Munro on 14-50 outlets for EV charging, and other worries

[Worldwide Beagle]

Doesn’t make sense to cheap out on a $50 receptacle when we’ve spent $100K on a car. The math doesn’t add up. And replacing the receptacle is easy since the hard parts (breaker and wiring) are already done. Just need a new receptacle, cover plate and a 1/4” torque wrench. Remember to switch the breaker off first. At this point, hard-wiring may be a challenge. Doubtful the pigtail will be long enough to connect to an EVSE. Definitely need to check the slack in the wiring before splurging on a charger. OR Plug in the charger and leave it “permanently” plugged in.

My wife, who only know about mains electrics from hearing me bitch, says the same exact thing. Over and over. Why cheap out to save $75 on a receptacle for a $100k car. Even stranger, some will not bat an eye for speeding $3000 to $6000 for magic goo ceramic coating but whine about $75 receptacle that can substantially reduce the chance their garage will catch on fire.

 

[DeaneG]

Doesn’t make sense to cheap out on a $50 receptacle when we’ve spent $100K on a car. The math doesn’t add up. And replacing the receptacle is easy since the hard parts (breaker and wiring) are already done. Just need a new receptacle, cover plate and a 1/4” torque wrench. Remember to switch the breaker off first...

Agree - but for many, this should be done with by electrician. It's a second language to some of us. Not everyone is capable of doing this safely.

 

[A Fischman]

Did you use the old 10-30's neutral wire as the ground on the 14-30, and leave the 14-30's neutral unconnected? If so, it'll work fine with your mobile charger but could destroy a clothes dryer someone else could plug in sometime in the future. It's also against code. Maybe put a label on the outlet to remind future you or someone else.

If there was a ground wire coming into the junction box, and you used that for the 14-30's ground terminal, great. You'd have all four terminals of the 14-30 properly connected.

Once a year or so, pull the mobile charger plug out after a hour charging your car and test the prongs for warmth again. The issue isn't how the receptacle works on day one, it's how it works after thermal cycling hundreds of times. Like the 14-50, an "industrial" 14-30 will hold up better with time than a "residential" grade piece due to its stiffer construction / better plastic and higher maximum terminal screw torque.

Incidentally, the -30 or -50 at the end of the receptacle type number is also the maximum circuit breaker amperage it is rated for. A 5-15 receptacle (an ordinary 120V household receptacle) is rated for a 15-amp breaker and can handle 15 amps non-continuous use (toaster oven, microwave) or 80% of that for "continuous" duty like EV charging.

There was a ground wire. The original electrician cut it too short, so I got some 14 gauge bare solid copper wire at Home Depot and crimp joined it to the stub that was there. All four terminals on the 14-30 are connected. I checked that the ground on the 14-30 receptacle is indeed grounded. I showed the electrician at Home Depot the result photos and he confirmed that it was done well. Thanks for your feedback.

 

[Worldwide Beagle]

There was a ground wire. The original electrician cut it too short, so I got some 14 gauge bare solid copper wire at Home Depot and crimp joined it to the stub that was there. All four terminals on the 14-30 are connected. I checked that the ground on the 14-30 receptacle is indeed grounded. I showed the electrician at Home Depot the result photos and he confirmed that it was done well. Thanks for your feedback.

Sorry to tell you, what you did a clear and definite violation of the NEC, and every local code. If an electrical inspector saw that install, it would be do flagged. The grounding wire must be 10 gauge, if your current conductors are 10; or 8 gauge grounding wire if your current conductors are 8. That dude at home depot was just that, some dude at home depot assigned to that department, making $20 a hour and talking about shit he has no education about.

If there is a serious electrical short in the wire or equipment, that tiny 14 gauge wire would vaporize in a flash.

You should hire a competent electrician. There are too few Lucid owners out there, we can't afford to loose any.

 

[Worldwide Beagle]

Agree - but for many, this should be done with by electrician. It's a second language to some of us. Not everyone is capable of doing this safely.

My God @DeaneG , to prove you point, look at the post below yours where someone used 14 gauge for grounding in a 30 amp circuit and relied on some random dude in HD for advice.

 

[lucidtouringman]

There was a ground wire. The original electrician cut it too short, so I got some 14 gauge bare solid copper wire at Home Depot and crimp joined it to the stub that was there. All four terminals on the 14-30 are connected. I checked that the ground on the 14-30 receptacle is indeed grounded. I showed the electrician at Home Depot the result photos and he confirmed that it was done well. Thanks for your feedback.

Umm.. free consulting advice... that violates multiple NFPA/NEC codes ...and the F in NFPA stands for Fire... please please spend the $150 for having a licensed electrician do it right. Also whoever you hire, their licenses can be looked up online to ensure they're not lying to you about being licensed.. when selecting potential electricians... I had several of them lie to me about them being actively licensed.

