Lucid Motors Unveils Plan For Three Affordable EVs To Challenge Tesla

[borski]

I love the EV6 (and @borski his IONIQ 5, I see). Also check out the Genesis GV60. They all charge almost as fast as the Lucid, are reasonably efficient (my AWD model dips under 3 mi/kWh if I drive at 75 mph+, IONIQ a bit less due to aero, GV60 less still as it's the heaviest), quite spacious inside (but small frunk), and the EV6 handles almost like a sporty car though it's a bit too tall. If your dad is used to the model S this is no biggie, but these can be driven more like normal cars - blended regen+friction brake, and at lowest regen you can almost coast by lifting the throttle. Auto Regen mode (that adjusts based on terrain and obstacles) is neat.

They are very similar but tuned differently - the IONIQ 5 suspension is softer (unless you get the N model), EV6 most sporty, GV60 in between.

If headroom is a concern in the EV6 GT-Line, try the Wind trim (but add the Tech package) - the sunroof in the former sacrifices headroom and can't be optioned out, the IONIQ 5 and GV60 are taller and iirc come with glass roof rather than a traditional sunroof so it's less of an issue. Definitely not an issue on the EV9 as well.

Kudos to your dad, I hope I'll still be driving when I'm 90 too!

To be clear, the Ioniq 5 is my wife’s car, and she has different needs than I do. I probably would’ve picked the EV6 just based on drive, but she preferred the looks and design of the Ioniq 5, and hey - her car, not mine.

And I want to be clear that it isn’t perfect; because I don’t drive it daily, it annoys the heck out of me in a bunch of tiny ways - the biggest one being that I-pedal is a thing I have to set every time I drive and you can’t set it to that by default, so you’re always in the wrong regen mode. Not a safety issue (lol), but very annoying.

 

[michel]

To be clear, the Ioniq 5 is my wife’s car, and she has different needs than I do. I probably would’ve picked the EV6 just based on drive, but she preferred the looks and design of the Ioniq 5, and hey - her car, not mine.

And I want to be clear that it isn’t perfect; because I don’t drive it daily, it annoys the heck out of me in a bunch of tiny ways - the biggest one being that I-pedal is a thing I have to set every time I drive and you can’t set it to that by default, so you’re always in the wrong regen mode. Not a safety issue (lol), but very annoying.

Ah, RWD or AWD?

On AWD the i-Pedal leads to lower efficiency because it keeps the front motor engaged - but yeah it doesn't have to be done this way, and then why stop the setting persisting on RWD either...

If i-Pedal can be made sticky (and done in a way that doesn't sap range) the HMG cars would actually be more flexible driving mode wise than Tesla/Lucid/Rivian (can only regen via accelerator) and some legacy maker's EVs that can't do one pedal driving at all. On par with BMW which also has adaptive regen and OPD via the B mode.

Lucid, Porsche and BMW smokes the Koreans in driving dynamics though.

 

[borski]

Ah, RWD or AWD?

On AWD the i-Pedal leads to lower efficiency because it keeps the front motor engaged - but yeah it doesn't have to be done this way, and then why stop the setting persisting on RWD either...

If i-Pedal can be made sticky (and done in a way that doesn't sap range) the HMG cars would actually be more flexible driving mode wise than Tesla/Lucid/Rivian (can only regen via accelerator) and some legacy maker's EVs that can't do one pedal driving at all. On par with BMW which also has adaptive regen and OPD via the B mode.

Lucid, Porsche and BMW smokes the Koreans in driving dynamics though.

AWD, and I don't really care how it's done, I want 1-pedal driving, lol. If it kills the efficiency, I'm fine with that; this isn't our roadtripper.

Agreed on the rest.

 

[MJAir23TheGoat]

I like it for Lucid news however, 2-3 years from now the Tesla lineup may look significantly different as well.

 

[Pragmatic]

I like it for Lucid news however, 2-3 years from now the Tesla lineup may look significantly different as well.

Yeah I heard new colors are in the planning stages. Should be released with the Roadster.

 

[Batteryman]

I like it for Lucid news however, 2-3 years from now the Tesla lineup may look significantly different as well.

