). If you continue to not put your hands on the wheel, the system will assume you are asleep or dying, and come to a slow in-lane stop, open the doors, and turn on the flashers, in hopes that someone will help you. Please note: in-lane stops are illegal in many places, and if you are not in dire danger, you may be ticketed or prosecuted for doing so. So, in brief: with Highway Assist, you are expected to maintain control of the vehicle at all times, and take over if necessary.

DD Pro includes additional hardware (LiDAR) built into the car, and thus is not a software-only option. The first announced feature of DD Pro is Highway Pilot which will be true handsfree driving on highways. It does not exist yet and no announcements have been made as to a release date yet. Additionally, the expectation is that over time Lucid may release city driving assistance as well, but no announcement has been made about that. The additional cameras, sensors, and computing power do enable things like greater granularity through LiDAR and an increased experience with Highway Assist as a result, but none have been released yet; largely, we assume, because no cars without LiDAR have been produced yet. It remains to be seen precisely how DD Pro highway assist features will differ, but the media release does specify “For vehicles equipped with DreamDrive Pro, further functions for Highway Assist are already in development.”

You can find more information here: https://www.lucidmotors.com/media-room/dreamdrive-advanced-driver-assistance-platform

DreamDrive will include Highway Assist and Traffic Jam Assist. Highway Assist is lane centering, adaptive cruise control, steering, on highways (GPS-controlled). Off highways, Adaptive Cruise Control is available, but you are responsible for steering. None of this is hands free, and you will be warned if your hands are not on the wheel for six seconds or longer (sometimes it may take a few extra seconds, but six seconds is the intent). If you continue to not put your hands on the wheel, the system will assume you are asleep or dying, and come to a slow in-lane stop, open the doors, and turn on the flashers, in hopes that someone will help you. Please note: in-lane stops are illegal in many places, and if you are not in dire danger, you may be ticketed or prosecuted for doing so. So, in brief: with Highway Assist, you are expected to maintain control of the vehicle at all times, and take over if necessary.

DD Pro includes additional hardware (LiDAR) built into the car, and thus is not a software-only option. The first announced feature of DD Pro is Highway Pilot which will be true handsfree driving on highways. It does not exist yet and no announcements have been made as to a release date yet. Additionally, the expectation is that over time Lucid may release city driving assistance as well, but no announcement has been made about that. The additional cameras, sensors, and computing power do enable things like greater granularity through LiDAR and an increased experience with Highway Assist as a result, but none have been released yet; largely, we assume, because no cars without LiDAR have been produced yet. It remains to be seen precisely how DD Pro highway assist features will differ, but the media release does specify “For vehicles equipped with DreamDrive Pro, further functions for Highway Assist are already in development.”

You can find more information here: https://www.lucidmotors.com/media-room/dreamdrive-advanced-driver-assistance-platform

I don’t recollect being offered an option to purchase dreamdrive pro with the AGT purchase, is it standard with the GT or something that will be addressed later with an OTA update?

 

[joec]

I don’t recollect being offered an option to purchase dreamdrive pro with the AGT purchase, is it standard with the GT or something that will be addressed later with an OTA update?

All AGTs come with Dream Drive Pro as standard. They are basically fully loaded Airs, with every available option included in the base price.

Only Touring and Pure customers need to pay extra for Dream Drive Pro.

 

[getafix]

I think the point of it is to perfect the service at least to a major city, and keep it driverless, then they'll expand outwards. For example, Phoenix doesn't have a lot of weather 'problems' like other states and cities with snow, or hail storms, etc...
Keeping it simple and expanding from there.
There was an announcement last year that they're going to NYC next, but I haven't seen any source that says that they are 'digitally mapped' and not actually navigating traffic or routing with their sensors. In fact, they themselves have said that where maps like Google Maps fail, they can navigate it effortlessly because of their 'mapping technology' which doesn't mean it's pre-mapped or some type of handicapped or assistive technology that takes away from its autonomous driving feats.

