Backup Camera battle with Garage Door Opener

To date, Lucid shipped (to my knowledge) less than 10,000 cars, ever! Tesla shipped 1.3+M cars in 2022 alone.
When we look at the Lucid bugs (for example, how many owners have reported turtle/brick, pilot panel outage, at-speed drive train failures, cars needing reboot, etc.), these are NOT DPM problems. We are talking percentages (or at least fraction of a percent) problems. These problems should have been found in QA/Validation, not by customers!
Yes, I understand Tesla was pretty bad 10 years ago too (that's why I never bought a Tesla even though i equipped my garage for EV charging NEMA 14-50 sockets et al since 2009) .We all want Lucid to succeed. Lucid is not competing with Tesla Circa 2013. Lucid needs to step up its game!
 
I would imagine pretty much everybody on the forum agrees that the functionality of Homelink is in need of improvement. Either the menu needs to appear over the top of the backup camera, needs to automatically shut the door, or some other functionality to allow the backup camera and home link to be active simultaneously. There is no argument here.

That said, let’s not generalize this situation to represent everything Lucid has done. That’s what we are trying to avoid here. Try to keep your constructive criticism just that - constructive, without resorting to generalized put downs. I have met several people that work at Lucid and I assure you they are working hard on some of these software issues that need improvement.
 
As someone said…
“Failure to acknowledge and communicate bug fix is a bad approach.”

It’s also not a good approach as a customer to not communicate the issue with customer care. I really hope all of us do that. I certainly do.
I have a good, honest relationship with the Scottsdale Service Center. I met with the Service Manager, the service rep, and the lead technician many times. They are all great people. No complaints with the Scottsdale Service Center.

I gave the Service Manager links to my postings on this forum. Lucid knows my forum user ID and they can see all my postings. It is all open and above-board.

Many of these "Bugs" we talk about in this forum are not serviceable issues. For example, my pilot panel went out twice in one day. The first incident happened when I was relatively close to the Service Center. I took the car in without an appointment, and they reset it for me after 15min. later that morning, I went on my 250-mile road trip. On my return in the late evening, my pilot panel went out again in the rural area of Arizona. Luckily, I was still with cellular range. I called the Lucid Service Number. after about 30min, they figure out how to reset my car remotely.

But resetting my pilot panel is not a fix to the root problem. The Service Center couldn’t do about the root-cause. Ultimately, the engineering/validation guys back at Newark have to identify the root-cause and do the fix.

I urge the organizer/moderator of this forum to make senior management connections with Lucid and meet with them regularly to pareto the problems the owners are encountering and have Lucid develop and communicate a plan and schedule on how and when to fix these bugs. As it stands, the owners have no idea when and if the bugs will be fixed. This leads to frustration and erosion of trust between the owners and Lucid. We all want Lucid to succeed. Griping alone won’t get us there. The owners forum should consolidate and pareto the user experience and Lucid should respond with plans and schedules.
 
I have a good, honest relationship with the Scottsdale Service Center. I met with the Service Manager, the service rep, and the lead technician many times. They are all great people. No complaints with the Scottsdale Service Center.

I gave the Service Manager links to my postings on this forum. Lucid knows my forum user ID and they can see all my postings. It is all open and above-board.

Many of these "Bugs" we talk about in this forum are not serviceable issues. For example, my pilot panel went out twice in one day. The first incident happened when I was relatively close to the Service Center. I took the car in without an appointment, and they reset it for me after 15min. later that morning, I went on my 250-mile road trip. On my return in the late evening, my pilot panel went out again in the rural area of Arizona. Luckily, I was still with cellular range. I called the Lucid Service Number. after about 30min, they figure out how to reset my car remotely.

But resetting my pilot panel is not a fix to the root problem. The Service Center couldn’t do about the root-cause. Ultimately, the engineering/validation guys back at Newark have to identify the root-cause and do the fix.

I urge the organizer/moderator of this forum to make senior management connections with Lucid and meet with them regularly to pareto the problems the owners are encountering and have Lucid develop and communicate a plan and schedule on how and when to fix these bugs. As it stands, the owners have no idea when and if the bugs will be fixed. This leads to frustration and erosion of trust between the owners and Lucid. We all want Lucid to succeed. Griping alone won’t get us there. The owners forum should consolidate and pareto the user experience and Lucid should respond with plans
While I would certainly be happy to meet with senior management and discuss issues and solutions, that is not something that is the job or responsibility of a moderator on this forum. We are volunteers and our purpose is to keep this forum neighborly and organized.

