Have you looked at the DCFC prices?

[Halodde]

Up until today, the only prices I saw were EA prices. By me, they are charging $0.49/kWh (for plan members) which I consider to be pretty high and not that much less expensive than regular unleaded gasoline in terms of the cost/mile driven. But on the NYS thruway, at the new Applegreen DCFC chargers in the rest area, it was $0.59/kWh. I feel like that's stupid high and will probably be a deterrent to EV adoption if anyone does the math before buying an EV.

And yes, I understand that we all prefer to charge at home where it's much more convenient and much less expensive. But come on... WTH are they thinking with setting prices like that so there's no financial advantages to road tripping in an EV??

 

[Bunnylebowski]

EVGo is 0.68/kW! They’re a lot more reliable than EA but that’s too expensive I think.

 

[LucidNJ]

EVGo is 0.68/kW! They’re a lot more reliable than EA but that’s too expensive I think.

They have peak pricing which is crazy. Imagine going to Exxon and paying more because you filled gas at 9am vs. 2am. I know we have peak and off peak pricing for our homes, but public charging is a lot more expensive than home charging. And on top of that, EVgo charges a session fee if you're not on a subscription plan.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

They have peak pricing which is crazy. Imagine going to Exxon and paying more because you filled gas at 9am vs. 2am. I know we have peak and off peak pricing for our homes, but public charging is a lot more expensive than home charging. And on top of that, EVgo charges a session fee if you're not on a subscription plan.

Yeah their plans are crazy too. You gotta pay $13/month if you want it to be cheaper than EA non-subscription plan.

 

[Lucken]

Yeah their plans are crazy too. You gotta pay $13/month if you want it to be cheaper than EA non-subscription plan.

But don’t most of these plans enable you to opt in and out depending upon your travel plans? So if you’re planning a vacation, you simply opt in for that month and exit when you return home.

It minimizes the hurt for that trip, but the prices are still crazy.

 

[Halodde]

The prices are a huge deterrent to driving an EV long distances. Once my 3 years of EA are up I'll only be charging away from home in an emergency when absolutely necessary. Maybe that's what they want to accomplish

 

[Tesla2.0]

Yeah their plans are crazy too. You gotta pay $13/month if you want it to be cheaper than EA non-subscription plan.

I don’t bother subscription unless I live in apartment needing DCFC all the time or road trip a lot.

 

[Bus Driver]

Up until today, the only prices I saw were EA prices. By me, they are charging $0.49/kWh (for plan members) which I consider to be pretty high and not that much less expensive than regular unleaded gasoline in terms of the cost/mile driven. But on the NYS thruway, at the new Applegreen DCFC chargers in the rest area, it was $0.59/kWh. I feel like that's stupid high and will probably be a deterrent to EV adoption if anyone does the math before buying an EV.

And yes, I understand that we all prefer to charge at home where it's much more convenient and much less expensive. But come on... WTH are they thinking with setting prices like that so there's no financial advantages to road tripping in an EV??

I’m afraid DCFC providers are like gasoline companies in California - they’re charging extortionate rates like that just because they can.

 

[hydbob]

The prices are a huge deterrent to driving an EV long distances. Once my 3 years of EA are up I'll only be charging away from home in an emergency when absolutely necessary. Maybe that's what they want to accomplish

If it's the same as gas, then it's a push IMO. The savings for driving EVs were always from charging at home and not from DCFC. I'm not sure where that misconception started, but it was never the case, even from the beginning.

 

[WildRide47]

If it's the same as gas, then it's a push IMO. The savings for driving EVs were always from charging at home and not from DCFC. I'm not sure where that misconception started, but it was never the case, even from the beginning.

I agree with hydbob.

Not to mention all the EV charging companies are losing money(spending vast amounts on expanding their outlets). If they do not raise their prices, they will go out of business.