 

[Worldwide Beagle]

Umm.. free consulting advice... that violates multiple NFPA/NEC codes ...and the F in NFPA stands for Fire... please please spend the $150 for having a licensed electrician do it right. Also whoever you hire, their licenses can be looked up online to ensure they're not lying to you about being licensed.. when selecting potential electricians... I had several of them lie to me about them being actively licensed.

Worse, the master electrician will be at a desk in the shop, the journeyman will be outside in his truck smoking and eating doughnuts, and some poor schmuck kid pulls the be wire.

I have seen Masters be sloppy and lazy, like still using cheap back stabbing receptacles, overload conduit, run Romex in mortar.

When I called for the rough on my 1910 rewired home, the inspector stood dumbfounded looking at the first ceiling. I asked why. He said he had only seen wiring like that in text books, never on site. All I did was use 1" PVC conduit to protect Romex lines penetrating 12" thick masonry walls.

 

[A Fischman]

Sorry to tell you, what you did a clear and definite violation of the NEC, and every local code. If an electrical inspector saw that install, it would be do flagged. The grounding wire must be 10 gauge, if your current conductors are 10; or 8 gauge grounding wire if your current conductors are 8. That dude at home depot was just that, some dude at home depot assigned to that department, making $20 a hour and talking about shit he has no education about.

If there is a serious electrical short in the wire or equipment, that tiny 14 gauge wire would vaporize in a flash.

You should hire a competent electrician. There are too few Lucid owners out there, we can't afford to loose any.

I misstated the gauge of the ground wire. It actually is 10 gauge. Sorry.

 

[Electrified]

Contact NECA If you're looking for the electrical contractors that employ the highest quality trained electricians in your geographical area.

Find a Contractor|List of Electrical Contractors|NECA

NECA Contractors perform the safest and most innovative electrical work in the country We help you find the right contractor for your home or business.

www.necanet.org

 

[emoylv]

Agree - but for many, this should be done with by electrician. It's a second language to some of us. Not everyone is capable of doing this safely.

If one is not comfortable with doing it yourself, definitely hire an electrician. Be aware that it takes a knowledgeable homeowner about 15 minutes to accomplish this, an electrician most likely even less time, so don't get gouged by a ridiculously high estimate. Look for a torque wrench or screwdriver. That would be my indicator of a professional job. Torque, wait 15 minutes, retorque. 75 inch-lbs.

ALWAYS have a healthy respect for electricity, especially when working around 220-240 volts; it can and will bite you. I don't know what comes after quadruple, but I do more than that in checking to make sure everything is OFF before I touch anything. The magic Greenlee chirping "pencil" is a god-send. Klein makes an equivalent product. You wave it next to a power wire; if it chirps, it's still live. It's my last procedure before I touch a wire. Then I wear leather gloves. Want to see ALL of you alive and well so we can continue complimenting and complaining about our cars lol!

 

[emoylv]

If one is not comfortable with doing it yourself, definitely hire an electrician. Be aware that it takes a knowledgeable homeowner about 15 minutes to accomplish this, an electrician most likely even less time, so don't get gouged by a ridiculously high estimate. Look for a torque wrench or screwdriver. That would be my indicator of a professional job. Torque, wait 15 minutes, retorque. 75 inch-lbs.

ALWAYS have a healthy respect for electricity, especially when working around 220-240 volts; it can and will bite you. I don't know what comes after quadruple, but I do more than that in checking to make sure everything is OFF before I touch anything. The magic Greenlee chirping "pencil" is a god-send. Klein makes an equivalent product. You wave it next to a power wire; if it chirps, it's still live. It's my last procedure before I touch a wire. Then I wear leather gloves. Want to see ALL of you alive and well so we can continue complimenting and complaining about our cars lol!

I meant 15 minutes to replace the receptacle only.

 

[A Fischman]

If one is not comfortable with doing it yourself, definitely hire an electrician. Be aware that it takes a knowledgeable homeowner about 15 minutes to accomplish this, an electrician most likely even less time, so don't get gouged by a ridiculously high estimate. Look for a torque wrench or screwdriver. That would be my indicator of a professional job. Torque, wait 15 minutes, retorque. 75 inch-lbs.

ALWAYS have a healthy respect for electricity, especially when working around 220-240 volts; it can and will bite you. I don't know what comes after quadruple, but I do more than that in checking to make sure everything is OFF before I touch anything. The magic Greenlee chirping "pencil" is a god-send. Klein makes an equivalent product. You wave it next to a power wire; if it chirps, it's still live. It's my last procedure before I touch a wire. Then I wear leather gloves. Want to see ALL of you alive and well so we can continue complimenting and complaining about our cars lol!

Thank you for the friendly reply. I have and did use the torque screwdriver. I always use a volt meter to check the line before doing anything. Your advice about the leather gloves and Greenlee chirping "pencil' is well taken. I have the gloves and will get the "pencil". Have a great holiday.