Final thoughts on my way out the door...

[tkhan456]

True Lucid fans can skip this.

I sold my Lucid Air today. I got one fairly early in the process and worked hard to adjust to it and also to work with the company.

For background, I'm firmly in the EV as a stepping stone to do something about the climate camp. I also love their simplicity and performance. I was a very early Prius user, and I've owned two Teslas, the Lucid, a Rivian RT1, a Kia EV6 and my wife has the Ioniq. And I spent a week renting an Audi etron.

Unfortunately, I also have a background in design and marketing, which makes me a bit of a difficult customer when it comes to UI, UX and customer service. When I see things on the dashboard or in their support approach that are clearly ill-conceived or inconsiderate, it's hard for me to justify in a luxury car.

The Lucid can't compare to the Rivian, even though it costs about twice as much. The stereo in the Rivian is dramatically better. The UX is thoughtful, largely bug-free and a delight. The customer service is human, responsive and curious. I would point things out and they'd be addressed in an update a few weeks later. They asked questions and they followed up often.

The Lucid team, on the other hand, is undertrained, underpowered and not particularly eager to take responsibility or improve things--at least that's been my experience in dozens of interactions. The UI is filled with bugs, demonstrating a lack of fit and finish that luxury software has to have. I gave them a three-page list two months ago and was encouraged to wait for the massive update that just happened, and almost none of the design flaws or bugs were addressed.

If you love your Lucid, that's fabulous! If you think it could be better, I agree with you. I hope the company becomes much more proactive in reaching out to customers and learning about what works or what doesn't. It's pretty clear that making a fast EV that doesn't break is simply the cost of entry, and that leadership in design and customer service are going to be crucial for any company that wants to stand out, grow or charge a premium.

Thanks to everyone here for being part of the community and generously sharing enthusiasm and knowledge.

Good luck to all of us!

I’ve had the 100% opposite experience with my Rivian customer service. Rivian has been Completely frustrating, useless and unwilling to work with me. Took for almost 2mo and at least 10 attempts to get a refund check I was owed for a trade in plus other issues. Rivian UI definitely more solid though. Car quality similar

 

[borski]

I don't think it's fair to dismiss concerns just because someone doesn't have a lot of miles on it.

I think it's unfair to assume you know the car after only 250 miles on it. Every car has quirks; some of them take a bit of time to learn. Not driving the car is certainly not going to help you better understand the car UX or interact with it, and you're missing the best part: how the car drives, which is the entire point.

 

[joec]

I've replied before, but I had the same wait time in my Tesla app from deep sleep i.e. overnight.

Yep. Same here. And sometimes I can open the car door and wake up the car manually, and the app still doesn't show the car as awake. Which means not being able to open the frunk, etc. Super annoying.

Other times, my Tesla app works great. So it's just the inconsistency that gets to me.

 

[joec]

I’ve had the 100% opposite experience with my Rivian customer service. Rivian has been Completely frustrating, useless and unwilling to work with me. Took for almost 2mo and at least 10 attempts to get a refund check I was owed for a trade in plus other issues. Rivian UI definitely more solid though. Car quality similar

The grass is always greener…

It's very important to remember that everyone has different experiences with every company. I've had nothing but amazing experience from Apple, for instance, but I've known plenty of people who had absolutely terrible service experiences.

Every bad experience is a failure. But your experience is not an indication of how someone else's experience might go.

There are those companies who are universally known for terrible customer experience, of course. Looking at you, Verizon…

 

[PewPew]

I think it's unfair to assume you know the car after only 250 miles on it. Every car has quirks; some of them take a bit of time to learn. Not driving the car is certainly not going to help you better understand the car UX or interact with it, and you're missing the best part: how the car drives, which is the entire point.

Different people have different expectations. For the price, it's perfectly reasonable to expect a great drive and a great UI. There's also tons of things you can learn without driving a bunch, like bluetooth connectivity, laggy UI etc. Again it's totally fair to say that these are somewhat known issues and comes with the early adopter territory but it's also totally fair for someone to say, "yea it's worse than I expected / it's not for me, and I'm gonna sell".

