Looking at moving from an aging Tesla M3 to an updated version vs making the jump to Lucid. What are users' experiences with the Lucid equivalent of FSD vs Tesla current state. Interested in how they compare if there are folks who have experienced both. On balance Tesla is a long way from true FSD, but it is still a very useful product particularly on the highway in my experience. Thanks in advance!
Lucid vs Tesla self drive software
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Lucid has hands-on auto steer on highways and adaptive cruise control. Not going to get into a comparison as that seems to be wildly opinionated. Give it a test drive if you want to judge it for yourself, Lucid offers relatively lengthy ones. I personally find Lucid’s auto steer to be nice and stable for a hands on system. No jerky movements like some others, and overriding and resuming is absolutely seamless. The adaptive cruise control is also very stable. Haven’t had any real issues with phantom braking on the road either.
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You'll definitely want that test drive - a long one. Lucid's cars are in a different category and are not really comparable to a Model 3. I owned a Model 3 performance for four years. After driving an Air GT for 20 months, I can't imagine going back to a Tesla. Just apples and oranges.
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Batteryman
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Lucid made for driving! I personally would never put my life in any FSD until autonomous cars are truly here.
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If FSD is your goal, Lucid is not your car for now. But if your goal is best drive, best performance, best millage, best service and best CAR, LUCID is your car.
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To your specific question - Lucid's Dream Drive Pro keeps a lighter hand on the steering wheel than Tesla's, and is smoother - with no phantom braking. It's great for long trips and my wife likes it - she refused to use Tesla's because of unpleasant braking and steering surprises. But it's not going to navigate you from one freeway to another. It's currently just a very nice, comfortable autosteer and traffic-aware cruise control. The Air is more of a driver's grand touring car IMO, with great comfort, handling, power, and amenities. Model 3 is more of an entertaining science project, kind of an unfinished hot rod.
I drove Tesla MS's for 11 years before changing to a Lucid GT so am extremely familiar with how the software works. I agree the GT drives like silk with incredible smoothness & power. It's also very well equipped from a hardware standpoint with better safety features including lidar & radar. That being said, however, from a software standpoint, the Lucid is significantly inferior to the Tesla. I am willing to put up with this difference because the GT is so well equipped from a hardware standpoint and Tesla has such a large jump start in software engineering. It's only a matter of time before the Lucid catches up though since purchasing the car 8 mos ago, there has been no substantive improvement in said software. I find engaging dreamdrive very clumsy and sometimes won't even engage on roads it previously did. Doesn't hold the center of the road well when engaged especially on curves. Doesn't have auto lane changing. Embarrasses me with the cars following behind as if I was texting constantly. Nags you excessively. More button tapping to engage different functions that can be quite distracting while driving. Also the integration of phone systems requires frequent re-installation and doesn't let you display Carplay with the native navigation or music at the same time. I'm concerned Lucid is not applying the necessary resources to the Air's software given the expensive cost of the car.
I accept these deficiencies in the hope that we'll see improvements in the near future.
I accept these deficiencies in the hope that we'll see improvements in the near future.
I've gone through Autopilot/FSD going back to the "what is that strange unannounced hardware" days through AP1, AP2, FSD (until I got the Lucid) and have driven all versions until then. While Lucid is behind where Tesla is overall, they started out doing things right with the parts that are in place. Tesla's original ACC was very unreliable. Lucid's is reliable but I have gotten collision warnings, on occasion, which made no sense. I assume that the car would have stopped anyway, but wasn't about to chance it. Lucid's autosteer is also far better than Tesla's was at that stage in development, and is about as good at lane centering as Tesla.
A big difference is the nag. While Lucid might not be nag free, it requires less pressure. More importantly, too much pressure doesn't disengage it. It merely lets you move closer to one side of the lane or the other, after which lane keeping kicks back in. The same holds after lane changes. The turn signal prevents lane keeping from fighting you, and as soon as you are in a new lane, it figures out lane keeping. I do miss Tesla's automatic driver initiated lane changes. I don't miss Tesla's nag, continued nag without enough pressure and disengagement with too much pressure. With Lucid, there's no balancing act. Also, Tesla sometimes has false alarms when it thinks there's a weight on the steering wheel even though there isn't.
The only thing I miss about FSD on freeways is that in unfamiliar areas with complex freeway changes and merges, I could pay attention to the road and lane changes rather than spending time trying to figure out what lane to be in, what the overhead sign around a slight curve is really telling me about which lane to be in, when to get out of the carpool lane, etc. It's an issue in Los Angeles but wouldn't be in most of the US. FSD never worked well for me on local streets, and given what did work, I felt that even if it had handled the parts where I had to take over, it wasn't a big advantage over actually driving. When Lucid adds some form of driver initiated lane change, that will put it almost on par with Tesla for what I think counts, and slightly ahead because of the way it handles deviating from where the car wants you to be in the lane.
