Beyond the Charging Curve: What Are Your Real-World DCFC Speeds?

[Buffalo Bob]

I ran an experiment that thus far seems to confirm my '35 Minute Rule'. On my last three preconditioned trips to an EA 350 kW charger, I charged my 2023 Pure AWD from 40% to 80%, 28% to 80% and 19% to 80%. Each session took (drum roll)... 35 minutes... with the initial charge rate going higher as the initial SOC goes lower. (The last time cracked 207 kW for a nanosecond.) Next time, I'll plug in at 10%. BTW, I'm in metro-Phoenix, so the ambient temperature is not that big a deal.

 

[momo3605]

I ran an experiment that thus far seems to confirm my '35 Minute Rule'. On my last three preconditioned trips to an EA 350 kW charger, I charged my 2023 Pure AWD from 40% to 80%, 28% to 80% and 19% to 80%. Each session took (drum roll)... 35 minutes... with the initial charge rate going higher as the initial SOC goes lower. (The last time cracked 207 kW for a nanosecond.) Next time, I'll plug in at 10%. BTW, I'm in metro-Phoenix, so the ambient temperature is not that big a deal.

19-80 in 35 minutes is close to best case scenario. 10-80 would probably be a tiny bit slower. Maybe 37-38 minutes

 

[Buffalo Bob]

I ran an experiment that thus far seems to confirm my '35 Minute Rule'. On my last three preconditioned trips to an EA 350 kW charger, I charged my 2023 Pure AWD from 40% to 80%, 28% to 80% and 19% to 80%. Each session took (drum roll)... 35 minutes... with the initial charge rate going higher as the initial SOC goes lower. (The last time cracked 207 kW for a nanosecond.) Next time, I'll plug in at 10%. BTW, I'm in metro-Phoenix, so the ambient temperature is not that big a deal.

19-80 in 35 minutes is close to best case scenario. 10-80 would probably be a tiny bit slower. Maybe 37-38 minutes

I'm inclined to agree. On my original post, I forgot to mention that I am not at all displeased with a reliable 35 minute time frame. Seems pretty reasonable to me, and if the Lucid API is any indicator, my battery health is quite high despite my exclusive use of EA over 13 months and 13k miles.

 

[EZEVDriver]

I'm inclined to agree. On my original post, I forgot to mention that I am not at all displeased with a reliable 35 minute time frame. Seems pretty reasonable to me, and if the Lucid API is any indicator, my battery health is quite high despite my exclusive use of EA over 13 months and 13k miles.

I think this is a really important point. I also use EA nearly exclusively except for rare occasions charging to 90 or 100% before a trip. I've lost a bit more than 1% in 21 months and <12k miles. The flip side of a conservative charging curve is how good my AT is on battery degradation.

 

[Buffalo Bob]

I ran an experiment that thus far seems to confirm my '35 Minute Rule'. On my last three preconditioned trips to an EA 350 kW charger, I charged my 2023 Pure AWD from 40% to 80%, 28% to 80% and 19% to 80%. Each session took (drum roll)... 35 minutes... with the initial charge rate going higher as the initial SOC goes lower. (The last time cracked 207 kW for a nanosecond.) Next time, I'll plug in at 10%. BTW, I'm in metro-Phoenix, so the ambient temperature is not that big a deal.

Here is the final test of my '35 Minute Rule'... Pulled into an EA station and had to wait a bit, as all four of their 350 kW chargers were occupied. A sunny 65 degree day in Phoenix, and I had preconditioned for more than 30 minutes. I initiated charging at an 11% SOC, and charged to 80%. Drum roll... Charging once again took 35 minutes. The same charger that initially delivered around 220 kW on my last visit only delivered 175 kW this time, but it held thereabout for around ten minutes before it started dropping, and was charging at about 65 kW when I hit 80%. I find this both interesting and acceptable... Especially if it means that I can count on my current (pun intended) low level of battery degradation. No, I won't try pulling in a 0% next time. Running the car down to 11% was as close as I want to get to range anxiety.

