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Tri-Motor Air?

Hawk

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Could this be the Tri Motor Air going up against a Taycan in the 1/4 mile? It appears at the very end of the video showing the 9.9 sec record setting run against the Model S. You can clearly see that it is a different car from the one that set the record against the Model S. Notice the different wrap and possibly a slightly larger rear spoiler.

 
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BlindPass

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Could this be the Tri Motor Air going up against a Taycan in the 1/4 mile? It appears at the very end of the video showing the 9.9 sec record setting run against the Model S. You can clearly see that it is a different car from the one that set the record against the Model S. Notice the different wrap and possibly a slightly larger rear spoiler.

I thought initially the allusions to “industry leading” performance was due Lucid’s version of Plaid. But then it was released it’s “just“ dual motors with pack size smaller than I once assumed.

I figure they have a tri motor in the works with a larger pack. For one, I recall Rawlinson promoting the benefits (I could be misremembering). Second, it would make sense with the SUV. Third, the competition will soon have Plaid performance.

Although the dual seems more than enough for me, from an enthusiast standpoint, I enjoy seeing the limits pushed. As hmp mentioned, just how much acceleration improvement can they get before needing non-EV tech to help with traction? I suppose it helps with tracking and other drive qualities.
 

hmp10

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There've been a few signs that there are some tri-motor Lucid's out there somewhere. "InsideEVs" thought the picture Hawk posted above suggested that. Also, the "Motor Trend" journalist who did a ride-along for a range test said they took a lunch break at a test track where he rode in two more Lucid beta cars. (The range test car was not being driven at the limit, obviously.) He felt the first car he got into at lunch break had blazing acceleration until he got into the second one, which he said felt as if it had afterburners that lit up. I suspect that last one was a tri-motor.

Everything Lucid has teased publicly suggests the Dream Edition will be a dual-motor car. But who knows? Maybe they'll surprise us with an option for the tri-motor? Not sure I'd take it, especially if it reduced range, but I would love to be confronted with the agony of having to decide.
 

Hawk

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I have no doubt, from all we have picked up on, that they already have an 1,800hp Tri-Motor version with the larger battery pack they have also shown us. I am extremely interested to learn if this is one of the surprises they have saved for the global reveal. Just don't know if they are saving it for a future "Performance" edition to best the Plaid? Depending on performance / range trade-off, I would definitely go for it in the Dream Edition.
 
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hmp10

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Yeah, this whole thread has my windmill turning about what to do if confronted with the option of a tri-motor car next week. A few things occur to me:

Since two motors add up to 1,340 hp and the dual-motor car is billed at 1,080 hp, it's clear that battery output limitations play a significant role. In fact, Lucid has said as much. I would guess a tri-motor car would also have a power output well below the nominal 2,010 hp of three motors, even with a larger battery pack.

With the combined 5,900 lb/ft of torque from two motors, the dual-motor car already has capability well beyond the limits of tire traction. Whatever acceleration and drag times we're seeing almost certainly involve power cutbacks by a traction control system to keep the tires from breaking loose. I suspect the third motor only brings two advantages: slightly more precise rear axle torque vectoring than you can get with the ABS modulation the dual-motor version uses, and perhaps noticeably more oomph when accelerating from high speeds to even higher speeds when tire traction limits are less in play. (The Motor Trend journalist mentioned feeling the "afterburner effect" in one of the beta cars when it was accelerating off apexes at the track, not when it was accelerating from a standstill.)

The real appeal to me of getting a tri-motor car is that I have never been content with owning anything less than the most powerful version of any car I've bought (and I have a history of premature trade-ins to prove it), despite very incremental differences in usable performance.

But with a car as stunningly fast as the dual motor already appears to be, it might be hard to forgo things such as the rear foot garage if that's the trade-off for a tri-motor car. I'll know by the time I wake up next Thursday . . . if I ever get to sleep Wednesday evening.
 
