Torn between Model S Plaid and Lucid Touring.

[joec]

I read somewhere that Tesla would get government financial support if they opened up their chargers to at least one other EV. Aptera uses the Tesla plug, not CCS. Opening the Tesla superchargers to Aptera may fulfill the Fed requirement and provide funding to Tesla without providing access to EVs using the CCS standard.

It's a bit more complicated than just the plug. None of the Tesla chargers have any way of charging a customer via a credit card, etc. The Tesla itself communicates with the charger, which is linked to your Tesla account, which then gets billed. So at minimum, without changing any hardware, Tesla would have to partner with someone like Aptera to write the correct software to communicate with the Tesla charging network and bill customers accordingly. Not insurmountable, but still another thing to consider.

 

[mraschko]

From Motor Trend:

It's even more impressive when you compare the Air Touring to cars from other automakers. Take the Tesla Model S. The Air Touring costs about $5,000 more, but it goes farther, charges faster, puts up slightly better performance numbers, has more space, and has a wildly better interior.

2023 Lucid Air Touring first test review

 

[off]

MT says the T has less rebound than the GT and GT-P. I didn't notice on the test drives, darn, I should have pushed harder!

 

[Lucidfan22]

Not sure if Motor Trend got the right torque numbers for the Touring. Seems like a typo.

885 lbs torque seems to be same torque as the GT with 819 HP. Not sure if anyone else caught that or verified that?

 

[Drendino]

This is pretty much what PG&E are pushing for to alieviate grid issues. Even getting to the point of creating infrastructure for the consumer to sell back stored power in their EV's.

PG&E only cares about PG&E. NEM 3 is a total disgrace, which will only hurt the grid and destroy the solar industry.

Utilities Net Metering 3.0 Impact on California Solar - Escondido Times-Advocate

In the past we have talked about how some states have tried to prevent the average citizen from getting solar on their homes, but not California. Think again. This fall, the utilities presented a formidable proposal to the California Public Utilities Commission. The solar industry fought hard...

www.times-advocate.com

 

[Electrified]

Lately, much of this hate toward Elon you read from people (not just here) is unfortunately based on politics. In addition to his incredibly successful ventures you already mentioned, his Starlink system has helped people in impoverished countries as well as aiding communication in the Ukraine.

Business folks should focus on business, and leave politics to the politicians. Outsized egos are never good for business.

Agreed… one big reason is that the car has so much torque that over time, the body will start to flex creating those body noises. I had a P100D and those creaking noises started to come out around 70k miles. You could feel the body of the car flex specially around corners then things began to rattle in the car. Again, if you plan on keeping the car on a short term basis, you will probably have less issues than me.

You have to take a car company that until a few month ago had no need to improve their car’s quality. Their stock kept going up no matter how the cars were made. It was bound to catch up with them at some point. For me, the frustration of the Tesla service centers trying to charge me money for warranty work was getting to be too much. My last service before I sold the car was after months of Tesla denying that my car had any issues ( when it was still under warranty), all the convenience features, ABS, air suspension, traction control,… went out on the car. The car refused to go in drive. I managed to somehow get to go into drive and drove it straight to a service center. Took them 2 months to ’fix’ the car. Charged me $3,500. I get my car back only to have the same issues come back one week later and I took it right back again. During that week my car was NOT driven and sat in my driveway as my Lucid was already delivered. They fixed it for free but were trying to tell me that the car took a heavy impact on It’s front bumper . Needless to say, I sold the car the following week.

That's unacceptable, my last several daily drivers have been Cadillacs since 1999 and all were tight as a drum with 80K on the clock. My last DD was a CT6 3.0TT and that car was driven hard in the city and burbs, the chassis was still as rigid as new when I sent it down the road this fall. With only 4500 miles on my AGT I'm thinking the Lucid chassis at 80K has an even chance of being close to where it is now at 4500 miles.

1 - I wanted range. I see it as luxury if I can frequent less at fast charging stations.

2 - I thought if I pay 6 figures for a car, I might as well get something unique. Tesla was becoming ubiquitous in my city.

3 - I fall love with Lucid cabin and cockpit design.

4 - I like to root for underdogs. Being an entrepreneur myself, I want to see other startups succeed. Tesla has plenty patrons, Lucid with such narrow market can use my support.

