Gravity Spec coming Oct 3 ?

Porsche in no way relies on Taycan sales for their very existence. They sell everything they can make with some of their other models, and are not beholden to one or two models. They are also way more aspirational for a huge segment of people, most of whom have never even heard of Lucid. I hope Lucid pulls it off but when you ask folks to make a massive change in their automotive paradigm, and also to pay that much money, it’s tough sledding - hence all the price cuts that killed values for early adopters (for Tesla also) just to generate some revenue in the short term.
 
Porsche in no way relies on Taycan sales for their very existence. They sell everything they can make with some of their other models, and are not beholden to one or two models. They are also way more aspirational for a huge segment of people, most of whom have never even heard of Lucid. I hope Lucid pulls it off but when you ask folks to make a massive change in their automotive paradigm, and also to pay that much money, it’s tough sledding - hence all the price cuts that killed values for early adopters (for Tesla also) just to generate some revenue in the short term.
Porsche has been very very lucky these past few years. Like you said, they sell everything they build. They'd rather cut production and sales of the Taycan than reduce the price and sell more of them. You can see them playing similar games with the 911 as well, limit production of base 911 so they can built more GT3s where they make significantly more profit. It's almost impossible for any other manufacturer to be in that class, other than maybe Ferrari. One day, hopefully Porsche's games of artificially limiting production of cars people want comes back to bite them.

Lucid can't compete with Porsche on that front, primarily because EVs just don't have that strong of a demand right now. High MSRPs, charging infrastructure, reliability, are all concerns. A large practical 7-seater is a great place to start, since there is not much EV competition there, but it can't be priced significantly higher than R1S or Model X (for equivalent spec). Case in point: The Air only started to sell at equal numbers to it's competition once the price was lowered to below that of the Model S. I suspect the same will be needed for the Gravity.
 
Every time I sneak a look at my Lucid stock portfolio, I end up asking myself, "was I satisfied with the EV offerings before Lucid arrived on the scene." The answer is a resounding "no".

I loved my first Tesla -- a 2015 P90D that made me an EV addict. But instead of maturing that design into a state-of-the-art car, Tesla took a path toward focusing more on manufacturing costs than on quality and driving dynamics, using hype as a substitute for real engineering, and thereby producing products such as our Model S Plaid -- a car that's all about acceleration numbers and gimmicks such a yokes that appeal to pubescent teens but comes up short in handling, braking, space engineering, and broad-spectrum driving exhilaration.

Then I look at the German brands. There I see a blotchy fabric of abysmal space packaging (few have frunks), enormous hoods on some, video arcade interiors, subpar range, and handling dynamics that vary from top-notch (Taycan) to boat-like (EQS).

No one, and I mean no one, approaches Lucid in its balance of range, power, handling, ride, and roominess.

We can all fret and wring our hands about Lucid's future. But whether they make it or not, the automotive scene will always be better for their having been there, as it revealed to people why EVs really can keep driving excitement and fine motoring alive and served notice on other brands that they still have a lot of fundamental work to do.
 
Every time I sneak a look at my Lucid stock portfolio, I end up asking myself, "was I satisfied with the EV offerings before Lucid arrived on the scene." The answer is a resounding "no".

I loved my first Tesla -- a 2015 P90D that made me an EV addict. But instead of maturing that design into a state-of-the-art car, Tesla took a path toward focusing more on manufacturing costs than on quality and driving dynamics, using hype as a substitute for real engineering, and thereby producing products such as our Model S Plaid -- a car that's all about acceleration numbers and gimmicks such a yokes that appeal to pubescent teens but comes up short in handling, braking, space engineering, and broad-spectrum driving exhilaration.

Then I look at the German brands. There I see a blotchy fabric of abysmal space packaging (few have frunks), enormous hoods on some, video arcade interiors, subpar range, and handling dynamics that vary from top-notch (Taycan) to boat-like (EQS).

No one, and I mean no one, approaches Lucid in its balance of range, power, handling, ride, and roominess.

