Switch to Apple?

[Tesla2.0]

Fact check: of the five screens in the car, the one currently used for CarPlay is the second largest.

Actually there are 7 screens. Instrument cluster is really 3 separate screens made look like a singlebscreen + left cockpit static screen + right cockpit + pilot panel infotainment + rear seat HVAC screen.

 

[Tesla2.0]

The other cars all show turn by turn on the dash in addition to CarPlay screen.

Polestar 2 just only now support this last month. They first released Apple CarPlay in 2022 July.

 

[GoFast]

Providing CarPlay is simply a matter of giving some customers a huge feature they want for little effort. Which is almost never a bad idea.

I am told that providing CarPlay is a ridiculously HUGE engineering effort.

 

[idiot900]

No matter what Lucid decides to do with CarPlay 2, they have to continue to build and maintain an infotainment system for those who don't have iPhones or don't wish to use CarPlay. That work never ends just because a large number of customers use CarPlay. So Lucid branded OS is always going to be present and maintained.

Providing CarPlay is simply a matter of giving some customers a huge feature they want for little effort. Which is almost never a bad idea.

So if Apple ever decided to "demand licensing fees" (which also makes no sense given Apple's business model) Lucid could simply pull the plug on CarPlay and blame Apple. But that's never going to happen, so it's not a concern.

The companies like GM who are removing CarPlay are not doing so because they fear Apple will want to charge them licensing fees. They are doing it because Apple won't give them the data they want to charge YOU subscriptions to all sorts of nonsense. They want your eyeballs and attention, so they can upsell you on features. CarPlay acually protects you from that.

As a customer, I want CarPlay 2. I'm not convinced that is "little effort" for Lucid, and unless it helps them sell more cars (as opposed to just CarPlay 1), it's an open question whether it's worth it from their business perspective. How many more Airs will they sell on the back of CarPlay 2?

Look at how long it took for them to even get their own system working to a reasonable standard. Now, hook it into someone else's application layer? CarPlay 1 is more or less video streamed over WiFi, but CarPlay 2 will take over a lot more pixels - will the streaming approach work for that? If not, does Lucid need to get Apple's proprietary renderer or other software running on top of their own Android implementation?

Licensing fees were just one example Apple could become uncooperative, but building your business on top of another company's whims is a dangerous game.

 

[borski]

I am told that providing CarPlay is a ridiculously HUGE engineering effort.

Sure, I think the point was that the step from CarPlay 1 to CarPlay 2 is a much smaller step than from 0 to CarPlay 1.

 

[Tesla2.0]

I am told that providing CarPlay is a ridiculously HUGE engineering effort.

It required much resources. Because Tesla, Rivian and Lucid all started their system ground up, this is a big deal to each of their own system. Traditional auto makers just plug in Apple product to their analog machines. These modern days EV are all digitally linked thru various customized computer sub-systems. Tesla didn’t bother bc they want their own system than to support Apple. Rivian didn’t bother to waste resources and openly told disgruntled customers no intent. Polestar took more than 2 years to deliver CarPlay on its Android native system. Lucid delivered in 14 months since debut. I would said it was big deal and differentiator from Rivian and Tesla. in addition, Apple products compliant department isn’t easy to work with to have any new product conform to their standards.

 

[Bobby]

Actually there are 7 screens. Instrument cluster is really 3 separate screens made look like a singlebscreen + left cockpit static screen + right cockpit + pilot panel infotainment + rear seat HVAC screen.

Must disagree. 34” panel is 3. Pilot makes 4, rear makes 5. You counted the dashboard twice.

 

[Tesla2.0]

Must disagree. 34” panel is 3. Pilot makes 4, rear makes 5. You counted the dashboard twice.

I counted 34” panel as 5 screens, the instrument panel seems to be 3 small screens weaved into one which each distinct zone. I thought I watched YouTube somewhere got that info.

 

[Bobby]

I counted 34” panel as 5 screens, the instrument panel seems to be 3 small screens weaved into one which each distinct zone. I thought I watched YouTube somewhere got that info.

3 distinct areas, yes. One screen. Proven when it boots up.

 

[joec]

It required much resources. Because Tesla, Rivian and Lucid all started their system ground up, this is a big deal to each of their own system. Traditional auto makers just plug in Apple product to their analog machines. These modern days EV are all digitally linked thru various customized computer sub-systems. Tesla didn’t bother bc they want their own system than to support Apple. Rivian didn’t bother to waste resources and openly told disgruntled customers no intent. Polestar took more than 2 years to deliver CarPlay on its Android native system. Lucid delivered in 14 months since debut. I would said it was big deal and differentiator from Rivian and Tesla. in addition, Apple products compliant department isn’t easy to work with to have any new product conform to their standards.

Tesla wants and relies on the data collected by their proprietary system. CarPlay's privacy features would not share every button press, navigation route, music listened to, etc. while in CarPlay mode. Thus, no CarPlay for Tesla. It's really that simple. They can't build FSD without that data. I think all the rumors of butt hurt feelings over this or that by CEOs and whatnot is a smoke screen.

Rivian took a chance their offerings were unique and appealing enough to not need CarPlay, at least in the short term. I think that has played out well for them so far, but we'll see how the appeal goes long term. Doesn't hurt one of their big competitors, Cybertruck, still doesn't exist. And Cybertruck won't have CarPlay, either. So it's really Ford they have to contend with at the moment. Which, to be sure, is tough competition.

So that lack of CarPlay might start hurting Rivian in a few years time. But that's plenty of time for them to adopt CarPlay if they wish.

Lucid, playing in the luxury space, had no real option but to support CarPlay. All of their direct competitors have it.

 

[Bill55]

Tesla wants and relies on the data collected by their proprietary system. CarPlay's privacy features would not share every button press, navigation route, music listened to, etc. while in CarPlay mode. Thus, no CarPlay for Tesla. It's really that simple. They can't build FSD without that data. I think all the rumors of butt hurt feelings over this or that by CEOs and whatnot is a smoke screen.

Rivian took a chance their offerings were unique and appealing enough to not need CarPlay, at least in the short term. I think that has played out well for them so far, but we'll see how the appeal goes long term. Doesn't hurt one of their big competitors, Cybertruck, still doesn't exist. And Cybertruck won't have CarPlay, either. So it's really Ford they have to contend with at the moment. Which, to be sure, is tough competition.

So that lack of CarPlay might start hurting Rivian in a few years time. But that's plenty of time for them to adopt CarPlay if they wish.

Lucid, playing in the luxury space, had no real option but to support CarPlay. All of their direct competitors have it.

It will be interesting to see how well GM does excluding Car Play on EVs. I don‘t want my vehicles to store another internet connected copy of my data.
it is very difficult on new vehicles to opt out of data collection and and doing so will disable features. I hope we get legislation in the future that makes it easier to opt out of tracking and disallowing manufactures from disabling features if you do.

 

[Tesla2.0]

Rivian took a chance their offerings were unique and appealing enough to not need CarPlay, at least in the short term. I think that has played out well for them so far, but we'll see how the appeal goes long term.

So that lack of CarPlay might start hurting Rivian in a few years time. But that's plenty of time for them to adopt CarPlay if they wish.

I’m on Rivian owners’ forum as well. Yes, there is faction of people complaining nonstop about lack of Apple CarPlay just as here in this forum complaining lack of NACS migration intent.

Major complaints are wanting more music options. Some wants Waze, ABRP, etc. etc. so Rivian added Tidal, bought out ABRP company to gradually integrate ABRP features to its native navigation and still no CarPlay promise. So certain truck owners complained and sold R1T for F150 Lightning bc of CarPlay.