I drove on I90, I81 and I80, yesterday in heavy rain, and have to admit, the Highway Assist was working impeccably. Much better than my Tesla used to be in bad weather.

 

[getafix]

Highway Assist does not work in Ontario Canada, however Adaptive cruise control was working.

 

[CLTGT]

The "new" thinking is 9-3. I just went through the Defensive Driving Course with my teenager a couple years ago and the NC State Patrol Officer said the thinking has changed to 9-3 due primarily to the injuries they were seeing from airbags coupled with the better range of wheel motion you can get from 9-3. I find myself doing both.

 

[Tâm]

This is my understanding of the features:

DreamDrive advanced driver assistance system (ADAS)	Tesla Autopilot/EAP/FSD
Over-the-air updates	Same
Automatic Emergency Braking	Same
Adaptive Cruise Control with Speed Limit Assist	Same
Automatic Park In & Out (Parallel & Perpendicular)	EAP/FSD: Not as consistent
Blind Spot Warning	Not as conventional
Driver Monitoring System (Includes Distracted Driver Alert & Drowsy Driver Alert)	Same, not as good
Forward Collision Warning	Same
Front & Rear Cross Traffic Protection	None
Lane Departure Protection	Same
Park Distance Warning	Same for sonars but not for sonarless for now
Rear Pedestrian Collision Protection	None
Rear View Monitoring	Same
Traffic Drive-Off Alert	Same
Traffic Sign Recognition	Same
DreamDrive Pro adds:	Tesla EAP/FSD
Surround view monitoring with blind spot display	None
Highway Assist: AutoSteer but Currently missing Auto Lane Change, Auto Exit	More function: Auto Lane Change, Auto Exit
Future ready hardware for semi-autonomous driving system with one of the most comprehensive sensor suites available	Goal is Pure Vision, no need for radars/sonars
Desireable to catch up with Tesla's features (no official promises)
Auto Lane Change	Present
Auto Exit	Present
Summon	Present but not reliable
Will work in city streets and not just highways	Present but not reliable

Based on the web order page below and my assumption above:

 

[hydbob]

This is my understanding of the features:

DreamDrive advanced driver assistance system (ADAS)	Tesla Autopilot/EAP/FSD
Over-the-air updates	Same
Automatic Emergency Braking	Same
Adaptive Cruise Control with Speed Limit Assist	Same
Automatic Park In & Out (Parallel & Perpendicular)	EAP/FSD: Not as consistent
Blind Spot Warning	Not as conventional
Driver Monitoring System (Includes Distracted Driver Alert & Drowsy Driver Alert)	Same, not as good
Forward Collision Warning	Same
Front & Rear Cross Traffic Protection	None
Lane Departure Protection	Same
Park Distance Warning	Same for sonars but not for sonarless for now
Rear Pedestrian Collision Protection	None
Rear View Monitoring	Same
Traffic Drive-Off Alert	Same
Traffic Sign Recognition	Same
DreamDrive Pro adds:	Tesla EAP/FSD
Surround view monitoring with blind spot display	None
Highway Assist: AutoSteer but Currently missing Auto Lane Change, Auto Exit	More function: Auto Lane Change, Auto Exit
Future ready hardware for semi-autonomous driving system with one of the most comprehensive sensor suites available	Goal is Pure Vision, no need for radars/sonars
Desireable to catch up with Tesla's features (no official promises)
Auto Lane Change	Present
Auto Exit	Present
Summon	Present but not reliable
Will work in city streets and not just highways	Present but not reliable

Based on the web order page below and my assumption above:

This is a great summary!

 

[Tâm]

This is a great summary!

Lucid is more conservative and does not overpromise until the features are stable and safe.

Tesla has more features, but they are not mature or stable enough for an average consumer, and beta testers just love the challenge so much, as seen on youtube.

 

[Neuner89]

Just got my AGT back from extended service (full battery replacement) - and has all the updates. Have tried out the Highway assist extensively over past 5 days. (Trips from Darien, CT to Baltimore and back - plus New York City and back. Previously leased Model S P85 for 3 years then a P100D for 3 years.

