RESOLVED Does your front footwell woofer work properly? TSB-B1122-001

[hmp10]

Ever since I set Tidal HiFi as the default source for music streaming in our Lucid, the sound has been incredible.

We have friends we take to dinner in the car at least twice a week, with them riding in the back seat. They have begun asking us on each outing to play certain songs because they are so blown away by the sound system in the car that they want to hear familiar favorites on it.

One of my new personal favorites is "Where Are You Now" by Calum Scott. And if anyone thinks this car doesn't have deep, pristine bass they should listen to "The Road to Ensenada" by Lyle Lovett. The deep bass line starts about halfway into the song and, even at moderate volume, vibrates the bottom of the seats. It's not the showy, throbbing bass line that so many people take for good bass, but rather a subtle, powerful bass floor under the melodic line.

 

[windscar911]

with them riding in the back seat.

Yeah I think the sound experience in the back is amazing!

 

[Bunnylebowski]

Just to flog this dead horse a little longer, that’s exactly the sound coming from the driver’s foot well or driver’s door. “Whoomp, whoomp, whoomp”, or fart, fart, fart.

I can’t decide whether I want to write this up and have Lucid Mobile take a look at it again (he did the first time and determined there was nothing wrong), or just live with it, and accept it as part of my $140,000 car’s high end, premium sound system.

I can mitigate the sound some by turning down the volume or tweaking the equaliser, and granted the sound isn’t present on every track.

Based on what you played it really does sound wrong to me. Does it make that noise on various low frequency test tones? I played the same track in my car and it doesn’t do that at any volume so it HAS to be something wrong with one of the speakers or enclosures or something near the speaker.

 

[ARamsdale]

Yeah I listened to the St Lucia track and don’t hear the issue you’re describing so there may be something loose or missing with your system. It doesn’t matter where I move the position, no flaws are heard.

That's actually fantastic news! Hopefully that means they can fix/replace the issue. I have an open service ticket, and should hear from the techs on Monday at the latest.

Thanks for taking the time to check that track.

 

[stratus]

Ever since I set Tidal HiFi as the default source for music streaming in our Lucid, the sound has been incredible.

We have friends we take to dinner in the car at least twice a week, with them riding in the back seat. They have begun asking us on each outing to play certain songs because they are so blown away by the sound system in the car that they want to hear familiar favorites on it.

One of my new personal favorites is "Where Are You Now" by Calum Scott. And if anyone thinks this car doesn't have deep, pristine bass they should listen to "The Road to Ensenada" by Lyle Lovett. The deep bass line starts about halfway into the song and, even at moderate volume, vibrates the bottom of the seats. It's not the showy, throbbing bass line that so many people take for good bass, but rather a subtle, powerful bass floor under the melodic line.

You really emphasize the number one point here. If people are not listening to hifi, especially Tidal or another service that streams hifi and Atmos, they are seriously missing out on the experience. It not only enhances the audio experience, in my view it enhances the driving experience .

For those who haven’t, please do yourself a giant favor and try it out. It completely changed the way I listen to music and I am now disappointed with other audio sources.

Will listen to Road to Ensenada , I am a big Lyle Lovett fan.

 

[stratus]

Regardless of whether you’re a fan of their music or not, just play this track by The Cure “Play for Today” at 75% volume. https://tidal.com/track/33351972

You will feel the beater of the kick drum in your chest, the very clean Fender jazz chorus amp with the guitars falls right into place, and none of the bouncing notes of the Fender precision bass are lost. If there was rampant phase cancellation this track would fall to pieces, especially with a chorused guitar (chorus effect is a form of phase cancellation itself, just slightly time delayed to create the effect), and yet every note and tone is head with pristine clarity. I do hope those who are struggling with the audio system in this car find a resolution, because it really is excellent.

Ok, first you made me listen to Prince and now the Cure!! Damn you Bunny .

 

[Bunnylebowski]

Ok, first you made me listen to Prince and now the Cure!! Damn you Bunny .

I’m a child of the 80s and will proselytize my nostalgia for that decade until my last breath, haha. I also was just listening to the soundtracks from ET and Close Encounters of the Third Kind, not even kidding! I’m using the car as a Time Machine, this was me in front of KITT at a car show in 1984, so it’s like I finally got to be Michael Knight with my black Air GT hahaha.

 

[stratus]

I’m a child of the 80s and will proselytize my nostalgia for that decade until my last breath, haha. I also was just listening to the soundtracks from ET and Close Encounters of the Third Kind, not even kidding! I’m using the car as a Time Machine, this was me in front of KITT at a car show in 1984, so it’s like I finally got to be Michael Knight with my black Air GT hahaha.

Fantastic!!! I love the 80s also, well most of it anyway.

