Hold out for the Gravity, or get something else?

[quantum]

All the suggestions are ignoring that you would take a Q4 and coming up with large suvs. Midsize suggestion would be EQE suv, Fisker, and possible 2024 models of XC60, Acura ZDX, Lotus eletre and Genesis electrified GV70. All are new first gen models so no predictions on reliability

But if range is important, Gravity I’m sure will beat all of them.

 

[quantum]

Polestar is a stand alone Swedish company that was acquired by Volvo. It shares most auto component parts with Volvo. But it is independently operated. But Geely aquired Volvo as well as Lotus and shares of many auto companies, even some Volkswagen, it’s not as Chinese really even owns Audi and Porsche, German do. And Lotus is still British operated. Geely Holding is even aiming to acquire Aston Marten.

Yeah, Geely Holdings owns Volvo. But they also own many European brands.

Polestar has its own design/engineering team, they do share many parts to cut components cost together with Volvo in supply chain. They are building a new plant in North Carolina at the moment for future Polestar 3 manufacturing.

I would give Polestar software a very high rating，mainly because it is the ONLY Android UI on the market with lots of Google Play Store apps. It is very stable, car never needed to reboot for hiccup. It’s more stable than Tesla and Lucid. But the infotainment UI is just not my cup of tea in the design language. It has HD Google Map 3D graphic on instrument cluster which is very slick. And there are tons of downloadable steaming apps, but so what if they are in Finnish, Swedish, French, German, Dutch… languages, the English language streaming content are British air programming. Maybe after they build an American manufacturing plant, they can have real American streaming app like Disney and Netflix. It has audio streaming Spotify, Tidal, etc.

I see, but I’m still hesitant. I just don’t trust the Chinese. I don’t want them grabbing even an ounce of my data. No tik tok in my household.

 

[hmp10]

All the suggestions are ignoring that you would take a Q4 and coming up with large suvs. Midsize suggestion would be EQE suv, Fisker, and possible 2024 models of XC60, Acura ZDX, Lotus eletre and Genesis electrified GV70. All are new first gen models so no predictions on reliability

I have been increasingly astonished as one new EV after another continues to hit the market -- especially from German manufacturers -- with poor drivetrain packaging. Even the MB EQS, which has a smaller battery pack on a 10-inch longer wheelbase than the Lucid Air, had to fill the frunk with electronic and powertrain components and offers no more passenger cabin space. And this includes not only EVs built on ICE platforms, but also cars built on new "dedicated" EV platforms.

The landscape may look different five years from now, but I think it is a safe bet that when the Gravity comes out next year, the ratio of passenger and cargo space to exterior volume will blow away all competition, just as the Air did in the sedan space.

 

[Tesla2.0]

But if range is important, Gravity I’m sure will beat all of them.

Rivian is coming up with 180 kWh to compensate efficiency to EPA 390 miles. I just had above average 2.3 mi/kWh on 22” all season tires. I’m sure Gravity can easily beat that. Lucid is the range king. But sometimes a great product is about the whole package. There are tons of SUVs and crossovers out there (ICE/EV) IMO are inferior than R1S. I still have a reservation of a R1S not cancelled. I’m keeping my option open. I’m also anticipating real Gravity reveal.

 

[joec]

I have been increasingly astonished as one new EV after another continues to hit the market -- especially from German manufacturers -- with poor drivetrain packaging. Even the MB EQS, which has a smaller battery pack on a 10-inch longer wheelbase than the Lucid Air, had to fill the frunk with electronic and powertrain components and offers no more passenger cabin space. And this includes not only EVs built on ICE platforms, but also cars built on new "dedicated" EV platforms.

The landscape may look different five years from now, but I think it is a safe bet that when the Gravity comes out next year, the ratio of passenger and cargo space to exterior volume will blow away all competition, just as the Air did in the sedan space.

Yes. I'm convinced as much as Tesla earned its success, part of the reason it jumped so far out ahead of the pack is that the traditional auto manufacturers are still not fully understanding the full potential of what EVs can bring to the table. It's like all their old-school engineers are still being dragged kicking and screaming into the electric space, so their hearts aren't in it, or something.

