Out of Spec Kyle - A.M.A. on Lucid Gravity

At least they could have shown him the car with the software stack closer to completion.
Could they? I don’t know if that’s true or not. RCs, Mules, etc are built to focus on specific things before it all comes together into a cohesive production car. This was filmed before the start of production so I’m assuming things are further along now, in fact my impression was the value in giving media early access to a car that hadn’t started production yet was to get their feedback as @outofspeckyle and others have an eye for detail that can help Lucid just as it helps these video creators get viewers. In the SavageGeese video Peter mentions he’s driving the software focused Gravity himself to make sure it’s correct, so I’m not worried.
 
I wish they would have only previewed cars closer to production. They’ve already done previews with some media outlets. It seems shortsighted to try release cars for review without working software even if Kyle was somewhat understanding. At least they could have shown him the car with the software stack closer to completion.
Lucid moves much faster than your typical auto company. We felt that it was better to give a small group of media who are educated enough to understand the difference between a full production car and a car that is near production so that we could have some driving impressions out there so people better understand the Lucid Gravity. There is no other product like this so it’s not easy for people to understand without experiencing. We won’t ship cars without software at the level that is appropriate.
 
It's not like there's a TON of room in the 3rd row but I can fit comfortably - I can in Kia EV9 as well. Really need to re-do our EV SUV comparisons next year with so many new ones coming on the market around now


It didn't sound like any major announcements other than the expected AC bidirectional up to 80A AC through NACS as well as V2V through RangeXChange


Should have asked them about adapters because there's no official automaker supported 1,000V CCS -> NACS adapter yet (the ones Tesla use are only 500V max) that would allow this vehicle to interface on public CCS chargers yet... they also don't have supercharger access so how should a Gravity owner DCFC and stay in compliance of automaker recommendations? Not sure...
We will have an adapter, of course.
 
I thought it was a very good review. Your concern call ours were some of mine as well. (Also thank you for calling out that turn signal sound. I thought I was the only one it was annoying). More convinced this therigh5 next car for me. Hoping they get the software sorted and charging works smoothly

Could they? I don’t know if that’s true or not. RCs, Mules, etc are built to focus on specific things before it all comes together into a cohesive production car. This was filmed before the start of production so I’m assuming things are further along now, in fact my impression was the value in giving media early access to a car that hadn’t started production yet was to get their feedback as @outofspeckyle and others have an eye for detail that can help Lucid just as it helps these video creators get viewers. In the SavageGeese video Peter mentions he’s driving the software focused Gravity himself to make sure it’s correct, so I’m not worried.
I personally went directly from our Gravity media drives to our factory in Arizona and watched vehicles come off of the line. The difference between the Gravity media drove, which was a prototype off of soft tools with final chassis tuning, is significant. Most reviewers are not as familiar with the product and manufacturing development process as those who work for auto companies. Lucid can accomplish more than any other auto company I am aware of in a given time. And I have worked for Porsche, Ford, GM, and Nissan prior to Lucid. The purpose served by these media drives was to provide a better understanding of the vehicle in the marketplace. We are just getting started with the launch of Gravity. More to come!
 
Lucid moves much faster than your typical auto company. We felt that it was better to give a small group of media who are educated enough to understand the difference between a full production car and a car that is near production so that we could have some driving impressions out there so people better understand the Lucid Gravity. There is no other product like this so it’s not easy for people to understand without experiencing. We won’t ship cars without software at the level that is appropriate.
I appreciate that. As a 4x Tesla owner with a Gravity order I’m obviously intrigued with what you guys are doing out there. But as someone who has worked in marketing for 20 years, it’s hard to change a first impression.

I’m not talking about Kyle’s first impression as he’s very experienced with seeing cars in various stages of development, but this video will be up in perpetuity (unless he removes it) of him loving the driving dynamics but not being able to navigate the menus on the dashboard. It’s hard to reverse people’s initial misconceptions with subsequent corrections. We see this all the time in Marketing, News, etc. People take their first impressions of a product and keep that in their mind despite evidence that their ideas are no longer valid.

I believe the cars will ship with the appropriate software, but you’re still working for a nascent car company with fairly low awareness. The news that people have about Lucid is almost always mixed with articles about the “loss per vehicle” metric and questioning the viability of the company as a going concern. People can be rightly concerned that they’ll get “Fiskered” with an expensive car that will no longer receive any further software development.
 
I’m not talking about Kyle’s first impression as he’s very experienced with seeing cars in various stages of development, but this video will be up in perpetuity (unless he removes it) of him loving the driving dynamics but not being able to navigate the menus on the dashboard. It’s hard to reverse people’s initial misconceptions with subsequent corrections. We see this all the time in Marketing, News, etc. People take their first impressions of a product and keep that in their mind despite evidence that their ideas are no longer valid.
Except that Kyle (and others) will almost certainly have future videos of production vehicles. Moreover, the first impression across the board has been nothing but praise, so I’d say the plan worked.