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Hawk

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Forget getting any sleep Wednesday evening. I'm sure we will be on the configurator (if up) examining all options / combinations and, studying final specs.
shocked-face-with-exploding-head_1f92f.png
 

BlindPass

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Yeah, this whole thread has my windmill turning about what to do if confronted with the option of a tri-motor car next week. A few things occur to me:

Since two motors add up to 1,340 hp and the dual-motor car is billed at 1,080 hp, it's clear that battery output limitations play a significant role. In fact, Lucid has said as much. I would guess a tri-motor car would also have a power output well below the nominal 2,010 hp of three motors, even with a larger battery pack.

With the combined 5,900 lb/ft of torque from two motors, the dual-motor car already has capability well beyond the limits of tire traction. Whatever acceleration and drag times we're seeing almost certainly involve power cutbacks by a traction control system to keep the tires from breaking free. I suspect the third motor only brings two advantages: slightly more precise rear axle torque vectoring than you can get with the ABS modulation the dual-motor version uses, and perhaps noticeably more oomph when accelerating from high speeds to even higher speeds when tire traction limits are less in play. (The Motor Trend journalist mentioned feeling the "afterburner effect" in one of the beta cars when it was accelerating off apexes at the track, not when it was accelerating from a standstill.)

The real appeal to me of getting a tri-motor car is that I have never been content with owning anything less than the most powerful version of any car I've bought (and I have a history of premature trade-ins to prove it), despite very incremental differences in usable performance.

But with a car as stunningly fast as the dual motor already appears to be, it might be hard to forgo things such as the rear foot garage if that's the trade-off for a tri-motor car. I'll know by the time I wake up next Thursday . . . if I ever get to sleep Wednesday evening.
Yes, yes, yes. Thank you for posting this.

The intrigue I have about the possibility of a tri-motor with larger pack is probably greater than the performance gain I’d actually get in my daily drives. But who am I kidding, I’m far from needing even “just” the dual motor 9.9 second 1/4 mile for driving on Tamiami, or the anything close, but I want it. As long as I can trick my senses into perceiving a difference, I’ll lust after a tri-motor.
 

hmp10

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I suspect that you firmly believe, as do I, that a clean car is faster than a dirty one. Hey, the only reality is in our heads, anyway. o_O
 

hmp10

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Alex Guberman of "E for Electric" posted a video this morning with more details about the Sonoma Raceway runs, including a brief interview with Peter Rawlinson at the track.

Lucid ran two cars that day. The car that ran the quarter mile in 9.912 seconds was a dual-motor Dream Edition. Rawlinson also drove a "performance version" that day that hit an undisclosed faster time. Rawlinson said the performance version would become available "later in 2021". That, I'm guessing, is the tri-motor car.

 

Hawk

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Alex Guberman of "E for Electric" posted a video this morning with more details about the Sonoma Raceway runs, including a brief interview with Peter Rawlinson at the track.

Lucid ran two cars that day. The car that ran the quarter mile in 9.912 seconds was a dual-motor Dream Edition. Rawlinson also drove a "performance version" that day that hit an undisclosed faster time. Rawlinson said the performance version would become available "later in 2021". That, I'm guessing, is the tri-motor car.

Thanks for posting. Certainly not what I wanted to hear from Rawlinson. This creates a real dilemma for me. I really, really, really, want the performance version and I am not sure that I like the exclusive Dream Edition exterior eureka gold color or any of the other initial colors being offered. I have always and currently drive performance cars - Lamborghini Performante Spyder, Ferrari 458 Spider, Audi R8 V10 Spyder. Just knowing that the performance tri-motor version of the Air will also be available (although later) in 2021 will probably result in my not being satisfied with the dual motor Dream Edition. I have no immediate need for another vehicle and may now just decide to let Lucid get any initial production issues resolved and wait for the performance version in the gray / blue color my wife prefers.
 
