Chance of upgrade from AGT to De

[DBordello]

I was a bit late to the party and ordered the Air Grand Touring.

However, I'd love a Dream Edition. I'd hate to know there are 311 ponies to be had.

Have all Dream Editions been shipped? Any chance of an upgrade?

 

[mnewber1]

They definitely haven't shipped all Dream Editions, however, the chance to get one is slim. I heard that 520 is a pretty hard number they are limiting to, and most AGT reservation holders are likely jawing to get one if a spot opens up. If you have a DA assigned already, there's a chance you can ask them.

 

[DBordello]

I appreciate the feedback.

I might just have to wait Lucid out. I doubt they'll stop manufacturing their best/most expensive car.

 

[hmp10]

I might just have to wait Lucid out. I doubt they'll stop manufacturing their best/most expensive car.

With a tri-motor car in the works, I doubt if Lucid will keep the Dream in production.

I wanted a Dream Edition for the same reason you did -- that extra bucket of horsepower. We have a Tesla Model S Plaid, and I didn't want the Lucid to feel more sluggish. But after driving the Dream for almost a month, I have to tell you that I almost never put it in Sprint mode to access that extra power, any more than I make use of anything close to the power the Plaid puts out. Both cars simply put way more power to the pavement than you can possibly make use of on public roads.

The only real advantage I see of the Dream over the Grand Touring is that in the two lower drive modes -- Smooth and Swift -- the Dream produces about 807 hp while the GT produces 670, if I remember correctly. However, given how little I get into the throttle even in Swift on the Dream, I suspect the GT's 670 will be more than enough oomph for most spirited driving. And, for those occasions when you want more punch, you can still access 933 hp in Sprint mode in the GT. I can promise that is plenty.

 

[manitou202]

There are several of us with Grand Touring reservations who are on the Dream wait list. I was told all of the Dreams are spoken for, but they would reach out if one does become available last minute.

 

[borski]

I appreciate the feedback.

I might just have to wait Lucid out. I doubt they'll stop manufacturing their best/most expensive car.

I think a lot of the existing DE owners who paid 30k extra to get one of the first 520 would be quite upset if they produced any more than 520.

 

[ThePaddyWan]

I think a lot of the existing DE owners who paid 30k extra to get one of the first 520 would be quite upset if they produced any more than 520.

That was a big reason for me. Spec wise, the 800 HP on the GT is far more than enough for anyone in practice. The fact that the DE had unique specs and limited (numbered) was what sold me on going ahead with it. The 520 units has a nice meaning to it based on the EPA range, which is something Lucid is rightfully proud of.

 

[CraZ8]

What do you think that sometime down the road Lucid will offer a 100hp OTA upgrade to grand touring owners, for somewhere between $7500 and $12,000? The horse power will still be less that the DE-R and it would be a great way to raise some almost cost free capital from a select pool of GT owners who want a little extra oomph as these motors are mostly software limited. Tesla has done similar things in the past.

 

[DBordello]

That is an interesting idea. Is the drive train identical?

 

[hydbob]

From what I was told, no. There is an actual hardware difference between the range and performance version. Maybe the GT can be updated via OTA upgrade to match the range but it will never be the same as the performance spec.

 

[CraZ8]

My point was that even with the hardware difference ( I think it’s just a change in metallurgy) lucid keeps stating these motors are good for ~670 hp each. Do you really think they can’t wring 50 hp more ( go from 400 to 450) with a software update. The reason I’m guessing 100 hp is you don’t want to piss off the DE range buyers by leapfrogging them on hp

 

[manitou202]

The motors are probably the same, but my guess is there is a difference in wiring and electronics.

Think of it like charging the car. Higher charging speeds require a lot of upgraded hardware. The AGT with 800hp (596kW) pulls a lot less power at peak compared to the ADE P with 1111hp (828kW). That's 650amps versus 900amps. So all of the associated wiring and electronics need to support much higher current.

 

[copper]

The motors are probably the same, but my guess is there is a difference in wiring and electronics.

Think of it like charging the car. Higher charging speeds require a lot of upgraded hardware. The AGT with 800hp (596kW) pulls a lot less power at peak compared to the ADE P with 1111hp (828kW). That's 650amps versus 900amps. So all of the associated wiring and electronics need to support much higher current.

Agreed. If I understand right, they're using a completely different set of IGBT's on the DE-P from the -R, and same for the GT on down. I think the motor is largely the same - it is the battery output and circuitry to control the motor with the higher output that differs.

Since the entire thing is so miniaturized I'm betting that there's no easy way to upgrade for more power outside of replacing the battery cells and motor assemblies.

 

[hmp10]

Here's what I was told by Zak Edson, Lucid's VP of Sales & Service, back before the Dream was bifurcated into a P and an R version:

The Dream's rear motor has a special metallurgy that adds about 15 hp but steps up the torque more significantly. (I don't know if that remains the case for both the P and the R, whether just the P rear motor has the special metallurgy, or even whether that special metallurgy made it into production cars at all.)

When Tesla upped the Model S output from "Insane" to "Ludicrous", one of the main changes was a higher-capacity power fuse that would allow the battery to deliver more current to the motors. I asked Edson whether the Lucid Dream and GT used different power fuses. He said no.

 

[copper]

Here's what I was told by Zak Edson, Lucid's VP of Sales & Service, back before the Dream was bifurcated into a P and an R version:

The Dream's rear motor has a special metallurgy that adds about 15 hp but steps up the torque more significantly. (I don't know if that remains the case for both the P and the R, whether just the P rear motor has the special metallurgy, or even whether that special metallurgy made it into production cars at all.)

When Tesla upped the Model S output from "Insane" to "Ludicrous", one of the main changes was a higher-capacity power fuse that would allow the battery to deliver more current to the motors. I asked Edson whether the Lucid Dream and GT used different power fuses. He said no.

Aha! Looks like I heard wrong then. That motor assembly is a work of art.

 

[hmp10]

Aha! Looks like I heard wrong then. That motor assembly is a work of art.

Keep in mind that what Edson told me was over a year before production began -- and before the Dream was split into two versions. I cannot claim to know the current situation with powertrain hardware.

 

[DBordello]

A quick update. I received a call two days from my delivery contact that there may be a red Dream Edition Range cancelation and asked if I was interested. I would have preferred the Performance, but told him I would be.

Yesterday he called and told me my GT order was canceled and walked me through the process to order the Dream Edition.

Too bad I can't change it to a Performance, but I assume this will move me up the delivery list.

 

[mnewber1]

A quick update. I received a call two days from my delivery contact that there may be a red Dream Edition Range cancelation and asked if I was interested. I would have preferred the Performance, but told him I would be.

Yesterday he called and told me my GT order was canceled and walked me through the process to order the Dream Edition.

Too bad I can't change it to a Performance, but I assume this will move me up the delivery list.

I would like to update my original answer from low to 100%.

 

[DBordello]

I would like to update my original answer from low to 100%.

I am curious why the order can't be changed to a Performance, but perhaps it has been manufactured.

 

[hydbob]

I am curious why the order can't be changed to a Performance, but perhaps it has been manufactured.

If you get the range with 21" it's pretty darn close I think!