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10 Days 736 miles and 1 road trip

Bill55

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Dec 17, 2021
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117
Location
San Diego
Vehicle(s)
Lucid Air P White
DE Number
40
Great review Bill55! On the software, I just don’t understand why companies want to make their software so complex. Simple is better. i have no experience with the car. However, it this is any indication, for example, their website is overly ornate and because they made it so complex, it crashes a lot on me. The site is trying to load too many layers and is just not coded right for something of that complexity. Sounds like the car is the same. These software developers are trying to get to fancy and forget to get the simple things right. I want a car that works, tha5 runs, that is not going to to wait with a little hourglass on the screen before I can start my journey. I want something where I am. To going to have to turn off the car and reboot the computer because there was a software glitch. Lucid… are you listening? Please get the software right bu the time my car is delivered, or you will have another unhappy, if not irate customer. Bill55, those little issues would drive me crazy too. I am looking forward to the range, charging speed and comfort. Those are what matter to me as this will replace an ICE for trips. However, those software issues will annoy me to no end. Not having CarPlay is just unacceptable. My Nissan Leaf has CarPlay. Pretty much every car on the market has CarPlay so no5 having it is unacceptable. I never use the NAV systems on the cars. They just aren’t really advanced enough or user friendly enough. I prefer Waze. Without CarPlay, I will have to mount my phone like on my old Toyota Sienna. In my garage, I will have to pull it to within 6 inches of the front to fit. If the car is fighting me by constantly braking, I will be frustrated. These are simple and shouldn’t hav3 been an issue to program.

Enough for now. Still waiting for that test drive I have. been promised since June. Sounds like there is a reason they are not letting it happen.
I would have put a lot of resources on car play / android auto. It gives people a nice feel of familiarity right from the start. Let google and apple spend the money on maps. Lucid should focus on the car. The park distance needs to be gotten right. I consider it to be a standard feature, and it gets used nearly every time you get in the car. Maybe I’ll set up some boxes and do a compare video.
 

hydbob

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Nov 14, 2021
Messages
756
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Dream P
DE Number
33
Okay so took some pics in my garage for data points lol
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Mountain Man

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Dec 18, 2021
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38
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Lucid Air Dream P
Very useful and realistic review, thank you, Bill! My Dream Edition is set to arrive at my home in Denver "before year end" (?), so I appreciate you helping me mentally prepare for these (temporary) frustrations. I sincerely hope Lucid hires some top-notch software engineers to address these issues quickly. Great software engineers are miraculous, but also notoriously difficult to hire and retain.

I chalk these issues up to "the current state of most cars." I took delivery of the first Model S (a P85) in Colorado in 2012, and I'm on my third MS (a P100D) -- as others have pointed out, Tesla has always had software issues, going all the way back to the beginning and persisting today. On my first Model S the passenger door would occasionally randomly pop open (!) while driving. Door handles failed and needed replacement. On my latest P100D, which is now 4 years old, the driver window has never auto-sealed properly despite several tech attempts to repair; voice command rarely works and takes 15 seconds when it does; the center screen periodically freezes up...Frankly, every modern car I own has little software issues that I just learn to live with. My $140k Range Rover is the worst...it freezes up and crashes and the $8k stereo sometimes won't work. My $350k Ferrari F8 Tributo often cannot find my phone. But in the end, I would much prefer a few little software glitches than the worries we all faced back in the old days in the 80s & 90s...cars smelling like gasoline and overheating and dripping oil and having brakes squeal incessantly or radiator fluid leaking or having to actually worry that the car might break down. I'm thrilled that those days are behind us and we are now left to complain that the car is too violent in preventing us from hitting the object in front of us as we park.

What interested me most about Bill's review was the positive comments about the vehicle dynamics, especially coming from a guy who seems to have a depth of experiences in performance cars.
 