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hmp10

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I traded a 2011 Audi R8 V10 Spyder in on my Tesla Performance P90D. My old boss owned a fleet of Ferraris which I used to take to the track with him, and I talked him into buying an MB-McLaren SLR. (He found the seats too brutal and used to "punish" me for talking him into the car by turning it over to me every weekend. He gave it to his dad after I retired.)

I was astonished by the Tesla. Not only did it easily out-accelerate the Audi, but its insanely low center of gravity put it on a handling par with the Audi, despite more weight and skinnier tires. It really was almost other-worldly.

The Dream Edition looks to be considerably quicker than my Tesla (2.5 vs. 3.2 secs 0-60). And the instant availability of full torque at launch is like nothing I'd ever seen in an ICE car. I seriously doubt that, unless you track the car, you'd ever be able to tell the difference between the dual- and tri-motor Lucid except, perhaps, in accelerating from high speed.

Despite my long history of buying a car at introduction and trading up as soon as a performance model comes out, I really think the Dream Edition might have reached a performance level from which going further up the performance scale might be pointless . . . especially if it comes at the price of features I need more in my dotage, such as better rear seating for equally-decrepit friends and family.

Remember that you're going to be picking up weight at one end of the car from the additional motor and probably even more weight (although more centered) with the larger battery pack that it will probably have.

I may be trying here to talk myself into not waiting for the Performance version . . . but I think the points are valid, nonetheless.

There's some likelihood that, if I take the Dream Edition, I'll add the Tesla Roadster when it comes out next year. The purpose of the Air is to carry myself and others in comfort, and they certainly won't appreciate being treated to the edge of the Performance Air.
 

hmp10

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Whether or not I can resist waiting for the Performance version, my Lucid will certainly not be in Eureka Gold. I don't know what's up with that. Oh, well, at least it's going to be unique to the Dream and won't pollute the rest of the line.

I've been wondering something, though, about both exterior and interior colors. Since none of the Design Studios in Florida will be open before Christmas, we're all going to be dependent on the color accuracy of the photographs and our computer monitors.

I think Lucid should send out a packet of color samples to all confirmed Dream reservation holders who request them. I'd be willing to pay a fee for this.
 

BlindPass

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I traded a 2011 Audi R8 V10 Spyder in on my Tesla Performance P90D. My old boss owned a fleet of Ferraris which I used to take to the track with him, and I talked him into buying an MB-McLaren SLR. (He found the seats too brutal and used to "punish" me for talking him into the car by turning it over to me every weekend. He gave it to his dad after I retired.)

I was astonished by the Tesla. Not only did it easily out-accelerate the Audi, but its insanely low center of gravity put it on a handling par with the Audi, despite more weight and skinnier tires. It really was almost other-worldly.

The Dream Edition looks to be considerably quicker than my Tesla (2.5 vs. 3.2 secs 0-60). And the instant availability of full torque at launch is like nothing I'd ever seen in an ICE car. I seriously doubt that, unless you track the car, you'd ever be able to tell the difference between the dual- and tri-motor Lucid except, perhaps, in accelerating from high speed.

Despite my long history of buying a car at introduction and trading up as soon as a performance model comes out, I really think the Dream Edition might have reached a performance level from which going further up the performance scale might be pointless . . . especially if it comes at the price of features I need more in my dotage, such as better rear seating for equally-decrepit friends and family.

Remember that you're going to be picking up weight at one end of the car from the additional motor and probably even more weight (although more centered) with the larger battery pack that it will probably have.

I may be trying here to talk myself into not waiting for the Performance version . . . but I think the points are valid, nonetheless.

There's some likelihood that, if I take the Dream Edition, I'll add the Tesla Roadster when it comes out next year. The purpose of the Air is to carry myself and others in comfort, and they certainly won't appreciate being treated to the edge of the Performance Air.
Between the Air Dream Edition, possible Model S Plaid, possible tri-motor Dream, and soon(ish) Roadster 2.0, there are a lot of good options.

