Still wavering on the fence

[DeaneG]

You can get some cars that will fulfill your criteria, but range is something that only a couple of vehicles have. I wonder if you would be open to a vehicle without the range? Do you do a lot of daily commuting or trips? How much of a deal breaker is range?

We have a great daily driver SUV-EV with 200-mile range. The only area it falls short in is the ability to visit certain remote areas without charging infrastructure (e.g. Glacier NP, Yellowstone NP, Lassen/Shasta areas in CA). And it needs many charging stops on shorter 1000-mile loops. So the Lucid's range is the draw for me - it'll make a difference between traveling in comfort in our own car vs having to make a lengthy backtrack at times to hit a charger again, or renting a gas car. I think the Air looks great but do not want another large sedan. However, that's the cost of range with today's EV technology. My thought is to deal with the Air's size for a few years so that we can travel easily while we can still hike well. I'm hoping that within five years I'll be able to replace the Air with a smaller SUV with similar 400+ mile range, if/when solid-state batteries make it to production.

 

[hmp10]

The GT's positives for me are:
1) Range, range, range. If not the for GT, I'd probably have to rent a gas car for remote trips - ugh.
2) Nice interior.
3) Comfortable ride.

Agree on all the above. However, you've left out the things that are the most universally-lauded among all the reviewers of the car: its prodigious power and top-tier driving/handling dynamics.

The Air is a high-end sport/touring sedan more than anything else. If the traits that make it that are not a top priority for you -- and they aren't for many drivers -- you might be happier with a different car. On the other hand, if it's an EV you want and range is critical, you're sort of right back to the Air.

Given your concerns about exterior dimensions, though, something like a Tesla Model 3 might be worth considering. It has less range than the Air, but the ubiquity and reliability of Tesla's supercharging network largely offsets that. On the other hand, the Model 3 (like all Teslas) is something of a bone shaker when it comes to suspensions, and you said a comfortable ride is key. So, again . . . the Air?

 

[limtless]

Weird, I just looked too and the MS is 197.7” and the Air is 195.5” in length, 78.2” width (without mirrors) on the MS and 76.34” on the Air (both are the same with mirrors as you mentioned) either way, they are definitely larger than the M3
I can honestly say, I’ve only used the 360 camera for fun, never for parking. That’s just me, I know people love them, I just haven’t gotten used to them. This is my first vehicle with one, I will say that!

360 only with DDP?

 

[limtless]

Just my personal experience. I got HRE p101sc’s. My OEM wheels weighed in at around 38 lbs. The HRE’s came in around 23. The effects of reducing that 60 lbs of unsprung weight have been astonishing. I just did the wheel swap for cosmetic reasons and didn’t expect much else. Super pleased. Will post a separate thread with a more thorough review as don’t want to hijack this one.

Lucid service give you any grief for after-market non-Lucid wheels?

 

[FastEddi3]

Just my personal experience. I got HRE p101sc’s. My OEM wheels weighed in at around 38 lbs. The HRE’s came in around 23. The effects of reducing that 60 lbs of unsprung weight have been astonishing. I just did the wheel swap for cosmetic reasons and didn’t expect much else. Super pleased. Will post a separate thread with a more thorough review as don’t want to hijack this one.

Very curious if you are able to detect any difference in aerodynamics, and therefore, in range performance. I have read that wheels comprise a large portion of the aerodynamics of a car, (somewhere around 30%) which, I presume, is why they have those clip on inserts to reduce rotational and forward drag coefficients. I am sure the fluid mechanics of it are very complex, so prob hard to know what the overall effect might be.

 

[borski]

I have zero regrets. It’s the best car I’ve ever driven, and my friends who work on and drive exotics for a living actually said the same. They miss the “punch” of ICE, but it’s an absolutely perfect drive.

The interior is really appealing to me as well, as it isn’t insanely gaudy, and feels luxury and well-designed.

The range can’t be beat, and the service has been spectacular. The software isn’t without its faults, but even with those faults it’s the best car I’ve ever owned.

 

[Demosthenes]

Lucid service give you any grief for after-market non-Lucid wheels?

Nope. But didn’t really ask permission…I’m pretty sure what the standard answer would be . My local service rep only expressed a keen excitement to check out my vehicle afterwards when I mentioned my plans to him

 

[limtless]

Nope. But didn’t really ask permission…I’m pretty sure what the standard answer would be . My local service rep only expressed a keen excitement to check out my vehicle afterwards when I mentioned my plans to him

Do you the spec for after market...offset width etc???

