DreamDrive Pro

[xponents]

As I understand it, keeping your hand on the steering wheel is simply a way for the ADAS system to know the driver is paying attention. However, one can easily doze off for a moment with one's hand resting on the wheel and -- especially with one's wrist resting on a steering wheel spoke -- perhaps considerably longer. A driver can also rummage through a glovebox or around a floorboard while still keeping one's hand on the wheel. A well-designed driver monitoring camera would be more effective for monitoring driver attention even at Level 2 ADAS.

Lucid, at least in early days of touting its ADAS approach, made a big deal about its driver monitoring camera (which Teslas do not yet have) performing that function by assessing direction of gaze, orientation of head, etc.

Does anyone know whether the Air's driver monitoring camera will be the monitoring method at L2 or only come into play at L3?

Late reply, but does this mean you dont need to keep a hand on the wheel, just look straight ahead?

 

[joec]

Late reply, but does this mean you dont need to keep a hand on the wheel, just look straight ahead?

The Lucid combines both "hand on the wheel" and the camera. if you take your hand off the wheel, it will warn you every 30 seconds or so to "pay attention." A quick wiggle of the wheel or slight pressure twist will settle the warning.

If you are not looking at the road, you get a different "Pay attention" warning with a little eyeball icon. Just look at the road, and it goes away.

Some have complained these two warnings are overly aggressive, but I actually find them very handy. They rarely pop up for me, because I keep my hand on the wheel and my eyes on the road. (I know steering wheel position and glasses can cause issues with the camera. I wear glasses, regular and sun, and never have this issue.) Every time the warning has gone off for me, I was indeed not looking where I was supposed to. So I don't mind the nag in that case.

If you ignore these warnings, the ADAS system will eventually disengage.

As good as HA and ACC are in the Lucid, they are not designed for "hands free" driving.

 

[MHDave]

Late reply, but does this mean you dont need to keep a hand on the wheel, just look straight ahead?

No, both are needed. You get a small allowance for looking away or for not providing a force on the wheel, but it wants to know you're engaged.

 

[Steveinarizona]

The full Lucid sensor suite, including Lidar, is necessary for Lucid ADAS to move from Level 2 to Level 3 functionality. This may well be doable in the 3-year time frame Lucid has mentioned.

Tesla is touting FSD as Level 4, which is a much more complicated level of autonomy and probably much farther away than Tesla will admit.

I think the odds of losing a bet that you will see Level 3 from Lucid during ownership are considerably lower than losing money on a $12,000 bet that Tesla will reach true self-driving during the ownership of one of their cars.

Despite your double negative, I agree.

 

[Drendino]

The Lucid combines both "hand on the wheel" and the camera. if you take your hand off the wheel, it will warn you every 30 seconds or so to "pay attention." A quick wiggle of the wheel or slight pressure twist will settle the warning.

If you are not looking at the road, you get a different "Pay attention" warning with a little eyeball icon. Just look at the road, and it goes away.

Some have complained these two warnings are overly aggressive, but I actually find them very handy. They rarely pop up for me, because I keep my hand on the wheel and my eyes on the road. (I know steering wheel position and glasses can cause issues with the camera. I wear glasses, regular and sun, and never have this issue.) Every time the warning has gone off for me, I was indeed not looking where I was supposed to. So I don't mind the nag in that case.

If you ignore these warnings, the ADAS system will eventually disengage.

As good as HA and ACC are in the Lucid, they are not designed for "hands free" driving.

I’ve also figured out a way to position my hand on the wheel in a way that is comfortable. I think I would like to see the warning extended until 45 seconds and a little less torque on the wheel, but over all I feel that it is an excellent start. It’s a fine line because it is a very relaxing way to drive and I could see people falling asleep if there is not enough warnings.

 

[Tim-in-CA]

I’ve also figured out a way to position my hand on the wheel in a way that is comfortable. I think I would like to see the warning extended until 45 seconds and a little less torque on the wheel, but over all I feel that it is an excellent start. It’s a fine line because it is a very relaxing way to drive and I could see people falling asleep if there is not enough warnings.

I thought that the steering wheel had touch sensor, bummer that it’s torque like Tesla.

 

[Drendino]

I thought that the steering wheel had touch sensor, bummer that it’s torque like Tesla.

This is all I’ve ever known but I suspect that I would prefer touch to torque. It’s not bad once you figure out how to hold the wheel, but I would like to see it respond to a little less torque. It’s very close to being great.

 

[Steveinarizona]

This is all I’ve ever known but I suspect that I would prefer touch to torque. It’s not bad once you figure out how to hold the wheel, but I would like to see it respond to a little less torque. It’s very close to being great.

I have had both and they each provide false positives.

 

[xponents]

The Lucid combines both "hand on the wheel" and the camera. if you take your hand off the wheel, it will warn you every 30 seconds or so to "pay attention." A quick wiggle of the wheel or slight pressure twist will settle the warning.

If you are not looking at the road, you get a different "Pay attention" warning with a little eyeball icon. Just look at the road, and it goes away.