I’m late on the excitement for Lucid. It wasn’t until they started releasing elite specs that I thought it would win out over the aforementioned other options.

I know I’ll be conflicted, even if I could drive each and know the price. A corollary is the Taycan Turbo S. An incredible EV, with better drive feel than my Model 3 and the acceleration of my Model S. With 4 doors, but smaller and low range, it’s kind of the most expensive daily driver you’ll find imo. We decided to keep or MS and M3. I mean, I’ll wait to see what the Roadster, Lucid, and Plaid are like for that price.
 

hmp10

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Hmmm . . . am I now the only person on this forum in Naples who will be getting the Dream Edition? I guess that'll make me the local guinea pig for initial build quality issues.

Oh, well. It's a nasty job, but somebody's gotta do it.
 

BlindPass

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Hmmm . . . am I now the only person on this forum in Naples who will be getting the Dream Edition? I guess that'll make me the local guinea pig for initial build quality issues.

Oh, well. It's a nasty job, but somebody's gotta do it.
Ha, ask me at the end of September!

I’m guessing I’ll get either the Dream Edition or the Plaid. But if Plaid performance is next level, but Tesla interior, I think I’ll be waiting for Tri-motor Dream.

A Lucid tri-motor that goes 0-60 in 2.3 without launch, and with afterburner feel when passing at freeway speeds would be worth waiting for.
 

Hawk

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A Lucid tri-motor that goes 0-60 in 2.3 without launch, and with afterburner feel when passing at freeway speeds would be worth waiting for.
Absolutely! And, may possibly even offer Electrochromic glass canopy by then?
 
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hmp10

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Not that I would mind having the tri-motor . . . but I'd be more inclined to wait in order to get the electrochromic glass.

Unless something really throws me in the reveal Wednesday, I'm resolved to get the Dream Edition and put up with the non-electrochromic glass as long as it has the recessed rear footwells. One of the things that most annoys backseat passengers in the Tesla is the flat floorboard necessary to clear the battery modules underneath. The seat cushions have to be low due to the low roofline and, without room to stretch your legs forward as front-seat passengers can, your knees are jacked up almost under your chin. While the Lucid Air roofline does not start swooping down as soon as the Tesla's does in the rear, the Air is still less than an inch taller than the Tesla (57.1" vs 56.9"). As a passenger hauler, I think recessed footwells will be important for adult comfort.

If a year later the Performance model comes out and the press concludes it really does make a noticeable difference in energetic street driving -- and the electrochromic canopy has become available -- I might just trade for the Performance model. It wouldn't be the first time I've done a quick trade to get an enhanced version of a car I just bought. By then I will know for certain whether the recessed footwells (which you will almost surely lose with the Performance car) really are necessary for rear seat comfort.

Here's a little exercise I did. These are photos of a Lucid Air and a Tesla Model S, both with glass roofs. The photos are to the same scale. The red bar, which is the same size in each picture, shows the height from the base of the chassis to the roofline about where a passenger's head would be. Of course, the Lucid will have considerably longer cabin than the Tesla, so Lucid rear passengers will have more room to stretch their legs forward. But that is still a more awkward sitting position than being able to drop your legs more vertically.

Screen Shot 2020-09-07 at 5.43.37 PM.png
Screen Shot 2020-09-07 at 5.44.23 PM.png
 
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hmp10

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"Drag Times" just posted an interesting look that dissects the 9.912 sec / 144.40 mph drag performance of the Lucid and compares it to Tesla. He attaches a lot of significance to the final trap speed and thinks it indicates that the Dream Edition has even more potential than these times show. In fact, he seems headed toward ordering one:

 

WillChen

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Eager to learn about model s plaid on battery day. If a tri-motor becomes standard (or as an option with small cost), with the increased hp and consistent/repeatable performance, all of the higher suggested prices would become really attractive and make it a great deal.
 
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