 

[Demosthenes]

Very curious if you are able to detect any difference in aerodynamics, and therefore, in range performance. I have read that wheels comprise a large portion of the aerodynamics of a car, (somewhere around 30%) which, I presume, is why they have those clip on inserts to reduce rotational and forward drag coefficients. I am sure the fluid mechanics of it are very complex, so prob hard to know what the overall effect might be.

This was the number 1 burning question in my mind when I decided to swap my wheels. I was going to do it anyways for cosmetic reasons, and was prepared to take a range hit due to the fact that the HRE’s are not a purpose built aero wheel. However, I really wasn’t sure what to expect. Therefore, other than the wheel swap (same size), I kept everything else the same including OEM tires.

You’re right - based on my readings, it seems like aerodynamics is the predominant factor influencing range of an EV when traveling at constant speed. The monoblock HRE’s are definitively not ‘aero’ since they have skinny spokes and are full of holes. They are, however, incredible pieces of engineering in their own right with things like wheel weight and rotational inertia 100% optimized and probably far superior to the OEM 21in aero blades. So in all driving aspects other than range, I almost instantly noticed a significant and super pleasing improvement.

But just from a range point of view, my initial test results have actually been pretty positive thus far. However, I think I need to drive a bit more and under more driving conditions before I can draw any sort of real conclusion. I’ll be sure to do a more thorough review once I get more miles on them!

 

[Sam6062]

That’s exactly what I did, went ahead and bought last month a Limited Ioniq 5, as a transition to either a Touring or better yet a Gravity. I’ll say more in a separate thread, but at about 60K the the Ioniq offers surprising luxury value.

I heard they are hard to find and in high demand.

 

[limtless]

This was the number 1 burning question in my mind when I decided to swap my wheels. I was going to do it anyways for cosmetic reasons, and was prepared to take a range hit due to the fact that the HRE’s are not a purpose built aero wheel. However, I really wasn’t sure what to expect. Therefore, other than the wheel swap (same size), I kept everything else the same including OEM tires.

You’re right - based on my readings, it seems like aerodynamics is the predominant factor influencing range of an EV when traveling at constant speed. The monoblock HRE’s are definitively not ‘aero’ since they have skinny spokes and are full of holes. They are, however, incredible pieces of engineering in their own right with things like wheel weight and rotational inertia 100% optimized and probably far superior to the OEM 21in aero blades. So in all driving aspects other than range, I almost instantly noticed a significant and super pleasing improvement.

But just from a range point of view, my initial test results have actually been pretty positive thus far. However, I think I need to drive a bit more and under more driving conditions before I can draw any sort of real conclusion. I’ll be sure to do a more thorough review once I get more miles on them!

Are running 21s?

 

[Sandvinsd]

This was the number 1 burning question in my mind when I decided to swap my wheels. I was going to do it anyways for cosmetic reasons, and was prepared to take a range hit due to the fact that the HRE’s are not a purpose built aero wheel. However, I really wasn’t sure what to expect. Therefore, other than the wheel swap (same size), I kept everything else the same including OEM tires.

You’re right - based on my readings, it seems like aerodynamics is the predominant factor influencing range of an EV when traveling at constant speed. The monoblock HRE’s are definitively not ‘aero’ since they have skinny spokes and are full of holes. They are, however, incredible pieces of engineering in their own right with things like wheel weight and rotational inertia 100% optimized and probably far superior to the OEM 21in aero blades. So in all driving aspects other than range, I almost instantly noticed a significant and super pleasing improvement.

But just from a range point of view, my initial test results have actually been pretty positive thus far. However, I think I need to drive a bit more and under more driving conditions before I can draw any sort of real conclusion. I’ll be sure to do a more thorough review once I get more miles on them!

The nice thing about a Lucid is that even taking a range hit, you will still get more than any car on the market!

 

[DeaneG]

...The Air is a high-end sport/touring sedan more than anything else....on the other hand, the Model 3 (like all Teslas) is something of a bone shaker when it comes to suspensions, and you said a comfortable ride is key. So, again . . . the Air?

Maybe so! I actually just sold my performance model 3 after four years of ownership. It's acceleration was enough to spoil my appetite for the rest of the day. So at this point a comfortable ride on long trips is more of a concern. The Air GT is sounding pretty good today.