Lucken

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Jan 31, 2021
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Long Island
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21 Audi e-Tron Sportback
I mean, it behaves the way its intended to. To emergency braking the car before you hit something. They do give you the option to disable it, they also give you the option to disable the parking sensors. Not saying no issues, but this is something that's up to the user's preference.
Agreed, but other cars that have this feature, including the two I currently have, have more accurate distance assessments. Specifically, I'm addressing this part of Bill's review, "The cameras and park distance are truly awful. They show you are hitting something when in fact you are 24" away." Now I use the front cameras of the e-Tron, which activate automatically, as I creep toward an EA charger. I need to be close to the charger to ease the task of gripping the charger handle & cable without having to stretch it beyond its limits. So the camera and its accuracy is important.
 

hydbob

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Nov 14, 2021
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Dream P
DE Number
33
I think you misinterpreted his comment or his car has a bug, but the cameras don't show you hitting something, the sensor Suite activates when you are about 24" away and is similar to other systems where it starts yellow then as you move closer turns orange and then red when you are too close. The only issue I've experienced but have gotten used to is that the system activates from a distance that is further than other parking systems, but obviously this is a preference for Lucid. If you look at my previous post, I posted pictures of what it looks like and have a measuring tape for distance.
 

FFT

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Mar 2, 2021
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43
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Boston
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Lucid GT on order
I just received the response below from my Lucid delivery advisor. Thought I would share:

I have been following the status of vehicle deliveries and I do understand that there have been frustrations expressed with the current vehicle applications. The two biggest complaints appear to be the lack of DreamDrive and Apple Carplay.

Dream Drive is currently undergoing final refinements and is expected to be available within the next few weeks. I anticipate that there will be some Dream Edition customer who will take delivery of a vehicle with Dream Drive already active. This means that by the time we bring Air Grand Touring to the market, the functionality should already be active.

I do not have a specific timeline on Apple Carplay but I have been notified that it will arrive shortly after deliveries start. While I do anticipate that Dream Drive will come before Apple Carplay, both functionalities will be made available via an over-the-air update soon

Based on my experience speaking with customers who have already taken delivery of their vehicles, they are praising the build quality, comfort and driving experience. Many of the concerns expressed are similar to what is found with other connected electric vehicles. What gives me a lot of reassurance is that the core functions of the vehicle work really well and we are continuing to improve the experience with each update we release.

Rest assured that by the time your car arrives, there will have been additional software updates made to the fleet that will resolve many of your concerns. I had a customer take delivery of their Dream Edition yesterday and they loved the experience so much, they ordered a Grand Touring within hours of getting their Dream Edition.
 

Lucken

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Jan 31, 2021
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21 Audi e-Tron Sportback
Bob, I probably did misinterpret this somewhat, but he did say at 12" the system crashes ("If you over ride that jarring brake, the screen goes all red and crashes the system at 12" away"). You don't want cameras blacking out (if that is indeed what's happening) as you're approaching a charger. Even in my garage there are times I might park within 12".

All of this shows that you must take 'professional' reviews with a grain of salt for things like this. I can't recall any review mentioning the issues Bill encountered. It's certainly not the first time I've seen professional reviewers fail to recognize issues with equipment. Recently, I purchased a Sony A9 Atmos speaker system. Reviewers raved about it, but not one mentioned an issue that appears to impact the majority of users, speaker dropouts. You sit there and wonder how it's possible that such a glaring defect was missed by so many reviewers. The cynics will say, 'well they're paid by Sony'.
 

hydbob

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Nov 14, 2021
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Dream P
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33
Well I've never had it crash on me after loading...failing to load was a different story though...
 

dawktah LucidGT

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Sep 16, 2021
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Being someone who is not in tech but has been using computers since 1983. Lets all remember Apple patented the page turn. We are saying why can Lucid have "x" when my Honda has it, but keep in mind its patented. If Lucid wants something similar it has to be new code and cannot by any means be considered a patent infringement. Software patents to me are nightmares!!!
 