It blows away what's now the free Autopilot in Teslas in most respects, but doesn't adjust speed on curves. It lacks the lane change feature of AP1, but avoided the many years of getting it to work reliably overall. I found that in general, I'm a better judge of when to change lanes than a Tesla is, so I'm fine with driver initiated lane changes instead of fully automated ones.
Personally, I think that Lucid is losing business because of where Dream Drive stands, and do know people who had early reservations but haven't bought the car because of it. However, given so many other things about the Lucid that I like better than the Tesla, it's worth the compromise on that feature for now. Since this isn't a Tesla vs Lucid thread, I won't go into which features Lucid has that are better, and there are some that were on my Tesla wish list that got implemented by Tesla but Lucid still has to get to it.
When I do drive a Model S on occasion, the ride quality, noise, lack of decent blind spot warnings, and other things bother me a lot more now.
A big difference is the nag. While Lucid might not be nag free, it requires less pressure. More importantly, too much pressure doesn't disengage it. It merely lets you move closer to one side of the lane or the other, after which lane keeping kicks back in. The same holds after lane changes. The turn signal prevents lane keeping from fighting you, and as soon as you are in a new lane, it figures out lane keeping. I do miss Tesla's automatic driver initiated lane changes. I don't miss Tesla's nag, continued nag without enough pressure and disengagement with too much pressure. With Lucid, there's no balancing act. Also, Tesla sometimes has false alarms when it thinks there's a weight on the steering wheel even though there isn't.
The only thing I miss about FSD on freeways is that in unfamiliar areas with complex freeway changes and merges, I could pay attention to the road and lane changes rather than spending time trying to figure out what lane to be in, what the overhead sign around a slight curve is really telling me about which lane to be in, when to get out of the carpool lane, etc. It's an issue in Los Angeles but wouldn't be in most of the US. FSD never worked well for me on local streets, and given what did work, I felt that even if it had handled the parts where I had to take over, it wasn't a big advantage over actually driving. When Lucid adds some form of driver initiated lane change, that will put it almost on par with Tesla for what I think counts, and slightly ahead because of the way it handles deviating from where the car wants you to be in the lane.
It blows away what's now the free Autopilot in Teslas in most respects, but doesn't adjust speed on curves. It lacks the lane change feature of AP1, but avoided the many years of getting it to work reliably overall. I found that in general, I'm a better judge of when to change lanes than a Tesla is, so I'm fine with driver initiated lane changes instead of fully automated ones.
Personally, I think that Lucid is losing business because of where Dream Drive stands, and do know people who had early reservations but haven't bought the car because of it. However, given so many other things about the Lucid that I like better than the Tesla, it's worth the compromise on that feature for now. Since this isn't a Tesla vs Lucid thread, I won't go into which features Lucid has that are better, and there are some that were on my Tesla wish list that got implemented by Tesla but Lucid still has to get to it.
When I do drive a Model S on occasion, the ride quality, noise, lack of decent blind spot warnings, and other things bother me a lot more now.
Interesting piece about Tesla FSD problems & dangers.
Whidbilly99
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I have driven/owned 2023 Model S only 11 Months and disagree. Since 2016 Tesla has said FSD will be a reality......that has been a lie to present.
In the software business..................a mantra is garbage in garbage out.........the latest Tesla ADA/FSD only has 8 cameras..........that can be blinded on many occasion: hard rain, fog even bright sunlight.
Look at youtubes Out of Spec Dave comparison of Tesla's HWD3 Vs new HWD4.......you get more questions than answers.
By going to Lucid I expect to get a better 360 camera view...........and Lidar radar and may more cameras and sensors......software can only go as far as hardware allows it.
All,
Tesla owners got to use FSD free for the month of April. I used it about 6 times and I did not like it. My complaint was if you went around a vehicle to pass on the highways in would stay in that lane until somebody started to tailgate you. It would not move back into the previous lane until it became absolutely necessary. This presented challenges on two lane interstates in East Texas. There are two speeds on the interstates in East Texas fast and faster.
Tesla owners got to use FSD free for the month of April. I used it about 6 times and I did not like it. My complaint was if you went around a vehicle to pass on the highways in would stay in that lane until somebody started to tailgate you. It would not move back into the previous lane until it became absolutely necessary. This presented challenges on two lane interstates in East Texas. There are two speeds on the interstates in East Texas fast and faster.
That's not supposed to happen. I had that problem once and it turned out to be a problem with the cable for the rear view camera. It caused an intermittent problem. There was no error message for it, and in the interim, using the turn signal got the car back in lane 2 when it was in the leftmost lane, but it went away when the cable was fixed.
That being said, for the highway portion, I like Enhanced Autopilot better than FSD. It does everything that FSD does on the highway, except that Tesla never claimed that it will ever work unsupervised. The other advantage that it has is that it lets users switch back and forth between that and standard Autopilot at the press of a button. That switches it to something closer to what Lucid has, except with driver initiated lane changes using the signal stalk.