I believe the cars will ship with the appropriate software, but you’re still working for a nascent car company with fairly low awareness. The news that people have about Lucid is almost always mixed with articles about the “loss per vehicle” metric and questioning the viability of the company as a going concern. People can be rightly concerned that they’ll get “Fiskered” with an expensive car that will no longer receive any further software development.
Sure, people can be. But they already are anyway, if they’re going to be. If these pre-prod vehicles had gotten negative reviews (like with Fisker), I’d agree with you. But they’ve been universally praise-heavy.

People can always wait to purchase. But I haven’t seen any indications that any of the reviews suggest waiting is a better option, or that there is an SUV that comes even close on the market or upcoming. 🤷‍♂️

That seems like a win to me, especially at this stage.
 
Except that Kyle (and others) will almost certainly have future videos of production vehicles. Moreover, the first impression across the board has been nothing but praise, so I’d say the plan worked.


Sure, people can be. But they already are anyway, if they’re going to be. If these pre-prod vehicles had gotten negative reviews (like with Fisker), I’d agree with you. But they’ve been universally praise-heavy.

People can always wait to purchase. But I haven’t seen any indications that any of the reviews suggest waiting is a better option, or that there is an SUV that comes even close on the market or upcoming. 🤷‍♂️

That seems like a win to me, especially at this stage.

Agree. A huge win based on all the reviews. In Kyle’s words, “best-driving SUV on the planet”. In his podcast the following part about following a Gravity in an Air GT was very interesting!

“And we were waiting for our slot to get into the gravity. And we pull up behind a gravity. We're like, oh, this is so cool.

Let's film it. And then they get on this highway on-ramp and we follow them because we're bored to cloverly. And I am at the absolute limit of traction in our Lucid Air.

I mean, I'm wide open throttle, leaning on the ESP systems.

Over 800 horsepower Lucid Air.

Yeah. I mean, it's not giving us that much because it's just, we're on there. And the gravity is just walking away from us in terms of grip and handling like we're standing still.

Now, obviously, we had the Aero wheels, they had the performance, but tires make a massive difference. And then just watching that gravity on-throttle rotate, just lean on that rear axle a little bit and shoot away onto the highway was amazing. And then that was like, we kind of were being a little bit pessimistic about gravity all morning.

And when we saw it was Jason Camisa driving, but when we saw Camisa rip around that off-ramp or the clover leaf, we were both like, oh shit this thing is crazy”
 
Except that Kyle (and others) will almost certainly have future videos of production vehicles. Moreover, the first impression across the board has been nothing but praise, so I’d say the plan worked.


Sure, people can be. But they already are anyway, if they’re going to be. If these pre-prod vehicles had gotten negative reviews (like with Fisker), I’d agree with you. But they’ve been universally praise-heavy.

People can always wait to purchase. But I haven’t seen any indications that any of the reviews suggest waiting is a better option, or that there is an SUV that comes even close on the market or upcoming. 🤷‍♂️

That seems like a win to me, especially at this stage.
I think the current reviews have done a good job convincing a lot of us who are ready to be convinced and have the means to purchase a car that is being produced by a company with a few question marks still hanging over its head (I bought my Model S in 2014). I'm super excited to be able to sit in one and drive it. But I think my concern still stands that the first impression of it being "unfinished" is a dangerous one to loft out there.

I don't think it's a death sentence but it's less than ideal. Obviously it's a benefit that the dynamics and engineering are getting rave reviews. But we've already been waiting to see reviews of the Gravity after they've opened orders, so releasing videos a month later but with significantly incomplete vehicles just seems like an odd choice. Obviously they're working hard and fast to complete things but if you were to sit down and plan the PR push for this car, nobody would say "Let's give a highly-subscribed YouTube channel a car where you can't navigate the dashboard yet."

In any case, I'm certainly not a "hater" in any way or a Tesla shill. I was just expecting these delayed reviews to be able to show a more comprehensive and complete view of the car, especially since we've already seen a fair number of pre-production preview videos of the car.
 
I think the current reviews have done a good job convincing a lot of us who are ready to be convinced and have the means to purchase a car that is being produced by a company with a few question marks still hanging over its head (I bought my Model S in 2014). I'm super excited to be able to sit in one and drive it. But I think my concern still stands that the first impression of it being "unfinished" is a dangerous one to loft out there.

I don't think it's a death sentence but it's less than ideal. Obviously it's a benefit that the dynamics and engineering are getting rave reviews. But we've already been waiting to see reviews of the Gravity after they've opened orders, so releasing videos a month later but with significantly incomplete vehicles just seems like an odd choice. Obviously they're working hard and fast to complete things but if you were to sit down and plan the PR push for this car, nobody would say "Let's give a highly-subscribed YouTube channel a car where you can't navigate the dashboard yet."

In any case, I'm certainly not a "hater" in any way or a Tesla shill. I was just expecting these delayed reviews to be able to show a more comprehensive and complete view of the car, especially since we've already seen a fair number of pre-production preview videos of the car.
Yeah I think the one disservice was around the hoopla with NACs and charge ports and access to Tesla with not the best details or clarity. Everyone should understand there are many good options for charging Gravity; but the average customer with a Model X simply doesn't need to think that hard about it.
 