Really missed the self driving aspect. SO PLEASED Lucid finally pushed it out.

Needs work from where Tesla is/was. In New England at least, we have winding highways like the Merritt Parkway. Doesn't seem Lucid anticipates the curves as well as Teslas does- and also reacts more slowly- will slow down a bit, but seemingly too late. If Lucid car senses too much force in the turn, it prompts you to take over- so you really have to pay attention (or hit the guardrail at disengage?) . Teslas take curves much more confidently. Sure Lucid will improve on this.

When Highway Assist is engaged, it takes much less driver force to disengage it than Tesla. With Tesla you feel a little bit more of a jolt disengaging auto steer. Good and bad. With Lucid, the auto steer automatically re-engages once it senses you're lane centered again. Tesla you have to re-engage manually. Pro to Lucid- it's an improvement to driver service. Con to Lucid - sometimes you can't tell whether the auto steer is engaged or not unless you look at the screen- it's much more soft haptically). Pro to Tesla- you feel more force on the wheel is protecting you in the lane.

Question for group- I have Lane Departure Protection switched off. I'll try it switched on - maybe that will increase the force of Highway assist.

Another software issue- Tesla's auto pilot display shows cars ahead of you, to the side of you, behind you, stop signs, traffic lights, people crossing, trucks/motorcycles versus cars, there's a lot of great data. Plus videos of Teslas stopping and avoiding collisions and not hitting people/bicycles/baby carriages, etc under controlled conditions. Really super safe. Lucid still just shows the one lane with the car in front of you. Again- I think Lucid will get there- especially working with Nvidia. But Tesla has set the bar here for all vehicles I think.

That said- I think Lucid is already on par or better than Tesla at stopping with traffic ahead of you. Tesla's worked but many times with whiplash and a fear of getting rear-ended. Lucid seems to pick up on stopped traffic ahead of you better and slows down better.

Overall- my largest qualm with Lucid was the lack of self driving and am so pleased they finally rolled it out. For me now at least the promise has been fulfilled and I can deal with what they have now. With the expectation it will get better- but it should.

My last issue is more of a discussion point- with such an amazing car, it does not appear to be getting the attention it deserves. Which is a little odd. It does get attention, and it gets great reviews, but for everything it has to offer and delivers (Range, comfort, power, luxury, sound system, looks, space, glass cockpit, etc) , it seems it should be garnering more accolades. Plus they are fully integrating from a design and manufacturing perspective. Am I missing something? Want them to succeed and thrive.

 

[joec]

First and foremost, great writeup. I agree on most points.

Another software issue- Tesla's auto pilot display shows cars ahead of you, to the side of you, behind you, stop signs, traffic lights, people crossing, trucks/motorcycles versus cars, there's a lot of great data. Plus videos of Teslas stopping and avoiding collisions and not hitting people/bicycles/baby carriages, etc under controlled conditions. Really super safe. Lucid still just shows the one lane with the car in front of you. Again- I think Lucid will get there- especially working with Nvidia. But Tesla has set the bar here for all vehicles I think.

Here's where I disagree somewhat. I find Tesla's "video game" graphics showing you everything the car sees highly distracting. And it takes up a third of the screen, which is just nuts. As a driver who is trying to pay attention, I have no need to see a little graphic picture of what I can see with my own eyes if I just keep looking at the road. It also doesn't help that all those graphics are in the center screen, not directly in front of me. So I actually prefer Lucid's approach here.

My last issue is more of a discussion point- with such an amazing car, it does not appear to be getting the attention it deserves. Which is a little odd. It does get attention, and it gets great reviews, but for everything it has to offer and delivers (Range, comfort, power, luxury, sound system, looks, space, glass cockpit, etc) , it seems it should be garnering more accolades. Plus they are fully integrating from a design and manufacturing perspective. Am I missing something? Want them to succeed and thrive.