I like those parts better that what Lucid currently has, except for the way autosteer disengages, but if (when?) Lucid adds driver initiated automatic lane changes, that will cover about 95% of what I consider important features. The Navigate on Autopilot is helpful in unfamiliar areas with complicated freeways, where it's better to watch the road than trying to figure out what lane to be in, where to change freeways, when to get out of the HOV lane, which lane actually goes to your exit, etc. But for familiar locations, I know better than the car does when to change lanes. Letting it change lanes can leave me stuck in traffic, and the only ways around it with FSD are to disable autosteer, constantly cancel upcoming lane changes when the notification comes up, or turn FSD off completely.
My older Model S has the original Autopilot and I'm fine with it. Since I'm not likely to use it for long road trips now that I have a Lucid, it has the features that actually make sense, and is better than the free autopilot that comes with new Teslas. When Lucid adds driver initiated automatic lane changes, it will beat what I have with my remaining Tesla. I'm not saying that I want Lucid to end development at that point, but for practical purposes and making driving easier, that's the important part.
Haggy,
I was under the impression that once your car passed the other car it would go back into the original lane. This situation happened several times before I stopped using FSD. Did not like the AutoPilot. Used Autopilot a few times, but did not have confidence in its decision making. Liked the cruise control.
I was under the impression that once your car passed the other car it would go back into the original lane. This situation happened several times before I stopped using FSD. Did not like the AutoPilot. Used Autopilot a few times, but did not have confidence in its decision making. Liked the cruise control.
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ap in the tesla is far superior to the lucid system
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I have DreamDrive Pro and use Highway Assist, and I have experience with BAP, EAP, and FSD in my Teslas.
Where I live in Southern California (because our freeways here are well-mapped).....Lucid's HA w/ DDP is superior to Tesla BAP. Lane centering is about the same between the two systems, and I feel HA is superior because you can signal a lane change and manually initiate and complete the lane change without dropping out of HA.
HA isn't currently as good as Tesla EAP on the freeways, because EAP will automatically perform the lane change for you on your signal and that is a helpful driver assistance aid.
HA of course can't do city streets like FSD so that's not applicable on city streets. On the freeways though it's a different story for me: this part of HA vs. FSD is more subjective, but I personally don't like the current lane centering of FSD on freeways compared to HA or even Tesla's own BAP/EAP. It wanders too much for my liking and likes to hug lane lines, whereas HA, BAP/EAP are far more consistent with keeping it in the center of the lane.
Where I live in Southern California (because our freeways here are well-mapped).....Lucid's HA w/ DDP is superior to Tesla BAP. Lane centering is about the same between the two systems, and I feel HA is superior because you can signal a lane change and manually initiate and complete the lane change without dropping out of HA.
HA isn't currently as good as Tesla EAP on the freeways, because EAP will automatically perform the lane change for you on your signal and that is a helpful driver assistance aid.
HA of course can't do city streets like FSD so that's not applicable on city streets. On the freeways though it's a different story for me: this part of HA vs. FSD is more subjective, but I personally don't like the current lane centering of FSD on freeways compared to HA or even Tesla's own BAP/EAP. It wanders too much for my liking and likes to hug lane lines, whereas HA, BAP/EAP are far more consistent with keeping it in the center of the lane.
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AP = Auto pilot, not the app
I drive a legacy Model X (AP 2.0) with EAP as well as my Lucid AT with DD Premiere (eg. no lane centering). My experience over nearly eight years with the Tesla colored my decisions with the Lucid. I originally signed up for DD Pro, but with the layoffs last year, I realized that its development, particularly to the point of taking full advantage of LIDAR, was not going to happen quickly. And I had spent years waiting for FSD, but never pulled the trigger because it was so erratic for such a long time and I would need a hardware upgrade as well. But now, I'm happy with Lucid's implementation of ADAS, preferring it to Tesla's (at least in my older X), because it slows down in traffic much more evenly and smoothly, whereas the Tesla rushes and then brakes more suddenly. Also, it's such a light touch to keep the Lucid manually centered in its lane that I don't mind it. Then, I just don't trust Elon's software decisions, so I don't use navigate-on-autopilot ever and only use auto lane changing when I am on EAP. I remember too clearly the early days of autopilot when I would be sent at 70mph on a sharply curved exit when I was trying to stay on the highway. Yikes. So I appreciate the relative conservatism of the Lucid software releases. I will say that I prefer EAP when I'm stuck in traffic on I-5.
I agree that camera only tech is not the right approach. Our vehciles have the right hardware to implement the best software for ADAS. Just paitently have to wait for that iterative updates to the software.
If only I could figure out the right clicks to the enable Highway Assist on that steering wheel button. I miss the stalk double press to enable ADAS.