Ormond

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Sep 10, 2020
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12
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Tesla
Bill55's report is very sobering and leaves me with little hope that Lucid can tackle that many software issues quickly.

Tesla offers no outside camera view of the car other than the backup camera. We can't even tell how far forward we can pull in a parking space before hitting the parking chock, much less see anything on the sides of the car.
When you put your Plaid in reverse, you should be able to see camera views for the sides and rear of the car. In the latest version 11 update, you can set up a preference to see the side view when you use a turn signal to see your blind spots. I do wish there was a front camera for parking. I use my sensors when parking to stop at 12 inches from my garage wall.
 

dawktah LucidGT

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Sep 16, 2021
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@Bill55 has a very thorough review. There are so many large auto groups VW/Audi, BMW, GM, Toyota and others that share technology and software. Someone can confirm but to include CarPlay Apple gets a cha-ching. There is probably some legal wrangling going on for some of these features we want. Who is paying for the licensing the maker or the end consumer? Other than things we accept as standards and are legal requirements I can believe there's a legal minefield to negotiate. Rolls Royce has a 360 degree camera so implementation cannot encroach on their product. I was a beta tester for the first Porsche Cayenne and it had bad proximity sensors that were inaccurate when wet. Hopefully this has been fixed across all cars by now.

Surround speaker dropout can be at the decoding level. I am researching which system to get for our new home theater and was amazed at all the configurations that have evolved since 5.1 surround. Dolby Atmos is encoded for far more speakers than the home system would have and if you don't have the system set up and configured to match the original format decoding is bound to create a dropout. Computers don't like to be fed errors without being told to do with them.

Same thing with this parking system, code is struggling with error.

Error 1201...

I saw front parking camera on a Ford many years ago, they may have a patent on that, so you have to create your way around it.
 

