Tesla Price Decrease

[HC_79]

Does anyone think Lucid is overpriced now that Tesla has dropped the price of its vehicles?

 

[LCIDdreams]

Ford now cutting Mach E prices:

Ford cuts prices on electric Mustang Mach-E, following Tesla's lead

Ford said Monday it will lower the price of the Mach-E, which is comparable to Tesla's Model Y, by an average of about $4,500, depending on the model.

www.cnbc.com

 

[blueice89]

I think folks are just positioning for March tax credit confirmation

 

[DBV]

Ford now cutting Mach E prices:

Ford cuts prices on electric Mustang Mach-E, following Tesla's lead

Ford said Monday it will lower the price of the Mach-E, which is comparable to Tesla's Model Y, by an average of about $4,500, depending on the model.

www.cnbc.com

Awesome - Tesla is putting big time pressure for all EV’s to cut prices to remain competitive. Competition is great for consumers.

 

[HC_79]

"The price cuts mean not all Mach-E models will be profitable on a per-unit basis, according to a Ford executive."

This is the issue. Companies like Ford, VW, GMC, etc. can afford to take the hit because they have ICE to sustain them. Tesla's price cuts puts Lucid and Rivian in a precarious situation. If they drop the price then they hemorrhage more cash and make bigger losses. Pure EV startups have no backup plan so whether he meant it or not I think Elon screwed Lucid and Rivian more than anyone else. With Elon's ego I wouldn't be surprised one bit if this was to stick the knife in further with his true competitors.

 

[DBV]

"The price cuts mean not all Mach-E models will be profitable on a per-unit basis, according to a Ford executive."

This is the issue. Companies like Ford, VW, GMC, etc. can afford to take the hit because they have ICE to sustain them. Tesla's price cuts puts Lucid and Rivian in a precarious situation. If they drop the price then they hemorrhage more cash and make bigger losses. Pure EV startups have no backup plan so whether he meant it or not I think Elon screwed Lucid and Rivian more than anyone else. With Elon's ego I wouldn't be surprised one bit if this was to stick the knife in further with his true competitors.

I don’t think he did it to screw anyone. Tesla prices should not have stayed that high to begin with. They were way out of whack from just 18 months ago and now are back down where they should be on the Y/3. I think the Model S/X will go down even more, as there is no way they are worth that much and have such a limited market. Model S should start around $80k, which is where it used to be.

EV’s are so overpriced compared to ICE cars and at least Tesla/Ford moves make them much more affordable. Good for consumers and to help drive the EV movement.

 

[joec]

"The price cuts mean not all Mach-E models will be profitable on a per-unit basis, according to a Ford executive."

This is the issue. Companies like Ford, VW, GMC, etc. can afford to take the hit because they have ICE to sustain them. Tesla's price cuts puts Lucid and Rivian in a precarious situation. If they drop the price then they hemorrhage more cash and make bigger losses. Pure EV startups have no backup plan so whether he meant it or not I think Elon screwed Lucid and Rivian more than anyone else. With Elon's ego I wouldn't be surprised one bit if this was to stick the knife in further with his true competitors.

I think if Lucid even attempts to compete on price, they will fail miserably.

Apple does not compete on price. Lamborghini does not compete on price. Lots of companies do not compete on price.

Compete on luxury. Keep the brand at the high-end in the short term, until a truly less expensive model is possible. Meanwhile, embrace being the more expensive, better, more prestigious option.

Cheap customers are never worth chasing.

If they play their cards right, no one will expect an Air to be priced similarly to a Model S. It will make no difference to the types of customers they want to target.

 

[DBV]

I think if Lucid even attempts to compete on price, they will fail miserably.

Apple does not compete on price. Lamborghini does not compete on price. Lots of companies do not compete on price.

Compete on luxury. Keep the brand at the high-end in the short term, until a truly less expensive model is possible. Meanwhile, embrace being the more expensive, better, more prestigious option.

Cheap customers are never worth chasing.

If they play their cards right, no one will expect an Air to be priced similarly to a Model S. It will make no difference to the types of customers they want to target.

True on Apple, but Lucid is no Apple yet, since it just starting out. Will be interesting to see what happens.

They will have to do something, as the market is very competitive now and will be even more so with all the EV’s coming out this year. I just can’t see any EV sedan making it long term priced the way they are now in the luxury market, which is so small. Just too big of a price difference from companies ICE vehicles. I think most people would not consider new companies prestigious yet, until proven. But, I get everyone is different and could just be me.

