Luck o' the Irish

[hmp10]

So what are you hoping for? I assume total loss? And you should spring for the Sapphire!

I'm on the fence. Part of me wants to keep the best car I've ever owned, and part of me is afraid of a car that will have had that much repair. I've been doing a lot of thinking about what I would do if the car is totaled, including whether I would switch to a Sapphire. At this point, I think not, and for four reasons.

First, "Motor Trend" just published a first-drive review of the prototype. While they thought the Sapphire's dynamics bordered on other-worldly, they found the ride to be quite stiff with more interior noise. (Derek Jenkins had said in an interview that the Sapphire would still "ride like a Lucid", which I hoped would perhaps mean firmer damper settings in some modes but less in the way of much stiffer springs and bushings. The MT review suggested otherwise.)

Second, the Air is already a low car for this 71-year-old with ortho woes, and MT said the Sapphire is even lower.

Third, after having already been through the hassle of two flats with the Air, I'm not sure I want to add the additional logistical headaches of finding tire services that can deal with center-hub-mounted wheels, especially on a road trip.

Fourth, after seeing what's involved when these cars get into accidents, the Sapphire would ratchet the headaches up considerably. As insurers who underwrote Lucids at reasonable rates before the loss data began to build come to understand the costs of repairing these cars, I suspect insurance rates will soon begin to climb appreciably. I shudder to think what it would cost to insure a Sapphire.

Bottom line on the Sapphire in my view: it best serves two purposes. One is at the race track, where it might well reign supreme but where I would not take it. The other is to be a rarely-driven garage queen in a collection of exotics . . . and that is also not for me.

If our car is totaled, what I would most like to do is find its exact match in an undamaged used Dream Edition P. I've got my eye on one and am on tenterhooks hoping it stays available long enough for State Farm to decide the fate of our car.

One thing I know: I don't want to replace it with anything other than another Lucid.

 

[Lucken]

Objectively it seems like State Farm would save considerable money by repairing the car as opposed to totaling it. It seems as if totaling it would be double or more the cost of repair, unless I'm missing something.

 

[Adnillien]

Objectively it seems like State Farm would save considerable money by repairing the car as opposed to totaling it. It seems as if totaling it would be double or more the cost of repair, unless I'm missing something.

You are missing the salvage value if totaled. Its hard to estimate but factors into State Farm's decision.

 

[xponents]

I'm on the fence. Part of me wants to keep the best car I've ever owned, and part of me is afraid of a car that will have had that much repair. I've been doing a lot of thinking about what I would do if the car is totaled, including whether I would switch to a Sapphire. At this point, I think not, and for four reasons.

First, "Motor Trend" just published a first-drive review of the prototype. While they thought the Sapphire's dynamics bordered on other-worldly, they found the ride to be quite stiff with more interior noise. (Derek Jenkins had said in an interview that the Sapphire would still "ride like a Lucid", which I hoped would perhaps mean firmer damper settings in some modes but less in the way of much stiffer springs and bushings. The MT review suggested otherwise.)

Second, the Air is already a low car for this 71-year-old with ortho woes, and MT said the Sapphire is even lower.

Third, after having already been through the hassle of two flats with the Air, I'm not sure I want to add the additional logistical headaches of finding tire services that can deal with center-hub-mounted wheels, especially on a road trip.

Fourth, after seeing what's involved when these cars get into accidents, the Sapphire would ratchet the headaches up considerably. As insurers who underwrote Lucids at reasonable rates before the loss data began to build come to understand the costs of repairing these cars, I suspect insurance rates will soon begin to climb appreciably. I shudder to think what it would cost to insure a Sapphire.

Bottom line on the Sapphire in my view: it best serves two purposes. One is at the race track, where it might well reign supreme but where I would not take it. The other is to be a rarely-driven garage queen in a collection of exotics . . . and that is also not for me.

If our car is totaled, what I would most like to do is find its exact match in an undamaged used Dream Edition P. I've got my eye on one and am on tenterhooks hoping it stays available long enough for State Farm to decide the fate of our car.