tastevens

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Dec 26, 2021
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6
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None
Hello all. I will detail some real world experience. I will try to be objective, but my subjective opinions are strong. I have the performance addition with the 21" wheels. For perspective I am 6'2", race in World Racing League endurance races for fun, have owned an Alpine B7 which is my all time favorite sedan, and unfortunately still is. I put an early deposit on the car as I wanted an EV, but I was waiting for better range and performance, plus a design mind set different than Tesla. I was/am driving a Yukon AT4. My wife and I picked the car up in Costa Mesa on 12/10. We spent about 3 hours going over the car with our delivery specialist and the service advisor spent some time with us as well. Our first trip was back to San Diego. No issues and we charged at home with a 14-50 outlet we had installed with a 50 amp breaker and the cable included with the car. I set the car for "Daily charging" and waited till 9pm to plug it in as scheduled charging is an unknown update away. I down loaded the iPhone app prior to picking up the car and have been using it almost exclusively as my "key". Saturday and Sunday we drove the car everywhere we went. My wife quickly realized that the car got more attention than she is comfortable with. Monday through Thursday I drove the car to work ~14 miles each way. Took people on test drives. The acceleration is truly breathtaking. I race cars and have owned a GTR and a 911 Turbo S. This car is fast. The handling and ride are great, the brakes are good, it's just hard to slow this much weight. With the week of commuting plus test drives the estimated range in miles has been going down some. I appreciate that the expected range is changing based on my driving, but it is still optimistic. On Thursday I went to a electrify america 150kw fast charger at walmart to test in anticipation of our upcoming trip to Santa Barbara over the weekend. I wanted to make sure everything worked. This is my first EV and first time charging other than at home. I used the Lucid app and everything worked great. The highest charge rate I saw was 77kw. I got about 100 miles of range in 28 minutes. Looking at Electrify America site, I ordered a level 2 home charger while charging so I could schedule charge times without waiting on an update from Lucid. The trip from San Diego to Santa Barbara after a full charge, range was indicated to be 459 at start. 222 miles later it showed as 171. I drove in "smooth" mode. I am no "miler", but I drove with the flow of traffic and no big acceleration runs. The hotel indicated they only had Tesla charging. The next day I found a charge point charging station, downloaded the app and starting charging with no issues. I got ~100 miles of range in 4 hours for $5. When we got back to the hotel I went to look at the Tesla charging stations. There were 2 stations per pole and maybe 10 stations over all. Each pole had a Tesla sign, but looking closer the last charger was on a pole with a Tesla charger but was a J1772. I went and got the Lucid and plugged in. The next morning the car showed a full charge and 429 miles of range. 99.5 miles later stopping for the night in Long Beach the car indicated 3.4mi/kWh and a range of 316 miles. The valet card has no hole punch for a valet to attache an identifier tag and hang the card on the key board. Also, it has a pictograph on how to unlock the car, but not how to "start" the car. I gave the valet a remote. They were able to park the car and retrieve it without issue. They could not figure out how to open the trunk. 115 miles to home. When we got home the car indicated a remaining range of 150 miles. My real world driving indicates for me a range of ~400 miles on a full charge. Our only mechanical issue so far is when I use the app to open the Frunk, it "pops" the latches, but doesn't open. So far the fix is press the open button on the panel in the car and it opens and then shuts as expected. I am sure some will be disappointed with my real world range. I am not. Drivetrain, suspension, brakes, paint, fit, finish, range, the car meets my high expectations. Now the software. It would be an insult to beta software to call this software beta. It is inconsistent, crashes, and is in many cases just plain bad even if it works. My wife feels it is a car designed by men for men because the security issues are so bad. Using the iphone app the proximity unlock does everything from unlock at 15' to not unlocking at all. Locking is even worse. I trust it not at all. My wife wants the car to unlock the driver door only when she touches it, be able to open the trunk with the doors looked. My expectation is higher, the AT4 I can open the rear hatch by getting close and waving my foot under the bumper. We both want the doors to lock if we are outside and press on the door handle. Sometimes it does, mostly it does not. Can we have an off button? The car shows the same status if you are getting out or about to shift into D. The cameras and park distance are truly awful. They show you are hitting something when in fact you are 24" away. It locks the brakes in a tooth filling loosing way when you are 18" away. If you over ride that jarring brake, the screen goes all red and crashes the system at 12" away. The GM vehicle at less than half the price, goes full "red" at 9" away. The car has the most sophisticated sensors on the planet, but the programers feel 24" equals stop. Trying to parallel park in this car is a nightmare. Unless you want to park 18" off the curb it has a defining and very urgent and anxiety producing audible response and then hits the e brake over and over and over. I have never been uncomfortable parking a car until now. The nav is awful, the music controls are awful, and in general there is a folder based mentality for the interface that predates the 2007 iPhone. Why even waste time on Nav. People are more attached to their phones than their cars. Have android auto and car play working from day one. People are attached to their cars, they are more attached to their phones. I would estimate Lucid owners are 80%+ iPhone. Car play not working on day one is a huge mistake. I bought the car to share with my wife. She wants a car that works as expected every time. This is not that car. First car we have ever owned that makes her feel "unsafe". Unfortunately, there is lots more on how bad the software is. Yes, it will get better. Telling me I am hitting something when it is 24" away shows me a mind set that is as bad or worse than Tesla philosophy. The grey scale map that represents the car in black and your location in white. Awful. Water is black, green space is black, buildings are black with dark grey roofs. The number of steps to transfer an address someone has texted me to the car is ridiculous. The Nav stops working if it loses internet. That is the only value of built in nav, working even if you lose cell connection. Alexa in the car finally makes siri look good. Homelink is per profile. Garage door openers have a limit of the number of links they store. A Lucid with 2 or 3 profiles will cause your other cars or openers to drop. Neither the nav or home display show direction. There is zero chance I would let software on this car drive for me. Software is what will decide the winners and losers. If there are not some impressive updates and soon, the aspects of this car that are great will soon be over run by the awful day to day experience of phone interaction, parking, navigating, music/audio controls, and just waiting forever for the car to boot. My wife would prefer I sell the car. Opposite of my intent to get her to embrace EV's. Everything that is bad in this car, is either good or great in my 40K Honda Accord and/or my 80K GMC AT4. Being different to be better is awesome, being different to be different is stupid. The remote feels cheap, looks cheap, it reminds me of a $10 powerpoint clicker. It is not intuitive, has a bad form factor, and is literally attached to your other keys by a thread. The door handle. The double clutch required to open is annoying, it is a cheap plastic on plastic part. It feels cheap, it has a plastic on plastic binding feel. Everyone is going to use this everytime they drive the car. I have had no other car where the door opener has such a "cheap" feel. Yes, I have high expectations for 185K car. This car both delights and infuriates me. BMW, Porsche, and Mercedes, are all working hard on EV's. Lucid has a small window before their chance at converting those enthusiasts who want an EV to Lucid will close. The impressive 900V architecture, the great performance, and good looks will all be for naught, if the software does not get much better quickly. I hope Lucid stops doing gimmicky things that look nice, but are shit. Benchmark a Honda accord. Benchmarking, BMW, Lexus, Mercedes, and Porsche can come later for Lucid, but only if they survive this start up period. I hope they get better.

