Luck o' the Irish

[Coltonw011]

Yikes, sorry for the headaches. I really hope it smoothed out.

If it’s the kids first car like I thought I read, they are on their parents policy, which holds them liable from there. Again, I hope it doesn’t come to that.

 

[hmp10]

The car is titled to the kid although it's on the mother's policy.

Notice this phrase, though, in the letter I got from State Farm:

"You may be responsible for charges that exceed what is reasonable in the local market area."

If in a charitable mood, I can at best view this as disingenuous language meant to confuse the uninitiated. This was an accident that the police determined was 100% the fault of the other driver. I am responsible for NO charges, as long as they are legitimate (which is different from "what State Farm deems reasonable"). There are two parties -- and two parties only -- who are responsible for payment of my legitimate costs: the at-fault driver and his insurer.

This is sheer bellicosity on the part of State Farm, meant to intimidate those who do not understand legal liability.

 

[Coltonw011]

The car is titled to the kid although it's on the mother's policy.

Notice this phrase, though, in the letter I got from State Farm:

"You may be responsible for charges that exceed what is reasonable in the local market area."

If in a charitable mood, I can at best view this as disingenuous language meant to confuse the uninitiated. This was an accident that the police determined was 100% the fault of the other driver. I am responsible for NO charges, as long as they are legitimate (which is different from "what State Farm deems reasonable"). There are two parties -- and two parties only -- who are responsible for payment of my legitimate costs: the at-fault driver and his insurer.

This is sheer bellicosity on the part of State Farm, meant to intimidate those who do not understand legal liability.

I couldn’t agree more. You should have to do nothing and I hope that’s how it goes. If it doesn’t, give them hell. Unacceptable and shoddy business, fortunately, I don’t see you rolling over like they may be hoping for.

 

[SaratogaLefty]

The car is titled to the kid although it's on the mother's policy.

Notice this phrase, though, in the letter I got from State Farm:

"You may be responsible for charges that exceed what is reasonable in the local market area."

If in a charitable mood, I can at best view this as disingenuous language meant to confuse the uninitiated. This was an accident that the police determined was 100% the fault of the other driver. I am responsible for NO charges, as long as they are legitimate (which is different from "what State Farm deems reasonable"). There are two parties -- and two parties only -- who are responsible for payment of my legitimate costs: the at-fault driver and his insurer.

This is sheer bellicosity on the part of State Farm, meant to intimidate those who do not understand legal liability.

Best of luck!! I think it is fair to say that everyone here on this Forum is totally in agreement with your position. I don't have State Farm but I've always thought they were a good insurer. Perhaps I've been misinformed. I really hope this all gets resolved in your favor soon and you don't have to resort to lawsuits.

 

[NoseyReporter]

Sorry about the car and the resulting headache with the insurance company. I've seen people fight this fight before and win, so there is hope. It will just be a long and drawn out process. Best of luck.

 

[Cosmo Cruz]

Excellent post / follow-up. Insurance problems were not even on my radar. Thanks for the heads-up. Glad everyone OK.
Had a close call last week = my fault. Still not used to the huge blind spot created by the A pillars. Especially bad when you are on an up-hill slope at an intersection. Practicing doing the jig-jag head bobs necessary to see what's behind them.

 

[hmp10]

As frustrated as I'm getting with my interactions with State Farm, I have been mightily impressed by Lucid's behind-the-scenes activities related to what happens with their cars in the hands of owners.

The certified repair shops coordinate closely with Lucid. The morning after our accident, Lucid had already obtained my VIN from the shop and checked the car's behavior during the crash -- did the seat belts tighten, did collision avoidance braking engage, etc. -- to be sure the car responded as engineered. And that report was sent to me by the shop shortly afterward.

The accident management person Lucid hired as liaison with the repair shops has 15 years of experience in aluminum bodywork. He stays in touch with the shops throughout the repair process and reviews every line item of parts, labor, and prices submitted by the shops. He also reports to Lucid Engineering anything found suggesting surprises with how the structure of the car handled the crash.

Then the car goes to a Lucid Service Center for checking the high-voltage systems, sensor calibration, and any other possible issues not addressed at the body shop.

These are things which marketing folks don't put out there about the company but that really indicate how dead serious Lucid is about putting a quality product on the road.

While I will probably switch insurers after this is over, I am more convinced than ever that there will be other Lucids in our household.

In fact, should State Farm decide to total this car, I want to replace it with as near its like as I can find -- a red Dream P -- and I'm already on the prowl.

 

[Pete44]

As frustrated as I'm getting with my interactions with State Farm, I have been mightily impressed by Lucid's behind-the-scenes activities related to what happens with their cars in the hands of owners.