 

[BS8899]

Here is the final test of my '35 Minute Rule'... Pulled into an EA station and had to wait a bit, as all four of their 350 kW chargers were occupied. A sunny 65 degree day in Phoenix, and I had preconditioned for more than 30 minutes. I initiated charging at an 11% SOC, and charged to 80%. Drum roll... Charging once again took 35 minutes. The same charger that initially delivered around 220 kW on my last visit only delivered 175 kW this time, but it held thereabout for around ten minutes before it started dropping, and was charging at about 65 kW when I hit 80%. I find this both interesting and acceptable... Especially if it means that I can count on my current (pun intended) low level of battery degradation. No, I won't try pulling in a 0% next time. Running the car down to 11% was as close as I want to get to range anxiety.

Based on your experience on the Pure, do you think it charges as fast as the other Lucid trims, including the AGT?

 

[Buffalo Bob]

Based on your experience on the Pure, do you think it charges as fast as the other Lucid trims, including the AGT?

The GT and Sapphire can handle higher initial charging rates, so they should be able to take on the same number of kWh in considerably less time. However, with their larger battery packs, adding the same % SOC may or may not take the same time, but I would expect them to be faster. The Pure AWD and the Touring should be exactly the same. I really don't know about the Pure RWD's initial charging rates, but the battery is smaller by (I think) about 4 kWh.

 

[BS8899]

The AGT and Sapphire can handle higher initial charging rates, so they should be able to take on the same number of kWh in less time. However, with their larger battery packs, adding the same % may or may not be the same. The Pure AWD and the Touring should be exactly the same. I don't know about the Pure RWD.

Lucid's spec says the Pure can onboard 200 miles range, i.e., 50% battery capacity, in 17min. With your charging time/experience, I'd expect you will be darn close to 80% by 35min (from 01% SoC start). Do you see that?

 

[BS8899]

Lucid's spec says the Pure can onboard 200 miles range, i.e., 50% battery capacity, in 17min. With your charging time/experience, I'd expect you will be darn close to 80% by 35min (from 01% SoC start). Do you see that?

I meant from 10% SoC.

Also, after 17m (@>50% SoC), the charger (Voltage) shouldn't be the limiting factor, correct?

 

[Buffalo Bob]

I meant from 10% SoC.

Also, after 17m (@>50% SoC), the charger (Voltage) shouldn't be the limiting factor, correct?

I don't think you can generalize the 'adding 50% of capacity' times, as I'm sure that 17 minute figure assumes a low initial SOC. I think there is no way any Lucid could, for example, go from 40% to 90% in only 17 minutes. Yes, I do think my experience is pretty consistent with what I would have expected from the performance specs, but I'm by no means an expert in the field. I barely know my ass from a (must be preconditioned) hot rock!

 

[BS8899]

I don't think you can generalize the 'adding 50% of capacity' times, as I'm sure that 17 minute figure assumes a low initial SOC. I think there is no way any Lucid could, for example, go from 40% to 90% in only 17 minutes. Yes, I do think my experience is pretty consistent with what I would have expected from the performance specs, but I'm by no means an expert in the field. I barely know my ass from a (must be preconditioned) hot rock!

I wasn't generalizing. I was using Lucid's data RE: charging the first 200 miles/0% to 15% on the Pure. that's their spec.

 

[Buffalo Bob]

I wasn't generalizing. I was using Lucid's data RE: charging the first 200 miles/0% to 15% on the Pure. that's their spec.

If the 0% to 15% is the assumed initial SOC, then yes!

 

[BS8899]

If the 0% to 15% is the assumed initial SOC, then yes! I am sorry, it is 0% to 50%, not 15%. My question is, if your charging session is 35min, starting @10% SoC, what is your end SoC after 35min?

 

[BS8899]

I am sorry, it is 0% to 50%, not 15%. My question is, if your charging session is 35min, starting @10% SoC, what is your end SoC after 35min?

 

[Buffalo Bob]

I am sorry, it is 0% to 50%, not 15%. My question is, if your charging session is 35min, starting @10% SoC, what is your end SoC after 35min?

I may be missing your question. My first posting today was saying that I went from 11% to 80% SOC in 35 minutes. I think that I would probably still be 35 minutes if I was as 10%, albeit with a slightly higher/longer initial charge rate. After all, it's been the same duration from 40%, 28% 19% and 11%.