I've not seen Apple/Google/car manufacturers etc. provide an open list of bugs, ask the public to prioritize, or provide a calendar of when each item will be addressed.

What I can assure you is that Lucid has a team of folks that are working hard to move forward.
 
I have a good, honest relationship with the Scottsdale Service Center. I met with the Service Manager, the service rep, and the lead technician many times. They are all great people. No complaints with the Scottsdale Service Center.

I gave the Service Manager links to my postings on this forum. Lucid knows my forum user ID and they can see all my postings. It is all open and above-board.

Many of these "Bugs" we talk about in this forum are not serviceable issues. For example, my pilot panel went out twice in one day. The first incident happened when I was relatively close to the Service Center. I took the car in without an appointment, and they reset it for me after 15min. later that morning, I went on my 250-mile road trip. On my return in the late evening, my pilot panel went out again in the rural area of Arizona. Luckily, I was still with cellular range. I called the Lucid Service Number. after about 30min, they figure out how to reset my car remotely.

But resetting my pilot panel is not a fix to the root problem. The Service Center couldn’t do about the root-cause. Ultimately, the engineering/validation guys back at Newark have to identify the root-cause and do the fix.

I urge the organizer/moderator of this forum to make senior management connections with Lucid and meet with them regularly to pareto the problems the owners are encountering and have Lucid develop and communicate a plan and schedule on how and when to fix these bugs. As it stands, the owners have no idea when and if the bugs will be fixed. This leads to frustration and erosion of trust between the owners and Lucid. We all want Lucid to succeed. Griping alone won’t get us there. The owners forum should consolidate and pareto the user experience and Lucid should respond with plans and schedules.
Well, as much as I would love to talk to senior management on the regular, like @Bobby Has stated our roles are here on the forums. We are lucky enough to have Lucid staff here monitoring however, so anything can be directed directly to customer service.
 
I am not asking this forum to PRIORITIZE the bug fixes or to define a schedule for those fixes. Bug fix priority and schedule are clearly in the domain of Lucid Motors.

I used the term "Pareto" (as a verb) the bugs, meaning to tabulate the frequency of occurrence. Again, as an example, maybe 75% of the owners complained about the wireless phone charging in the Lucid (high on the Pareto) but that does not translate to a high-priority item to be fixed. If I were Lucid, I will tell the owners outright that there is no plan to fix the wireless phone charging problem on this generation of the Lucid Air. No further discussion as it is a waste of resources. Now, we might not like it, but that's the right decision and everyone should just move on.

On the other hand, brick/Turtle/screen blank/car moving in the opposite direction as intended, issues might only be a 1-5% (hypothetical) problem hence low Pareto scores, but it is mission critical and should be top of the list to be fixed. This is what triage is all about, right?

If you do a Google search on companies that have dedicate bug reporting, (Apple, Microsoft, Google, Meta, Toyota, Hyundai, Mercedes, Tesla, HP, Nvidia, Intel, AMD, etc.) they all have portals that invite the users to report bugs. Some offer bounties for bugs. Lucid does not.

I believe Lucid should take leadership to acknowledge the key bugs and their planned disposition. It builds confidence and loyalty in in its user base.
 
Thanks for posting these detailed instructions. I think I followed all the instructions but was not able to get Alexa in car to open or close the garage door. I can open and close the garage door from the LiveKey app on my iphone. I can control the garage door from the Alexa app on my iphone. The routines are listed in the Alexa app and work. Alexa on my phone also works with the voice commands. When I try the Alexa voice commands in the car - no response nothing happens. How does the Alexa app in the car get the garage door routines? My other Alexa routines that I set up work in the car.
I had similar issues getting the routine to work in the car. A couple of things to check in the Alexa app. Go to the routine you made, and look at the section 'when you say'. You can add several phrases to activate this routine. I didn't initially get the phrase 'exactly' right (left out an adjective), and Alexa would not close the door. I added additional phrases so that I had all the possible iterations. Also check the 'from' entry at the bottom of the routine; I specified from the 'xx Lucid Assistant (official)' entry. Once I had these changes, it works as advertised
 
