Does anyone know anything about the release or major changes? According to the press release last month, it indicated that it would be introduced in January 2024 and also hinted at increased efficiency based on lessons learned from the Grand Touring Performance. Could this mean a possible heat pump? Wil the Grand Touring Performance still exist with the introduction of the Sapphire which has a heat pump?
2024 Grand Touring changes and release
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Can someone explain to me what the big deal is about a heat pump? What's the benefit for having one as opposed to not having one?
Pros of a heat pump in an electric car include improved energy efficiency, extended driving range in cold weather, and faster heating. However, cons may involve higher upfront costs, weight, potential maintenance complexities, and reduced efficiency in extremely low temperatures.
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A heat pump uses about 1/3 to 1/4 the electrical energy to provide a given amount of heat compared to ordinary resistance heating. It's a good thing in an EV, but adds cost.
Steveinarizona
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A heat pump moves hot air instead of heating it with resistance. My HVAC systems are heat pumps as is my hot water heater. That makes them way more efficient than using resistance heat. So the big advantage is that you are not using electrons to make heat, just a few to move it. Therefore a heat pump in an EV will increase range.
Where does the hot air come from in an EV in cold weather?
Steveinarizona
Active Member
Try this:
What’s a heat pump and why do EVs use them?
Tesla made big news including a heat pump in the Model Y, but they've been around for ages. Here's the low down and what you need to know.
thenextweb.com
xponents
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The same as how your heater gets hot air to your house even if the weather is cold outside, I'd assume(electric ones only, probably more similar to resistance heating).
Nope, read the article linked above!
A heat pump is a variation of an air conditioner where the condenser and evaporator can swap roles. When it's running, the evaporator gets cold and the condenser gets hot. In your home AC, there is a fan that moves air over the evaporator to cool the house, and there's a separate box outside with a fan pulling the heat out of the condenser. That heat is coming from inside the house! (
) Now imagine turning that flow around... The part inside the house becomes the condenser and gets hot because it moves (pumps) the heat from outside the house. But, that also means the box outside your house, which is now in the role of evaporator, will get cold. Really cold. Like, almost instant frostbite cold. This works, even when it's cold outside, because the air outside is still warmer than how cold the evaporator is getting.
) Now imagine turning that flow around... The part inside the house becomes the condenser and gets hot because it moves (pumps) the heat from outside the house. But, that also means the box outside your house, which is now in the role of evaporator, will get cold. Really cold. Like, almost instant frostbite cold. This works, even when it's cold outside, because the air outside is still warmer than how cold the evaporator is getting.- Joined
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It helps, but it’s not a panacea. In the M3 test the effective loss in battery charge was reduced by 7%, nice, but not a game changer. Of course it would also add cost to an EV. With that said, yes, I’d opt for it over not having it.
Best explanation I ever read. Thanks.A heat pump is a variation of an air conditioner where the condenser and evaporator can swap roles. When it's running, the evaporator gets cold and the condenser gets hot. In your home AC, there is a fan that moves air over the evaporator to cool the house, and there's a separate box outside with a fan pulling the heat out of the condenser. That heat is coming from inside the house! (
DBV
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Would definitely take the extra 7% in the winter months.
xponents
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CoasterNerd
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An air conditioner is a heat pump that works in only one direction. Coldness is just the absence of heat. An air conditioner leverages the scientific principle called the latent heat of vaporization to collect the heat inside and move it outside. A heat pump is just an air conditioner with a reversing valve that collects/concentrates heat energy outside and moves it inside. A heat pump in air conditioning mode compresses a gas (the refrigerant or “Freon”) which causes it to get hot), hotter than the outside ambient temperature. It then passes through a condenser where it turns into a liquid and gives off a bunch of heat (mainly due to that “latent heat of vaporization”). In then moves inside and goes through an expansion valve which reduces the pressure. Immediately after the expansion valve, it passes through the evaporator where it boils. This boiling causes it to absorb heat (and feel cold). After the evaporator it goes back to the compressor and the cycle starts over. A heat pump just reverses the flow, causing the evaporator (inside) to function as the condenser (giving off heat) and turns the condenser (outside) into the evaporator (collecting heat). It’s by far the most efficient means of heating (300-400% of the energy used to run the compressor), but there are limitations (mainly having to do with how great a of a temperature difference can be achieved between inside and outside. That’s why many home air conditioners have trouble maintaining the desired temperatures in extreme heat (like 100F+). The same is true in heating mode. If it’s too cold outside (like below 5-20F depending on the system), it may not be able to reach the desired indoor temperature, so a backup heat source is always needed (in homes it may be a gas furnace or an electric heating element in the air handler). So for a car, it adds weight and complexity, and you still need an electric heating element as backup heat for extremely low temps.
It looks like you are now able to order and build a 2024 Grand Touring, however, there is no available ones already configured. Does anyone know if the 2024 grand touring will have a more efficient battery? Will the new door seals be included on this model?
xponents
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Weird that the “extended” leather interior is more than the leather option on the touring… but to answer your questions, we do not know any of those yet. Lucid stays notoriously quiet on these types of specific details, and we will have to ask Lucid support or wait for somebody to get the car!
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Presumably because the “extended” leather is more costly than the touring leather?
xponents
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We discussed this before, the extended leather is more like decreased leather! Alcantara should in theory be cheaper than the lower quality leather used in the touring for the accents, but what do I know…
DBV
Active Member
Noticed the range was lowered on the 24 models or at least the GT with 19’s. I thought I had read the 2024 GT range would be going up some?
