Automaker Leaders meet with Sec. Pete Buttigieg

mnewber1

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Including
Pete Rawlinson on the right, and Elon Musk - his former employer - on top. Jim Farley showing off Ford's CEO office while Tetsuo performing a power move being so far away from the camera. Everyone else had pretty boring backgrounds.
 
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Including
Pete Rawlinson on the right, and Elon Musk - his former employer - on top. Jim Farley showing off Ford's CEO office while Tetsuo performing a power move being so far away from the camera. Everyone else had pretty boring backgrounds.

Ted Ogawa is the CEO of Toyota.
Tom Doll is CEO of Subaru.
Mary Barra is CEO of GM.
Carlos Tavares is CEO of Stellantis, which owns Jeep, Chrysler, Dodge, RAM, Fiat, Alfa Romeo, Maserati, Citroen, Peugeot, etc.
Jose Munoz is CEO of Hyundai/Genesis North America.
Jeff Guyton is CEO Mazda North America.
Sean Yoon is CEO Kia North America.
Jim Farley is CEO Ford.
Dimitris Psillakis is CEO Mercedes-Benz USA.

What was the context? That’s most of the industry lol
 
Ted Ogawa is the CEO of Toyota.
Tom Doll is CEO of Subaru.
Mary Barra is CEO of GM.
Carlos Tavares is CEO of Stellantis, which owns Jeep, Chrysler, Dodge, RAM, Fiat, Alfa Romeo, Maserati, Citroen, Peugeot, etc.
Jose Munoz is CEO of Hyundai/Genesis North America.
Jeff Guyton is CEO Mazda North America.
Sean Yoon is CEO Kia North America.
Jim Farley is CEO Ford.
Dimitris Psillakis is CEO Mercedes-Benz USA.

What was the context? That’s most of the industry lol
Jeremie Papin- Nissan North American Chairman
 
Ted Ogawa is the CEO of Toyota.
Tom Doll is CEO of Subaru.
Mary Barra is CEO of GM.
Carlos Tavares is CEO of Stellantis, which owns Jeep, Chrysler, Dodge, RAM, Fiat, Alfa Romeo, Maserati, Citroen, Peugeot, etc.
Jose Munoz is CEO of Hyundai/Genesis North America.
Jeff Guyton is CEO Mazda North America.
Sean Yoon is CEO Kia North America.
Jim Farley is CEO Ford.
Dimitris Psillakis is CEO Mercedes-Benz USA.

What was the context? That’s most of the industry lol
It was about EV charging stations. Elon Musk was not happy... https://www.reuters.com/business/au...-industry-meeting-with-musk-barra-2022-04-07/
 

Please don’t mind me as I play the world’s tiniest violin for Elon Musk’s sorrows. 🎻

(Whether you like him or not, and I do in many ways, the idea that charging infrastructure should be interoperable is the right idea - can you imagine if every ICE car had different gas station brands they could use? It would be madness.)
 
Please don’t mind me as I play the world’s tiniest violin for Elon Musk’s sorrows. 🎻

(Whether you like him or not, and I do in many ways, the idea that charging infrastructure should be interoperable is the right idea - can you imagine if every ICE car had different gas station brands they could use? It would be madness.)
There’s certainly a point where innovation, profit and the public good need to intersect…
 
Please don’t mind me as I play the world’s tiniest violin for Elon Musk’s sorrows. 🎻

(Whether you like him or not, and I do in many ways, the idea that charging infrastructure should be interoperable is the right idea - can you imagine if every ICE car had different gas station brands they could use? It would be madness.)
Agree. But really we are down to just two standards as Chademo is going away. All tesla has to do is to add CCS adapters to its network, provide Tesla to CCS adaptors in its vehicles and we are good. Everyone else is on the same page now.
 
Agree. But really we are down to just two standards as Chademo is going away. All tesla has to do is to add CCS adapters to its network, provide Tesla to CCS adaptors in its vehicles and we are good. Everyone else is on the same page now.

Oh, I agree! I wish you luck convincing Elon to add CCS adapters to the supercharger network, though. :) I really do hope it happens.
 