We can all fret and wring our hands about Lucid's future. But whether they make it or not, the automotive scene will always be better for their having been there, as it revealed to people why EVs really can keep driving excitement and fine motoring alive and served notice on other brands that they still have a lot of fundamental work to do.
I agree, I think Lucid Air offers the best balance overall. What it loses in software quality, makes up in driving dynamics and range.

The German EVs - except the refreshed Taycan - are all subpar, one way or another. That's why I never considered an EV before I got to drive the Air.

I love my Air - that's why I bitch and fret so much :)
 
A lot of "SUV"s are front wheel drive these days. See Escape, Rouge, CR-V, RAV-4, previous generation Explorer, Highlander, etc.
Same for the GM Ultium products
 
Agree, sadly. And since they ceased production of the Air GT Performance that spanned the gap between the GT and the Sapphire, I doubt if they'll try to fill that gap in the Gravity lineup.



This phrasing in the "Motor Trend" article struck me as odd: "The team is still thinking about what to do on the performance side so no announcement on an Air Sapphire-matching Gravity . . . ." Granted those were the authors words and not from Bach himself, but it suggested the possibility of something I had posted about months ago, i. e.:

The Gravity does not seem suited for the hard-core track tuning and track vibes of the Air Sapphire. Maybe this "still thinking about what to do on the performance side" will lead to a tri-motor Gravity that ups the performance ante but will stay more in line with the cargo/family mission of the Gravity cosmetically. The Air took on the muscular bulges of the Sapphire with aplomb. I'm not sure the Gravity could take them on without looking a bit odd, maybe even Munster-mobile-ish.

If a more cloned descendant of the Air Sapphire were in the works, it would have been easy just to say it will follow in due course, not say they are still thinking about what to do?
The question is what would be the point of a Gravity Sapphire? Will it be another extremely limited production 250K mega SUV? At this point the only real competition is a Model X Plaid. The GT will already smoke the rest of the EV SUVs and the ICE like the Urus and BMWs.
 
At this point the only real competition is a Model X Plaid. The GT will already smoke the rest of the EV SUVs and the ICE like the Urus and BMWs.

In terms of performance, the Model X Plaid would only beat the Gravity GT in low-end acceleration. I'm willing to bet the Gravity will absolutely trounce it in the handling department, just as our Air Dream P does our Model S Plaid. And the Plaid's front end goes so loose under hard acceleration that the Lucid gets more usable power to the ground.

The new Urus SE is pulling 0-60 acceleration in the low threes and, unlike the Teslas, has handling to be reckoned with.

If Lucid wants to win all the performance trophies for an SUV, it's going to need a Sapphire version. The real question is whether it's worth the effort for an SUV, as the Sapphire sedan already gives Lucid the test bed it needs to drive the cutting edge of EV technology and driving dynamics further along.
 
I think everyone is thinking wrong about Gavity performance. Rather than on-road performance I think they are going to go with larger tires and a lift kit for off-road performance. More like what Ford does with the Raptor line.
 
I think everyone is thinking wrong about Gavity performance. Rather than on-road performance I think they are going to go with larger tires and a lift kit for off-road performance. More like what Ford does with the Raptor line.

Lucid did announce that a Sapphire version was not going to be unique to the Air but rather that Sapphire was going to be a performance division that would produce a version of each model in the lineup, much like MB's AMG unit and the BMW M division.

I was told in early days by a senior Lucid executive that the Air platform was developed to take up to four motors. He said that the Air would never have four motors, but that larger vehicles eventually might. I think there's no question that there will be at least a tri-motor Gravity at some point. To me, the question is whether it'll have the track vibe of the Air Sapphire, or be an up-powered Gravity with more restrained visual cues.
 
I'm thinking more of a 911 Dakar vibe.
No chance. They need the upperclass mall crawlers to pick this over their next Range Rover. The # of people that ever go even remotely off road in their SUV is approximately zero in the grand scheme of things. This needs to be an alternative to high end SUVs and maybe minivans. I don’t even think they should worry about performance being crazy, but focus on it being smooth, quiet, comfy, reliable, and luxurious. The SUV performance race is silly - and I say that while owning a Cayenne GTS.
 