Tesla is removing features from its cars- no radar, no parking sensors, no gear lever, no passenger lumbar support....wonder what they will remove in newer models.

 

[Haggy]

Tesla is removing features from its cars- no radar, no parking sensors, no gear lever, no passenger lumbar support....wonder what they will remove in newer models.

When they got rid of the radar in my Model 3, it no longer saw what was two cars ahead. It's probably not an issue for FSD, but for manual driving it's nice to have extra warning if the vehicle in front of the vehicle in front slams on its brakes. Parking sensors are gone, but cameras are there for automatic parking. They didn't get rid of bird's eye view because they never had it in the first place. Gear lever is one of those things that you'd have to try for yourself to see if you are fine without it. I haven't driven a Tesla without a gear selector. I have driven other cars with push buttons instead of a gear lever, and I didn't like it, but I can't say what I would have felt in the long term. When Tesla came out with the Model 3 with only a center screen, I didn't know what to make of it, but it took seconds to get used to. That's until they enabled side view cameras, at which point it was clear that the display is in a really bad place. They never had blind spot indicators on the mirrors or A pillar. They got rid of the sun roof when they found out that 96ish percent of owners never used it, and they likely analyzed passenger lumbar support use to find out if it was widely used. They also removed any included charging equipment. Originally, they gave something functionally similar to what Lucid gives. Then they stopped including the NEMA 14-50 plug. Then they said that people will probably want to install a home charging station so they didn't want to second guess the buyer.

I don't know what they will remove next, but they did add fart sounds. It says something about their priorities. They also have lots of games that can be played only when the car is stopped, and I have no desire to play games while in a driver seat looking to my side at a small (compared to a home system) screen. I'm not a gamer to begin with, but if I were, it would be for the same reason I don't like watching Netflix in a car.

They have added lots of little things over the years, some of which Lucid is still missing and will hopefully get to. It took Tesla years to get the homelink pop-up to integrate well, especially in reverse, but they eventually got there. Those tend to be software features that don't have ongoing production costs though. The latest was Amazon Music, which I understand Lucid might add. It sort of works with Alexa now but there's no screen interface.

They have improved some things in the latest version of the Model 3, but I can't think of anything they added that Lucid didn't already have. And they are still behind Lucid in lots of ways.

 

[Haggy]

I love the EV6 (and @borski his IONIQ 5, I see). Also check out the Genesis GV60. They all charge almost as fast as the Lucid, are reasonably efficient

He's considering an Iconiq 6 but hasn't seen one in person yet. As far as charging, he's using a standard 15A outlet, and for the amount he drives (probably under 2000 miles per year) I don't think it will matter, but it will make him happy to see that he's getting more miles of charge per hour -- even if he won't use the car again for a few days.

They are very similar but tuned differently - the IONIQ 5 suspension is softer (unless you get the N model), EV6 most sporty, GV60 in between.

If headroom is a concern in the EV6 GT-Line, try the Wind trim (but add the Tech package) - the sunroof in the former sacrifices headroom and can't be optioned out, the IONIQ 5 and GV60 are taller and iirc come with glass roof rather than a traditional sunroof so it's less of an issue. Definitely not an issue on the EV9 as well.

It's mostly an issue of the height of the door frame. With the Tesla, he has to bend down. I assume that it won't matter for the door opening itself. I think the GT-Line has the comfort and safety features that he should have. I don't know how close they come to Lucid in each respect, but he will like being able to get out of the vehicle before putting it in the garage.

Kudos to your dad, I hope I'll still be driving when I'm 90 too!

I have no idea how long he'll continue driving, but he's not at the "take the keys away from grandpa" stage yet. One of the things I like about the EV9 is that when he does get to that point, my son will probably like it. I have his Kia Sorento sitting in my driveway. I assume that he'd like the EV6 better. My father realizes that that's going to be the next step and he doesn't expect to be driving a decade from now. My son is in Spain teaching English so he has no immediate need for an upgrade. So sooner or later, I'll have a vehicle to pass down instead of one that I'd want to get rid of.

 

[MJAir23TheGoat]

Tesla is removing features from its cars- no radar, no parking sensors, no gear lever, no passenger lumbar support....wonder what they will remove in newer models.