I am curious to see the BMW i5 and the Audi A6 EV’s, especially if they get over 400 in range. Both would have well established software systems too and already a loyal following. Hopefully they are good!

 

[HC_79]

They will have to do something, as the market is very competitive now and will be even more so with all the EV’s coming out this year. I just can’t see any EV sedan making it long term priced the way they are now in the luxury market

Agreed. Lucid has now priced itself out of the market. The cost variance between the S and Air pre price drop was relatively minimal where you could argue you're getting better quality over the S and with similar efficiency \ performance. But now, the Model S is in EQS territory whilst Lucid is so far out it's no longer competitive.

Like it or not there aren't many "performance luxury" cars on the market that are priced for the masses. Whilst luxury on a Tesla is debatable it was the closest thing Lucid could be compared to and unfortunately it's still going to be compared to the S now the price has dropped on the Plaid. If Lucid wants mass appeal then $150K+ isn't going to cut it especially when trying to get the brand recognized by people. Unless they have no interest in mass sales and prefer to live in the world of Bentley, Lamborghini, etc. then keep the price as is but it contradicts why they need such a big factory if this is the high end space they want to play in.

 

[joec]

True on Apple, but Lucid is no Apple yet, since it just starting out. Will be interesting to see what happens.

They will have to do something, as the market is very competitive now and will be even more so with all the EV’s coming out this year. I just can’t see any EV sedan making it long term priced the way they are now in the luxury market, which is so small. Just too big of a price difference from companies ICE vehicles. I think most people would not consider new companies prestigious yet, until proven. But, I get everyone is different and could just be me.

I am curious to see the BMW i5 and the Audi A6 EV’s, especially if they get over 400 in range. Both would have well established software systems too and already a loyal following. Hopefully they are good!

I agree, Lucid is no Apple. Yet. But you don't become the prestigious brand by starting off cheap. Apple didn't compete on price even when it was six months from bankruptcy. It stuck to its guns throughout.

That's the trick with brands. You can't just flip them on a whim. Which is why I think it's a far more disturbing sign Tesla is willing to devalue its own brand at this particular moment. Everyone is playing it as good news for Tesla, but to me it just reinforces the perception that Teslas are glorified Toyotas at this point. Common and not particularly noteworthy.

Not that there's anything wrong with being Toyota. But they just ceded what little grasp they had on the prestige market for the foreseeable future.

 

[DBV]

I agree, Lucid is no Apple. Yet. But you don't become the prestigious brand by starting off cheap. Apple didn't compete on price even when it was six months from bankruptcy. It stuck to its guns throughout.

That's the trick with brands. You can't just flip them on a whim. Which is why I think it's a far more disturbing sign Tesla is willing to devalue its own brand at this particular moment. Everyone is playing it as good news for Tesla, but to me it just reinforces the perception that Teslas are glorified Toyotas at this point. Common and not particularly noteworthy.

Not that there's anything wrong with being Toyota. But they just ceded what little grasp they had on the prestige market for the foreseeable future.

There is no way that Tesla has devalued their brand. They literally lowered prices back to where they were 18 months ago. There is absolutely no reason for their prices or other EV’s to stay that high. That was just a Covid jump, that had component shortages and car shortages that automobile manufactures took advantage of. Then at the same time you got high gas prices. Perfect scenario to raise prices to unsustainable levels.

It has nothing to do about devaluing your brand, as your prices are almost exactly where they were 18 months ago. Like I said, Model S/X still need to come back down too, as do other auto manufacturers. If you think about even though prices have gone back down to where they were should be, there are still battening much higher interest rates now too.

So, nothing at all disturbing. It was more disturbing how quickly auto manufactures raised prices. And awesome that now we have car companies bringing them back down to where they should be.

Laughable on the Toyota comment and totally disagree. I love Lucid, but they have a long ways to become an Apple or even a top sustainable brand.

 

[borski]

Laughable on the Toyota comment and totally disagree. I love Lucid, but they have a long ways to become an Apple or even a top sustainable brand.

Laughable why? Teslas are extremely commonplace now and they haven’t had any serious innovation in a very long time. That’s very Toyota. In fact, Toyota’s new EV plans are actually even more innovative than any of Tesla’s stuff, Cybertruck and new Roadster notwithstanding, since those may or may not still be vaporware.

