Pro and Con evaluation of battery saving

[Tesla2.0]

SOC -5% unplugged from L2 charger in garage for 17 days, 12 hours and I never logged in to check SOC status once just this experiment. So I assume my AGT was in hibernation in garage. My post here is to see anyone has any pros and cons opinion of unplugged.

9/5 - left to Europe

9/23 - returned back to states

 

[Adnillien]

I think this tells us that Lucid's phantom drain is low enough that it does not matter if you leave it plugged in or not. It matches very closely to what I saw when I left mine plugged in for 2 weeks and woke it up every 3-4 days to see it recharge ~1%. When we are not around to wake it up, the car is fine. Your garage was about 4-5 degrees cooler than mine. We really do not need to worry much about how we leave the car. This result may be different for cold climates in the winter but in the summer, no worries.

 

[hellolucid]

i lost 25miles in 18 days. never opened the app in between. a little over a mile per day. i'm okay with that.

 

[Tesla2.0]

I was more concerned about fire hazard in case I’m not around and longevity of battery if the car is not waking up to cool often. But the drain is very little compared to what I lost overnight when I came home from EA station wake up next day sometimes even 6% overnight after a fast charge.

 

[hmp10]

I was more concerned about fire hazard in case I’m not around and longevity of battery if the car is not waking up to cool often.

I may be wrong about this, but I think the battery monitoring system stays active even during deep sleep and will come on to cool or heat the battery pack even if unplugged. My car goes into deep sleep when parked overnight in the garage even when plugged in, and I hear the battery cooling system come on periodically.

 

[DaveyBoyGT]

I was more concerned about fire hazard in case I’m not around and longevity of battery if the car is not waking up to cool often. But the drain is very little compared to what I lost overnight when I came home from EA station wake up next day sometimes even 6% overnight after a fast charge.

Your fire hazard concern is legitimate, and I would not leave it charging for that length of time either. The Battery loss of charge is going to happen, that is the nature of batteries.

That being said, this forum concern for "phantom" lost charge is unfounded. The way the Lucid battery setup is structured, the HV battery charges up the 12V batteries via the Wonderbox. When the car is not being used, the HV battery trickle charges the 12V batteries to maintain a constant 12.5 to 12.7 volts, so the 12V, AGM lead acid battery does not degrade and start sulfation on the lead plates. All lead acid batteries do this and have so since they were invented. In actuality this car, as all EVs, have a built-in trickle charger for the 12V batteries. On my ICE cars, there is no trickle charging as the battery is charged by the alternator. When an ICE car is idle or in storage, the battery loses charge unless a trickle charger is plugged in the battery, which I do, and unfortunately it is the only way to avoid discharging the battery, even if you take the battery out of the car. The only concern you should have is if there is a huge loss of charge, which may indicate a loss of charging capacity of the 12V battery or a problem with the 12V charging circuit from the Wonderbox. You just have to accept some loss of charge when the car is idle, knowing that the HV battery and Wonderbox are keeping the 12V batteries from permanently losing charge capacity.

 

[hmp10]

In actuality this car, as all EVs, have a built-in trickle charger for the 12V batteries.

Tesla switched from lead acid to lithium ion for the 12V accessory battery in the updated Models S and X. The Model 3 and Y still use lead acid.

 

[Sandvinsd]

Your fire hazard concern is legitimate, and I would not leave it charging for that length of time either. The Battery loss of charge is going to happen, that is the nature of batteries.

That being said, this forum concern for "phantom" lost charge is unfounded. The way the Lucid battery setup is structured, the HV battery charges up the 12V batteries via the Wonderbox. When the car is not being used, the HV battery trickle charges the 12V batteries to maintain a constant 12.5 to 12.7 volts, so the 12V, AGM lead acid battery does not degrade and start sulfation on the lead plates. All lead acid batteries do this and have so since they were invented. In actuality this car, as all EVs, have a built-in trickle charger for the 12V batteries. On my ICE cars, there is no trickle charging as the battery is charged by the alternator. When an ICE car is idle or in storage, the battery loses charge unless a trickle charger is plugged in the battery, which I do, and unfortunately it is the only way to avoid discharging the battery, even if you take the battery out of the car. The only concern you should have is if there is a huge loss of charge, which may indicate a loss of charging capacity of the 12V battery or a problem with the 12V charging circuit from the Wonderbox. You just have to accept some loss of charge when the car is idle, knowing that the HV battery and Wonderbox are keeping the 12V batteries from permanently losing charge capacity.

The phantom drainwas Mainly after charging where the car would lose 2-3% right after charging. There was also some larger drains, but some of these updates have seemed to fix most of those issues now.

 

[hydbob]

The phantom drainwas Mainly after charging where the car would lose 2-3% right after charging. There was also some larger drains, but some of these updates have seemed to fix most of those issues now.

Since you are keenly tracking the drain and usage, how has it faired over the life of your ownership so far?

 

[DaveyBoyGT]

The phantom drainwas Mainly after charging where the car would lose 2-3% right after charging. There was also some larger drains, but some of these updates have seemed to fix most of those issues now.