Not all 3-row SUVs are created equal. We are looking for an EV to replace our Honda Odyssey minivan which we keep primarily for local outings and day tripping with groups of 5-6 older adults. (We're the only ones in our circle of friends who have such a vehicle, so it gets a fair bit of use. I have even lent it out to friends for outings we are not joining.)

We had a chance to talk to an EV9 owner who showed us his SUV at an Electrify America station recently. He liked it very much but volunteered before I even asked that its third row was a bit cramped for adults. I have since seen the Gravity in the flesh twice, and its third row is considerably roomier. In fact, it gives the Odyssey a run for the money in terms of 6-passenger adult seating.

So it really depends on one's priorities. If 6-seating adult comfort is among them, I'm not sure that any coming EV except the Cadillac Escalade fits the bill as well as the Gravity . . . and there are so many reasons I wouldn't touch that behemoth.
You are 100% right. And it is for sure that neither EV9 nor EX90 will provide comparable interior space. Maybe EQS SUV will, I don't know.
Just for European market the overall size is critical, so these cars are in the same category: large SUV. Nobody would buy a bigger personal car in Europe: Escalate just doesn't exist for European consumers. And all other cars in European "large SUV" category have 3rd row as a compromise, and everyone accepted this (because no other options exist). Those, who need comfortable space for 6-7 adults buy a minivan. And there are quite a few minivans: more premium from Mercedes, well known VW, much more affordable from Peugeot, Citroen, Opel.
So Gravity is only one in its own class: sporty premium SUV that can fit 7 adults. This is huge advantage, but also a big challenge: being just one in its own class will lead it to also compete with other classes: large premium SUV where it will probably have to provide something significantly better (yes, dynamics for example), but where big 3rd row won't be a killer feature for many: most of this category consumers accepted already to have 3rd row as a rarely used bonus, not as full functional seat; or minivan category, where price is very important factor for many however, and not everyone will want to pay much more to have much better dynamics for example, because dynamics they have in a usual minivan is already enough for many of them.
Personally I need 3rd row, but ok with a compromise one, that is okish for kids or smaller adults for a short drive - I use it once in a month and I always find someone who can fit there. So for me the space that EV9 and EX90 provide is already enough. Sure Gravity has more, but I'm already ok with less - so this "more" is not a critical feature for me. The size of Gravity, EV9 and EX90 is already "oh it's big! But maybe..." for me however. If Lucid would build a vehicle smaller than EV9 and EX90 still with the same space that would be clear winner for me.
So the price becomes critical factor: if Gravity will cost more than EX90 I'd just go ahead and buy EX90.
 
have since seen the Gravity in the flesh twice, and its third row is considerably roomier. In fact, it gives the Odyssey a run for the money in terms of 6-passenger adult seating.

Is it confirmed that Gravity will have a captains chairs 6-seater option?
 
You are 100% right. And it is for sure that neither EV9 nor EX90 will provide comparable interior space. Maybe EQS SUV will, I don't know.
Just for European market the overall size is critical, so these cars are in the same category: large SUV. Nobody would buy a bigger personal car in Europe: Escalate just doesn't exist for European consumers. And all other cars in European "large SUV" category have 3rd row as a compromise, and everyone accepted this (because no other options exist). Those, who need comfortable space for 6-7 adults buy a minivan. And there are quite a few minivans: more premium from Mercedes, well known VW, much more affordable from Peugeot, Citroen, Opel.
So Gravity is only one in its own class: sporty premium SUV that can fit 7 adults. This is huge advantage, but also a big challenge: being just one in its own class will lead it to also compete with other classes: large premium SUV where it will probably have to provide something significantly better (yes, dynamics for example), but where big 3rd row won't be a killer feature for many: most of this category consumers accepted already to have 3rd row as a rarely used bonus, not as full functional seat; or minivan category, where price is very important factor for many however, and not everyone will want to pay much more to have much better dynamics for example, because dynamics they have in a usual minivan is already enough for many of them.
Personally I need 3rd row, but ok with a compromise one, that is okish for kids or smaller adults for a short drive - I use it once in a month and I always find someone who can fit there. So for me the space that EV9 and EX90 provide is already enough. Sure Gravity has more, but I'm already ok with less - so this "more" is not a critical feature for me. The size of Gravity, EV9 and EX90 is already "oh it's big! But maybe..." for me however. If Lucid would build a vehicle smaller than EV9 and EX90 still with the same space that would be clear winner for me.
So the price becomes critical factor: if Gravity will cost more than EX90 I'd just go ahead and buy EX90.
Here just look at this nifty comparison we made earlier. It's night and day compared to the Gravity. Space/efficiency/performance wise.