I feel like we're drifting from what I really wanna say: I don't think its right to be dismissive of people's concerns or suggest they shouldn't have bothered to make a post before leaving.

 

[hydbob]

Different people have different expectations. For the price, it's perfectly reasonable to expect a great drive and a great UI. There's also tons of things you can learn without driving a bunch, like bluetooth connectivity, laggy UI etc. Again it's totally fair to say that these are somewhat known issues and comes with the early adopter territory but it's also totally fair for someone to say, "yea it's worse than I expected / it's not for me, and I'm gonna sell".

I feel like we're drifting from what I really wanna say: I don't think its right to be dismissive of people's concerns or suggest they shouldn't have bothered to make a post before leaving.

We are but I just want to touch on the whole reason why this thread had semi-devolved, and it all starts with the opening sentence of OP's post...True Lucid fans can skip this...it's a very combative opening and begging for the discussion/back-and-forth above.

 

[borski]

Different people have different expectations. For the price, it's perfectly reasonable to expect a great drive and a great UI. There's also tons of things you can learn without driving a bunch, like bluetooth connectivity, laggy UI etc. Again it's totally fair to say that these are somewhat known issues and comes with the early adopter territory but it's also totally fair for someone to say, "yea it's worse than I expected / it's not for me, and I'm gonna sell".

I feel like we're drifting from what I really wanna say: I don't think its right to be dismissive of people's concerns or suggest they shouldn't have bothered to make a post before leaving.

Not trying to come off dismissive; it's a car, and it's meant to be driven. If I bought a coffeemaker and used it solely to make tea, I wouldn't expect it to be that great at it, but it might make fantastic coffee.

I'm not even saying that the 'early adopter' issues should be there; I don't find the UI laggy at all anymore, and I have no bluetooth connectivity issues, post-2.0. My point was that 250 miles is less than half a full charge, and is really not enough time with the car to actually use it, imho.

Posting about selling it is fine; it's just a bit of a confusing post when they basically didn't use it, but have lots of complaints, that's all.

 

[DeaneG]

Hoping the OP has cleared the doorway and is now on his next automotive adventure. Enough of a thread already.

 

[Drendino]

I'm not even saying that the 'early adopter' issues should be there; I don't find the UI laggy at all anymore, and I have no bluetooth connectivity issues, post-2.0. My point was that 250 miles is less than half a full charge, and is really not enough time with the car to actually use it, imho.

I’m getting an R1S the second half of next year and and can’t wait to have it. I am however prepared for a small range, long charge times, mediocre suspension and no CarPlay or Sirius. In fact, in the time it will take me to charge 250 miles at an EA, I could drive 250 miles on my GT and be left with close to the full range of my R1S

 

[Babyrocko1908]

So you joined a forum to post complaints about a car you barely drove that you already sold. Got it.

And is mad because Lucid didn't respond to his 3 pages of likely unsolicited "advice!"

 

[Steveinarizona]

I think it's unfair to assume you know the car after only 250 miles on it. Every car has quirks; some of them take a bit of time to learn. Not driving the car is certainly not going to help you better understand the car UX or interact with it, and you're missing the best part: how the car drives, which is the entire point.

Correct. Every car has some quirks and some features one doesn't like and is missing some features one does like. I finally mostly gave up on Lucid but not because of the car but because I gave up waiting for specs on my proposed car (I was willing to wait for the car but not to find out if I wanted the car). I bring this up because my solution is the Genesis GV60 Performance. It is much smaller than the Lucid (77.8" long) which some would say is a fault but I would say is an advantage (I prefer a smaller car). The car doesn't have self close doors but it does have easy entry/exit. Its biggest fault is range (only around 230 but in my first week of incity driving it has been getting around 3.2 mkh) but it has a Headup Display. Etc. Etc. So far, after one week, I really like the GV60 BUT the point of my post is that every car has features and performance one will like and dislike and one has to balance all of them to decide what works for you. So while I also left (probably, I am keeping my reservation for now) I agree with this comment.

