Easy way to tell: The correct receptacles are 2.44" in diameter, almost two and a half inches. The cheapies are 2.1" or barely over 2" in diameter. They will use different sized cover plates.
Hardwire your home charging station! Or use a Hubbel / Bryant / Cooper 14-50 receptacle, not Leviton
- Thread starter DeaneG
- Start date
Only if I can stay at the Del. And seafood!
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2021
- Messages
- 6,829
- Location
- Cupertino, CA
- Cars
- Air DE-P, ZR, 21"
- DE Number
- 241
- Referral Code
- Q1BTN5Y3
Mine is *definitely* overkill; I just had the space and the additional cost was not that crazy, aside from the nominal additional cost of the Lucid charger.
The prior setup was two very inconveniently placed 14-50 plugs, both outside the garage (previous owners had an RV and an EV).
So rather than dealing with the nonsense, I figured if I was going to be re-running wiring anyway, may as well do it the way I want to do it and maximize possible power output.
Now there’s a 3D printer in the garage, so the Wallbox Power Boost is even more useful.
But again: definitely overkill. Nobody *needs* my setup. I’d be lying if I said it wasn’t super convenient though.
(Especially when I forget to plug in and can still get a quick fast charge in the morning before leaving)
It's all because you DON'T GET ENOUGH SLEEP!!!
Mine is *definitely* overkill; I just had the space and the additional cost was not that crazy, aside from the nominal additional cost of the Lucid charger.
The prior setup was two very inconveniently placed 14-50 plugs, both outside the garage (previous owners had an RV and an EV).
So rather than dealing with the nonsense, I figured if I was going to be re-running wiring anyway, may as well do it the way I want to do it and maximize possible power output.
Now there’s a 3D printer in the garage, so the Wallbox Power Boost is even more useful.
But again: definitely overkill. Nobody *needs* my setup. I’d be lying if I said it wasn’t super convenient though.
(Especially when I forget to plug in and can still get a quick fast charge in the morning before leaving)
I thought they were 2.48 but who's counting
. Ah, that's the hole size in the plate.... People bitch about getting the larger plate. Amazon sells the correct Hubbell in stainless. As does Zoro. About $14.
Great post by the way. Damn easy way to check if you have a residential or industrial receptacle.
And, you used the word the magic word receptacle! Only people that have to read the damn NEC use that defined word. Even @DeaneG uses Outlet, but he is a real engineer, not a sparky. We still love him.
sparky
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2021
- Messages
- 6,829
- Location
- Cupertino, CA
- Cars
- Air DE-P, ZR, 21"
- DE Number
- 241
- Referral Code
- Q1BTN5Y3
ok mom
40 years as an enginerd! Not electrical but had to learn the NEC handbook extremely well. I guess some of it stuckI thought they were 2.48 but who's counting
People bitch about getting the larger plate. Amazon sells the correct Hubbell in stainless. As does Zoro. About $14.
Great post by the way. Damn easy way to check if you have a residential or industrial receptacle.
And, you used the word the magic word receptacle! Only people that have to read the damn NEC use that defined word. Even @DeaneG uses Outlet, but he is a real engineer, not a sparky. We still love him.
sparky
PompousAss
Member
Perhaps another stupid question:
I plan to install a permanent charger in the garage, but we also have a shed/shop/whatever you want to call it with separately metered electricity. In that panel there is a 50 amp breaker pair that once powered a hot tub but is now unused.
My wild idea is to use that breaker (and the wiring, if it's sufficient) to run 50 amp service to an A/B switch. Downstream from that switch I would install one 14-50 outlet inside the shop and a second one on the wall outside. Only one at a time would be hot.
Part of the motivation for this is that we frequently have this problem at our house called "crap in the way". It would also give me an outside 240V source so folks with EVs or RVs would have a power source when they visit.
So, stupid idea? I've always said I know just enough about electrical wiring to get myself killed someday.
I plan to install a permanent charger in the garage, but we also have a shed/shop/whatever you want to call it with separately metered electricity. In that panel there is a 50 amp breaker pair that once powered a hot tub but is now unused.
My wild idea is to use that breaker (and the wiring, if it's sufficient) to run 50 amp service to an A/B switch. Downstream from that switch I would install one 14-50 outlet inside the shop and a second one on the wall outside. Only one at a time would be hot.
Part of the motivation for this is that we frequently have this problem at our house called "crap in the way". It would also give me an outside 240V source so folks with EVs or RVs would have a power source when they visit.