2 of the best selling cars in the world. I don’t see them ever having issues selling their cars.
Tesla now has the highest retention rate in the automotive industry, estimated to be at a sky-high 87%.
Like him or not…
Elon is a genius.
No reply needed.

 

[illopp00]

Main competition for Gravity is Model X which sells around 20k units every year. Do the math. And how many buyers are willing to spend 80k -120k on a minivan/crossover suv ?

There are about 400K large 80K+ SUVs sold a year if you include al the gas competitors like big 7 seat truck based and crossover/suv Escalade, Yukon, Range Rover and Germans that Peter compares to. The goal is not necessarily to take market share from Tesla even though that is what all the clickbait does.

 

[HariK]

How do you like the EV6 in the meantime? I can't wait for the new Lucids to come out. I mean that literally. My father needs a new car. He's 90 years old, and waiting for a few years isn't such a great idea. He might not need a car by then. In the meantime, he's got my Model S, and he finds the roof of it and the Air too low, so I'm thinking that something like it or an EV9 might be a good choice. Of course if Lucid said tomorrow that a release date was set for the Gravity, that would change everything. I don't miss the irony of asking about a non-Lucid in a Lucid forum, and I expect Lucid to blow these other vehicles away when they have a bigger lineup. But the EV9 and others have gotten decent reviews, and might be a good interim choice. Or final choice if he stops driving.

My wife totally loves her ioniq 5 rwd limited. We looked at genesis gv60 and Kia EV6 which are basically the same platform. The reason we got her this car is that she needs more range than awd. She was driving rwd Lexus ls and never needed awd. She wanted an suv to in and out easier than in a sedan and for the wheel chair of her mom. Finally she wanted the 360 degree camera heads up display and all the auto braking safety features. Gv60 top of the line was awd. So this fit her needs. She gers 4.7 miles per KWh in her mix of local and highway driving which is 350 miles vs epa range of 303. She is very happy. Also it comes with 2 110v outlets. One is inside the car and one connects to the ccs charge port. Total 3.6kw which is great for emergency use or on a camping trip or all day outing. If you pay cash it now costs 55k on the road.

 

[Steveinarizona]

If headroom is a concern in the EV6 GT-Line, try the Wind trim (but add the Tech package) - the sunroof in the former sacrifices headroom and can't be optioned out, the IONIQ 5 and GV60 are taller and iirc come with glass roof rather than a traditional sunroof so it's less of an issue. Definitely not an issue on the EV9 as well.

I have a 6'11" buddy. He had to sell his wife's beloved Lexus NX because he couldn't fit in it. He tried sitting in my GV60 and it was fine. While the GV60 doesn't have a traditional sun roof (the large glass roof doesn't open and close) it does have a powered cover similar to what companies that have sun roofs use. He still had no problem fitting in. While the KIA EV6 GT and Genesis share a common platform, they differ on most everything else so the seats are likely different but I would have someone tall sit in the EV6 GT and check it out before assuming it would be a problem.

One of my hesitations on the Lucid was its size...I prefer a smaller vehicle. But I do still want a powerful one. Most traditional automakers drop luxury and performance as one goes down in size. I hope that Lucid at least offers those types of options. I am weird in that I prefer small vehicle and am willing to pay for the luxury and performance features that are usually only available on the more expensive (and larger) vehicles. A smaller Lucid that still was luxurious and performance oriented would check all of my boxes (well...almost all. I still wish Lucid had a HUD).

 

[HariK]

To be clear, the Ioniq 5 is my wife’s car, and she has different needs than I do. I probably would’ve picked the EV6 just based on drive, but she preferred the looks and design of the Ioniq 5, and hey - her car, not mine.

And I want to be clear that it isn’t perfect; because I don’t drive it daily, it annoys the heck out of me in a bunch of tiny ways - the biggest one being that I-pedal is a thing I have to set every time I drive and you can’t set it to that by default, so you’re always in the wrong regen mode. Not a safety issue (lol), but very annoying.