I originally reserved a Touring, but after learning Air received MotorTrend 2022 Car of Year, I went back to change to Dream Edition, but alas the reservation was closed in front of me. I ended up getting GT and asked to be on DE wait list if anyone fall out. In the end, I got delivered Air GT.

NO REGRET! BEST EV HARDWARE EVER!

1,2,3,4, all of it BAM!

 

[Electrified]

PG&E only cares about PG&E. NEM 3 is a total disgrace, which will only hurt the grid and destroy the solar industry.

Utilities Net Metering 3.0 Impact on California Solar - Escondido Times-Advocate

In the past we have talked about how some states have tried to prevent the average citizen from getting solar on their homes, but not California. Think again. This fall, the utilities presented a formidable proposal to the California Public Utilities Commission. The solar industry fought hard...

www.times-advocate.com

I took this out of the link:

On December 15, 2022, the CPUC voted to change that. With NEM 3.0, instead of being credited with $.30/kWh, they will be credited with only $.08/kWh when they use it back. This results in a lower financial gain for the solar customer. The only way to offset this loss is to install storage batteries, so no extra solar goes on the utilities grid, but rather stores in the batteries. That way when the sun goes down and the solar shuts off, the home or business can run off of the battery. This will add to the price of the solar system, but here at Cosmic Solar we have daily requests for battery storage because it also gives you protection during power failures. Unfortunately, it will lengthen the payback years for the purchase of the system, but it will mitigate the financial loss with NEM 3.0.

Being Lucid owners we know are cars are storage batteries, eventually every EV manu will offer something similar to Lucid's bi-directional charger.

 

[nevadagame]

I have a Lucid Touring booked getting close to delivery. But really torn between that and a Model S Plaid. Performance vs Comfort. Roughly same price +/- 10K.

Any thoughts? What would you get?

Thanks in advance!

I own some fine cars, Taycan turbo, Bentley GT BMW iX, many corvettes including C8 with supercharger, to name a few, I am a serious car and thrill addicted car nut, I was driving my air GT this evening and an odd thing happened before, in any of my other cars. Believe me when I say I do get close but tonight was unique. I was literally overcome with emotion, it was hard to explain, but I experienced an overwhelming feeling of automotive perfection, I realized I was experiencing a state of the art driving experience, go ahead and think I’m crazy but it brought actual tears to my eyes. My GT has never had one glitch, never done anything wrong, and gives me the kind of feeling I seriously doubt the model S could ever do. For what ever my opinion is worth.

 

[hydbob]

I own some fine cars, Taycan turbo, Bentley GT BMW iX, many corvettes including C8 with supercharger, to name a few, I am a serious car and thrill addicted car nut, I was driving my air GT this evening and an odd thing happened before, in any of my other cars. Believe me when I say I do get close but tonight was unique. I was literally overcome with emotion, it was hard to explain, but I experienced an overwhelming feeling of automotive perfection, I realized I was experiencing a state of the art driving experience, go ahead and think I’m crazy but it brought actual tears to my eyes. My GT has never had one glitch, never done anything wrong, and gives me the kind of feeling I seriously doubt the model S could ever do. For what ever my opinion is worth.

Wow, compared to your previous posts regarding the Lucid this is quite a turn around...and I'm all for it.

 

[blueice89]

Well lot of people hate my opinion but you should ask yourself what matters to you.

If the following matter to you:

1) Rear entertainment
2) a really Fast car like stupid fast
3) Basic interrior
4) World class leading software and fun features like Dog mode, auto pilot, and Netflix Disney plus
5) The most reliable charge network that exists

Then Plaid is probably a good choice.
What you will get with Lucid:

1) Verified owners badge
2) Smoother ride and quieter
3) Less bass
4) a lot of people will show interest in your car and turn heads.

Overall Lucid is the better overall car if all that matters to you is the car and the driving. If you want an entertainment Machine with a lot of ease and comfort for road tripping then Tesla is better.

For me at least with 1025 hp it’s just like nothing I ever had before. But he prepared the car is not perfect and it’s going to feel not as stable as the Lucid but if you like the other aspects then it’s okay. Lucid is going to ultimately be the better driving experience but it’s not too far off from a Tesla.

So what actually matters to you?