This is why I think companies like Lucid actually worry Musk. It's the first time another car company came along and pushed the boundaries even further on efficiency and design.

 

[Drendino]

R1S is our family keeper.

Gravity now compete with Cyber Truck on production 2024 delivery.

We are a soccer family (ECNL, ODP, PDP). We really need the ultimate soccer mom car and of any electric 7 seater suv, the R1S is the only game in town, which is why we are waiting.

If Lucid prices the Gravity to compete with Rivian, I’ll be a day 1 order. A lot of that has to do with how poorly Rivian has treated me. I received my GT within a couple of months of my estimate, so Lucid has my trust. Rivian is off by years. The Gravity is just a phantom right now, but in my mind there is no question that it will dominate on performance, efficiency and comfort. Software, not so much, but I’m ok with that.

 

[geosynch]

I picked up my Touring (my 8th EV) in late December and am very happy with it. An R1S was to complete the driveway, but it needed to arrive Summer of 2022 (which was very realistic when I reserved it). I couldn't wait and got an Ioniq 5. It's my wife's daily driver and we are very pleased with it.

I frankly don't need the capability of the R1S, just wanted the 3rd row and a bit bigger. I still have the reservation for the R1S, but unless something tragic happens with the i5, I'll probably cancel. Just putting it out there that the i5 is a decent package if you can't wait.

 

[Tesla2.0]

We are a soccer family (ECNL, ODP, PDP). We really need the ultimate soccer mom car and of any electric 7 seater suv, the R1S is the only game in town, which is why we are waiting.

If Lucid prices the Gravity to compete with Rivian, I’ll be a day 1 order. A lot of that has to do with how poorly Rivian has treated me. I received my GT within a couple of months of my estimate, so Lucid has my trust. Rivian is off by years. The Gravity is just a phantom right now, but in my mind there is no question that it will dominate on performance, efficiency and comfort. Software, not so much, but I’m ok with that.

Yeah, I was browsing Rivian owners forum site, Rivian is great, but their mobile service is slowwww, just don’t break down your Rivian.

Lucid post-delivery customer service is simply stellar; but pre-delivery, Rivian and Lucid both have little or no communication in my personal experience. Because paperwork takes time, I asked Rivian Venice HUB give me a customer care number in case I break down driving from California to Texas, they refused and told me to call Triple A number. But once I proved ownership and got system transfer car to me, I got assigned a Rivian Guide (never used her), mobile app and on car infotainment tutorial was smooth and pleasant. And magically, 1-800 support number is now shown in various places.

Lucid will win in efficiency for sure, but not necessary performance and comfort by wide margin. 1/2 a sec performance is not revolutionary number. In fact, I would rather trade current quad motors down to dual motors to get Max pack 45 more kWh battery. How often am I going to go off-road drift rally or donut spin? Torque vectoring is just not practical for me.

I managed to get home today at 2.54 mi/kWh x 135 kWh = 343 miles, 343/303 = 113% of EPA which is puzzling to me. I had AC on too, maybe traffic is just bad and last 15 minutes may be too small statistical aggregation.

 

[SDHacker]

But if range is important, Gravity I’m sure will beat all of them.

Yes but he wrote the Etron is too big so the Gravity is likely to also be too big. Since the 265 max range of the Q4 is fine with him, I doubt big range is a deciding factor.

I forgot to add the Porsche Macan EV to the list of possible 2024 suvs.

 

[hydbob]

Yeah, I was browsing Rivian owners forum site, Rivian is great, but their mobile service is slowwww, just don’t break down your Rivian.

Lucid post-delivery customer service is simply stellar; but pre-delivery, Rivian and Lucid both have little or no communication in my personal experience. Because paperwork takes time, I asked Rivian Venice HUB give me a customer care number in case I break down driving from California to Texas, they refused and told me to call Triple A number. But once I proved ownership and got system transfer car to me, I got assigned a Rivian Guide (never used her), mobile app and on car infotainment tutorial was smooth and pleasant. And magically, 1-800 support number is now shown in various places.

Lucid will win in efficiency for sure, but not necessary performance and comfort by wide margin. 1/2 a sec performance is not revolutionary number. In fact, I would rather trade current quad motors down to dual motors to get Max pack 45 more kWh battery. How often am I going to go off-road drift rally or donut spin? Torque vectoring is just not practical for me.