The certified repair shops coordinate closely with Lucid. The morning after our accident, Lucid had already obtained my VIN from the shop and checked the car's behavior during the crash -- did the seat belts tighten, did collision avoidance braking engage, etc. -- to be sure the car responded as engineered. And that report was sent to me by the shop shortly afterward.

The accident management person Lucid hired as liaison with the repair shops has 15 years of experience in aluminum bodywork. He stays in touch with the shops throughout the repair process and reviews every line item of parts, labor, and prices submitted by the shops. He also reports to Lucid Engineering anything found suggesting surprises with how the structure of the car handled the crash.

Then the car goes to a Lucid Service Center for checking the high-voltage systems, sensor calibration, and any other possible issues not addressed at the body shop.

These are things which marketing folks don't put out there about the company but that really indicate how dead serious Lucid is about putting a quality product on the road.

While I will probably switch insurers after this is over, I am more convinced than ever that there will be other Lucids in our household.

In fact, should State Farm decide to total this car, I want to replace it with as near its like as I can find -- a red Dream P -- and I'm already on the prowl.

First, I'm really sorry you had the accident and poor experience with State Farm (totally not a surprise). But I thought for sure if this was totaled you would be getting the Sapphire!

 

[Electrified]

As frustrated as I'm getting with my interactions with State Farm, I have been mightily impressed by Lucid's behind-the-scenes activities related to what happens with their cars in the hands of owners.

The certified repair shops coordinate closely with Lucid. The morning after our accident, Lucid had already obtained my VIN from the shop and checked the car's behavior during the crash -- did the seat belts tighten, did collision avoidance braking engage, etc. -- to be sure the car responded as engineered. And that report was sent to me by the shop shortly afterward.

The accident management person Lucid hired as liaison with the repair shops has 15 years of experience in aluminum bodywork. He stays in touch with the shops throughout the repair process and reviews every line item of parts, labor, and prices submitted by the shops. He also reports to Lucid Engineering anything found suggesting surprises with how the structure of the car handled the crash.

Then the car goes to a Lucid Service Center for checking the high-voltage systems, sensor calibration, and any other possible issues not addressed at the body shop.

These are things which marketing folks don't put out there about the company but that really indicate how dead serious Lucid is about putting a quality product on the road.

While I will probably switch insurers after this is over, I am more convinced than ever that there will be other Lucids in our household.

In fact, should State Farm decide to total this car, I want to replace it with as near its like as I can find -- a red Dream P -- and I'm already on the prowl.

Glad to hear about the incredible attention that Lucid is giving you and your car!! Nothing like a positive customer experience to retain customers and grow the customer base by word of mouth.

 

[xponents]

Glad to hear about the incredible attention that Lucid is giving you and your car!! Nothing like a positive customer experience to retain customers and grow the customer base by word of mouth.

Read the first post: it wasnt all flowers for lucid.(im as much a lucid fan as anybody else(

 

[hmp10]

Read the first post: it wasnt all flowers for lucid.(im as much a lucid fan as anybody else(

Yes, I was frustrated that I couldn't get through to Customer Service for advice on what to do and not do with the car to avoid further damage at the crash scene. However, everything about Lucid's involvement since has redeemed them, and then some.

While Lucid does need to set up a way to get to the head of the queue with Customer Service in such a situation, I have come to see this is a bug that needs fixing but nothing indicative of any systemic failure. The speed and scope of their actions in handling matters behind the scenes -- not all of which I will discuss here -- has really been unlike anything I have ever experienced with an automaker.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

Yes, I was frustrated that I couldn't get through to Customer Service for advice on what to do and not do with the car to avoid further damage at the crash scene. However, everything about Lucid's involvement since has redeemed them, and then some.

While Lucid does need to set up a way to get to the head of the queue with Customer Service in such a situation, I have come to see this is a bug that needs fixing but nothing indicative of any systemic failure. The speed and scope of their actions in handling matters behind the scenes -- not all of which I will discuss here -- has really been unlike anything I have ever experienced with an automaker.

Yeah, even though I’m fortunate enough this far to not need their response for an accident, in all my dealings with Lucid the recurring theme over and over has been they care very much about doing a good job and work very hard at it, and if something doesn’t happen the way you expected or wanted there’s usually a reason and it’s usually something that was already on Lucid’s radar to improve or there’s a good explanation. Whenever my car nears the end of its life cycle I definitely intend to get another Lucid.