So, stupid idea? I've always said I know just enough about electrical wiring to get myself killed someday.
Great idea. I did something similar in my other garage for an air compressor and a welder with full understanding that I would only use one of them at a time.
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2022
- Messages
- 3,299
- Location
- Santa Clara County, CA
- Cars
- Air GT, XC40 P8 EV
- Referral Code
- 3OKY7YGA
Neocharge, Splitvolt, Lectron all make plug-and-play devices to "smart split" a single 30A or 50A circuit to two loads without requiring a manual A/B switch or creating danger of overloading the circuit. Neocharge is UL listed, haven't checked the others lately.
Say it with me Industrial grade never Leviton
Almost 100% correct. You can run #6 Romex (not in conduit) for 50A breaker drawing 40A at the charger - or you can run #8 THHN/THWN-2 in conduit. You'll not only save a wire size but #8 is more pliable than #6.
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2022
- Messages
- 170
- Cars
- Lucid, Rivian, Genesis GV
Well, if you pull out a six-foot cheater bar and go to town, you'll probably break the connectors.
Instructions say 75in-lbs, doesn't say it's the minimum. I'd say torque it to 75, wait 15 minutes, re-torque to 75 and call it good. No need to overthink it.Well, if you pull out a six-foot cheater bar and go to town, you'll probably break the connectors.
I recently had a solar system installed and they told me that they would also install a 220 outlet for my EV. I told them, please make it industrial grade. It looked good when they installed it - a step up from the Home Depot varieties but when I measured it, the round portion was around 2" in diameter. I remember reading a post that it should be larger - 2 1/4". I bought a Bryant (it measures 2 3/8") and important - the faceplate for that receptacle! Looking at the Bryant, it is beefier compared to the one they installed and had them return. At first the electrician told me they had used the other receptacle for many EV installations without problems. Afterwards, he understood why I wanted to change because he saw the Bryant was better.
Long story short, the round portion of the receptacle of an industrial outlet is larger than 2". Don't settle for less!
Long story short, the round portion of the receptacle of an industrial outlet is larger than 2". Don't settle for less!
Bobby,
Here's my short stab at it for starters. Others please chime in to add, subtract or correct. I am using 40A as the de facto norm. Others can add for 48A charging, etc.
For 40-amp charging, you need a 50A breaker, #6 Romex or #8 THHN/THWN-2 (in conduit). This is for wire runs of less than 100 feet and applies to both hard-wiring and installing a receptacle. This should cover probably 90% of the people on this forum. Check your local codes to see if running conduit is a must or if you need a permit.
Option 1: If you are buying a separate Level 2 charger (ChargePoint, Emporia, Autel, Grizzl-E, JuiceBox), you should consider hard-wiring as the preferred option. It eliminates a connection point (receptacle). If you’re looking to charge at 48-amps or higher (for those chargers that are capable), hard-wiring is your ONLY option.
Option 2: If you are installing a 14-50 receptacle (for using the Lucid-supplied mobile charger), use only Bryant Electric 9450R, Hubbell HBL9450A, or Eaton 5754N. Do NOT allow your electrician to substitute a cheaper receptacle. They are easily identifiable by the diameter of the black receptacle, approx. 2.44”. The cheap plastic ones are 2” in diameter. Be sure to purchase the correct cover plate. Leviton SL701 is stainless steel, works nicely and looks sharp. There are others. Torque connections to 75 in-lbs, wait 15 minutes, then re-torque to 75 in-lbs. Recommendation: Leave the charger plugged in unless/until you need it for a trip. Saves wear and tear on the receptacle's contacts.
Incredibly well written. Bravo!! Kudos for pointing out retorquing. Many sparkies fail that test.
48A hardwired charging is easy. Use 6awg THHN-THWN in 3/4" PVC or metal conduit for the two current conductors, with a 8 or 10 awg for ground. No neutral. Use a 60A breaker. With a ChargePoint service equipment (charger) your charge rate is 11.5 kw, vs 9.6 with 40A.
And, of course, do everything @emoylv said above.
Excellent! I would add: Do NOT let your electrician substitute aluminum wire. Although it is allowable by NEC, the lugs on your EVSE will probably be too small and you may void your EVSE warranty.
Bite your tongue using the A word
truly false economy. And it introduces a new set of variables for the installer to F-up, like oxidation. It would not surprise me if the Hubbell receptacle and CP service equipment said CU Only.
Tongue bit! Hubbell does say CU only but in very small letters lol!Bite your tongue using the A word
