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Countdown to Year End

Lucken

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As I’ve said before, Manchin has folded before, so this wouldn’t be without precedent.
 

WildRide47

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2018 Porsche Panamera Tur
Yes, but this bill is not a tax increase. I do agree that the only certainty is to place the car in service in 2021, but I’d still be very surprised to see this part of the bill (if it passes) to be made retroactive to 1/1.

With that said, even if I lose the credit, it won’t deter me from buying either EV I’m considering.

Congress has done this before and can very easily pass a bill say in March of 2022 and have it back dated effective as of Jan 1st 2022. There is plenty of precedent for this, not to say they would do it that way, but not that unlikely that they won't either.
 

SaratogaLefty

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Dream Edition P 21"
So I wrote this in the other Deliveries Forum but thought I'd also post it here. Based upon hmp10's experience, I'm strongly considering witholding my payment until they give me a firm delivery date. I've never paid in full for a car before that wasn't delivered to me at the same time. I sent an email to my DA asking her if I can pay only when they give me a firm delivery date. Hopefully I'll get an answer tomorrow.
 

SaratogaLefty

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If her answer is no, then that strongly implies I won't get the car this year.
 

Lucken

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So I wrote this in the other Deliveries Forum but thought I'd also post it here. Based upon hmp10's experience, I'm strongly considering witholding my payment until they give me a firm delivery date. I've never paid in full for a car before that wasn't delivered to me at the same time. I sent an email to my DA asking her if I can pay only when they give me a firm delivery date. Hopefully I'll get an answer tomorrow.
Tesla, which has a similar sales model, didn’t ask for my payment until the car was ready for delivery. To ask for 170K, without you being in possession of the car let alone a firm delivery date, is not only an atypical practice in the automobile industry, but somewhat unethical IMO.

I‘m sure some will defend their approach, but I don’t see it. Surely they can give you a firm delivery date prior to the transferring of funds.
 
Last edited:

hmp10

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I had a lengthy conversation this afternoon with Zak Edson, Lucid's VP of Sales and Service. I had met Zak at the opening of the Miami Design Studio and then, as now, I found him to be very up front with information he could share.

First, on my car specifically: It's just moving into final inspection off the assembly line. Barring any issues that are found that require a return to assembly, Edson thinks there will be time to get my car to me in Florida by the end of next week. Any rework need that inspection uncovers could jeopardize delivery by year end.

On Zenith Reds: Opting for red does means your car will be built after the other three colors are built. The primary factor otherwise controlling place in the production queue is the date of the original reservation, not the date on which the order was confirmed with a Delivery Advisor as I had erroneously been told. Thus, if an early reservation holder opts for red, that car will be built after the other colors but early in the schedule of red car production.

On production generally: Zak did not go into any detail, but there have been some breaks in production as processes were found to need revision. This is to be expected with a new production line and accounts for the wide discrepancies in time between issuance of a VIN and delivery that has been reported from one order to another. Zak said that the VIN is issued at the point the car moves onto the general assembly line, not near the end of production as I had originally been told.

On timing of request for payment: Lucid is not booking revenue ahead of delivery. The reason people are being sent "invitations to pay" well ahead of delivery is that some customers said they needed a final invoice in time to finalize financing before delivery, so Lucid is sending them out early enough to accommodate that need.

On transport issues: There have been some issues in arranging transport due to personnel shortages across the trucking industry right now. Lucid is not yet at the volume where intermodal transport is practical, so all cars are shipped via truck no matter the distance. For long-haul deliveries, Lucid tries to find team drivers so that the truck can roll round the clock without running into driver time-out regulations.

On after-delivery technical support: Lucid has not set up a central clearing house for technical questions regarding things such as support for installing remote radar and laser detectors or anything else that requires going into the mechanicals or electrics of the vehicle. He said such issues should be raised with the Technical Team at the service center nearest you. If you already know what support you will need, he recommended notifying the delivery team when you take possession of the car that you are going to need a contact person for you or installers to reach when needed.

(Speaking of radar/laser detectors, Zak says the Air has a metallic coating on the windshield that blocks detector reception inside the car except in a small corner on a lower side of the windshield. So people who plan to use such systems probably need to consider remote systems where the antennae are mounted on the exterior of the car.)

Will Lucid deliver all Dreams in 2021: I didn't ask this question specifically, as I didn't want to put Zak on the spot with a question he may not be authorized to answer. However, I think the answer is obvious from the fact that we are seeing Dream buyers on the forums who don't yet have their VINs, and that finding flaws in vehicles just now coming off the production line could be enough to cause a miss in a 2021 delivery date.
 