This is exactly why I'm waiting for the bugs to be worked out. New car from a new company.

Guess that makes me a "kinda early" adopter.

Hope your issues all get addressed and you are pleased with your purchase.
 

kmadonna

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Jan 5, 2022
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1
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745e; 911 Turbo S
Geez, I just got an email saying my Air Grand Touring is available. Not sure I want it after reading this review and also just finding out that there is no satellite radio. I just bought a new 745e that I am not 100% satisfied with and was considering replacing it with the Lucid but if there is one thing that drives me crazy is software issues with cars. Perhaps I'll get a Panamera hybrid 4S instead. In addition to the 745e, I have a 2014 911 Turbo S that has been bulletproof as well as a 2021 Sierra 2500 Denali and 2021 Toyota Sienna. The software on both of the newer cars are just about flawless and very intuitive which is important to me because I do not have the patience to read owner's manuals. I want to get into a car and figure out how to operate it quickly. Who needs a headache that you pay $140 k for?
 

hydbob

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Nov 14, 2021
Messages
756
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Dream P
DE Number
33
Geez, I just got an email saying my Air Grand Touring is available. Not sure I want it after reading this review and also just finding out that there is no satellite radio. I just bought a new 745e that I am not 100% satisfied with and was considering replacing it with the Lucid but if there is one thing that drives me crazy is software issues with cars. Perhaps I'll get a Panamera hybrid 4S instead. In addition to the 745e, I have a 2014 911 Turbo S that has been bulletproof as well as a 2021 Sierra 2500 Denali and 2021 Toyota Sienna. The software on both of the newer cars are just about flawless and very intuitive which is important to me because I do not have the patience to read owner's manuals. I want to get into a car and figure out how to operate it quickly. Who needs a headache that you pay $140 k for?
In Lucid's defense, the software that is working is very intuitive and easy to use, haha.
 

Maverick

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Dec 14, 2021
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61
Location
Scottsdale, AZ
Vehicle(s)
Lucid GT
Geez, I just got an email saying my Air Grand Touring is available. Not sure I want it after reading this review and also just finding out that there is no satellite radio. I just bought a new 745e that I am not 100% satisfied with and was considering replacing it with the Lucid but if there is one thing that drives me crazy is software issues with cars. Perhaps I'll get a Panamera hybrid 4S instead. In addition to the 745e, I have a 2014 911 Turbo S that has been bulletproof as well as a 2021 Sierra 2500 Denali and 2021 Toyota Sienna. The software on both of the newer cars are just about flawless and very intuitive which is important to me because I do not have the patience to read owner's manuals. I want to get into a car and figure out how to operate it quickly. Who needs a headache that you pay $140 k for?
Did your email say it was available or they were inviting you to confirm your reservation? If the former, when did you reserve and when did you confirm?
 