 

[Halodde]

If it's the same as gas, then it's a push IMO. The savings for driving EVs were always from charging at home and not from DCFC. I'm not sure where that misconception started, but it was never the case, even from the beginning.

Yeah you can say that it's a push (and I would agree). However, if the goal is to increase EV adoption, a 'push' isn't going to tip the scales or add motivation for people to buy an EV.

Add the high price of DCFC with the scarcity of reliable charging options, and some people will be actively staying away from buying an EV.

 

[Halodde]

I agree with hydbob.

Not to mention all the EV charging companies are losing money(spending vast amounts on expanding their outlets). If they do not raise their prices, they will go out of business.

Well, I'd say they are investing in their networks for future profit. I don't know how much they are making on high pricing for DCFC if people are only going to use it when absolutely necessary and only get enough juice to drive to a less expensive option.

It might just be a supply and demand thing. They might just be gouging because there are not enough options to establish competition

 

[WildRide47]

Well, I'd say they are investing in their networks for future profit. I don't know how much they are making on high pricing for DCFC if people are only going to use it when absolutely necessary and only get enough juice to drive to a less expensive option.

It might just be a supply and demand thing. They might just be gouging because there are not enough options to establish competition

How is it gouging when EVGO, Chargepoint and Blink are all losing money? They have negative earnings because of the large amounts of money they are spending to expand their networks.

 

[Halodde]

I use the term gouging to refer to charging above (or at least at the high end of) market value based on the limited amount of competition and charging options along the NYS thruway.

And just because those companies currently have negative cash flow doesn't mean it's good business to over charge for their currently available products/services. The $ they are spending now is investing in future sales revenue. It's not going to work well for them to try to make up for negative cash flow with current high prices.

 

[joec]

I'm with @hydbob. The reason to get an EV is to charge at home and save your money there. Not to mention the much cheaper maintenance costs. (No oil changes, no brake pads, thanks to regen, very few moving parts in general.) And don't forget the biggest savings of all: your time. Plug in at home and spend zero time on refueling.

So long as fast charging remains a just bit cheaper than gas, an EV is still a great cost savings over an ICE vehicle.

I think fast charging as a business is going to continue to evolve over time. I would not be surprised to see the smarter chains going extremely cheap or even free for the charging itself, in favor of getting you in the door to spend money on other things. It's still very early times for this business.

Look at it this way: At least the pricing isn't being dictated by a giant conglomerate artificially managing supply for maximum profit. So long as competition is around, pricing should stay within reason.

 

[inthewoods]

NYSEG installed a "day/night" meter so when I charge at night, the rate is $0.0347/Kwh.

 

[WildRide47]

I use the term gouging to refer to charging above (or at least at the high end of) market value based on the limited amount of competition and charging options along the NYS thruway.

And just because those companies currently have negative cash flow doesn't mean it's good business to over charge for their currently available products/services. The $ they are spending now is investing in future sales revenue. It's not going to work well for them to try to make up for negative cash flow with current high prices.

I don't think they have a choice. If they lower their price, then they don't have enough money to expand and they go out of business.

At the moment, the stocks of those companies are in the dumpster. If they lower their price and their negative cash flow increases, that's the end of those companies.

 

[WildRide47]

I don't think they have a choice. If they lower their price, then they don't have enough money to expand and they go out of business.

At the moment, the stocks of those companies are in the dumpster. If they lower their price and their negative cash flow increases, that's the end of those companies.

These companies do not have a Saudi Fund to back them up. They are in a more precarious position.

 

[Halodde]

These companies do not have a Saudi Fund to back them up. They are in a more precarious position.

I guess we can just disagree on how they are pricing their current products now. I would contend that they would sell more of their product to more customers if they priced it more reasonably. Like I said above, all they are going to sell at those prices is the minimum amount of energy necessary to get someone to the closest more reasonable charging option.

I look at it in the same regard as all the EV manufacturers lowering prices to sell more cars. Just a difference of opinion though.