Oh, I agree! I wish you luck convincing Elon to add CCS adapters to the supercharger network, though. :) I really do hope it happens.
. I’m fine if Tesla wants their own proprietary network, but no standard plug, no public money. Just like in every other new tech standardization, the best technology doesn’t always win out. Tesla is the Betamax and CCS is the VHS of the charging networks.(am I showing my age? LOL)
 
. I’m fine if Tesla wants their own proprietary network, but no standard plug, no public money. Just like in every other new tech standardization, the best technology doesn’t always win out. Tesla is the Betamax and CCS is the VHS of the charging networks.(am I showing my age? LOL)
Agreed on all points. and lol @ Betamax/VHS.

(Also, I'd make the argument that EA is better tech than Tesla Superchargers; there just aren't as many of them yet)
 
. I’m fine if Tesla wants their own proprietary network, but no standard plug, no public money. Just like in every other new tech standardization, the best technology doesn’t always win out. Tesla is the Betamax and CCS is the VHS of the charging networks.(am I showing my age? LOL)
I'm not sure that Tesla's connector has the creepage and clearance distances required for 800-950 volt operation. They may always be limited to 450 volts or so. Much easier to use than CCS, but maybe not as capable ultimately.
 
Please don’t mind me as I play the world’s tiniest violin for Elon Musk’s sorrows. 🎻

(Whether you like him or not, and I do in many ways, the idea that charging infrastructure should be interoperable is the right idea - can you imagine if every ICE car had different gas station brands they could use? It would be madness.)
I admire what Musk has accomplished but not the man. But I do think that the Tesla charging network is a significant advantage that Tesla paid for and I don't think that Tesla should be required to share it with other company cars.

I don't think the analogy to gas stations works. Exxon, Mobil, Sunoco, etc. are not car companies and they compete for customers. Tesla is a car company that paid for and built a network to support its cars.

I do want a full BEV but I also want to wait until the charging network is better built out. But that doesn't mean taking spots from Tesla unless Tesla wants to give them up.
 
...I do want a full BEV but I also want to wait until the charging network is better built out. But that doesn't mean taking spots from Tesla unless Tesla wants to give them up.
If you do a few long road trips per year, both Tesla and CCS charging networks are currently pretty workable. The exceptions are around large remote parks like Glacier, Yellowstone, etc. 98% of the time you'll be charging at home, painless and easy. The remaining 2% of the time you can take your BEV, or fly and rent a gas car.
 
I admire what Musk has accomplished but not the man. But I do think that the Tesla charging network is a significant advantage that Tesla paid for and I don't think that Tesla should be required to share it with other company cars.

I don't think the analogy to gas stations works. Exxon, Mobil, Sunoco, etc. are not car companies and they compete for customers. Tesla is a car company that paid for and built a network to support its cars.

I do want a full BEV but I also want to wait until the charging network is better built out. But that doesn't mean taking spots from Tesla unless Tesla wants to give them up.

Off our tax dollars...
 
Clearly Elon can do what he wants, and will. Even though the CCS connector (and communication-over-power line protocol) is a cluster#$%, I wish the US had mandated it for Tesla as did the EU and now Australia for commonality.
 

Off our tax dollars..
I can’t stand Elon and am glad there are finally viable alternatives to Tesla (at least in the higher price ranges) but, to be fair, Lucid and all other EV customers also benefit from federal and state rebates and incentives the same way Tesla customers do (for some state incentives) and once did (federal rebates). These rebates don’t go to the manufacturers so I would say the article linked is very misleading… then again the Institute for Energy Research is essentially a front for big oil (check where their funding comes from) so to be expected.

The zero emission vehicle credits Tesla has been receiving does not come from tax payers but rather from other auto manufacturers who, rather than getting their act together and developing ZEVs to comply with ZEV requirements enacted by various states and countries, decided it was easier to pay Tesla credits instead. Now 10 years after the Model S came out these OEMs are finally scrambling to develop and manufacture EVs and to wind down their ICE programs. This illustrates how idiotic the OEMs are and suggests sitting on their hands for almost a decade was the wrong move strategically, but has nothing to do with tax breaks.

I am sure Tesla has received state and local subsidies and tax breaks (ie they just opened their Austin factory yesterday - I imagine Austin and Texas would have offered plenty of carrots for them to chose that location). Same is true for Lucid in Arizona though.