View attachment 10188

I managed to get home today at 2.54 mi/kWh x 135 kWh = 343 miles, 343/303 = 113% of EPA which is puzzling to me. I had AC on too, maybe traffic is just bad and last 15 minutes may be too small statistical aggregation.

Did we drive different cars? The R1S in comparison to the Air in terms of comfort is like a 5 star hotel compared to Motel 6.

 

[Tesla2.0]

Did we drive different cars? The R1S in comparison to the Air in terms of comfort is like a 5 star hotel compared to Motel 6.

Best line of the day.
I’m just implying higher off ground, SUV drives differently than sedan. Air will have more road comfort than Gravity imo. But Gravity will have easier time to get in and out of vehicle.

 

[hmp10]

Air will have more road comfort than Gravity imo.

Hmm . . . why do you think that?

From the teasers Lucid has posted on its website, the Gravity dashboard layout appears identical to the Air, and the seats look to be every bit as luxurious and cosseting. As for roominess, the Gravity will likely be even more capacious than the Air as there have been mentions of its being slightly wider.

As for ride and handling, Porsche managed with the Cayenne to make an SUV with taut handling and good ride compliance, and I've seen nothing that suggests that Rawlinson and his suspension team can't hold their own against the best suspension engineers in the business. He earned his chops at Jaguar and Lotus, after all.

 

[hmp10]

It's like all their old-school engineers are still being dragged kicking and screaming into the electric space, so their hearts aren't in it, or something.

This is why I think companies like Lucid actually worry Musk. It's the first time another car company came along and pushed the boundaries even further on efficiency and design.

As someone who spent a career dealing with organization design issues, I can attest to the difficulties of breaking organizations free of their inertia during transitional epochs.

There's frequent mention of Rawlinson's time at Tesla on the Model S. What is often overlooked is that he was the head of Advanced Engineering at Lotus several years earlier when Musk turned to Lotus for help in engineering the powertrain of the original Roadster. That is why Musk reached out to Rawlinson when Tesla hit a dead end in the early stages of Model S development.

I doubt if there's anyone working in the automotive industry today who is as thoroughly steeped in EV engineering as Peter Rawlinson.

 

[Tesla2.0]

Hmm . . . why do you think that?

From the teasers Lucid has posted on its website, the Gravity dashboard layout appears identical to the Air, and the seats look to be every bit as luxurious and cosseting. As for roominess, the Gravity will likely be even more capacious than the Air as there have been mentions of its being slightly wider.

As for ride and handling, Porsche managed with the Cayenne to make an SUV with taut handling and good ride compliance, and I've seen nothing that suggests that Rawlinson and his suspension team can't hold their own against the best suspension engineers in the business. He earned his chops at Jaguar and Lotus, after all.

Gravity may have longer wheelbase than Air. I’m just going with the generalization, lower planted to the ground and longer wheel base will have better road compliant ride, so it all depends on the ratio of height of SUV to wheelbase, tire size and suspension.

 

[hmp10]

Gravity may have longer wheelbase than Air. I’m just going with the generalization, lower planted to the ground and longer wheel base will have better road compliant ride, so it all depends on the ratio of height of SUV to wheelbase, tire size and suspension.

It will be interesting to see what Lucid does in adapting the Air platform to the Gravity. I've read that the Gravity's body will be about an inch longer than the Air's.

I'm especially curious about footwell depth in the Gravity. Lucid's teaser video of the Gravity shows steeply reclining second-row seats in the Gravity, even with a third row. In the Air, the reclining rear seats (if they ever arrive) will be available only with the smaller battery pack, as the footrests needs the additional footwell depth to operate. With the Gravity cabin be tall enough for recliners to operate with the larger battery pack?

Also, Lucid stacks battery modules under the rear seat of the Air. Will that be the case with the Gravity? Will they even increase pack size by stacking additional modules under the third-row seat? Will either of these scenarios mean seats can't be removed to create a flat cargo floor?

Jeez . . . I feel as if I've rolled back the clock to my three years of fretting over endless questions about the Air. I had almost forgotten how entertaining and frustrating it was.