 

[noobified]

It's not unreasonable to expect something that costs 150k+ to be refined with very little bugs. Some people also don't want to be part of the "beta" process. As someone considering a Lucid Air purchase, I appreciate the feedback the OP has provided. I'm obviously considering a Lucid Air because I've already read and listened to all the fanboy stuff.

 

[dawktah LucidGT]

Whenever I read this thread Rolls Royce comes to mind. If you want a bug free car get one like this with no tech.

 

[epradox]

I’m getting an R1S the second half of next year and and can’t wait to have it. I am however prepared for a small range, long charge times, mediocre suspension and no CarPlay or Sirius. In fact, in the time it will take me to charge 250 miles at an EA, I could drive 250 miles on my GT and be left with close to the full range of my R1S

Im getting my R1S too around the same time to replace my model y performance and im super excited for it. The air suspension on the r1s is super crazy i wouldnt call it mediocre. the thing goes from slammed to the ground to carve canyons up to like 15+ in of ground clearance to rock crawl with its 4 motors. Its pretty wild. All the reviews ive seen on it praise the suspension. Range and efficiency will be a bit of an issue. it is a giant brick after all. hard to compare it to a svelte sedan with the lowest co efficient of drag.

It's not unreasonable to expect something that costs 150k+ to be refined with very little bugs. Some people also don't want to be part of the "beta" process. As someone considering a Lucid Air purchase, I appreciate the feedback the OP has provided. I'm obviously considering a Lucid Air because I've already read and listened to all the fanboy stuff.

Yep im one of those people that doesnt really want to be a part of the beta process unless theres a financial incentive. I have a day before price hike pure order with no options hoping to get it as late as possible. 2024-2025. Hoping by then they can copy some of teslas know how of software and bms stuff. Like I read about all these 12v batteries dying on literally every new ev on the market. e-gmp, mach e, id4, lucid airs, etc etc just type any ev then 12v into google. Tesla has some new fangled 16v lithium ion accessory battery that should last the life of the vehicle. I have to say my 22 model year teslas are pretty refined when it comes to random stuff like that mainly because they had the experience of failing 12vs early on amongst other EV things. Im assuming eventually the industry will learn and figure it out so hoping by then, my air pure is free from most early build quirks and issues.

Whenever I read this thread Rolls Royce comes to mind. If you want a bug free car get one like this with no tech.

well I think a better comparison to a Lucid Air would be Rolls Royce parent company BMW. The BMW i7 is a seriously compelling argument against the Air. Lucid doesn't exist in a bubble, you have to evaluate it against its competitors and the value it offers in comparison.

 

[borski]

Im getting my R1S too around the same time to replace my model y performance and im super excited for it. The air suspension on the r1s is super crazy i wouldnt call it mediocre. the thing goes from slammed to the ground to carve canyons up to like 15+ in of ground clearance to rock crawl with its 4 motors. Its pretty wild. All the reviews ive seen on it praise the suspension. Range and efficiency will be a bit of an issue. it is a giant brick after all. hard to compare it to a svelte sedan with the lowest co efficient of drag.



Yep im one of those people that doesnt really want to be a part of the beta process unless theres a financial incentive. I have a day before price hike pure order with no options hoping to get it as late as possible. 2024-2025. Hoping by then they can copy some of teslas know how of software and bms stuff. Like I read about all these 12v batteries dying on literally every new ev on the market. e-gmp, mach e, id4, lucid airs, etc etc just type any ev then 12v into google. Tesla has some new fangled 16v lithium ion accessory battery that should last the life of the vehicle. I have to say my 22 model year teslas are pretty refined when it comes to random stuff like that mainly because they had the experience of failing 12vs early on amongst other EV things. Im assuming eventually the industry will learn and figure it out so hoping by then, my air pure is free from most early build quirks and issues.



well I think a better comparison to a Lucid Air would be Rolls Royce parent company BMW. The BMW i7 is a seriously compelling argument against the Air. Lucid doesn't exist in a bubble, you have to evaluate it against its competitors and the value it offers in comparison.