 

[illopp00]

I’ve always wondered with the additional energy consumed with pre-conditioning, what’s the real net gain for the faster charging speeds? Afterall, that additional pre-conditioning charge loss has to now be added to the normal charge you’re seeking.

This is probably a variable with ambient temperature playing a key role, but I wonder if at times the pre-conditioning speed gain makes little difference in the total charge time. I don’t believe I’ve ever seen an A/B test showing bottom line net gain.

It always consistently uses about 3% SOC for preconditioning to achieve the optimal temps. The main benefit is the allows the battery to effectively contain higher capacity at higher SOC. I have a 24 Touring that I have gotten to show 431 miles EPA range (rated for 420) by L1 charging it to 99%, preconditioning and then charging it back to 100%.....

 

[borski]

It always consistently uses about 3% SOC for preconditioning to achieve the optimal temps. The main benefit is the allows the battery to effectively contain higher capacity at higher SOC. I have a 24 Touring that I have gotten to show 431 miles EPA range (rated for 420) by L1 charging it to 99%, preconditioning and then charging it back to 100%.....

That is a *really* interesting hack. You didn’t precondition until you had hit 99%? At that point did preconditioning even do anything? Since your battery should theoretically have already been at temp?

 

[illopp00]

That is a *really* interesting hack. You didn’t precondition until you had hit 99%? At that point did preconditioning even do anything? Since your battery should theoretically have already been at temp?

This was done in prep for a roadtrip, so it was DCFC until 85%, home L1 charge until 100%, pre-condition again in the morning of the trip while I took it to get donuts on a 30 DEG F day and then L1 charged back to 100%. So, the Pre-conditioning took it from 99% to 95% and then the battery was nice and warm and trickle charging it is quite efficient...

There is a battery capacity vs temp curve out there on the net. But I was just expecting the temp swings to be quite dramatic.

 

[chinesejpl]

I recently had my main battery in my 22 AGT changed along with the wunderbox. I went to charge at the only available Electrify Canada station I have access to (350Kw) that I had charged my car at dozens of times in the past 1.5 years. Preconditioned fully and arrived at charger @ 6% SOC. I immediatly drew 277kw and it stayed above 200kw for more than 10min. In 11min I put in 333km of range or about 45-46kwh (=ave ~250 kw rate) and I got to 90% in 47min! This is by far the fastest and flattest curve I've ever achieved. Ambient temp was 5-6 C so it was cold. Previously I would charge for 45-50min and could only get to max 80% from SOC of 5-15% (didn't really matter much). If you llook at my receipt, I received 97.2kwh in 46min which is average of about 129kw incl charging to 90%!

Last year on a trip to the Okanagan I charged at an EC 350kw station and got 100km in 5min (all I had time for) so my recent experience was about 50% faster.

I know this is only a 1 time charging session but I was impressed.

 

[TomMJM36]

I own a '23 Air Touring with 20,000 miles on it and just completed a 1-way 1,100 mile trip down the east coast. I have seen very similar charging speeds. The highest kW I saw the entire trip was about 200 kW at an EVGo station, and only for a brief period of time. And due to the lack of chargers where I am (the nearest L3 charger is 50 miles away), I attempted to charge to close to 100% and saw a drop to 9kW at 95% (at which time I gave up trying to get more charge). In cases where the car was at a relatively low state of charge, a message on the dash would state "charging speed limited by charger." At higher states of battery charge, this statement would not be there and thus I assumed the charging speed was limited by my car.

I have to smile when I hear Peter Rawlinson talk about only needing an EV with 200 miles of range because, in reality, that is what I have. On road trips, traveling at 75+ mph with the heat or AC on, I typically get about 2/3 of my specified range. And then if I charge to 80%, and take into account that L3 chargers are fairly spread out, thus requiring that I stop sooner than I would otherwise, I find that I'm stopping about every 200 miles.

BTW, with every stop I made, EA worked flawlessly in recognizing my car (my free period expired recently so I'm now paying, and the Lucid App used my credit card on file). A few stops at EVGo also worked flawlessly (I have an account with them as well).

Overall, a pleasant drive, other than some horrendous traffic. The car is supremely comfortable and fun to drive. We could have taken my wife's 2025 Cayenne which has a range of about 500 miles on a full tank of gas. However, I would much rather drive the Lucid!