 

[noobzilla]

@DeaneG when calculating range have you considered that you likely wont get the 500mi range? Leave 5-10% buffer, 85% actual efficiency unless you drive like EPA, 5-15% battery degradation.. that 500mi will be more like 400mi practical range.

Also I read Kia EVs have issues too.

Prices going up.

Solid state battery still a long way to go and still expensive.

Who knows if the govt tweaks the 7500 credit and luxury cars may get excluded.

Just some of the things to consider too.

EV isnt really meant to save you money unless you drive a ton.

 

[Sandvinsd]

@DeaneG when calculating range have you considered that you likely wont get the 500mi range? Leave 5-10% buffer, 85% actual efficiency unless you drive like EPA, 5-15% battery degradation.. that 500mi will be more like 400mi practical range.

Also I read Kia EVs have issues too.

Prices going up.

Solid state battery still a long way to go and still expensive.

Who knows if the govt tweaks the 7500 credit and luxury cars may get excluded.

Just some of the things to consider too.

EV isnt really meant to save you money unless you drive a ton.

And other makers, like Ford, are imposing a mandatory 25% markup on their cars in stock.

 

[Slam08]

We have a great daily driver SUV-EV with 200-mile range. The only area it falls short in is the ability to visit certain remote areas without charging infrastructure (e.g. Glacier NP, Yellowstone NP, Lassen/Shasta areas in CA). And it needs many charging stops on shorter 1000-mile loops. So the Lucid's range is the draw for me - it'll make a difference between traveling in comfort in our own car vs having to make a lengthy backtrack at times to hit a charger again, or renting a gas car. I think the Air looks great but do not want another large sedan. However, that's the cost of range with today's EV technology. My thought is to deal with the Air's size for a few years so that we can travel easily while we can still hike well. I'm hoping that within five years I'll be able to replace the Air with a smaller SUV with similar 400+ mile range, if/when solid-state batteries make it to production.

Thanks for the reply!

To be honest I’m not sure if an EV is best for what you want to do. You would have much more comfort in a gas car with an extra tank of fuel in the trunk if needed. For me it would depend upon how often I took this trips. Every weekend? Then I would want my own car. Every couple of months? I would get a 60K EV and use the 40k I saved to rent a fun ICE car for trips. I can understand why you want an EV though.

 

[Steveinarizona]

I agree. I think of the Air as medium large. I ordered an i4 for my wife because she says the Air is too large for her and she wants a smaller car(her 2013 Audi S4 is about 185 inches long.

If the I4 40 had more HP and the I4 50 had more range, I would have ordered one despite hating the Bugs Bunny totally unnecessary grille. I am still waiting for a smaller but powerful BEV with lots of range. The Lucid hits every point except size. But I have lived with that size with my BMW 530e so I can tolerate it.

 

[Sam6062]

I have now had my EV6 for 3 months. Love the car more and more. I rarely drive my Tesla any more and will trade it when my Touring arrives. But the EV6 is a fantastic value, even at 60K.

How is the Mileage. I see it’s rated for 232 miles

 

[Sam6062]

Thanks for the reply!

To be honest I’m not sure if an EV is best for what you want to do. You would have much more comfort in a gas car with an extra tank of fuel in the trunk if needed. For me it would depend upon how often I took this trips. Every weekend? Then I would want my own car. Every couple of months? I would get a 60K EV and use the 40k I saved to rent a fun ICE car for trips. I can understand why you want an EV though.

I feel if/when they bring out the SUV IS when they would really come into,their own. Unfortunately they have run into usual new car issues with a first time production vehicle and they will be forced to dilute the already hefty share count. That is what happens when SPAC Mergers happen. These guys already fleeced the Company.

I feel like they have the ability to be extremely successful but I question if they can do so under Rawlinson. They should start planning the SUV Debut but they have pushed it by a Year. I think they were contract bound to the Saudi PIF to build that plant in Saudi Arabia.

It should become interesting in 2023-2024. Problem is they are 10 Year behind Tesla and no 0ne on the Street recalls Tesla’s growing pains because they were the Pioneer.

 

[Slam08]

If the I4 40 had more HP and the I4 50 had more range, I would have ordered one despite hating the Bugs Bunny totally unnecessary grille. I am still waiting for a smaller but powerful BEV with lots of range. The Lucid hits every point except size. But I have lived with that size with my BMW 530e so I can tolerate it.

The problem is that a smaller car means smaller battery. So it’s hard to get the range.

All Lucid would have to do honestly is take the frunk out and they have a midsize sedan!