One thing I know: I don't want to replace it with anything other than another Lucid.

Its a dream 1 less of 520

 

[hmp10]

Objectively it seems like State Farm would save considerable money by repairing the car as opposed to totaling it. It seems as if totaling it would be double or more the cost of repair, unless I'm missing something.

State Farm said they usually total cars if the repairs reach 75% of the replacement value. Of course, there are some factors that might tip the call one way or the other, such as damage to a critical non-reparable component such as that "horseshoe" in the Lucid.

The rub is that they tell me they don't have any real database yet for Lucid resale and salvage values.

 

[hmp10]

Now that I've had time to look over the 6-page preliminary repair estimate in detail, the prices for some parts were lower than I would have guessed. All the prices seemed reasonable, in particular these items:

Front Hood - $768.05

Headlamp - $1,143.32

Forged 21 x 8.5 Wheel - $925

The most expensive item was the front subframe assembly at $2,517.65.

Having owned Audi R8s and Mercedes AMGs, it seems Lucid is not trying to make replacement parts a big profit center, at least at this stage.

Back in the '90's when BGAM (a GE / Bosch joint venture for automotive motors) was charging Ford $14 for a window lift motor, Ford was selling it at its Parts counters for $112.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

Now that I've had time to look over the 6-page preliminary repair estimate in detail, the prices for some parts were lower than I would have guessed. All the prices seemed reasonable, in particular these items:

Front Hood - $768.05

Headlamp - $1,143.32

Forged 21 x 8.5 Wheel - $925

The most expensive item was the front subframe assembly at $2,517.65.

Having owned Audi R8s and Mercedes AMGs, it seems Lucid is not trying to make replacement parts a big profit center, at least at this stage.

Back in the '90's when BGAM (a GE / Bosch joint venture for automotive motors) was charging Ford $14 for a window lift motor, Ford was selling it at its Parts counters for $112.

One repair I paid for out of pocket was window trim that was damaged by a rock. It was not expensive at all, cost more to recalibrate the ADAS because they had to take the door apart and cameras in the mirror to do the repair.

 

[SaratogaLefty]

Now that I've had time to look over the 6-page preliminary repair estimate in detail, the prices for some parts were lower than I would have guessed. All the prices seemed reasonable, in particular these items:

Front Hood - $768.05

Headlamp - $1,143.32

Forged 21 x 8.5 Wheel - $925

The most expensive item was the front subframe assembly at $2,517.65.

Having owned Audi R8s and Mercedes AMGs, it seems Lucid is not trying to make replacement parts a big profit center, at least at this stage.

Back in the '90's when BGAM (a GE / Bosch joint venture for automotive motors) was charging Ford $14 for a window lift motor, Ford was selling it at its Parts counters for $112.

So I suspect the labor will be the really big item.

 

[hmp10]

So I suspect the labor will be the really big item.

Yes, and there's a $40/hr difference between what the body shop charges and what State Farm claims is "reasonable" for the area. Lucid tells me, though, that most of their certified shops will have similar differences from the volume shops that insurers like to use. These shops have to invest in special tooling for certain Lucid repairs, and they have to send personnel to California for training by Lucid. As the Lucid is a low-volume car at this point, only high-end shops that specialize in exotics and ultra-luxury cars will sign up for that investment.

Here's the certified shop nearest the Riviera Beach Service Center:

Fantastic Finishes – Luxury Collision Repair Center

Luxury Collision Repair Center

ffpalmbeach.com

 

[borski]

Yes, and there's a $40/hr difference between what the body shop charges and what State Farm claims is "reasonable" for the area. Lucid tells me, though, that most of their certified shops will have similar differences from the volume shops that insurers like to use. These shops have to invest in special tooling for certain Lucid repairs, and they have to send personnel to California for training by Lucid. As the Lucid is a low-volume car at this point, only high-end shops that specialize in exotics and ultra-luxury cars will sign up for that investment.