Nobody is saying Lucid is Apple, yet; but they are following the same playbook. When the first iPod came out, it was priced far higher than the Diamond Rio or any other MP3 player at the time, and did less. But it did it *better*, and in the end that was what mattered.

Same was true for the iPhone. Cheaper Android devices existed pre-iPhone. Price wasn’t the thing that Apple billed itself on, though.

Lucid is trying to do the same thing.

 

[HC_79]

Laughable on the Toyota comment and totally disagree.

There is a reason the Tesla is called the "California Camry"

 

[DBV]

Laughable why? Teslas are extremely commonplace now and they haven’t had any serious innovation in a very long time. That’s very Toyota. In fact, Toyota’s new EV plans are actually even more innovative than any of Tesla’s stuff, Cybertruck and new Roadster notwithstanding, since those may or may not still be vaporware.

Nobody is saying Lucid is Apple, yet; but they are following the same playbook. When the first iPod came out, it was priced far higher than the Diamond Rio or any other MP3 player at the time, and did less. But it did it *better*, and in the end that was what mattered.

Same was true for the iPhone. Cheaper Android devices existed pre-iPhone. Price wasn’t the thing that Apple billed itself on, though.

Lucid is trying to do the same thing.

They are not even close to Toyota. At least in Ohio, there are still not tons of Teslas, so I think they are still very unique, as do everyone I know. When I see a Tesla, it still turns my head. Toyota certainly does not and never has. Tesla is still the EV that everyone is trying to beat and always compared too and where the talk is always around.

Apple was already so well established for years before the iPhone. Lucid is not even close yet and hopefully will reach that point. Outside of this forum, when I mention I am going to buy a Lucid, no one even knows what that is and ask why I would get rid of my new Model S. They have a very long ways to go in a super competitive market.

Everyone has to agree that competition is great for companies and consumers. It will make Tesla and other car companies better/stronger, which will benefit consumers.

 

[DBV]

There is a reason the Tesla is called the "California Camry"

Yep - only in CA, but no where else. They are in their own little bubble.

 

[HC_79]

Yep - only in CA, but no where else. They are in their own little bubble.

Yep, we hear that a lot on many things "only in CA"

 

[joec]

Yep - only in CA, but no where else. They are in their own little bubble.

In Boulder, Teslas are more common than Camrys. But that certainly isn’t true everywhere.

Pretty much everyone who has seen my Lucid so far has referred to it as a much more “high end” car, though. They know Teslas well, and they no longer think of them as head turners.

Like I said, perception is more important than reality. And so long as Lucid has more reservations than they can build in a year, it’s in their best interest to maintain that perception.

 

[Steveinarizona]

I never viewed the Models 3 and Y nor the Mach-e as competitors to the Lucid Air

Like it or not there aren't many "performance luxury" cars on the market that are priced for the masses

There never are. There are some performance cars priced for the masses; there are some luxury cars (sort of) priced for the masses. What there aren't are both. Mercedes put together a souped up A series but there was absolutely no luxury in the car.

 

[hs22]

Tesla dropped prices on Model S (5K) & X (10K). The base mode Model S price drop to $89,990 seems to be directly takign aim at the Pure. IMO Lucid & Peter Rawlison are taking a big risk by not making more Pures where there is much more demand. With Pure reservation owners waiting for over 2+ years already and Lucid sharing not any details on it when they will start producing those in quantity it's going to lure some of those reservation holders to jump for the Model S despite having wanting to get the better product.

 

[abbas2099]

Quality is better on Lucid for sure but Tesla has been around longer. I do agree that Lucid needs to produce more Pures.

 

[Viking]

Tesla dropped prices on Model S (5K) & X (10K). The base mode Model S price drop to $89,990 seems to be directly takign aim at the Pure. IMO Lucid & Peter Rawlison are taking a big risk by not making more Pures where there is much more demand. With Pure reservation owners waiting for over 2+ years already and Lucid sharing not any details on it when they will start producing those in quantity it's going to lure some of those reservation holders to jump for the Model S despite having wanting to get the better product.

I'm still with my reservation for a Pure with legacy pricing, but it is giving me pause (S < $90k). But how Tesla pricing will effect Lucid viability is an open question. I think they may have to react. Maybe more $7,500 credits issued. We'll see.