I had similar issues getting the routine to work in the car. A couple of things to check in the Alexa app. Go to the routine you made, and look at the section 'when you say'. You can add several phrases to activate this routine. I didn't initially get the phrase 'exactly' right (left out an adjective), and Alexa would not close the door. I added additional phrases so that I had all the possible iterations. Also check the 'from' entry at the bottom of the routine; I specified from the 'xx Lucid Assistant (official)' entry. Once I had these changes, it works as advertised
Thanks. I think your suggestion on 'from' entry at the bottom of the routine; I specified from the 'xx Lucid Assistant (official)' entry" is what I need. However, I do not see the "From" when I edit the routine in the Alex app on my phone. On another routine I created the "From" is there. Suggestions?
 
These problems should have been found in QA/Validation
In an economically feasible way, how would they do that? When it is fit and finish issues, I totally agree that QA should catch all of those because it’s a simple eyeball test. The turtle and other drive related issues I would argue that the car passed all tests and was driving normally until components failed. Unless you duty tested every component for hours/days, you won’t catch something that yields results that are within spec but has a manufacturing weakness that causes failure sometime down the road. You can sample test but that doesn’t stop a random weak component from getting installed.

The pilot panel you’re having issues with turned on at the factory and worked. It worked when you picked up your car. Then something related to the panel started to fail. What would a validation process that would catch that without heavily impacting the cost structure look like?
 
Thanks. I think your suggestion on 'from' entry at the bottom of the routine; I specified from the 'xx Lucid Assistant (official)' entry" is what I need. However, I do not see the "From" when I edit the routine in the Alex app on my phone. On another routine I created the "From" is there. Suggestions
 
I honestly do not know why the from is not showing in your routine. My best guess would be to just delete that routine and start over.
 
In an economically feasible way, how would they do that? When it is fit and finish issues, I totally agree that QA should catch all of those because it’s a simple eyeball test. The turtle and other drive related issues I would argue that the car passed all tests and was driving normally until components failed. Unless you duty tested every component for hours/days, you won’t catch something that yields results that are within spec but has a manufacturing weakness that causes failure sometime down the road. You can sample test but that doesn’t stop a random weak component from getting installed.

The pilot panel you’re having issues with turned on at the factory and worked. It worked when you picked up your car. Then something related to the panel started to fail. What would a validation process that would catch that without heavily impacting the cost structure look like?
Having worked in software development and QA for over 30 years in some of the leading software and hardware development companies, I would NOT expect QA to catch the issue we’re discussing.

That’s not to say that QA can’t make a suggestion or log an issue with the design team. As we have all observed how this works, yes it’s poor, but I bet it works as designed. Yes it should be redesigned by the design/development team. But to say that QA/validation should have caught it is not correct.

QA and development often have arguments as to what’s a bug and what isn’t. In the end, a group such as product management has the final say as to how a feature should work.
 
Having worked in software development and QA for over 30 years in some of the leading software and hardware development companies, I would NOT expect QA to catch the issue we’re discussing.

That’s not to say that QA can’t make a suggestion or log an issue with the design team. As we have all observed how this works, yes it’s poor, but I bet it works as designed. Yes it should be redesigned by the design/development team. But to say that QA/validation should have caught it is not correct.

QA and development often have arguments as to what’s a bug and what isn’t. In the end, a group such as product management has the final say as to how a feature should work.
QA and Validation are two separate but related subjects.

Let me use some straight-forward (though not all encompassing) examples to illustrate.

QA: when I go pick up my Lucid on delivery day, if there are scratches on the paint, mis-aligned panels, trunk mats that are not properly secured (which happened in my case), those are QA issues. In other words, if Lucid inspected the car carefully before delivery, they would have picked up on these defects and corrected these issues before the customer arrives to take delivery. These are random defects, not systematic issues.

Validation: this is a completely different animal. First, there are multiple levels of validation. Let’s start with SW and HW. Each one has to be validated (i.e., testing the functionality against the specification) on its own. Thereafter, the SW and HW have to be tested together, under a range of circumstances (e.g., at different temperature, humidity, etc.) to make sure they work together as intended.