 

[Bus Driver]

Based on what you played it really does sound wrong to me. Does it make that noise on various low frequency test tones? I played the same track in my car and it doesn’t do that at any volume so it HAS to be something wrong with one of the speakers or enclosures or something near the speaker.

Actually, I don’t believe I ever attached a video, that was probably @Bobby. But now that you’ve mentioned it, here is what mine sounds like, using one of Tidal’s speaker test thingies that somebody upthread was kind enough to recommend:

 

[Bunnylebowski]

Actually, I don’t believe I ever attached a video, that was probably @Bobby. But now that you’ve mentioned it, here is what mine sounds like, using one of Tidal’s speaker test thingies that somebody upthread was kind enough to recommend:

Yeah, that’s a blown speaker or loose driver/assembly or something. It should NOT sound like that regardless if settings or source.

 

[stratus]

Actually, I don’t believe I ever attached a video, that was probably @Bobby. But now that you’ve mentioned it, here is what mine sounds like, using one of Tidal’s speaker test thingies that somebody upthread was kind enough to recommend:

Definitely sounds way off, almost static like.
Service needs to figure that out. Probably just a bad speaker.

 

[Bobby]

Actually, I don’t believe I ever attached a video, that was probably @Bobby. But now that you’ve mentioned it, here is what mine sounds like, using one of Tidal’s speaker test thingies that somebody upthread was kind enough to recommend:

Mine is getting replaced. Waiting for parts. It sounded a lot like yours, loose and blown. If you’re up in the North County area, you’re welcome to drop by and listen to it.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

An improperly tuned port/enclosure can lead to muddy or "airy" bass that doesn't have a good kickdrum punch, if you will.

Yeah, that’s why putting a subwoofer in the footwell wouldn’t make sense because you need meters just to have one sound wave. I think it’s just a woofer under the dash, not a subwoofer.

The reason why I'm wondering if this was a design issue, is that there seems to be very little room for this footwell speaker to properly function. Bass radiates,

Yeah it’s because of the long wavelengths with low frequencies. Elephants communicate watering hole locations using infrasound that travels MILES. Talk about a subwoofer!

Now quick sidebar on soundwaves - speakers generate two opposite soundwaves, one on each side of the speaker.

Actually they make a compression and rarefaction of the air mostly on the same side of the speaker, the driver pushes and pulls it which makes a sinusoidal wave, the push is the positive part of the wave and the pull is the negative part, and the cabinet is there to reduce the inaccurate artifactual and some out of phase parts of the sound from the reverse side of the speaker as you say. But it’s directional as the speaker isn’t planar but cone shaped. I’m sure you’ve seen planar speakers at CES shows, those emanate on both sides. (And yeah I haven’t heard the top end Focals but my friend who’s still in the sound design business has Focal SM9s in his studio, oh boy those are so good!). That is an interesting thought that certain speakers aren’t properly sealed? While it doesn’t sound that way in my car the only way to tell is to physically see them which means taking the car apart. If anyone is ballsy enough to do that, take pictures! I’d love to see all the speakers.

 

[Bobby]

Yeah, that’s why putting a subwoofer in the footwell wouldn’t make sense because you need meters just to have one sound wave. I think it’s just a woofer under the dash, not a subwoofer.


Yeah it’s because of the long wavelengths with low frequencies. Elephants communicate watering hole locations using infrasound that travels MILES. Talk about a subwoofer!

Actually they make a compression and rarefaction of the air mostly on the same side of the speaker, the driver pushes and pulls it which makes a sinusoidal wave, the push is the positive part of the wave and the pull is the negative part, and the cabinet is there to reduce the inaccurate artifactual and some out of phase parts of the sound from the reverse side of the speaker as you say. But it’s directional as the speaker isn’t planar but cone shaped. I’m sure you’ve seen planar speakers at CES shows, those emanate on both sides. (And yeah I haven’t heard the top end Focals but my friend who’s still in the sound design business has Focal SM9s in his studio, oh boy those are so good!). That is an interesting thought that certain speakers aren’t properly sealed? While it doesn’t sound that way in my car the only way to tell is to physically see them which means taking the car apart. If anyone is ballsy enough to do that, take pictures! I’d love to see all the speakers.

I’ll take pictures when my front footwell speaker is replaced soon.

 

[MoniputerLM]

I played a test tone video from YouTube through the Lucid and the EQS. In the Lucid I could start to hear something at 30Hz but not well until 40Hz. In the EQS I could hear 10Hz and plenty at 20Hz.

 

[Bobby]

There is no subwoofer control to allow you to give it the kick that I like in the 80-150hz range. The base control seems to be much higher and at full volume I felt it sounded quite distorted to my other vehicles.

Yes! Wishing for a more controllable equalizer.

 

[SDHacker]

There is no subwoofer control to allow you to give it the kick that I like in the 80-150hz range. The base control seems to be much higher and at full volume I felt it sounded quite distorted to my other vehicles.