We seem to be at a point where what little press Lucid gets is all negative. Folks who are either hoping for Lucid's destruction or at least hoping to manipulate the stock price down. Car of the Year doesn't seem to carry the weight it once did, I guess. Hoping Lucid's PR department can garner some more positive write-ups next year. They seemed to do well with the GT-P release, where they invited a bunch of press folks out to drive the car. That ended up producing a lot of good YouTube coverage for about a minute, at least. But then with the Pure/Touring announcement—crickets. Probably bad timing. That seems to be why they canceled the Pure December 17 delivery event. Just no one interested in flying out to Arizona during the holidays to cover a car, I guess.

Right now, the majority of the Lucid videos I see are hit pieces from Tesla fans. Lucid needs its own YouTubers to counteract that. But no one seems to have taken up that mantle yet.

With any luck, we'll start seeing video and written reviews of the Touring soon. And then the Pure. That will really help. At the end of the day, watching great reviews of a $150k+ car isn't quite as effective as showing off the more affordable trims.

 

[hydbob]

Just got my AGT back from extended service (full battery replacement) - and has all the updates. Have tried out the Highway assist extensively over past 5 days. (Trips from Darien, CT to Baltimore and back - plus New York City and back. Previously leased Model S P85 for 3 years then a P100D for 3 years.

Really missed the self driving aspect. SO PLEASED Lucid finally pushed it out.

Needs work from where Tesla is/was. In New England at least, we have winding highways like the Merritt Parkway. Doesn't seem Lucid anticipates the curves as well as Teslas does- and also reacts more slowly- will slow down a bit, but seemingly too late. If Lucid car senses too much force in the turn, it prompts you to take over- so you really have to pay attention (or hit the guardrail at disengage?) . Teslas take curves much more confidently. Sure Lucid will improve on this.

When Highway Assist is engaged, it takes much less driver force to disengage it than Tesla. With Tesla you feel a little bit more of a jolt disengaging auto steer. Good and bad. With Lucid, the auto steer automatically re-engages once it senses you're lane centered again. Tesla you have to re-engage manually. Pro to Lucid- it's an improvement to driver service. Con to Lucid - sometimes you can't tell whether the auto steer is engaged or not unless you look at the screen- it's much more soft haptically). Pro to Tesla- you feel more force on the wheel is protecting you in the lane.

Question for group- I have Lane Departure Protection switched off. I'll try it switched on - maybe that will increase the force of Highway assist.

Another software issue- Tesla's auto pilot display shows cars ahead of you, to the side of you, behind you, stop signs, traffic lights, people crossing, trucks/motorcycles versus cars, there's a lot of great data. Plus videos of Teslas stopping and avoiding collisions and not hitting people/bicycles/baby carriages, etc under controlled conditions. Really super safe. Lucid still just shows the one lane with the car in front of you. Again- I think Lucid will get there- especially working with Nvidia. But Tesla has set the bar here for all vehicles I think.

That said- I think Lucid is already on par or better than Tesla at stopping with traffic ahead of you. Tesla's worked but many times with whiplash and a fear of getting rear-ended. Lucid seems to pick up on stopped traffic ahead of you better and slows down better.

Overall- my largest qualm with Lucid was the lack of self driving and am so pleased they finally rolled it out. For me now at least the promise has been fulfilled and I can deal with what they have now. With the expectation it will get better- but it should.

My last issue is more of a discussion point- with such an amazing car, it does not appear to be getting the attention it deserves. Which is a little odd. It does get attention, and it gets great reviews, but for everything it has to offer and delivers (Range, comfort, power, luxury, sound system, looks, space, glass cockpit, etc) , it seems it should be garnering more accolades. Plus they are fully integrating from a design and manufacturing perspective. Am I missing something? Want them to succeed and thrive.

Highway assist automatically engages lane departure protection while it's active, so it won't help you out there. I think this first iteration of HA is playing it very safe and wanting the drivers to stay engaged as much as possible while being disengaged.