DougieFresh

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Dec 11, 2021
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AGT
I had a lengthy conversation this afternoon with Zak Edson, Lucid's VP of Sales and Service. I had met Zak at the opening of the Miami Design Studio and then, as now, I found him to be very up front with information he could share.

First, on my car specifically: It's just moving into final inspection off the assembly line. Barring any issues that are found that require a return to assembly, Edson thinks there will be time to get my car to me in Florida by the end of next week. Any rework need that inspection uncovers could jeopardize delivery by year end.

On Zenith Reds: Opting for red does means your car will be built after the other three colors are built. The primary factor otherwise controlling place in the production queue is the date of the original reservation, not the date on which the order was confirmed with a Delivery Advisor as I had erroneously been told. Thus, if an early reservation holder opts for red, that car will be built after the other colors but early in the schedule of red car production.

On production generally: Zak did not go into any detail, but there have been some breaks in production as processes were found to need revision. This is to be expected with a new production line and accounts for the wide discrepancies in time between issuance of a VIN and delivery that has been reported from one order to another. Zak said that the VIN is issued at the point the car moves onto the general assembly line, not near the end of production as I had originally been told.

On timing of request for payment: Lucid is not booking revenue ahead of delivery. The reason people are being sent "invitations to pay" well ahead of delivery is that some customers said they needed a final invoice in time to finalize financing before delivery, so Lucid is sending them out early enough to accommodate that need.

On transport issues: There have been some issues in arranging transport due to personnel shortages across the trucking industry right now. Lucid is not yet at the volume where intermodal transport is practical, so all cars are shipped via truck no matter the distance. For long-haul deliveries, Lucid tries to find team drivers so that the truck can roll round the clock without running into driver time-out regulations.

On after-delivery technical support: Lucid has not set up a central clearing house for technical questions regarding things such as support for installing remote radar and laser detectors or anything else that requires going into the mechanicals or electrics of the vehicle. He said such issues should be raised with the Technical Team at the service center nearest you. If you already know what support you will need, he recommended notifying the delivery team when you take possession of the car that you are going to need a contact person for you or installers to reach when needed.

(Speaking of radar/laser detectors, Zak says the Air has a metallic coating on the windshield that blocks detector reception inside the car except in a small corner on a lower side of the windshield. So people who plan to use such systems probably need to consider remote systems where the antennae are mounted on the exterior of the car.)

Will Lucid deliver all Dreams in 2021: I didn't ask this question specifically, as I didn't want to put Zak on the spot with a question he may not be authorized to answer. However, I think the answer is obvious from the fact that we are seeing Dream buyers on the forums who don't yet have their VINs, and that finding flaws in vehicles just now coming off the production line could be enough to cause a miss in a 2021 delivery date.
Thanks for the update! Did Zak indicate whether Zenith Reds will be the last to be built for the other trim lines as well (eg, Grand Touring) or just for the Dream Editions?
 

Paladin732

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Nov 21, 2021
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Taycan
I had a lengthy conversation this afternoon with Zak Edson, Lucid's VP of Sales and Service. I had met Zak at the opening of the Miami Design Studio and then, as now, I found him to be very up front with information he could share.

First, on my car specifically: It's just moving into final inspection off the assembly line. Barring any issues that are found that require a return to assembly, Edson thinks there will be time to get my car to me in Florida by the end of next week. Any rework need that inspection uncovers could jeopardize delivery by year end.

On Zenith Reds: Opting for red does means your car will be built after the other three colors are built. The primary factor otherwise controlling place in the production queue is the date of the original reservation, not the date on which the order was confirmed with a Delivery Advisor as I had erroneously been told. Thus, if an early reservation holder opts for red, that car will be built after the other colors but early in the schedule of red car production.

On production generally: Zak did not go into any detail, but there have been some breaks in production as processes were found to need revision. This is to be expected with a new production line and accounts for the wide discrepancies in time between issuance of a VIN and delivery that has been reported from one order to another. Zak said that the VIN is issued at the point the car moves onto the general assembly line, not near the end of production as I had originally been told.

On timing of request for payment: Lucid is not booking revenue ahead of delivery. The reason people are being sent "invitations to pay" well ahead of delivery is that some customers said they needed a final invoice in time to finalize financing before delivery, so Lucid is sending them out early enough to accommodate that need.

On transport issues: There have been some issues in arranging transport due to personnel shortages across the trucking industry right now. Lucid is not yet at the volume where intermodal transport is practical, so all cars are shipped via truck no matter the distance. For long-haul deliveries, Lucid tries to find team drivers so that the truck can roll round the clock without running into driver time-out regulations.