Thread 'Time to put some specs into perspective'
https://lucidowners.com/threads/time-to-put-some-specs-into-perspective.7150/
 
Here just look at this nifty comparison we made earlier. It's night and day compared to the Gravity. Space/efficiency/performance wise.

Thread 'Time to put some specs into perspective'
https://lucidowners.com/threads/time-to-put-some-specs-into-perspective.7150/
What about interior space comparison? Has Lucid shared any numbers around legroom, shoulder room, height, etc...?

Are we talking interior dimensions on-par with a Toyota Highlander? Or a full-size SUV like a Tahoe?
 
What about interior space comparison? Has Lucid shared any numbers around legroom, shoulder room, height, etc...?

Are we talking interior dimensions on-par with a Toyota Highlander? Or a full-size SUV like a Tahoe?
At the time I made the table, they did not.

I also didn't include non-evs, which in hindsight, I should have....maybe it's time for a new table!
 
Is it confirmed that Gravity will have a captains chairs 6-seater option?

It appears it won't, at least at launch. The "Motor Trend" article on their interview with Eric Bach, Lucid's Chief Engineer, reported, "Bach says a six-passenger version is being considered but it has not been decided." The early Lucid promos of the Gravity described it as having 5-, 6-, or 7-passenger capacity, but recent promos have eliminated any reference to 6-passenger seating. Also, the computer rendition of captains chairs on the Lucid website disappeared some time ago.
 
Are we talking interior dimensions on-par with a Toyota Highlander? Or a full-size SUV like a Tahoe?

This is the graphic Lucid used to compare interior space to competitors in its recent Technology & Manufacturing event. The black outlines are the Gravity, and speculation is that the red outlines are the Cadillac Escalade, which shares its chassis and dimensions with the Tahoe. As you can see, the Gravity is marginally roomier inside but significantly smaller outside -- in other words, Lucid's space engineering magic again at work.

What I find particularly interesting is that the Lucid has not only the most fore-aft legroom in the third row, but also the most relaxed knee angle, which is a key (but often under-appreciated) contributor to seating comfort.

Screenshot 2024-09-11 at 12.20.10 PM.webp
 
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This is the graphic Lucid used to compare interior space to competitors in its recent Technology & Manufacturing event. The black outlines are the Gravity, and speculation is that the red outlines are the Cadillac Escalade, which shares its chassis and dimensions with the Tahoe. As you can see, the Gravity is marginally roomier inside but significantly smaller outside -- in other words, Lucid's space engineering magic again at work.

What I find particularly interesting is that the Lucid has not only the most fore-aft legroom in the third row, but also the most relaxed knee angle, which is a key (but often under-appreciated) contributor to seating comfort.

View attachment 23539

Wow I hope this is accurate. More legroom than an Escalade is wild. Escalade is even bigger than the Tahoe I mentioned. I think Escalade is equivalent to Suburban
 
Wow I hope this is accurate. More legroom than an Escalade is wild. Escalade is even bigger than the Tahoe I mentioned. I think Escalade is equivalent to Suburban

You're right. I just checked. The Suburban wheelbase is 134.1", the Tahoe wheelbase is 120.1", and the Gravity wheelbase is 119.5". Based on the rear wheels shown in that graphic, I suspect that's the Suburban chassis we're seeing in red, not the Escalade. (Actually, the Escalade shares its chassis with the Tahoe, with both having a 120.9" wheelbase.)
 
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