 

[SDHacker]

Yes. I'm convinced as much as Tesla earned its success, part of the reason it jumped so far out ahead of the pack is that the traditional auto manufacturers are still not fully understanding the full potential of what EVs can bring to the table. It's like all their old-school engineers are still being dragged kicking and screaming into the electric space, so their hearts aren't in it, or something.

This is why I think companies like Lucid actually worry Musk. It's the first time another car company came along and pushed the boundaries even further on efficiency and design.

Absolutely. There’s been a few articles/videos on Toyota tearing down a Model Y and just being blown away and coming to that exact realization. Toyota rested on their laurels as the top at manufacturing technology/methodology and found themselves staring at what had leapfrogged them. The new CEO completely revamped the leadership team for EV development and it’s thought that Toyota won’t have a truly EV only platform based vehicle until 2026.

 

[msaunders9430]

I turned 70 waiting over three years for our Lucid Air, and I swore I'd never do that again. I will say that digging and hanging onto every word, jot, rumor, and tittle about the Air during that time was a source of endless entertainment, although with a healthy dollop of aggravation occasionally thrown in.

After living 14 months with our Air, I've become a hard and fast devotee of the brand, have dropped my 3.5-year reservation for a Rivian R1S, and now plan to replace our Honda Odyssey with the Gravity SUV when it comes out. However, I now find that the "Available 1H 2023" language on the website actually means reservations will open up sometime this spring, with production not starting until 1H 2024.

So, I'm likely back at the Air rodeo: building excitement followed by reservation delays, followed by production delays, followed by delivery delays, probably while this and that spec changes along the way. And this time, I'll probably hit 73 while I wait.

So why, damnit, am I doing this all over again?

Because if the Gravity is to SUVs what the Air is to sports sedans, it's going to slay everything else in the niche.

Here's hoping that the Gravity, Lucid -- and I -- all survive the wait.

Please tell me how you waited three years. I decided in 2023 that I would buy my first ev in 2025 when I turn 65. I've been searching less than I year. I'm sold on the Gravity if nothing changes from the current model and they survive. Researching via this forum, back to 2020 has given me some perspective and an indication of how much some love their Airs. Perhaps this forum kept you going along with the Air being an awesome ev? If I needed a car, I'd buy a AT today.

 

[Steveinarizona]

Yes but he wrote the Etron is too big so the Gravity is likely to also be too big. Since the 265 max range of the Q4 is fine with him, I doubt big range is a deciding factor.

I forgot to add the Porsche Macan EV to the list of possible 2024 suvs.

I would vote for the Porsche Macan EV IF the buyer can wait and is willing/able to pay Porsche prices. Another small, luxury option is what I have...a Genesis GV60 Performance. Fast, luxurious and small. I got the GV60P after waiting a few years on the Lucid waiting list. In Audi terms the GV60P is similar in size to the Q4 E-Tron -- slightly shorter and slightly wider than the Q4 but way more luxurious and rapid.

 

[xponents]

As somebody who got an EV9... just wait for the Gravity. Once you have even sat in an Air, your perceptions regarding other SUV EVs will be ruined. The Gravity cannot be touched by any of its competitors regarding packaging, speed (I'm not counting the MXP as a luxury 7 seat SUV, sorry), likely the drive dynamics, and most importantly, RANGE. Even the price is reasonable!

We went into our EV9 purchase thinking we'd keep it. After experiencing the range (not even that bad at 330 real world.. but 450) and all we were missing out compared to the Air/Gravity, we have decided to get a Gravity reservation as soon as possible.

 

[AirDoll]

Please tell me how you waited three years. I decided in 2023 that I would buy my first ev in 2025 when I turn 65. I've been searching less than I year. I'm sold on the Gravity if nothing changes from the current model and they survive. Researching via this forum, back to 2020 has given me some perspective and an indication of how much some love their Airs. Perhaps this forum kept you going along with the Air being an awesome ev? If I needed a car, I'd buy a AT today.

Waiting three plus years was definitely what happened to a lot of the early reservation holders. My reservation was put in March 2020, I waited two and a half and I got my GT in October ‘22. If people were waiting for Touring or Pure the wait was much longer.