 

[Electrified]

Read the first post: it wasnt all flowers for lucid.(im as much a lucid fan as anybody else(

I did read the first post and it's in the rearview mirror, but I'm really the digging the reponse that they have now as I'm thinking it can only help @hmp10 in his efforts to build a case to get SP to cover this accident in a way that will have him smiling at the end of the day.

In regards to CS I read some different posts here in the forum and it's alien to me because the CS I have recvieved here in Chicago has been nothing short of outstanding; if anyone from Lucid is reading this you should have all your CS folks spend a month at Chicago GI learning how to do it right.

 

[Tesla2.0]

Coming home from dinner the evening before St. Patrick's Day:

View attachment 10591
View attachment 10592

Last night we were driving home when a pickup truck made a left turn in front of us. The truck had plenty of room and cleared the intersection safely. But right on his tail following him through the turn was a Subaru WRX driven by a young kid. We did not see him until it was too late, and he later told the police he did not see us because his view was blocked by the pickup. The police found him 100% at fault for failure to yield right of way.

The kid was actually quite polite. The first thing he said getting out of the car was to ask if we were all right. (We were.) Then he apologized profusely. He called his parents who came to the scene and were also just as nice. I ended up feeling really sorry for the kid. This was his first car, which he had only had three weeks. And I can't imagine what this is going to do to his insurance rates for the next few years. (We ere both with State Farm.)

A few observations from the incident:

While pretty much everything forward of the A pillar in the Air is damaged, the car fared considerably better than the Subaru. Even the left front wheel nearest the impact point shows no damage. Nothing aft of the A pillar seems out of line. In short . . . built like a tank.

All the airbags did their job. Even though it was a relatively low speed collision, neither of us in the Air had any discomfort from the activation of the airbags.

After the police arrived and took in the scene, they asked us to move the cars out of the intersection. The Subaru could be moved, but the Air was giving us a "Drive System Failure" message and would not go into gear. However, when the tow truck arrived almost an hour later, the driver was able to drive the Air up onto the flatbed.

While we were waiting for the tow truck, I called Lucid to find out what authorized repair facility the car should be towed to. I also wanted any advice they might give me about moving the car. Having experienced long waits with Customer Service calls, I punched in Roadside Assistance on the IVR. They answered quickly. However, it turns out they are a contract service and could not tell me which were the authorized repair shops in our region. They told me to hold while they switched me over to Lucid Customer Service. I remained on hold over 20 minutes and finally had to hang up as the police needed to go over some things with me. After that was done, I called Lucid Customer Service again and again was left on hold. When the two truck arrived more than a half hour later, I was still on hold for Customer Service and, once again, just hung up. Right now the car is at a tow lot, leaving me hoping that phantom drain does not kill the battery before I can get the car someplace where it can be plugged in.

Conclusions:

The car is very well built.

Customer Service is useless in such a situation.

I just read thru this thread. First of all, it really breaks my heart to see a Lucid Air gets damaged like this, especially a zenith red that I can relate and adore. Secondly, it is a blessing no one in your family is hurt, and that is most important thing in life —- health and well-being. Thirdly, I hope Lucid management team is reading and studying this thread and thus improve their Customer Care response rate at the point of airbag deployment. Data Server really should have sent SOS signal to notify Customer Care to call you right away to assist as what premium luxury brand should be offering. And lastly, I feel somewhat infuriating of petty experience State Farm rendered to you. It alarms me to review my own Geico policy.

Thank you for taking time to share your post-accident process and experience. It is eyes opener and much to learn for different aspects of our first luxury EV ownership.

 

[hmp10]

I did read the first post and it's in the rearview mirror, but I'm really the digging the reponse that they have now as I'm thinking it can only help @hmp10 in his efforts to build a case to get SP to cover this accident in a way that will have him smiling at the end of the day.

In regards to CS I read some different posts here in the forum and it's alien to me because the CS I have recvieved here in Chicago has been nothing short of outstanding; if anyone from Lucid is reading this you should have all your CS folks spend a month at Chicago GI learning how to do it right.

I should clarify that the issue about accident response is with the call center in California. My experience with the Service Center in Riviera Beach, FL, where actual work is done on the cars, has been quite good, both in terms of responsiveness and work quality.

 

[hmp10]

In insurance, everything is governed by the contract (policy) terms. If the Policy allows SF to do what it says, then you are screwed. If it doesn't, what does it say about reimbursement? Most insurers say that if you go to one of their approved body shops, you don't pay extra. Did SF offer up body shops? If they did, and you picked one, I wonder what would happen. They can't just pick up a wonderbox from Autozone.

