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Lucid Production Week Event

hmp10

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Is it also that loud?
We haven't yet been hit by a police laser gun. It wasn't any louder than the radar alerts when the installer was demonstrating it using his laser signal generator.
 

WildRide47

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Hey Jerry, sorry for the delay on this. Here's my best quick rundown of how the system works and what controls you'll need to worry about.

Note the 2 buttons installed in the ashtray.

System Controls
Radar & Laser Defense System






Here's a quick overview of what the buttons so. The items in black are handled by either button, and the items in red or blue are unique to that button.

LEFT BUTTON:

  • RADAR MUTE
  • LASER JAMMING SHUTDOWN
  • VOLUME DOWN
  • LASER POWER

RIGHT BUTTON:


  • RADAR MUTE
  • LASER JAMMING SHUTDOWN
  • VOLUME UP Unfortunately the volume control is only for the loudness of the radar, not the volume of the laser jamming
  • LASER MENU (NOT USED)

HOW TO CHANGE VOLUME:


Press an hold both buttons simultaneously until voice command starts. Then press ether the left or right button to change volume state. Once desired volume level is reached, don't press anything for 5 seconds and system will save settings.

RADAR OPERATION:

The radar connection to the controls in the console is for MUTE only. You can use either button on the control pad to mute a radar alert.

LASER OPERATION:

The laser system is set up to jam a signal for four seconds after receiving the initial hit, giving you that window of time to slow to an acceptable speed. After the four seconds, the system will say "laser detection mode only" and the LED alert will turn green. This means you are no longer jamming and the officer can acquire your speed. After 60 seconds the LED will turn blue again as the system restarts and enables jamming again.

If you want to shut down the jammers before the four seconds, simply press either of the two buttons within that four second window to initiate the 60-second detect only mode.
 

hmp10

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I think you would find the Radenso system a good bit easier to operate.

- The volume for all alerts is controlled by a pair of simple up and down buttons.

- You mute an alarm by a brief press on either the Power, Brightness, or Driving Mode button, so aiming your finger is not all that critical. (The buttons execute their primary functions by pressing and holding them for a couple of seconds.)

- The laser jamming cutoff time can be adjusted from 0-6 seconds. (I have mine set at 6 seconds.)
 

WildRide47

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Thanks. I will ask my installer. There is no problem with the radar/laser detector. The volume is easily adjustable on those alerts. It is the laser jammer alert where there is no adjustment for ear splitting volume.
 

hmp10

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"Motor Authority" just posted a thorough review of the Air (at least as thorough as a 30-minute drive can produce).


Two things really caught my eye:

As did Kyle Conner, they noticed some tire noise off the rear wheels when sitting in the backseat: "in the back seat we noticed some pavement 'patter' at the rear wheels." (Neither Conner nor Halvorson seemed to have noticed it from the front seat.)

Halvorson gave the most informative reason I've seen so far for why Lucid settled on a coil spring instead of an air suspension: "The hysteresis, or lag, from an air-spring setup would have meant too many compromises in the damping that would affect ride and handling, according to Zach Walker, engineering manager for chassis mechanical."

All in all, this was one of the most glowing reviews of the Air thus far.
 

Lucken

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"Motor Authority" just posted a thorough review of the Air (at least as thorough as a 30-minute drive can produce).


Two things really caught my eye:

As did Kyle Conner, they noticed some tire noise off the rear wheels when sitting in the backseat: "in the back seat we noticed some pavement 'patter' at the rear wheels." (Neither Conner nor Halvorson seemed to have noticed it from the front seat.)

Halvorson gave the most informative reason I've seen so far for why Lucid settled on a coil spring instead of an air suspension: "The hysteresis, or lag, from an air-spring setup would have meant too many compromises in the damping that would affect ride and handling, according to Zach Walker, engineering manager for chassis mechanical."

All in all, this was one of the most glowing reviews of the Air thus far.
Again, it's so surprising to me that the Lucid team either hadn't noticed this or done what was necessary to eliminate or greatly mitigate it. Thus far, this is the most disappointing aspect of the car that pops up in the reviews...as well as interior recordings.
 

dawktah LucidGT

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Again, it's so surprising to me that the Lucid team either hadn't noticed this or done what was necessary to eliminate or greatly mitigate it. Thus far, this is the most disappointing aspect of the car that pops up in the reviews...as well as interior recordings.
Its distressing to say the least. I cannot remember when the new tires were announced but I get the feeling it was after the sound testing and insulation had been decided. I am reading that Hankook makes a quieter tire.
 

hmp10

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Conner seemed truly aggravated by the noise; Halvorson just noted it as "some pavement 'patter'". Both Conner and Halvorson otherwise thought the car was quiet and the ride good. It's interesting that no one who experienced the car only from the front seats has mentioned the issue.