As someone who spent half their career in engineering and half in marketing (unusual, I know ;)), I can appreciate both sides of this discussion. However, I suspect the audience at the moment is pretty nerdy. Few non-nerds pay so much attention to unreleased vehicles that they are watching these initial reviews. And this audience understands that the product being reviewed isn't final. Most people aren't even in the first stage of the funnel yet (awareness). You need a steady flow of positive information and other actions that gets progressively deeper and broader to get people into the interest and then consideration stages. I've seen multiple different vehicles at very different locations in these reviews, so they were reaching out pretty broadly. I suspect Lucid used what was available at the time and decided it was worth the risk. I've already placed an order, so I'm looking for as much info as I can get, therefore I have no issue with it, but if I put my marketing hat back on I'd still say it was the right way to go.
 
I appreciate that. As a 4x Tesla owner with a Gravity order I’m obviously intrigued with what you guys are doing out there. But as someone who has worked in marketing for 20 years, it’s hard to change a first impression.

I’m not talking about Kyle’s first impression as he’s very experienced with seeing cars in various stages of development, but this video will be up in perpetuity (unless he removes it) of him loving the driving dynamics but not being able to navigate the menus on the dashboard. It’s hard to reverse people’s initial misconceptions with subsequent corrections. We see this all the time in Marketing, News, etc. People take their first impressions of a product and keep that in their mind despite evidence that their ideas are no longer valid.

I believe the cars will ship with the appropriate software, but you’re still working for a nascent car company with fairly low awareness. The news that people have about Lucid is almost always mixed with articles about the “loss per vehicle” metric and questioning the viability of the company as a going concern. People can be rightly concerned that they’ll get “Fiskered” with an expensive car that will no longer receive any further software development.
I blame Tesla CEO and Tesla fanboys for that rumor about being Fiskered…..I’m sure Musk comment about Lucid and Rivian going bankrupt lost plenty of sales……
 
I blame Tesla CEO and Tesla fanboys for that rumor about being Fiskered…..I’m sure Musk comment about Lucid and Rivian going bankrupt lost plenty of sales……
Pretty sure that the widespread raves Gravity is likely to get (and the ensuing sales) will put the bankruptcy risk in the rearview mirror. I think some do not realize the incredible staying power Lucid has as a result of the Saudi PIF being a 60% owner. Many American minds / haters just cannot conceive of a company that actually has a true long term focus and the resolve to see that focus through. I believe Lucid does.
 
I blame Tesla CEO and Tesla fanboys for that rumor about being Fiskered…..I’m sure Musk comment about Lucid and Rivian going bankrupt lost plenty of sales……
To be fair, he lived through that commentary for 10 years, even now the new Anti-EV movement is rehashing the whole "Tesla's profits are all from credits" BS....
 
Pretty sure that the widespread raves Gravity is likely to get (and the ensuing sales) will put the bankruptcy risk in the rearview mirror. I think some do not realize the incredible staying power Lucid has as a result of the Saudi PIF being a 60% owner. Many American minds / haters just cannot conceive of a company that actually has a true long term focus and the resolve to see that focus through. I believe Lucid does.
Unlikely...doesn't matter how good it is, a $95k-$130k SUV is not going to pull the sales/volume that are needed to change the bankruptcy mindset. I do agree with you that it appears the PIF is invested deep enough to continue bailing them out, but that will be on investors and customers minds until Lucid can build a midsize to really grow volume sales. I am hopeful though that the Gravity will help Lucid show some growth over the next couple years. I think for sure the next 12 months will be all positive for Lucid.
 
I guess the Gravity's purpose is not so much to make a ton of money now as to convince investors that Lucid will one day be viable on its own. IMHO the Gravity competes with the Porsche Cayenne. For $100k, my best guess is that the Cayenne is not even close as a product, with the exception of brand recognition and the total lack of range anxiety.

So @outofspeckyle - would you agree or disagree with these assertions?
 
It would seem that Lucid is following (at a higher overall quality level) the same Model S, Model X, Model 3 / Y approach (perhaps the 3 and Y will be reversed) that certainly was a very successful model for Tesla and with better tech, a more long term focus set of investors and vehicles that are superior, I am not sure why so many doubt it can work…
 
I think the current reviews have done a good job convincing a lot of us who are ready to be convinced and have the means to purchase a car that is being produced by a company with a few question marks still hanging over its head (I bought my Model S in 2014). I'm super excited to be able to sit in one and drive it. But I think my concern still stands that the first impression of it being "unfinished" is a dangerous one to loft out there.

I don't think it's a death sentence but it's less than ideal. Obviously it's a benefit that the dynamics and engineering are getting rave reviews. But we've already been waiting to see reviews of the Gravity after they've opened orders, so releasing videos a month later but with significantly incomplete vehicles just seems like an odd choice. Obviously they're working hard and fast to complete things but if you were to sit down and plan the PR push for this car, nobody would say "Let's give a highly-subscribed YouTube channel a car where you can't navigate the dashboard yet."

In any case, I'm certainly not a "hater" in any way or a Tesla shill. I was just expecting these delayed reviews to be able to show a more comprehensive and complete view of the car, especially since we've already seen a fair number of pre-production preview videos of the car.
Anyone spending 100k will do their research….
 
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