[URGENT] $7500 credit for current reservation holders

[idiot900]

My DA told me the DAs have no visibility into production plans. I think many of them are just making educated guesses to placate customers.

 

[ikonos]

it's still a credit against adjusted income - NOT A REFUND - please see and understand IRS Form 8936.

It is not a credit against adjusted income (which is a deduction) but a credit towards the taxes paid. I looked at IRS Form 8936 and it says the credit goes on to Line 20 on From 1040 through Schedule 3. Essentially it gets added to the total taxes paid. And if that amount is higher than the taxes owed you can take the refund.

 

[Halodde]

I know this is beating a dead horse and there are other forums that speak to this but I still believe and my accountant as well that if you entered into an agreement before 8/16/2022 it doesn't matter that delivery takes place in 2023.

EV Tax Credit 2022​

What happens to the EV tax credit for the rest of 2022? The Inflation Reduction Act offers some relief for EV buyers who have written, binding sales contracts from this year to purchase EVs that will be placed in service or delivered in 2023. Essentially, if you purchased an electric vehicle before the Inflation Reduction Act became effective (so before August 16, 2022), and that vehicle is otherwise eligible for the old EV tax credit, you can claim that credit.

Website is https://www.kiplinger.com/taxes/605081/ev-tax-credit-inflation-reduction-act-2022-changes

This is the first time I've seen anything in print from a well known financial establishment saying that delivery date doesn't matter. I wonder how they came across this important point of clarification. I actually tried to email the author using the link next to her name at the bottom of the article. But the email got kicked back saying that [email protected] address doesn't exist. Maybe I will try to contact Kiplinger directly.

 

[Mr_rhythm]

This is the first time I've seen anything in print from a well known financial establishment saying that delivery date doesn't matter. I wonder how they came across this important point of clarification. I actually tried to email the author using the link next to her name at the bottom of the article. But the email got kicked back saying that [email protected] address doesn't exist. Maybe I will try to contact Kiplinger directly.

This has the same caveat they all do aka "written, binding sales contract". It all comes down to whether the non-refundable deposit does the trick or not, and we won't know till we can file and see, or more explicit clarification comes out from the IRS.

 

[idiot900]

This is the first time I've seen anything in print from a well known financial establishment saying that delivery date doesn't matter. I wonder how they came across this important point of clarification. I actually tried to email the author using the link next to her name at the bottom of the article. But the email got kicked back saying that [email protected] address doesn't exist. Maybe I will try to contact Kiplinger directly.

I thought the issue was that as it stands Lucid's damages if we cancel our pre-Inflation-Reduction-Act confirmations are limited to less than 5% of the value of the contract and may not qualify as binding under the transition rule.

Then the IRS issued guidance saying cars placed into service in 2022 would still qualify, apparently (?) without regard to the 5% guideline. Hence the urgency with end-of-year deliveries.

But does the 5% matter for cars placed into service in 2023? That's the open question.

 

[CrewChief]

This is the first time I've seen anything in print from a well known financial establishment saying that delivery date doesn't matter. I wonder how they came across this important point of clarification. I actually tried to email the author using the link next to her name at the bottom of the article. But the email got kicked back saying that [email protected] address doesn't exist. Maybe I will try to contact Kiplinger directly.

You can read on p. 146 of the Inflation Reduction Act the language dealing with the Transition. It is quite clearly consistent with the interpretation that Broklynboy describes above.

 

[Halodde]

Agree with all of you. I was only commenting on the date the vehicle is delivered/placed in service. All other criteria are still in play and could determine eligibility (contract, income etc...)

Although the IRA does not specify an end date (it says something to the effect of... after the IRA is signed...), many people here and elsewhere have interpreted it as saying that the vehicle has to be delivered in 2022 to qualify for the transition rule. This article is the first thing I've seen in print that says if the vehicle is delivered in 2023 and would have qualified prior to the IRA, it still qualifies for the tax credit in 2023

 

[maazymaaz]

I received a call from Lucid to tell me my reservation (confirmed before the Law was signed) would not qualify if delivered in 2023 due to it not being 5%

 

[Halodde]

I must be missing something. Does the IRA say that the 5% deposit is related to the date of delivery? Why would a car delivered in 2022 without a 5% deposit be any different than one delivered in 2023 without a 5% deposit?

 

[Babyrocko1908]

This is the first time I've seen anything in print from a well known financial establishment saying that delivery date doesn't matter. I wonder how they came across this important point of clarification. I actually tried to email the author using the link next to her name at the bottom of the article. But the email got kicked back saying that [email protected] address doesn't exist. Maybe I will try to contact Kiplinger directly.

Please and thank you!

 

[changinator]

I must be missing something. Does the IRA say that the 5% deposit is related to the date of delivery? Why would a car delivered in 2022 without a 5% deposit be any different than one delivered in 2023 without a 5% deposit?

because a car delivered in 2022 wouldn't have a 5% deposit, it would have a 100% deposit. also because lucid is made in America

 

[maazymaaz]

I must be missing something. Does the IRA say that the 5% deposit is related to the date of delivery? Why would a car delivered in 2022 without a 5% deposit be any different than one delivered in 2023 without a 5% deposit?

the 5% is just what is considered a binding agreement, so the "transition rule" goes into play if delivered in 2023. If you get the car in 2022 and since its made in America you are on the old rules.