Let’s use the Homelink garage door opener as an example. So, there is a “module” (HW and SW) that performs the Homelink function (programming the garage door open code, multiple users, multiple garage doors, multiple brands of garage door openers, temperature extremes, etc.) . Let’s just say the engineers tested all of these and the Homelink Module performed faultlessly. Is the Homelink module therefore “Validated”? Yes, validated at the module level (i.e., if that’s the only standalone function), So, is it good-to-go. NO!. We still don’t know if it will it work in conjunction with all the other functions (modules) in the rest of the car under all circumstances.

As many of us (myself included) experienced, the Homelink module does not work properly when the Lucid is in reverse backing out of the garage (even though Homelink works perfectly on its own). The reason why this happens is (likely) Lucid might not have tested these two functions (Homelink and backing up) in conjunction (i.e., as a system). Now, we have a “bug”, an unanticipated interaction between two independent functions (Homelink and backup) that interacted in a manner we did not anticipate.

OK, so what! Now we know this unintended interaction, let’s fix this bug and move on. (Let’s say) We did an OTA , now it is fixed. But, is it? What happens if I try to close the garage door with Homelink while backing up at the same time, but it is raining and it is dark, so I have my headlights on and the wipers going., will the “bug-fix” for the Homelink-Backup still work? The answers is, I have no idea! The unintended interaction between independent functions is virtually impossible to anticipate and they generate scenarios that cannot be easily predicted.

Hence, we have to do SYSTEM VALIDATION…i.e., test the SYSTEM (the whole car, all its functions, at all kinds of systematic and random sequences, under different environmental conditions, temperature, rain, night/day, etc.). It this kind of testing sounds very arduous, you got it right, it is!

System manufactures (computers, airplanes, cars, space crafts, etc.) have learned that even though each individual module works faultlessly on their own, there is no guarantee they will work harmoniously TOGETHER. More likely than not, they won’t. That’s why we do SYSTEM VALIDATION. It is hard work arduous, and it is a grind to run all those regressions. And it is a never-ending task. Many a times, we are luck enough we could fix some of these unintended interactions with SW fixes (OTA). That’s great. SW fixes are easy to implement as opposed to hardware fixes. Many a times, people get confused and call them Quality issues, they are not! These are architecture/design/system bugs that were inadvertently baked into the system. We call them “bug”/”defects” because they manifest themselves “randomly”. In reality, they are not random, though they are hard to pin down. They only manifest themselves when the stars and the moon align.

I don’t want to come across as a pessimistic doomsayer. I just want us to be realistic. Building a world-class, reliable electro-mechanical-computerized system on wheels going at 70-80 mph is not for the faint of heart. A lot more work has to be done in validation to get the Lucid system to be robust.
 
Homelink works while the car is in reverse. You must tap the X to close the camera to access the menu. Then, you can turn the camera back on if desired. Of course, this is an undesirable sequence and needs improvement, but it is not a bug. It is functioning as designed… but designed poorly.
 
... A lot more work has to be done in validation to get the Lucid system to be robust.
My own POV is that the work is being done, and the Air's software is becoming more robust, but the patience of buyers varies. The speed of progress does not overly concern some, but is "unacceptable" to others. I'm in the former camp. Of course I wish the car's software was completely mature but I do not view that as realistic at this point.
 
Homelink works while the car is in reverse. You must tap the X to close the camera to access the menu. Then, you can turn the camera back on if desired. Of course, this is an undesirable sequence and needs improvement, but it is not a bug. It is functioning as designed… but designed poorly.
Yes, I know I have to tap on X. Then I tap on the Homelink icon. Often, it goes into Homelink config mode, asking me if i want to setup another Homelink function. I will try again tomorrow. i've tried many times.
 
My own POV is that the work is being done, and the Air's software is becoming more robust, but the patience of buyers varies. The speed of progress does not overly concern some, but is "unacceptable" to others. I'm in the former camp. Of course I wish the car's software was completely mature but I do not view that as realistic at this point.
It’s a heck of a lot better than it used to be.
 
QA and Validation are two separate but related subjects.

Let me use some straight-forward (though not all encompassing) examples to illustrate.