However, even though Conner might have overreacted a bit, there does seem to be something Lucid missed or could not ameliorate in sound engineering the cabin. It was apparent in Conner's follow-on podcast that his comments caught the attention of Lucid engineers who met him as soon as he got out of the car after his test drive to probe deeper into his observation. So I think the question is whether, at this late stage, there is anything Lucid can do about it.

It won't prevent my taking the car, but I do find this a little surprising and would like to hear more from other reviewers on this specific point, as we're still a while away from customer test drives.
 

Lucken

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I might also take a look at the upcoming BMW I4. A different type of vehicle, but it does look interesting and I suspect I might be able to test drive it before I can the Lucid.
 

hmp10

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I'm an unusual buyer in that I am an "early adopter" of new products and have ordered several cars that had long waiting lists before the first cars were available for test drives: the Audi R8, the Mercedes SL55 AMG, the first dual-motor version of the Tesla Model S Performance, and now the Lucid. However, I have bought them because acquiring the newest technology was my priority, and I was willing to live with other compromises.

Given what your priorities seem to be -- and they're certainly more mainstream than mine -- I think you definitely should hold off on ordering a Lucid until you can test drive one . . . and do so in the road conditions that will shed meaningful light on your primary concerns. Very few dealers allow cars to be test driven in truly revealing circumstances. I hope Lucid will be different on that score. One clue will be whether professional auto reviewers are given more than the 15-30 minutes behind the wheel they were given last week in a car Lucid provides to them, or whether they will have to wait to borrow cars from owners, as many reviewers have had to do with the new Tesla Model S.
 

Adnillien

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Other than Conner, reviewers either do not mention it or seem to think that the rear seat noise is a minor issue. I have recently driven the roads that the test drives were done on and can confirm that they will accentuate the noise. While I do want the hear an listen for myself, I am not too worried about. Either I am not worried or I am just trying to convince myself that the Lucid Air is a great car, which it is.
 

dawktah LucidGT

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Other than Conner, reviewers either do not mention it or seem to think that the rear seat noise is a minor issue. I have recently driven the roads that the test drives were done on and can confirm that they will accentuate the noise. While I do want the hear an listen for myself, I am not too worried about. Either I am not worried or I am just trying to convince myself that the Lucid Air is a great car, which it is.
Coming from an ICE and this will be my first EV, I think the difference will be so dramatic that the NVH that is of concern I probably won't notice. I test drove an Audi All-Road back in when it was introduced and at a certain speed it would develop a harmonic an percussion sound inside. I was a beta tester with the Cayenne and it had a weird harmonic that was from a cardan shaft so the truck vibrated at 55-58 mph.
 

hmp10

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Other than Conner, reviewers either do not mention it or seem to think that the rear seat noise is a minor issue.
I agree. I think when the dust settles, this is going to turn out to be a convergence of events: a rider who is hyper-sensitive to certain noises, riding in the backseat of a car on a particularly chopped up surface (as Tom Moloughney indicated that road to be), on performance tires, in a car with very little of the noises that ICE vehicles emit.

There have just been too many other ride-alongs with professional car reviewers and too many late-stage tests with Tesla engineers riding in the backseat for this to be a problem over a wide array of use conditions.
 

Lucken

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Coming from an ICE and this will be my first EV, I think the difference will be so dramatic that the NVH that is of concern I probably won't notice. I test drove an Audi All-Road back in when it was introduced and at a certain speed it would develop a harmonic an percussion sound inside. I was a beta tester with the Cayenne and it had a weird harmonic that was from a cardan shaft so the truck vibrated at 55-58 mph.
If I had been coming from my previous Jaguar I-Pace or Tesla MS, I wouldn't be quite as concerned either. Both cars, although certainly quieter than most ICE vehicles (particularly the I-Pace), had enough noise that I don't think the Lucid's road intrusion would bother me that much. However the Audi e-Tron is in a different class of 'quiet' and, for me, has sent a benchmark I had hoped the Lucid would match or exceed. It's appearing this may not be the case.
 

hmp10

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I'm curious. Are you keeping the e-Tron or planning to trade it for a Lucid?
 

Lucken

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I'm curious. Are you keeping the e-Tron or planning to trade it for a Lucid?
I’ll trade it. The killer for me is the limited range. I knew this going in, but after a test drive I was enamored with the ride quality and quietness. Despite that, I knew this was going to be a placeholder car.
 
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hmp10

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Perhaps the most comprehensive report yet on driving the Lucid Air (including even "Motor Trend's" 2-day drive):


Regarding the rear seat noise that has been under discussion . . . both drivers found the car very quiet up front, but one of them did feel that rear seat noise was more than they had expected.

However, on NVH in general, they found the car remarkably good and, more notably, found that NVH increased virtually nil with speed, saying the car was as quiet at 80 mph as at 35 mph. And no squeaks or rattles were detected.

As for driving, they kept using the word "fabulous": no body roll, precise steering, suspension both highly compliant and remarkable planted.