 

[Alex]

That said- I think Lucid is already on par or better than Tesla at stopping with traffic ahead of you. Tesla's worked but many times with whiplash and a fear of getting rear-ended. Lucid seems to pick up on stopped traffic ahead of you better and slows down better.

Sorry, but for me, Lucid is crap compared to Tesla in this regard. Specifically, Lucid even states in their manual that the car may not stop if there is stopped traffic ahead or the traffic is moving less than 6 mph. The fact that Tesla knows about red traffic lights and stop signals helps it in reducing speed way before it even comes close to the traffic. Detection of stop cars around bends is also way better than Lucid‘s: Tesla takes the curves into account, whereas Lucid plows ahead until it finally sees the car and possibly stops or most likely would rear end it (haven’t got the guts to try it)

 

[borski]

Sorry, but for me, Lucid is crap compared to Tesla in this regard. Specifically, Lucid even states in their manual that the car may not stop if there is stopped traffic ahead or the traffic is moving less than 6 mph. The fact that Tesla knows about red traffic lights and stop signals helps it in reducing speed way before it even comes close to the traffic. Detection of stop cars around bends is also way better than Lucid‘s: Tesla takes the curves into account, whereas Lucid plows ahead until it finally sees the car and possibly stops or most likely would rear end it (haven’t got the guts to try it)

We've had different experiences in this, but to be fair I only use it on highways via Highway Assist, so no traffic lights or stop signs.

 

[joec]

Sorry, but for me, Lucid is crap compared to Tesla in this regard. Specifically, Lucid even states in their manual that the car may not stop if there is stopped traffic ahead or the traffic is moving less than 6 mph. The fact that Tesla knows about red traffic lights and stop signals helps it in reducing speed way before it even comes close to the traffic. Detection of stop cars around bends is also way better than Lucid‘s: Tesla takes the curves into account, whereas Lucid plows ahead until it finally sees the car and possibly stops or most likely would rear end it (haven’t got the guts to try it)

I think there’s a fundamental disconnect with people’s expectations for Highway Assist. It is not Autopilot. It is not full self driving. It’s designed to help you relax a little on longer stretches of open highway by not forcing you to constantly put your foot down on the pedal, and to keep you in the lane on those long monotonous stretches with as little effort as possible. And that’s it.

Traffic Jam assist, which is a future feature, is the one that more resembles level 2 autonomy. Where it will handle stop and go traffic, etc.

I think a good number of folks want to use Highway Assist in a way it was not intended or designed to work, in other words. They basically want to have the car drive itself. That doesn’t exist, and Lucid never said it did.

If traffic is stopped up ahead, turn off HA and take over. If you are passing a big truck that’s making you nervous, turn off HA and take over.

Yes, this is not as capable as what some other manufacturers have shipped. On the plus side, the car doesn’t seem to jam on its brakes for no reason or steer you into oncoming traffic on city streets. As far as I’m concerned, Lucid can take its time with that bit and actually get it right.

 

[hydbob]

I think there’s a fundamental disconnect with people’s expectations for Highway Assist. It is not Autopilot. It is not full self driving. It’s designed to help you relax a little on longer stretches of open highway by not forcing you to constantly put your foot down on the pedal, and to keep you in the lane on those long monotonous stretches with as little effort as possible. And that’s it.

Traffic Jam assist, which is a future feature, is the one that more resembles level 2 autonomy. Where it will handle stop and go traffic, etc.

I think a good number of folks want to use Highway Assist in a way it was not intended or designed to work, in other words. They basically want to have the car drive itself. That doesn’t exist, and Lucid never said it did.

If traffic is stopped up ahead, turn off HA and take over. If you are passing a big truck that’s making you nervous, turn off HA and take over.

Yes, this is not as capable as what some other manufacturers have shipped. On the plus side, the car doesn’t seem to jam on its brakes for no reason or steer you into oncoming traffic on city streets. As far as I’m concerned, Lucid can take its time with that bit and actually get it right.

Yea I think the function is aptly named...Highway Assist. The feature assists you on the highway. It's named properly unlike Full Self Drive or Autopilot...