QA: when I go pick up my Lucid on delivery day, if there are scratches on the paint, mis-aligned panels, trunk mats that are not properly secured (which happened in my case), those are QA issues. In other words, if Lucid inspected the car carefully before delivery, they would have picked up on these defects and corrected these issues before the customer arrives to take delivery. These are random defects, not systematic issues.

Validation: this is a completely different animal. First, there are multiple levels of validation. Let’s start with SW and HW. Each one has to be validated (i.e., testing the functionality against the specification) on its own. Thereafter, the SW and HW have to be tested together, under a range of circumstances (e.g., at different temperature, humidity, etc.) to make sure they work together as intended.

Let’s use the Homelink garage door opener as an example. So, there is a “module” (HW and SW) that performs the Homelink function (programming the garage door open code, multiple users, multiple garage doors, multiple brands of garage door openers, temperature extremes, etc.) . Let’s just say the engineers tested all of these and the Homelink Module performed faultlessly. Is the Homelink module therefore “Validated”? Yes, validated at the module level (i.e., if that’s the only standalone function), So, is it good-to-go. NO!. We still don’t know if it will it work in conjunction with all the other functions (modules) in the rest of the car under all circumstances.

As many of us (myself included) experienced, the Homelink module does not work properly when the Lucid is in reverse backing out of the garage (even though Homelink works perfectly on its own). The reason why this happens is (likely) Lucid might not have tested these two functions (Homelink and backing up) in conjunction (i.e., as a system). Now, we have a “bug”, an unanticipated interaction between two independent functions (Homelink and backup) that interacted in a manner we did not anticipate.

OK, so what! Now we know this unintended interaction, let’s fix this bug and move on. (Let’s say) We did an OTA , now it is fixed. But, is it? What happens if I try to close the garage door with Homelink while backing up at the same time, but it is raining and it is dark, so I have my headlights on and the wipers going., will the “bug-fix” for the Homelink-Backup still work? The answers is, I have no idea! The unintended interaction between independent functions is virtually impossible to anticipate and they generate scenarios that cannot be easily predicted.

Hence, we have to do SYSTEM VALIDATION…i.e., test the SYSTEM (the whole car, all its functions, at all kinds of systematic and random sequences, under different environmental conditions, temperature, rain, night/day, etc.). It this kind of testing sounds very arduous, you got it right, it is!

System manufactures (computers, airplanes, cars, space crafts, etc.) have learned that even though each individual module works faultlessly on their own, there is no guarantee they will work harmoniously TOGETHER. More likely than not, they won’t. That’s why we do SYSTEM VALIDATION. It is hard work arduous, and it is a grind to run all those regressions. And it is a never-ending task. Many a times, we are luck enough we could fix some of these unintended interactions with SW fixes (OTA). That’s great. SW fixes are easy to implement as opposed to hardware fixes. Many a times, people get confused and call them Quality issues, they are not! These are architecture/design/system bugs that were inadvertently baked into the system. We call them “bug”/”defects” because they manifest themselves “randomly”. In reality, they are not random, though they are hard to pin down. They only manifest themselves when the stars and the moon align.

I don’t want to come across as a pessimistic doomsayer. I just want us to be realistic. Building a world-class, reliable electro-mechanical-computerized system on wheels going at 70-80 mph is not for the faint of heart. A lot more work has to be done in validation to get the Lucid system to be robust.
With all due respect you are missing entirely “Software QA”, which is what I was talking about. This is where you test the software against the requirements.

In any event let’s not go down this rat hole. We all want the sane thing; for Lucid’s software to improve.

I’ve witnessed first hand how Tesla’s software improved significantly over the 7 years I owned a model S and X.

I believe Lucid will get there. We all need to communicate our issues and design suggestions not just to this forum but to Lucid customer care and feedback mechanisms, via the app, etc.
 
Yes, I know I have to tap on X. Then I tap on the Homelink icon. Often, it goes into Homelink config mode, asking me if i want to setup another Homelink function. I will try again tomorrow. i've tried many times.
I’ve never had it go into the config menu.
 
Wow - you read all this and you think the sky is falling. But wait - the car works like a dream for me. So far no major issues, HW or SW that is worth getting in a dander over. Im having a ball with the car. Now leaving it at the airport for a week. let's see how this goes.
 
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