Tesla isn’t immune either: https://driveteslacanada.ca/model-3...ttery-dying-rapidly-under-certain-conditions/

 

[epradox]

Tesla isn’t immune either: https://driveteslacanada.ca/model-3...ttery-dying-rapidly-under-certain-conditions/

Yeah that was fixed pretty quickly with an update because LFP cant calculate correct battery percentage from voltage since its doesnt drop linearly so they forced everyone to charge to 100% with LFPs and it fixed the issue with the BMS calculations. None of the other chemistries had this issue including both my 22 model year teslas with the 16v battery with 1 currently in below freezing weather. LFP doesnt have this issue after the update.

 

[ModelSToLucidAir]

Gonna sleep on this but tomorrow, I will cancel my order unfortunately. With the recession looming, I can’t justify spending $113k on a new car that won’t hold its value. Plus the loan rate is more then 5% APR. usually when you buy brand new, you get below market APR incentives. If I still really want it, I’m sure I can pick it up in the used market next year for less. I’ve been following uses GT on the secondary market. The asking price is $125k for a low mileage GT. That’s less than old pricing - $7500 credit. That’s been sitting there for weeks now. So will probably go for less. If the same thing happens, I expect a used touring will be at $100k for the touring with all the bells and whistles. If not, I’ll just pick up a refresh S. I found one at a local dealer for less than $100k with less than 5000 miles.

 

[TCGT]

Gonna sleep on this but tomorrow, I will cancel my order unfortunately. With the recession looming, I can’t justify spending $113k on a new car that won’t hold its value. Plus the loan rate is more then 5% APR. usually when you buy brand new, you get below market APR incentives. If I still really want it, I’m sure I can pick it up in the used market next year for less. I’ve been following uses GT on the secondary market. The asking price is $125k for a low mileage GT. That’s less than old pricing - $7500 credit. That’s been sitting there for weeks now. So will probably go for less. If the same thing happens, I expect a used touring will be at $100k for the touring with all the bells and whistles. If not, I’ll just pick up a refresh S. I found one at a local dealer for less than $100k with less than 5000 miles.

No one can argue with your personal choices, as you have all the cards. I’ve had my own head spin multiple times on any number of deals that were at the edge of my comfort zone. You will be fine, either way. Good luck.

 

[Steveinarizona]

well I think a better comparison to a Lucid Air would be Rolls Royce parent company BMW. The BMW i7 is a seriously compelling argument against the Air. Lucid doesn't exist in a bubble, you have to evaluate it against its competitors and the value it offers in comparison.

Am I the only one who doesn't think a foot and a half of extra length means they are not comparable or competitors? The Lucid Air is a mid sized car so the BMW equivalent would be the forthcoming I5 (but vaporware until it is spec'd and released).

I agree that those who initially bought the DE had a reasonable right to expect the software to mostly work well. But after the problems got disclosed, IMO buyers were alerted to the problems of being an early adopter and had to make a decision. One of my decisions was to wait for a Pure and a second decision was to reluctantly replace the yet to be released RWD Pure with a Genesis GV60 performance.

 

[dawktah LucidGT]

Gonna sleep on this but tomorrow, I will cancel my order unfortunately. With the recession looming, I can’t justify spending $113k on a new car that won’t hold its value. Plus the loan rate is more then 5% APR. usually when you buy brand new, you get below market APR incentives. If I still really want it, I’m sure I can pick it up in the used market next year for less. I’ve been following uses GT on the secondary market. The asking price is $125k for a low mileage GT. That’s less than old pricing - $7500 credit. That’s been sitting there for weeks now. So will probably go for less. If the same thing happens, I expect a used touring will be at $100k for the touring with all the bells and whistles. If not, I’ll just pick up a refresh S. I found one at a local dealer for less than $100k with less than 5000 miles.

I grew up with cars depreciate as soon as they drive off the lot. Cars that "hold" value were rare until COVID. This is bound to correct over time.