Here's the certified shop nearest the Riviera Beach Service Center:

Fantastic Finishes – Luxury Collision Repair Center

Luxury Collision Repair Center

ffpalmbeach.com

This is why I’m glad I’m with an insurer like PURE (or Cincinnati or Chubb or AIG or others) who specialize in these sorts of claims. They’re a bit more expensive, but it’s agreed value, great coverage, etc.

 

[Bobby]

Its a dream 1 less of 520

Likely it would be repaired and sold with a salvage or rebuilt title. Parts is the issue.

 

[hmp10]

This is why I’m glad I’m with an insurer like PURE (or Cincinnati or Chubb or AIG or others) who specialize in these sorts of claims. They’re a bit more expensive, but it’s agreed value, great coverage, etc.

I'm waiting to see how things play out with State Farm. I had a conversation with them Friday that gave me some hope we may all get on the same page. However, I'm also going to explore other insurers. I used Chubb when I lived in Connecticut and had a large collection of antiques to cover but never had a claim to test that aspect of their coverage. Their website only shows three agents in Florida, though, and none are in my part of the state. My attempts to get through to the nearest one have been met with voicemail boxes so far.

Florida is the inverse of many other states, in that many insurers don't want to underwrite homeowners insurance in Florida because of hurricane risk but welcome auto coverage. So it can be tricky to get bundled HO/Auto coverage here. In Massachusetts, where fraudulent insurance claims are a cottage industry, trying to get reasonable car insurance was a nightmare.

The body shop told me that they've had smooth sailing with GEICO and Progressive on expensive repairs, which kind of surprised me. I've used GEICO before but, again, had no experience with filing claims with them.

Having lived in 10 states, I've been with a lot of insurance companies over the years and dealt with everything from trying to insure homes in earthquake zones (the Hollywood Hills of L.A., where our fault-line geosurvey read like a novel) to Florida (where our house has been through two hurricanes -- Irma and Ian).

In 55 years of driving I've never had an at-fault insurance claim, and in 40 years of home ownership I've only had two HO claims (for lightning strikes in Connecticut and Florida), so my experience has been more with rates than with claims.

 

[Volund]

So sorry to hear about the accident @hmp10
Im glad no one was hurt and you were able to walk away hopefully with no long lasting pain or injury.

Do you remember if the Lucid reacted to the Subaru and attempted to stop, did it mitigate the damage? Was the security and ADAS systems satisfactory from what you experienced?

From the EU tests, I remember Lucid being a bit weak to detect diagonal objects coming towards the Lucid around exactly where the front pillars would be.

I also have State Farm and am curious how they handle things as I don't have many insurance options here in Utah.

 

[hmp10]

So sorry to hear about the accident @hmp10
Im glad no one was hurt and you were able to walk away hopefully with no long lasting pain or injury.

Do you remember if the Lucid reacted to the Subaru and attempted to stop, did it mitigate the damage? Was the security and ADAS systems satisfactory from what you experienced?

From the EU tests, I remember Lucid being a bit weak to detect diagonal objects coming towards the Lucid around exactly where the front pillars would be.

I also have State Farm and am curious how they handle things as I don't have many insurance options here in Utah.

The accident happened so fast that I don't remember much. The Subaru was following behind a pickup that was making the turn, and we didn't see it until the last instant before the crash. The Subaru driver said the same thing about not seeing us because of the pickup truck. (People drive some monster pickups down here.) I wasn't even aware the airbags had deployed until I registered the strong reek of the explosive gas. Neither of us had any recollection of how the car responded or even of the seat belts tensioning, although the car's computer reported that they did.

I'm not even sure whether I had time to get on the brakes. But since no one in either car was injured in the least and all the damage to both cars was forward of their A pillars, something must have braked our car fairly effectively before the crash, and I don't know what that would have been other than the collision avoidance system. Here's the diagram from the police report, which is quite accurate (we were V2):

As for State Farm, they and the Lucid-certified shop I'm using have something of a "history" with each other. I'll know more after State Farm examines the car on Tuesday and reviews the shop's estimates with them.

 

[Amster]

As someone who recently lost their Lucid in an accident, I was happy it was totalled. It took Safeco a few weeks to decide, and I was kind of worried they might decide to repair it.