 

[blueice89]

I replaced the Plaid with a Touring and it was a decision that I made without ever setting foot in a Lucid. After having it for 3 weeks, I miss a lot of things about the S, but I'm enjoying the Lucid. The software is a bit buggy, but I'm hopeful they will fix it in due time. In terms of interior and exterior, the Lucid is superior. Tesla is more mature software and features wise.

Curious what do you miss ?

 

[blueice89]

Well lot of people hate my opinion but you should ask yourself what matters to you.

If the following matter to you:

1) Rear entertainment
2) a really Fast car like stupid fast
3) Basic interrior
4) World class leading software and fun features like Dog mode, auto pilot, and Netflix Disney plus
5) The most reliable charge network that exists

Then Plaid is probably a good choice.
What you will get with Lucid:

1) Verified owners badge
2) Smoother ride and quieter
3) Less bass
4) a lot of people will show interest in your car and turn heads.

Overall Lucid is the better overall car if all that matters to you is the car and the driving. If you want an entertainment Machine with a lot of ease and comfort for road tripping then Tesla is better.

For me at least with 1025 hp it’s just like nothing I ever had before. But he prepared the car is not perfect and it’s going to feel not as stable as the Lucid but if you like the other aspects then it’s okay. Lucid is going to ultimately be the better driving experience but it’s not too far off from a Tesla.

So what actually matters to you?

 

[JillyBean]

^^^^^^^^
4. When Tesla model S first came out it turned heads for years because they were RARE
Lucid air will be the same. My debadged Corvette C8 was one of first delivered 2.5 years ago it turned heads like no other for the first two years now it’s just another Corvette lol.

 

[PacificGL]

With Lucid you will get:
- longest range EV per single charge
- fastest charging EV, capable of adding 300 miles in 20 minutes
- engineering excellence with attention to details and quality
- most efficient large electric sedan in the world
- gorgeous-looking car with beautiful interior
- top-notch driving machine with software that is continuously improving

With Tesla you will get:
- aging (12+ years) old design
- clunky hardware with hard and shallow suspension, so you'd enjoy every road imperfection and potholes
- inferior quality that is driven by continuous cost reduction
- cheap looking minimalist interior
- wind noise and a lot of random rattle noise
- really bad customer support
- below average car with software that is aging badly
- FSD that will never reach real FSD level

 

[blueice89]

I love in these descriptions you can tell which one people favor lol

 

[hydbob]

This is exhausting and I'm tired of moderating this thread.

 

[borski]

Well lot of people hate my opinion but you should ask yourself what matters to you.

If the following matter to you:

1) Rear entertainment
2) a really Fast car like stupid fast
3) Basic interrior
4) World class leading software and fun features like Dog mode, auto pilot, and Netflix Disney plus
5) The most reliable charge network that exists

Then Plaid is probably a good choice.
What you will get with Lucid:

1) Verified owners badge
2) Smoother ride and quieter
3) Less bass
4) a lot of people will show interest in your car and turn heads.

Overall Lucid is the better overall car if all that matters to you is the car and the driving. If you want an entertainment Machine with a lot of ease and comfort for road tripping then Tesla is better.

For me at least with 1025 hp it’s just like nothing I ever had before. But he prepared the car is not perfect and it’s going to feel not as stable as the Lucid but if you like the other aspects then it’s okay. Lucid is going to ultimately be the better driving experience but it’s not too far off from a Tesla.

So what actually matters to you?

This is not a fair comparison and you know it. Starting it with “verified owners badge” is solely there to be inflammatory, and that is clearly intentional.

Tesla’s “world class leading software” has been no better for me than my Lucid DE. It crashes constantly (at least there’s a quick reboot), the nav takes me to the wrong place all the time, I have absolutely no idea where anything is - for example, to adjust the wipers I have to… find the wiper button and press it, because there is nothing in the UI for it.

The Lucid bass is *accurate*. The Tesla bass is increased but inaccurate. You may like that, and that’s fine.

Also, there are a dozen things you didn’t list about the Lucid or Tesla - Lucid is far more comfortable for long road trips, the massaging seats are spectacular, the soundstage is world-class (when listening to high quality recordings), it is extremely stable despite being insanely fast, has far more cargo space, far more rear legroom, better interior materials, etc.

My point is, you can make any argument unfair by just listing the things you like about one side and ignoring the other or saying inflammatory things like “verified owners badge.”

Please refrain from such inflammatory posts in the future, as nobody here wants to moderate you but we will if forced to.

Have a nice weekend.