Some have complained these two warnings are overly aggressive, but I actually find them very handy. They rarely pop up for me, because I keep my hand on the wheel and my eyes on the road. (I know steering wheel position and glasses can cause issues with the camera. I wear glasses, regular and sun, and never have this issue.) Every time the warning has gone off for me, I was indeed not looking where I was supposed to. So I don't mind the nag in that case.

If you ignore these warnings, the ADAS system will eventually disengage.

As good as HA and ACC are in the Lucid, they are not designed for "hands free" driving.

2nd question, when will highway PILOT come out?

 

[Bobby]

2nd question, when will highway PILOT come out?

That information has not been made public.

 

[xponents]

That information has not been made public.

Any estimate?

 

[Drendino]

I have had both and they each provide false positives.

Does that mean that they sometimes don’t respond to torque or touch?

 

[Drendino]

The Lucid combines both "hand on the wheel" and the camera. if you take your hand off the wheel, it will warn you every 30 seconds or so to "pay attention." A quick wiggle of the wheel or slight pressure twist will settle the warning.

If you are not looking at the road, you get a different "Pay attention" warning with a little eyeball icon. Just look at the road, and it goes away.

Some have complained these two warnings are overly aggressive, but I actually find them very handy. They rarely pop up for me, because I keep my hand on the wheel and my eyes on the road. (I know steering wheel position and glasses can cause issues with the camera. I wear glasses, regular and sun, and never have this issue.) Every time the warning has gone off for me, I was indeed not looking where I was supposed to. So I don't mind the nag in that case.

If you ignore these warnings, the ADAS system will eventually disengage.

As good as HA and ACC are in the Lucid, they are not designed for "hands free" driving.

I just counted and it gives the warning every 15 seconds. I would like to see 30, which I believe is the industry standard.

 

[Tâm]

I have had both and they each provide false positives.

I haven't tried but: If there are no responses from the driver, does the system slows down to a stop with 4-way flashers on?

 

[Adnillien]

I haven't tried but: If there are no responses from the driver, does the system slows down to a stop with 4-way flashers on?

It will after multiple alerts that are not responded to by the driver.

 

[wux]

One of the reasons that I wanted a Lucid is the hardware that come with DD pro. It features 32 sensors, including multiple cameras, radar units, ultrasonic sensors, and a lidar unit, which makes Lucid more future-proof for self-driving capability. Tesla refuses to use lidar, which is expansive, but some experts cliam that a true self-driving cannot be done without it. On the other hand, GM's Super Criuse uses lidar generated road map data and sensors on the car. GM's approch is much more conservitive than Tesla's. I feel that a combination of harderware, road data, and software will be the way to go for the future of the self-driving. All possible driving conditions are just too complicated for the safety to depend on a computer alone.

 

[Steveinarizona]

Does that mean that they sometimes don’t respond to torque or touch?

It means, in my experience, that I can have my hand(s) on the steering wheel and get a message to do so in my prior car (touch) and current car (torque). I suspect that a camera system will also be an occasional pain. It just goes with the territory of Level 2 automation.

 

[dr121212]

After ~7 months of driving w/ BlueCruise in the F150 Lightning, and comparing it to my experience with Tesla and other "regular L2" vehicles, IMO there is a huge difference in terms of being able to take your hands off the wheel. I was disappointed to learn that Lucid isn't offering this even though it has the interior camera hardware - and is causing me to re-think whether I will take delivery. It's more of a game-changer than I expected it to be, and I'm not sure I can live without "L2+" hands-free driving on my next vehicle. The Ford system is pretty accurate in terms of whether you are watching the road consistently, even working perfectly when wearing sunglasses or at night. It's worth checking out if the automated driving differences are important to you.

 

[LCIDdreams]

After ~7 months of driving w/ BlueCruise in the F150 Lightning, and comparing it to my experience with Tesla and other "regular L2" vehicles, IMO there is a huge difference in terms of being able to take your hands off the wheel. I was disappointed to learn that Lucid isn't offering this even though it has the interior camera hardware - and is causing me to re-think whether I will take delivery. It's more of a game-changer than I expected it to be, and I'm not sure I can live without "L2+" hands-free driving on my next vehicle. The Ford system is pretty accurate in terms of whether you are watching the road consistently, even working perfectly when wearing sunglasses or at night. It's worth checking out if the automated driving differences are important to you.

I’m not sure how these systems determine if someone is watching the road when wearing dark sunglasses. I can only think they are programmed to assume they are watching as long as their head is up and pointing forward (ie would not be able to determine if someone’s eyes are closed)

 

[dr121212]

I’m not sure how these systems determine if someone is watching the road when wearing dark sunglasses. I can only think they are programmed to assume they are watching as long as their head is up and pointing forward (ie would not be able to determine if someone’s eyes are closed)

They are IR cameras watching your eyes - even behind sunglasses. If you glance away or even just close them it alerts within a maybe 10-15 second grace period. I’ve tested it a bunch and pretty surprised how well it works.