Technically, that is considered mid-bass. Subwoofers would crossover around 60hz, maybe 80 with woofers handling the 80-150 range that you are looking for. But your point is you want more granularity to customize the sound to your liking. Have to wonder if limiting it to bass, mid, treble was a conscious decision based on not allowing us to mess up the sound too much or given the infantile state of the infotainment system at launch, that’s what they could deliver.

 

[Bobby]

Technically, that is considered mid-bass. Subwoofers would crossover around 60hz, maybe 80 with woofers handling the 80-150 range that you are looking for. But your point is you want more granularity to customize the sound to your liking. Have to wonder if limiting it to bass, mid, treble was a conscious decision based on not allowing us to mess up the sound too much or given the infantile state of the infotainment system at launch, that’s what they could deliver.

I know I'm way off topic here, but I do long for "advanced" features for those who want them, like more extensive drive history and data, more EQ controls, options for auto Homelink, mirror dip, creep mode only in reverse, hiding unused or unwanted items (audio sources, for example), adding/renaming navigation shortcuts, etc. All are easily written into software. Mature software platforms allow extensive user customization. I hope Lucid goes in that direction. My I Pace allows complete control over what (and where) items are displayed on the screen and allows multiple fully customized screens while still maintaining the look and feel of the interface. It's like choosing what's on the first screen of your cell phone.

Some here wish for simplicity, others more stuff. Allow for both.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

I know I'm way off topic here, but I do long for "advanced" features for those who want them, like more extensive drive history and data, more EQ controls, options for auto Homelink, mirror dip, creep mode only in reverse, hiding unused or unwanted items (audio sources, for example), adding/renaming navigation shortcuts, etc. All are easily written into software. Mature software platforms allow extensive user customization. I hope Lucid goes in that direction. My I Pace allows complete control over what (and where) items are displayed on the screen and allows multiple fully customized screens while still maintaining the look and feel of the interface. It's like choosing what's on the first screen of your cell phone.

Some here wish for simplicity, others more stuff. Allow for both.

Yeah the Mercedes allowed that stuff too and you could put it anywhere you wanted on the display. I’d love to have data like you’re describing, like how much kW has the AC used, etc, elevation changes in navigation. I actually don’t care about the EQ in the car, I got the settings that work for me (+4/+1/+1) but I think it’s reasonable to want more EQ tweak-ability.

 

[ARamsdale]

Yeah, that’s why putting a subwoofer in the footwell wouldn’t make sense because you need meters just to have one sound wave. I think it’s just a woofer under the dash, not a subwoofer.


Yeah it’s because of the long wavelengths with low frequencies. Elephants communicate watering hole locations using infrasound that travels MILES. Talk about a subwoofer!

For speakers that either couldn't produce the frequency necessary, or the enclosure wasn't proper for the frequency response, we would put inline bass blockers to prevent the speaker from overexerting itself and causing the popping noise. This can likely be done in software, as I would imagine that Lucid has full control over the amp outputs. Possibly an easy fix.

I’m sure you’ve seen planar speakers at CES shows, those emanate on both sides.

I'm actually extremely interested in hearing the new AMT style tweeters. Some headphones are starting to use them as well. Instead of the cone moving forward/backward, my understanding is they use a wafer, almost like an air filter, and then the ridges squeeze back and forth to produce high-frequencies (think left/right, versus in/out) - but perhaps you may have some better insight on these... seems like interesting tech.

(And yeah I haven’t heard the top end Focals but my friend who’s still in the sound design business has Focal SM9s in his studio, oh boy those are so good!). That is an interesting thought that certain speakers aren’t properly sealed? While it doesn’t sound that way in my car the only way to tell is to physically see them which means taking the car apart. If anyone is ballsy enough to do that, take pictures! I’d love to see all the speakers.

Possibly? But I'm starting to lean towards Lucid design decision versus my old knowledge and expectation of balance control (or a combination of both).

My random thoughts on this: Historically, the large rear deck + the natural enclosure and separation provided by the trunk, allowed for 5x7/6x8/6x9 inch speakers that provided great midrange and even some low frequencies, and often used the back window as a reflector to give a large amount of volume into the cab. What I'm finding in the design choices for Lucid is highly directional speakers that sound great, but are very targeted - kinda like the museum reflectors that allow you to stand underneath them and hear audio that no one else can hear. It's noticeably different when you sit in the back, and it sounds loud, but if you are playing with the balance on the screen, even at high volume, it can make it go to a whisper in the front. I think someone earlier in the thread mentioned that it's almost like an executive mode. That part is very impressive. And maybe the bass/lack of bass decision was a tradeoff, since bass is much less controllable; although I'd like to see that configurable in future revisions.

Thanks for all of the ideas and constructive knowledge sharing!