On after-delivery technical support: Lucid has not set up a central clearing house for technical questions regarding things such as support for installing remote radar and laser detectors or anything else that requires going into the mechanicals or electrics of the vehicle. He said such issues should be raised with the Technical Team at the service center nearest you. If you already know what support you will need, he recommended notifying the delivery team when you take possession of the car that you are going to need a contact person for you or installers to reach when needed.

(Speaking of radar/laser detectors, Zak says the Air has a metallic coating on the windshield that blocks detector reception inside the car except in a small corner on a lower side of the windshield. So people who plan to use such systems probably need to consider remote systems where the antennae are mounted on the exterior of the car.)

Will Lucid deliver all Dreams in 2021: I didn't ask this question specifically, as I didn't want to put Zak on the spot with a question he may not be authorized to answer. However, I think the answer is obvious from the fact that we are seeing Dream buyers on the forums who don't yet have their VINs, and that finding flaws in vehicles just now coming off the production line could be enough to cause a miss in a 2021 delivery date.
I have found the same from Doreen Allen, their Sr Director in charge of sales. I spoke with her just a few days ago.

A few other items she has mentioned to me that are not covered above:

They are NOT permitted to discuss missing the deadline of EOY 2021. This is an executive decision. The idea behind it is to inspire the workforce to ensure to get the vehicles out. The general thought is that if they start discussing missing the deadline, they will miss it. By not having it as an option, they still hope to get it completed.

She also mentioned several issues in production in general. The parts are arriving JIT for assembly, so if say, 3 cars are moving at the same time and only 2 of a part arrive, that third car will wait for the missing part.

Additionally, she mentioned that it has not been uncommon for cars to repeat stages of assembly. Some items have been failing the extensive QA they have added at each step. Those cars are sent back to be reworked and the parts replaced. Some of the vendors have not been supplying to the quality they want, so when they encounter parts like that it gets yanked and replaced with a higher quality one. Some, such as the glass, have been particularly problematic here.

She made some interesting mention of panel gaps, small scratches, and whatnot requiring reworks. That they are being particular about all technical details and are refusing to let any out without being in impeccable condition. This jives with what we have heard from service where even a small scratch on something at pickup that the service center noticed, has resulted in replaced parts.

Of note: she mentioned these problems are getting dramatically better, and the speed has ramped up quite substantially in the past few weeks. At the beginning, cars could take up to 3 weeks to complete, that has dropped down to the sub 1 week range.

None of what she told me, nor her mannerisms or information felt like she was being purposefully disingenuous. She made comments that sound like she legit wants to help, and commented that she is in line, herself, for a GT.

(For my vehicle in particular, it entered production over the weekend, and they are still expecting it to deliver to CA by end of year)
 

hmp10

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Thanks for the update! Did Zak indicate whether Zenith Reds will be the last to be built for the other trim lines as well (eg, Grand Touring) or just for the Dream Editions?

Sorry, I didn't ask. My guess, for what it's worth, is that now that the paint shop has been set up to run Zenith Red, they will run enough bodies through to cover the orders already on the books. if that's true, it might be the Quantum Grays and Cosmos Silvers that will have to wait a bit.
 

SaratogaLefty

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Dec 7, 2021
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186
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Dream Edition P 21"
I have found the same from Doreen Allen, their Sr Director in charge of sales. I spoke with her just a few days ago.

A few other items she has mentioned to me that are not covered above:

They are NOT permitted to discuss missing the deadline of EOY 2021. This is an executive decision. The idea behind it is to inspire the workforce to ensure to get the vehicles out. The general thought is that if they start discussing missing the deadline, they will miss it. By not having it as an option, they still hope to get it completed.

She also mentioned several issues in production in general. The parts are arriving JIT for assembly, so if say, 3 cars are moving at the same time and only 2 of a part arrive, that third car will wait for the missing part.

Additionally, she mentioned that it has not been uncommon for cars to repeat stages of assembly. Some items have been failing the extensive QA they have added at each step. Those cars are sent back to be reworked and the parts replaced. Some of the vendors have not been supplying to the quality they want, so when they encounter parts like that it gets yanked and replaced with a higher quality one. Some, such as the glass, have been particularly problematic here.

She made some interesting mention of panel gaps, small scratches, and whatnot requiring reworks. That they are being particular about all technical details and are refusing to let any out without being in impeccable condition. This jives with what we have heard from service where even a small scratch on something at pickup that the service center noticed, has resulted in replaced parts.

