Opt Out Pros and Cons

[SaratogaLefty]

I signed my documentation last Friday. I read I have 60 days to send an email if I want to "Opt Out" of the Arbitration clause. I know this has been discussed briefly in the past but I don't remember what are the pros and cons of "Opting Out". If I read it correctly, I believe if you don't opt out then you cannot participate in a Class Action suit. I've never been a big fan of class actions; they just seem to be a way for the lawyers to drum up fees, but maybe I'm overlooking something?? Anyway, if there are persons on this forum with knowledge on this subject, I would appreciate a discussion of the pros and cons of opting out please.

 

[borski]

I signed my documentation last Friday. I read I have 60 days to send an email if I want to "Opt Out" of the Arbitration clause. I know this has been discussed briefly in the past but I don't remember what are the pros and cons of "Opting Out". If I read it correctly, I believe if you don't opt out then you cannot participate in a Class Action suit. I've never been a big fan of class actions; they just seem to be a way for the lawyers to drum up fees, but maybe I'm overlooking something?? Anyway, if there are persons on this forum with knowledge on this subject, I would appreciate a discussion of the pros and cons of opting out please.

Post in thread 'Air Dream Deliveries?'

Air Dream Deliveries?

Yes. You can still do binding if you want, but it’s not mandatory then You can still do arbitration* (You cannot bind Lucid to arbitration without a separate agreement, and vice versa. It just gives you the ability to take it to the courts if you choose to do so. Lucid and other corps will...

lucidowners.com

 

[SaratogaLefty]

Post in thread 'Air Dream Deliveries?'

Air Dream Deliveries?

Yes. You can still do binding if you want, but it’s not mandatory then You can still do arbitration* (You cannot bind Lucid to arbitration without a separate agreement, and vice versa. It just gives you the ability to take it to the courts if you choose to do so. Lucid and other corps will...

lucidowners.com

So I did see that post but I'm wondering if it is true that if you opt out you can't participate in any class action suit or is it the opposite?

 

[borski]

So I did see that post but I'm wondering if it is true that if you opt out you can't participate in any class action suit or is it the opposite?

Preface: I’m not an attorney and this isn’t legal advice.

The opposite. Binding arbitration (the default) binds you and Lucid to arbitration in the case of a dispute. It also means you cannot be party to a class action, etc.

Opting out of arbitration (within 60 days) “gives you your rights back,” and you have the same rights as any other citizen that didn’t otherwise sign the contract, so you can sue at will, class-action or otherwise. Of note, you can *still* agree to binding arbitration with Lucid in that situation; you just don’t *have* to.

Binding arbitration tends to be good for companies because it is cheaper, faster, less public (sometimes), and they tend to win (by virtue of having great attorneys, etc.). It is bad for consumers for all of those same reasons; the threat of “I’m going to sue you if you don’t fix your exploding car” no longer holds any force.

 

[SaratogaLefty]

Preface: I’m not an attorney and this isn’t legal advice.

The opposite. Binding arbitration (the default) binds you and Lucid to arbitration in the case of a dispute. It also means you cannot be party to a class action, etc.

Opting out of arbitration (within 60 days) “gives you your rights back,” and you have the same rights as any other citizen that didn’t otherwise sign the contract, so you can sue at will, class-action or otherwise. Of note, you can *still* agree to binding arbitration with Lucid in that situation; you just don’t *have* to.

Binding arbitration tends to be good for companies because it is cheaper, faster, less public (sometimes), and they tend to win (by virtue of having great attorneys, etc.). It is bad for consumers for all of those same reasons; the threat of “I’m going to sue you if you don’t fix your exploding car” no longer holds any force.

Ok recognizing you are not an attorney, I guess I'm wondering what if any disadvantage is there to opting out? Seems like there isn't any downside, correct?

 

[borski]

Ok recognizing you are not an attorney, I guess I'm wondering what if any disadvantage is there to opting out? Seems like there isn't any downside, correct?

Correct.

Why You Should Opt Out of Forced Arbitration Whenever Possible

When the news that Dropbox was moving to forced arbitration to resolve issues between itself and customers—and that they were giving you a way to o

lifehacker.com

 

[Maverick]

Ok recognizing you are not an attorney, I guess I'm wondering what if any disadvantage is there to opting out? Seems like there isn't any downside, correct?

Just wait to opt out until you get the car; otherwise the downside might be a surprise fit and finish issue .

 

[SaratogaLefty]

Just wait to opt out until you get the car; otherwise the downside might be a surprise fit and finish issue .

Yeah I hear you. I've got 60 days so plenty of time. I reread the "Opt-Out" clause and it says "You may opt-out of the Arbitration Agreement, within 60 days from the date you accept this Agreement, by sending an email to [email protected] from the email associated with your order with "Arbitration Opt-Out" in the subject line and indicating your request to opt-out of the arbitration provision in the body of the email." I'm not sure which email they are referring to with the words "associated with your order"??

 

[borski]

Yeah I hear you. I've got 60 days so plenty of time. I reread the "Opt-Out" clause and it says "You may opt-out of the Arbitration Agreement, within 60 days from the date you accept this Agreement, by sending an email to [email protected] from the email associated with your order with "Arbitration Opt-Out" in the subject line and indicating your request to opt-out of the arbitration provision in the body of the email." I'm not sure which email they are referring to with the words "associated with your order"??

Nobody is manually tracking this, at least not on a regular basis. Emailing that email gets you an autoreply (which will go to your spam if your inbox is anything like mine, so check it) acknowledging your opt out. That's it.

Re: the email associated with your order it'll be the one you log into the lucidmotors.com account with to place / review the order.

 

[Paladin732]

I opted out also. There is no reason not to.

Note: binding arbitration can and has horribly bitten companies in the past. It is a very expensive process for the company, just cheaper then a lawsuit.

The trick is that it is way easier to do than a lawsuit, so there have been companies where folks did coordinated “binding arbitration attacks”.

(This is rare though)

 

[Steveinarizona]

Opt out if you can. I had multiple battery issues with my prior BMW and I ended up walking into the dealership with two letters: one to the GM and one to BMWNA that I was invoking the lemon law. The service manager told me he agreed with me and asked me to give him an hour to try to convince BMW. An hour later he called me and said that BMW would buy back the car (incidentally, once the company agreed the process was splendid. I bought another BMW and it has been rock solid)).

The threat of the lawsuit was the final issue that got me the result I wanted. But note that I am retired and was a litigator so my experience may not be a good paradigm for others.