Charging the battery causes the HV battery to heat up. When the temp gets too high the battery coolant gets circulated to cool it down, resulting additional energy consumption from the coolant pump. This is especially noticeable in high heat climates (i.e., AZ) so the coolant pump runs longer to cool off the battery. In low temp climates the coolant will be circulated to heat the battery up to optimum while it's charging, resulting in additional energy consumption from the battery and the coolant pump. So, in high heat climates and low temperature climates you will get the most "phantom' drain. This energy consumption is in addition to the energy consumption to trickle charge the 12V batteries. Garaging your car will help to temper the temp extremes. It might be worthwhile to monitor the phantom drain in various climate conditions to quantify the energy losses.

 

[Tesla2.0]

The phantom drainwas Mainly after charging where the car would lose 2-3% right after charging. There was also some larger drains, but some of these updates have seemed to fix most of those issues now.

I do agree and think recent updates somehow reduce drainage.

 

[Sandvinsd]

Since you are keenly tracking the drain and usage, how has it faired over the life of your ownership so far?

I have found that everything has improved with updates since July when I first took delivery. The 2-3% drain after overnight charging is not there anymore And it doesn’t lose much just sitting in the garage now, perhaps only a mile or two in a day.

 

[Bill55]

Your fire hazard concern is legitimate, and I would not leave it charging for that length of time either. The Battery loss of charge is going to happen, that is the nature of batteries.

Fire hazard is not a legitimate concern for leaving an EV plugged in, unless you also classify parking a car with 20 gallons of gas in your garage as a legitimate fire hazard concern.

 

[DaveyBoyGT]

Fire hazard is not a legitimate concern for leaving an EV plugged in, unless you also classify parking a car with 20 gallons of gas in your garage as a legitimate fire hazard concern.

That's a pretty lame effort to equate the fire hazard of a gasoline tank with an actively energized electrical circuit. A doubled line gas tank with the car shut off has zero hazard compared to an electrically energized circuit connected for several weeks. This is especially concerning considering the problems with the Lucid charging problems and the associated 12v battery failures. If you believe in the far-out belief in spontaneous combustion, then I can see why might think that there is a hazard with gasoline tanks.

 

[Bill55]

That's a pretty lame effort to equate the fire hazard of a gasoline tank with an actively energized electrical circuit. A doubled line gas tank with the car shut off has zero hazard compared to an electrically energized circuit connected for several weeks. This is especially concerning considering the problems with the Lucid charging problems and the associated 12v battery failures. If you believe in the far-out belief in spontaneous combustion, then I can see why might think that there is a hazard with gasoline tanks.

If your statement of leaving Lucid plugged in was a “legitimate fire hazard” you would not be able to insure the car or your house. Further the recommendation would be to charge outside and not at night when people are sleeping. Some one will win the power ball, just because I’ve heard of someone winning and have a ticket. I’m not at “legitimate risk to win”

 

[Bill55]

That's a pretty lame effort to equate the fire hazard of a gasoline tank with an actively energized electrical circuit. A doubled line gas tank with the car shut off has zero hazard compared to an electrically energized circuit connected for several weeks. This is especially concerning considering the problems with the Lucid charging problems and the associated 12v battery failures. If you believe in the far-out belief in spontaneous combustion, then I can see why might think that there is a hazard with gasoline tanks.

FIRE RISK: Ford Tells 200,000 SUV Owners to Park Outside

Ford has issued two new recalls impacting nearly 200,000 SUV owners whose gas-powered vehicles may spontaneously combust!

cleantechnica.com

 

[Coho]

That's a pretty lame effort to equate the fire hazard of a gasoline tank with an actively energized electrical circuit. A doubled line gas tank with the car shut off has zero hazard compared to an electrically energized circuit connected for several weeks. This is especially concerning considering the problems with the Lucid charging problems and the associated 12v battery failures. If you believe in the far-out belief in spontaneous combustion, then I can see why might think that there is a hazard with gasoline tanks.

It certainly is not clear to me why a plugged in Lucid or other EV which pulls current current periodically on demand from a home charger set up which can be controlled as to when it allows current to flow would be any different than current flowing to other 240v devices like furnaces, stoves, pumps etc. For that matter, any 120v system is also a hazard following the logic expressed.

 

[Bill55]

It certainly is not clear to me why a plugged in Lucid or other EV which pulls current current periodically on demand from a home charger set up which can be controlled as to when it allows current to flow would be any different than current flowing to other 240v devices like furnaces, stoves, pumps etc. For that matter, any 120v system is also a hazard following the logic expressed.

People hear about an EV fires and make claims without knowledge. I’ve no worries leaving the Lucid plugged in.

 

[martinmeyer]

I leave my Tesla plugged in all the time. There is no significant risk of fire hazard from leaving an EV plugged in. These aren’t filled with dumb batteries. They don’t just keep getting stuffed with energy until they explode. The battery management system knows when to cut off charging and it does so well before any fire is likely to start.