Pete44

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Nov 9, 2021
Messages
80
Location
Palm Beach Gardens, FL; Westport CT; NYC
Vehicle(s)
Lucid AGT, Tesla S 90D
Geez, I just got an email saying my Air Grand Touring is available. Not sure I want it after reading this review and also just finding out that there is no satellite radio. I just bought a new 745e that I am not 100% satisfied with and was considering replacing it with the Lucid but if there is one thing that drives me crazy is software issues with cars. Perhaps I'll get a Panamera hybrid 4S instead. In addition to the 745e, I have a 2014 911 Turbo S that has been bulletproof as well as a 2021 Sierra 2500 Denali and 2021 Toyota Sienna. The software on both of the newer cars are just about flawless and very intuitive which is important to me because I do not have the patience to read owner's manuals. I want to get into a car and figure out how to operate it quickly. Who needs a headache that you pay $140 k for?
Wow. First one. When did you put a deposit down and when did you confirm? Thanks.
 

Paladin732

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Nov 21, 2021
Messages
190
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Taycan
Geez, I just got an email saying my Air Grand Touring is available. Not sure I want it after reading this review and also just finding out that there is no satellite radio. I just bought a new 745e that I am not 100% satisfied with and was considering replacing it with the Lucid but if there is one thing that drives me crazy is software issues with cars. Perhaps I'll get a Panamera hybrid 4S instead. In addition to the 745e, I have a 2014 911 Turbo S that has been bulletproof as well as a 2021 Sierra 2500 Denali and 2021 Toyota Sienna. The software on both of the newer cars are just about flawless and very intuitive which is important to me because I do not have the patience to read owner's manuals. I want to get into a car and figure out how to operate it quickly. Who needs a headache that you pay $140 k for?
Are you sure that its not the email telling you that you can confirm it? No AGT should be going out yet as the DE are not complete. You would have gotten a note from your DA asking you to confirm details, payment, etc.
 

HC_79

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Jan 4, 2022
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122
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2019 Audi e-Tron
Are you sure that its not the email telling you that you can confirm it? No AGT should be going out yet as the DE are not complete. You would have gotten a note from your DA asking you to confirm details, payment, etc.

It will be the email to confirm the reservation. I got emailed today to lock in my AGT order. All done and received order confirmation email.
 

HC_79

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Jan 4, 2022
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122
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2019 Audi e-Tron

Yet again, it looks like EA just can't deliver a consistent charging sessions. 77Kw is pathetic for a car that charges at 300Kw. I have the same issues with my Audi, supposed to charge at 150Kw from 0% to 80% but it all depends on how the EA charger feels on the day as to whether you get 150Kw or 30Kw. I really hope the more EV's that use EA forces them to actually do something to address these inconsistent charging issues especially in states where you pay by charging time not Kw used.

When it comes to the software, i'm not surprised its got serious issues. It's very telling when early reviews are happening and the car is being praised for its driving and handling but no one is mentioning the software. Even the press day in October when they announced cars were about to come of the production line, no one was showing the UI and it became clear to me that it wasn't ready and Lucid didn't want it shown. Look how late they announced DreamDrive and in the end it wasn't an event it was literally a 5 min video on what really "is coming" in the future.

Lucid has said they will take customer feedback and change the software as necessary so the UI you see today may not be the one you see in 12 months. Given 1.0.8 has gone out within 2 months of the car being released shows me that they're aggressively working on improving the software. 8 versions whilst it may look bad that the car needs this is still impressive to push out in such a short timeframe. It took Audi a good 8+ months to give me a software update after buying my e-Tron and very few have followed since over the last 3 years.

For me, i'm willing to accept bugs as long as I can see Lucid is actively fixing them which it appears they are. Again, whilst its frustrating, you are an early adopter so these issues are to be expected. lets hope in 12 months we're all happy with how Lucid has updated and improved the software.
 
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