I don’t see why any of this would be a justification for the federal government to legislate that Tesla switch their system over to CCS charging format, anymore than it would be a justification for the govt to require any EV maker to build their own CCS stations just because their customers received tax rebates on their car purchase in the past. If Tesla wants to use the federal funding for new charging station buildouts, of course anything they build with that money should have CCS compatibility. If Tesla build out new charging stations without the federal funding it’s up to them what connector format they use, not the govt. If the govt wants Tesla to convert existing charging stations to CCS and Tesla is agreeable to that, then I suppose it’s fair Tesla ask for the cost to be covered. I don’t think that makes any sense given other posters’ experience of overloaded supercharger stations with long waits. Better to put all the funding towards building out as many QIALITY CCS chargers IN THE RIGHT LOCATIONS as fast as possible. I would also note that all EV mfrs have the option to take the initiative and build out their own charge stations with the federal funding available to improve their customers’ experience - hopefully some of them do rather than just sit around and wait and hope for EA and EVgo etc to just figure it out.
 
I can’t stand Elon and am glad there are finally viable alternatives to Tesla (at least in the higher price ranges) but, to be fair, Lucid and all other EV customers also benefit from federal and state rebates and incentives the same way Tesla customers do (for some state incentives) and once did (federal rebates). These rebates don’t go to the manufacturers so I would say the article linked is very misleading… then again the Institute for Energy Research is essentially a front for big oil (check where their funding comes from) so to be expected.

The zero emission vehicle credits Tesla has been receiving does not come from tax payers but rather from other auto manufacturers who, rather than getting their act together and developing ZEVs to comply with ZEV requirements enacted by various states and countries, decided it was easier to pay Tesla credits instead. Now 10 years after the Model S came out these OEMs are finally scrambling to develop and manufacture EVs and to wind down their ICE programs. This illustrates how idiotic the OEMs are and suggests sitting on their hands for almost a decade was the wrong move strategically, but has nothing to do with tax breaks.

I am sure Tesla has received state and local subsidies and tax breaks (ie they just opened their Austin factory yesterday - I imagine Austin and Texas would have offered plenty of carrots for them to chose that location). Same is true for Lucid in Arizona though.

I don’t see why any of this would be a justification for the federal government to legislate that Tesla switch their system over to CCS charging format, anymore than it would be a justification for the govt to require any EV maker to build their own CCS stations just because their customers received tax rebates on their car purchase in the past. If Tesla wants to use the federal funding for new charging station buildouts, of course anything they build with that money should have CCS compatibility. If Tesla build out new charging stations without the federal funding it’s up to them what connector format they use, not the govt. If the govt wants Tesla to convert existing charging stations to CCS and Tesla is agreeable to that, then I suppose it’s fair Tesla ask for the cost to be covered. I don’t think that makes any sense given other posters’ experience of overloaded supercharger stations with long waits. Better to put all the funding towards building out as many QIALITY CCS chargers IN THE RIGHT LOCATIONS as fast as possible. I would also note that all EV mfrs have the option to take the initiative and build out their own charge stations with the federal funding available to improve their customers’ experience - hopefully some of them do rather than just sit around and wait and hope for EA and EVgo etc to just figure it out.
The problem is not that Tesla has their own network, but that they want to keep their own proprietary charging connection while getting government money for building charging infrastructure that can only be used with their vehicles.

It is perfectly reasonable that the federal government legislate CCS chargers for NEW funds given to Tesla for charging infrastructure. They obviously can't force them to convert old ones, but in order to get that sweet sweet money, they should either build CCS connections or convert old ones into CCS.
 
The problem is not that Tesla has their own network, but that they want to keep their own proprietary charging connection while getting government money for building charging infrastructure that can only be used with their vehicles.

It is perfectly reasonable that the federal government legislate CCS chargers for NEW funds given to Tesla for charging infrastructure. They obviously can't force them to convert old ones, but in order to get that sweet sweet money, they should either build CCS connections or convert old ones into CCS.

Yes- I don’t think Tesla can get the federal funding for proprietary chargers. I thought the legislation is pretty clear that it is for open CCS chargers (edit: and I think universal L2 chargers as well), so Tesla can argue whatever they like but they won’t get what is not covered in the legislation.
 
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I'll bet Tesla is negotiating for funds for charging stations that have both types of connectors, a dual-cable setup.
 
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