 

[hmp10]

As someone who recently lost their Lucid in an accident, I was happy it was totalled. It took Safeco a few weeks to decide, and I was kind of worried they might decide to repair it.

Would you want to share any details of your accident?

 

[Amster]

Would you want to share any details of your accident?

Look at this thread: https://lucidowners.com/threads/thi...r-air-into-a-wall-of-rock-at-high-speed.4843/
Basically my husband tried to pass a few slow moving cars on a two lane mountainous road, and ran out of space. In order not to roll over into the canyon, he spun the car back into the road. We're not sure how fast he was going, he says the pedal was floored. In a GT, that's usually very fast.

 

[hmp10]

Look at this thread: https://lucidowners.com/threads/thi...r-air-into-a-wall-of-rock-at-high-speed.4843/
Basically my husband tried to pass a few slow moving cars on a two lane mountainous road, and ran out of space. In order not to roll over into the canyon, he spun the car back into the road. We're not sure how fast he was going, he says the pedal was floored. In a GT, that's usually very fast.

Wow, I had missed that thread. I'm glad you both fared so well from such a crash. Ours was at a lower speed but, like you, we found the car to be built like a tank.

Your comments about how this accident happened were interesting. I was told by someone at Lucid that the southeast region of the U.S. is seeing 8-9 wrecked Lucids a week. I commented that seemed an extraordinarily high number and was told many of the accidents are the result of drivers not being used to the kind of power these cars produce and how fast that power comes on. It reminded me that in the initial months after the Tesla Plaid's release there were frequent news stories and videos of them crashing.

I purchased my first EV eight years ago -- a Tesla Model S P90D. Even though I had owned high-performance ICE cars, I had never experienced the speed and fluidity with which the power comes on in high-performance EVs and how fast they can get to astonishing speeds with the driver getting little sense of it. A neighbor who is retired law enforcement took our Model S Plaid out right after we got it. A punch of the throttle took him north of 120 mph before he realized it. Once he did, he pulled over and asked me to drive the car back home. He was literally afraid of it. I offered him a drive in our Lucid Air Dream Performance when we took delivery a few months later, and he declined when I told him the horsepower figures.

As attracted as I am to high-performance EVs, I am seriously worried about their going mainstream. I would not want to meet any of the three EVs I've owned on the road with a teenager or young adult driver behind the wheel. Fortunately, most cannot afford them right now, but that's going to change as battery prices continue to drop.

 

[Lucken]

Your comments about how this accident happened were interesting. I was told by someone at Lucid that the southeast region of the U.S. is seeing 8-9 wrecked Lucids a week. I commented that seemed an extraordinarily high number and was told many of the accidents are the result of drivers not being used to the kind of power these cars produce and how fast the power comes on.

I remember charging at my neighborhood EA charging spot and speaking with the owner of a Porsche Taycan turbo who was charging next to me. In discussing the car, he said there was no way he would let a teenager drive the Porsche turbo, insisting the odds of them killing themself would be about 90%. He went on to say that driver training for a car like his Porsche should be almost mandatory.

At the end of our discussion he surprised me with his final assessment. He loved the car but would never buy a car that fast again. Despite his many years of driving experience, he felt the car was too fast, even for him. In his opinion there was no need for this kind of speed. Obviously there are those that would disagree with him, but I’m not one of them.

 

[hmp10]

He loved the car but would never buy a car that fast again. Despite his many years of driving experience, he felt the car was too fast, even for him. In his opinion there was no need for this kind of speed. Obviously there are those that would disagree with him, but I’m not one of them.

I'm not one of them, either. However, I do not drive or even like to drive at particularly high speeds. What I like about the prodigious power and instant torque delivery of performance EVs is their low-end acceleration and their responsiveness in conditions which call for frequent changes in speed.

The combination of an EVs instant throttle response and high regenerative braking is driving nirvana for me on today's crowded highways and byways. Using just one foot, one can quickly and precisely plant the car exactly where you want it.

The Air Dream excels at this . . . and throws in amazing handling when open roads invite.