One big surprise: there was so much distortion in the glass canopy that one driver, who otherwise loved the car, said he would not hand over the check at delivery if the car being delivered had glass like this. (This particularly caught my attention, as a 2011 Honda Odyssey I bought at the introduction of a new generation of the minivan had this same problem down the passenger side A-pillar. It was a surprising gaffe for a car with Honda's quality reputation.) He did feel, however, that this is something Lucid can correct prior to delivering cars.

Finally, both said that, while they expected a high-quality car, they were sure they would find subtle indicators that this was the first product of a start-up. Instead, they found a car that felt as if it came off the production line of a long-established company that built cars of the highest order.
 
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Lucken

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So I finally got a chance to watch that rather long 43 minute video. Here are a few thoughts I had based on their observations:

* The windshield distortion was truly surprising to me. This was not just distortion in the canopy from above as was in my Tesla, this was field of vision distortion. Interestingly, he was greatly bothered by it and she never mentioned it. Although a different problem, my Jaguar I-Pace had an optional heated windshield. This caused an overall subtle ‘fogging’ that always bothered me. It also produced rainbows at certain sun angles. I would never go with a heated windshield again. Windshield issues can really detract from the driving experience.

So the question is, was this a one-off problem or do all the full canopies have it? It’s the first time I heard it mentioned. Is this because he was the only driver to see it? Is that because he was the perfect height to have the unfortunate luck to have it directly in his field of vision? Or is it because his tester was the only one with this optical distortion. I don’t think this is a minor point. My Lucid will have a conventional windshield, so it’s unlikely to be an issue for me, but others should not dismiss this.

* The mics used in this video were of higher quality (for voice) than most previous videos and I suspect they filtered out much of the ambient sounds. The rear seat noise that bothered Winter was apparently not picked up by the mics. It didn’t appear the mics had much of an upper frequency response either. Video is a hobby of mine so I tend to notice these things. If I judged noise solely by the noise picked up by the mics in this video, I wouldn’t be bothered. We shall see.

* Regardless of the previous drives their tester was subject to, was nobody surprised by the 1.9 miles/kWh? I was for sure. I didn’t think even aggressive driving would result in that poor an efficiency in the Lucid. That’s something I’ll watch out for in road tests in the future. I doubt it will be an issue, but this did strike me as surprising.

* The backseat foot issue won’t be a problem for me or my passengers, but it might for the large battery pack buyers. No surprises here, we knew this.

Otherwise the feedback was excellent. Even Winter’s comment that the Lucid did not give him a luxury car ride, was not concerning. He raved about it being a driver’s car which he absolutely loved. I wished he had gone into more detail about those comments, but I assume he meant the ride was not ‘pillowy soft’.
 

hmp10

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A poster on another forum is a physician, and he noted that certain astigmatisms combined with looking through glass at an angle can cause the phenomenon that Winter observed. Winter was wearing glasses for vision correction and, as you say, no one else has noticed this problem. I'm pretty sure Winter has never been in a car with the windshield rising above his head at that angle. From my earlier experience with the Honda, it is something to which I'm going to pay special attention at delivery, and I will reject the car if I see the same problem to the extent Winter did. Until then, I'm not going to worry about it, as I strongly suspect this is a one-off thing.

I've seen enough test drives from last week's event at Casa Grande to know that the cars were put through repeated bursts of hard acceleration. Remember that Nikki and Winter were looking at a power use indicator that can be set to display use over varying time periods. As they saw a considerable drop in power use during their test drive on the same indicator, I think it was set for a short measurement period. If the car had been put through a few hard acceleration punches by the prior driver, the gauge could well be expected to show 1.9 m/kWh when they got into the car. In our Tesla Plaid, we can easily see the power consumption rate climb precipitously when we're playing with the car. Again, not something I'm going to worry about.

Regarding the backseat leg comfort, Winter pointed out something I experienced. On my first two visits to a Design Studio where the car had the larger battery pack, I arrived intending to check out the rear seat leg drop, as it was an issue that plagued me in our 2015 Tesla Model S. On both visits I kept my feet flat on the floor and, short as I am, still found the knees jacked up too high for real comfort. On a third visit (I'm ashamed to admit there have been four) I was chatting with someone and unconsciously crossed my feet and let my thighs drop sideways into the position I normally ride in a rear seat. The space seemed to open up almost miraculously, and I found the space quite comfortable. (I still wish Lucid had found someplace else for those four extra battery modules, as the rear seat with the smaller battery pack we experienced at another Studio is on par with any large German sedan, if not better.)

The one thing that was still nagging me was whether it is folly to buy not just a first model from a start-up, but also one of its first production cars off the line. Given that the car Nikki and Winter drove was a late pre-production car with a few nits yet to be addressed, I was truly impressed with their closing remarks about the car feeling like something a major luxury automaker had been producing for years. This is where the fact that Lucid's senior ranks are staffed with leading people from their respective fields in engineering and building cars really pays off.
 
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