 

[scharnhorst]

So if I understood this correctly. As someone who didn't put the 5% down in August, if I take delivery this year then I could get the tax credit. But as someone with just the regular 1k deposit if I take delivery in 2023 then I would not right?

 

[maazymaaz]

So if I understood this correctly. As someone who didn't put the 5% down in August, if I take delivery this year then I could get the tax credit. But as someone with just the regular 1k deposit if I take delivery in 2023 then I would not right?

YES, Lucid called me directly to tell me this... they wanted me to upgrade my touring to DDP and SSP to deliver the car this year, hence qualifying me to get the credit

 

[changinator]

So if I understood this correctly. As someone who didn't put the 5% down in August, if I take delivery this year then I could get the tax credit. But as someone with just the regular 1k deposit if I take delivery in 2023 then I would not right?

anyone takes delivery of any new Lucid Air this year REGARDLESS will receive the tax credit
anyone taking delivery in 2023 is technically not guaranteed any tax credit. depends on Treasury/IRS, depends on your state laws on written binding contracts, etc. as it is written, a 5% deposit at anytime before EOY would have a higher probability of working for a 2023 delivery than a $300 or $1k deposit, but not guaranteed

 

[GMan]

Does anyone know if Lucid has provided the documentation to the IRS to ensure the TOURING version is going to qualify for the existing $7,500 credit? Per the IRS below, only the Dream Edition and Grand Touring are listed. Has Lucid done the below in Red and have received the acknowledgement from the IRS?

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/irc-30d-new-qualified-plug-in-electric-drive-motor-vehicle-credit

"Qualified Plug-In Electric Drive Motor Vehicles (IRC 30D)
Internal Revenue Code Section 30D provides a credit for Qualified Plug-in Electric Drive Motor Vehicles including passenger vehicles and light trucks. For vehicles acquired after 12/31/2009, the credit is equal to $2,500 plus, for a vehicle which draws propulsion energy from a battery with at least 5 kilowatt hours of capacity, $417, plus an additional $417 for each kilowatt hour of battery capacity in excess of 5 kilowatt hours. The total amount of the credit allowed for a vehicle is limited to $7,500.

The credit begins to phase out for a manufacturer’s vehicles when at least 200,000 qualifying vehicles manufactured by that manufacturer have been sold for use in the United States (determined on a cumulative basis for sales after December 31, 2009). For additional information see Notice 2009-89.

Manufacturers of the vehicles listed below have provided appropriate information and have received from the Service acknowledgement of the vehicles eligibility for the credit and the amount of the qualifying credit. The list of qualified vehicles provided below applies only to vehicles acquired after December 31, 2009."

 

[borski]

Does anyone know if Lucid has provided the documentation to the IRS to ensure the TOURING version is going to qualify for the existing $7,500 credit? Per the IRS below, only the Dream Edition and Grand Touring are listed. Has Lucid done the below in Red and have received the acknowledgement from the IRS?

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/irc-30d-new-qualified-plug-in-electric-drive-motor-vehicle-credit

"Qualified Plug-In Electric Drive Motor Vehicles (IRC 30D)
Internal Revenue Code Section 30D provides a credit for Qualified Plug-in Electric Drive Motor Vehicles including passenger vehicles and light trucks. For vehicles acquired after 12/31/2009, the credit is equal to $2,500 plus, for a vehicle which draws propulsion energy from a battery with at least 5 kilowatt hours of capacity, $417, plus an additional $417 for each kilowatt hour of battery capacity in excess of 5 kilowatt hours. The total amount of the credit allowed for a vehicle is limited to $7,500.

The credit begins to phase out for a manufacturer’s vehicles when at least 200,000 qualifying vehicles manufactured by that manufacturer have been sold for use in the United States (determined on a cumulative basis for sales after December 31, 2009). For additional information see Notice 2009-89.

Manufacturers of the vehicles listed below have provided appropriate information and have received from the Service acknowledgement of the vehicles eligibility for the credit and the amount of the qualifying credit. The list of qualified vehicles provided below applies only to vehicles acquired after December 31, 2009."

View attachment 7991

That is not necessary for the vehicle to qualify. It is just a listing of “prequalified” vehicles, and my guess is they haven’t done it yet because they’ve barely shipped any Tourings.

It should not disqualify you from claiming the credit, however, provided you are otherwise eligible.

 

[Tâm]

Does anyone know if Lucid has provided the documentation to the IRS to ensure the TOURING version is going to qualify for the existing $7,500 credit? Per the IRS below, only the Dream Edition and Grand Touring are listed. Has Lucid done the below in Red and have received the acknowledgement from the IRS?

If your car is missing from the list, you can supplement the list by looking up the VIN:

Welcome to VIN Decoding :: provided by vPIC

vpic.nhtsa.dot.gov

It has the notice;

"Note: The information displayed through the VIN decoder is reported by the manufacturer. If you have further questions regarding this information, please contact the vehicle manufacturer. In addition, more information may be available on a label affixed to the vehicle. See 49 C.F.R. Part 583."

If Lucid didn't report, then the VIN decoder wouldn't display the correct country of final assembly.

For 2022 delivery, you need:

1) below 200,000 EV delivery cap
2) North America final assembly

Thus, the printed list may be behind as some might think that Lucid could only have enough time in 2022 to deliver 2 Models: Dream and Grand Touring.