I need to update my earlier answer to you, in which I said there was nothing in the State Farm liability policy about "reasonable" costs. When I had time to read the entire policy, I found such a clause on Page 30.

However, State Farm's statement to me by phone and letter that I am responsible for charges beyond what they pay is flat out wrong. The person who caused the accident (the police deemed him 100% responsible in this case) has the ultimate responsibility for the costs of my repairs. He cannot avoid that liability by claiming his insurance limits are tapped out.

Unlike State Farm, courts will look at factors such as why Lucid requires the use a certified shop, the reasons why non-Lucid parts are not available, and the reasons the shop might charge above prevailing local rates. I think it would be easy to prevail on all of these points in the case of a low-volume, state-of-the-art electric car new to the market.

 

[Cosmo Cruz]

I just read thru this thread. First of all, it really breaks my heart to see a Lucid Air gets damaged like this, especially a zenith red that I can relate and adore.

You missed something: it's a Dream Edition ...

Thank you for taking time to share your post-accident process and experience. It is eyes opener and much to learn for different aspects of our first luxury EV ownership.

Yes @hmp 10 's post and follow-ups and the commentary are outstanding. This is why I visit here, even though I already know everything.

 

[hmp10]

Glad to hear no serious injury here.
Hopefully, only transient musculoskeletal pain.

We're now 5 days after the accident and are amazed at how "gentle" this collision felt. Neither of us has any recollection of impact from the airbags or pressure from tensioning of the seatbelts. Nor have we had the least sign of soreness or stiffness at the scene or any time since.

I think the combination of collision avoidance braking, the robustness of the Air's structure, and the placement and blast pattern of the airbags was remarkably effective in protecting us.

 

[Cosmo Cruz]

I think this may have to do with the "crumple zone" on the child's ill-advised hot rod (looks like a WRX ? = parent's asking for trouble). Looks like he hit a strong point on your Dream Edition, whilst his took the hit "head on", where a car is designed to absorb energy to save occupants. Glad to hear you are all OK.

but:
{for context: I was rear-ended by a drunk kid whilst I was stopped at a red light. His Neon had nothing in front of the firewall = completely crushed like a bier can, and I drove home. My rare Silver Arrow Edition R-129 was totaled but drivable ... auto roll bar deployed and auto-tensioner seat belts locked, enough force to tweek the Merc. so hard top would not fit / wheel scraping bent-in fender, etc... but everythng worked and drivable, and not even noticible unless you looked closely. Here's the thing:
The EMT questioned me about "you sure you don't want a ride to the ER?" to which I replied 'no thanks, I"m OK" I was holding my chest area unconsciously.... they hung around next to me ??? waiting for a pay-day I thought. But I drove home anyway because I did not want to leave my dream car to the vultures. Three hours later I woke, felt a bit sore around my belly (substantial at that time), got out of bed for a pissah, and felt the worst pain ever trying to get there (went to eleven)= spasms that were so powerful I soon blacked-out from the pain and collapsed against the bathroom door. My spouse heard this but could not open the door as I had fallen against it. When I came too I couldn't move for the pain, tried to, and blacked-out again. Next time I came to wife threatened to call ambulance, so I managed to get it together and fight the pain. At the ER it went " ALL HANDS ON DECK" and every tech = doctor in the place ran to me. OK = " 65 yo obese male w/ chest pain " apparently rings the heart attack bells. I took three IV dilaudid doses to get me to the cat scan table. Got a week of oxy (that stuff is amazing). No major damage other than all muscles/tendons/connective tissue around abdomin wrecked from g-forces / and seat-belt auto tensioner, or again, so I thought. Then sciatica hit me after the oxy script ran out. Unrelenting leg pain left me walking with a cane until I was saved by epidurals / more oxy / PT / daily stretching / exercise / pot }. It was about three years to get back to my old self. I'm now terrified of young drivers and anyone behind me. Permanantly damaged I am.

"Yeah, I'm OK" never assume this after a car crash. it could be days before symptoms show themselves.

 

[hmp10]

"Yeah, I'm OK" never assume this after a car crash. it could be days before symptoms show themselves.

I understand. I have to note, however, that I share some of your traits. I've had two joint replacements and have screws and clips in my feet (too many years as an avid runner), have arthritis pretty much everywhere (was also a weight lifter) and am on two blood thinners due to an artificial heart valve, so I bruise if someone looks at me too hard.

Yet I've experienced absolutely no after-effects from this collision. No increased joint soreness, and even the bruising people often report from seat belt tensioning in an accident has not developed.

At first, I thought the car must have braked so effectively that the collision was at a very low speed. But the damage to both cars, especially the Subaru, suggests not.