Of note: she mentioned these problems are getting dramatically better, and the speed has ramped up quite substantially in the past few weeks. At the beginning, cars could take up to 3 weeks to complete, that has dropped down to the sub 1 week range.

None of what she told me, nor her mannerisms or information felt like she was being purposefully disingenuous. She made comments that sound like she legit wants to help, and commented that she is in line, herself, for a GT.

(For my vehicle in particular, it entered production over the weekend, and they are still expecting it to deliver to CA by end of year)

Very informative information from both hmp10 and Paladin 732. Based on what you've indicated and given that I just received my VIN yesterday, Tuesday, it doesn't sound like I should expect to receive my car in Millbrae by end of year. Further, there doesn't appear to be any reason to pay early since I am paying cash via wire transfer and don't require any financing in advance. All good info and bottom line is I'd rather have my car delivered with the utmost quality control rather than being expedited. Thank you both for your extensive information!!
 

Paladin732

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Nov 21, 2021
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@SaratogaLefty , you may still get it by end of year. I'm picking up from Millbrae also (its where I met Peter and Doreen, actually, when they had the grand opening).
If you just got your VIN yesterday, you may be close, my (second) VIN (first was yanked back due to wheel change) only came on Friday.
 

SaratogaLefty

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Dream Edition P 21"
@SaratogaLefty , you may still get it by end of year. I'm picking up from Millbrae also (its where I met Peter and Doreen, actually, when they had the grand opening).
If you just got your VIN yesterday, you may be close, my (second) VIN (first was yanked back due to wheel change) only came on Friday.

What configuration did you order? Mine is Eureka Gold Performance with 21" wheels. Hopefully you didn't get the last good windshield (LOL)!! I wish I had gone to the grand opening in MillBrae but I had a golf commitment.
 

Paladin732

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What configuration did you order? Mine is Eureka Gold Performance with 21" wheels. Hopefully you didn't get the last good windshield (LOL)!! I wish I had gone to the grand opening in MillBrae but I had a golf commitment.
Red, 21, p
 

SaratogaLefty

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So the bottom line is they won't be delivering 577 vehicles this year and most likely won't get all the Dream Edition cars delivered either. Too bad.
 

Mountain Man

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Dec 18, 2021
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Lucid Air Dream P
I got my VIN on Friday 12/17. My headquarters advisor (who has been great) says the car (Eureka Gold Dream P) is in production and set to be delivered to my home. I sensed they are really working at getting them all out by year-end.
 

SaratogaLefty

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Dream Edition P 21"
I got my VIN on Friday 12/17. My headquarters advisor (who has been great) says the car (Eureka Gold Dream P) is in production and set to be delivered to my home. I sensed they are really working at getting them all out by year-end.

I know they are working hard and I do hope you and all of us other Dream Edition future owners receive our cars by year end. Let's all keep each other informed. My Headquarters Advisor did just call me and told me I can pay when she gets me a delivery date if I want to wait. Waiting won't impact my delivery date according to her. I still have not received the Docusign documents but she thought that would happen in the next couple of days. If the car is going to be in Millbrae by next Friday, then I would think it will need to be on a truck by Tuesday to allow time for transit and final prep at Millbrae. So she should have the delivery date by Monday or Tuesday the latest by my calculation.
 

blueice89

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They actually said they would deliver 577 vehicles by year end with the 520 Dream Editions coming first. I am still waiting for my Dream Edition Performance, Eureka Gold, 21" wheels!! Although they have told me repeatedly it would happen this year, I still don't even have a VIN. I'm hopeful but must admit I'm also skeptical.
There are currently close to 200 cars on Lucid lot they wil get done trust the process
 

SaratogaLefty

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There are currently close to 200 cars on Lucid lot they wil get done trust the process

I got a VIN yesterday and again my Headquarters Advisor said delivery by year end is still the plan. Hoping she is correct!!
 

dawktah LucidGT

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So I wrote this in the other Deliveries Forum but thought I'd also post it here. Based upon hmp10's experience, I'm strongly considering witholding my payment until they give me a firm delivery date. I've never paid in full for a car before that wasn't delivered to me at the same time. I sent an email to my DA asking her if I can pay only when they give me a firm delivery date. Hopefully I'll get an answer tomorrow.

I have always paid for all my vehicles in the finance office of a dealership. After inspecting the car I was purchasing. It will be interesting and weird to close this transaction before I board a plane to California. I guess this is the risk and the flaw of this type of sales model. I still haven't been invited to test drive. I will start off any conversation with a delivery advisor with that.
 
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