I too set the I-pedal every time I drive my wife's ioniq 5. I too get annoyed by that. My wife likes the default. It is her car and she likes it that way. She also likes the bulit in nav but I prefer Android auto when I drive her car. The other annoying thing is that we cannot just walk away and the car locks itself as in Lucid. You have to push the stop button and then use the key fob to lock the car every single time. That is even more annoying to me. I am still keeping a 2005 Sienna minivan which is driven barely 200 miles a month for the home depot runs, dogs and to load 3 bikes for local bike rides. I may end up with a used Gravity 4 years from now to replace it unless Kia EV 9 or Hyundai ioniq 7 for that use. As @borski says, no car will ever be perfect.

 

[methrow25]

I have a 6'11" buddy. He had to sell his wife's beloved Lexus NX because he couldn't fit in it. He tried sitting in my GV60 and it was fine. While the GV60 doesn't have a traditional sun roof (the large glass roof doesn't open and close) it does have a powered cover similar to what companies that have sun roofs use. He still had no problem fitting in. While the KIA EV6 GT and Genesis share a common platform, they differ on most everything else so the seats are likely different but I would have someone tall sit in the EV6 GT and check it out before assuming it would be a problem.

One of my hesitations on the Lucid was its size...I prefer a smaller vehicle. But I do still want a powerful one. Most traditional automakers drop luxury and performance as one goes down in size. I hope that Lucid at least offers those types of options. I am weird in that I prefer small vehicle and am willing to pay for the luxury and performance features that are usually only available on the more expensive (and larger) vehicles. A smaller Lucid that still was luxurious and performance oriented would check all of my boxes (well...almost all. I still wish Lucid had a HUD).

Gravity will have a HUD so it may come in the midsize vehicles. Possibly in a future Air refresh.

 

[FA14]

There are about 400K large 80K+ SUVs sold a year if you include al the gas competitors like big 7 seat truck based and crossover/suv Escalade, Yukon, Range Rover and Germans that Peter compares to. The goal is not necessarily to take market share from Tesla even though that is what all the clickbait does.

Have you seen the Gravity in person? It’s gorgeous and screams luxury….but at the same time gives a minivan/crossover vibe for a 7 seater passenger vehicle. I don’t see a like to like comparison or stealing significant market share from the vehicles you mentioned above.

 

[xponents]

Have you seen the Gravity in person? It’s gorgeous and screams luxury….but at the same time gives a minivan/crossover vibe for a 7 seater passenger vehicle. I don’t see a like to like comparison or stealing significant market share from the vehicles you mentioned above.

I actually do agree with the Range Rover comparison, but no way it will take significant market share from Yukons, Escalades, or the like.

 

[michel]

I too set the I-pedal every time I drive my wife's ioniq 5. I too get annoyed by that. My wife likes the default. It is her car and she likes it that way. She also likes the bulit in nav but I prefer Android auto when I drive her car. The other annoying thing is that we cannot just walk away and the car locks itself as in Lucid. You have to push the stop button and then use the key fob to lock the car every single time. That is even more annoying to me. I am still keeping a 2005 Sienna minivan which is driven barely 200 miles a month for the home depot runs, dogs and to load 3 bikes for local bike rides. I may end up with a used Gravity 4 years from now to replace it unless Kia EV 9 or Hyundai ioniq 7 for that use. As @borski says, no car will ever be perfect.

I just lock by pressing the manual button on the door handle - but yeah in cases where I forget the fob (or phone) has to come out

 

[HariK]

I just lock by pressing the manual button on the door handle - but yeah in cases where I forget the fob (or phone) has to come out

The annoying thing is you cannot lock ioniq 5, ev 6, gv60 like that.

 

[xponents]

The annoying thing is you cannot lock ioniq 5, ev 6, gv60 like that.

Wait, what? On my EV9, as long as the key is nearby, you can press the button and the car will lock.

 

[Steveinarizona]

The annoying thing is you cannot lock ioniq 5, ev 6, gv60 like that.

The GV60 lets you do that. I do it all the time. I also no longer carry the fob as I use my phone as my key. So it works so long as the phone acting as a key is in the vicinity. And before someone asks, I don't entirely trust my phone so I also carry a keycard in an RFID sleeve in my wallet and there is also a eyeball reader, finger print reader system which I have tested and can also use as a backup.