Lucid Financing Quote Question

[hydbob]

Only the wisdom of those in government could rationalize the credit only for leases and not purchases.

It makes perfect sense. Just follow the money.

 

[fyellin]

So I realized that the BofA leasing quote program was just some Javascript, so I of course figured out how to download and examine it. Turns out the the residual value is $0. Always. Doesn't depend on how many miles your drive or how long your lease is. $0. It also ignores taxes, fees, etc.

So obviously this better not be the values they use when doing an actual lease.

There is also a table that converts credit rating and length of lease into "rate". But this rate is not an interest rate. For example, for A+ credit and a 4-year lease, it is .00321. I'm trying to figure out the connection between this and interest rates.

 

[bobofat]

So I realized that the BofA leasing quote program was just some Javascript, so I of course figured out how to download and examine it. Turns out the the residual value is $0. Always. Doesn't depend on how many miles your drive or how long your lease is. $0. It also ignores taxes, fees, etc.

So obviously this better not be the values they use when doing an actual lease.

There is also a table that converts credit rating and length of lease into "rate". But this rate is not an interest rate. For example, for A+ credit and a 4-year lease, it is .00321. I'm trying to figure out the connection between this and interest rates.

Leases use something called a money factor. To calculate it to like APR, you multiply the MF by 2400.
Residuals will not be 0. Higher end cars tend to depreciate quite a bit in the first 3 years but not to 0. Common values after 3 years for residuals are 50-60 percent. Other vehicles hold their value much better. Is this your first time leasing?

 

[fyellin]

Leases use something called a money factor. To calculate it to like APR, you multiply the MF by 2400.
Residuals will not be 0. Higher end cars tend to depreciate quite a bit in the first 3 years but not to 0. Common values after 3 years for residuals are 50-60 percent. Other vehicles hold their value much better. Is this your first time leasing?

My question isn't about leases. I've leased before.

I'm in the processing of ordering and financing my car. My issue is that the calculator that comes up when you go to Dashboard -> Apply For Financing shows an excessively large monthly payment. Mine was about 25% larger than the amount shown on the "Lucid Payment Calculator" when I entered identical values. I do not know why this monthly payment lease calculator uses a residual of $0, but it is clear from the code that it does. I've even added breakpoints to the code to watch it at work and verified the $0 amount.

In some sense I'm sort of relieved. It means that the Lucid Payment Calculator is more likely to be closer to the truth than the one generated by the bank.

 

[Impatient7536]

My question isn't about leases. I've leased before.

I'm in the processing of ordering and financing my car. My issue is that the calculator that comes up when you go to Dashboard -> Apply For Financing shows an excessively large monthly payment. Mine was about 25% larger than the amount shown on the "Lucid Payment Calculator" when I entered identical values. I do not know why this monthly payment lease calculator uses a residual of $0, but it is clear from the code that it does. I've even added breakpoints to the code to watch it at work and verified the $0 amount.

In some sense I'm sort of relieved. It means that the Lucid Payment Calculator is more likely to be closer to the truth than the one generated by the bank.

please keep us posted on what the final number is. im reading that the calculators at different parts of the ordering process are giving very different numbers.

 

[BerkeleyLeaser]

I just leased for 2 years and the residual value is $65K.

The DDs were: 24 months @ 12k miles pa/$1567 pcm with $10K down/adj cap cost=$86,045/residual=$64,898.

If the residual had been zero, the payment would have been ~$3500, even before considering time value of money (or sales/use tax).

 

[AirHead]

I just leased for 2 years and the residual value is $65K.

The DDs were: 24 months @ 12k miles pa/$1567 pcm with $10K down/adj cap cost=$86,045/residual=$64,898.

If the residual had been zero, the payment would have been ~$3500, even before considering time value of money (or sales/use tax).

Are you willing to post the early termination terms? I want to see if they do remaining months - Unearned Rent charges (Like most OEMs) + residual.

Last I checked they were charging the unearned rent charges still.

 

[BerkeleyLeaser]

Sure, here you go... (Spoiler alert - it's unchanged since you last checked)

<<
B. EARLY TERMINATION.
In the event you terminate this Lease prior to the end of the Lease Term, the Standard Early Termination Liability will apply unless
you choose the Voluntary Early Termination Liability.
STANDARD EARLY TERMINATION LIABILITY is calculated as follows:
1. The Turn-In Fee;
2. Plus any past due Monthly Payments and any other amount due under this Lease;
3. Plus any official fees and taxes related to early termination;
4. Plus all costs of repossession, storage, recovery, and preparation for sale, including attorneys’ fees to the extent permissible
under applicable law;
5. Plus the greater of zero or the Adjusted Lease Balance minus the Realized Value.
VOLUNTARY EARLY TERMINATION LIABILITY is calculated as follows:
1. The Turn-In Fee;
2. Plus any past due Monthly Payments and any other amount due under this Lease;
3. Plus any official fees and taxes related to early termination;
4. Plus the Base Monthly Payment times the number of Monthly Payments not yet due;
5. Plus Excess Wear and excess mileage charges.
Total Loss/GAP Waiver. You agree to notify the Lessor and your insurer immediately in the event the Vehicle is lost, stolen, or
damaged beyond repair and you agree to coordinate with your insurer and take all steps necessary to ensure payment to Lessor by the
insurer on the claim. You agree to cooperate fully and to refrain from accepting a cash settlement without our consent. If you have
complied with all provisions of this Lease and the Vehicle is declared a Total Loss by the insurer, you will have no further liability
once we have received (1) all amounts due under the Lease as of the date of Total Loss, (2) an amount equal to the deductible and
any other subtractions from the actual cash value made by the insurer, and (3) the insurance proceeds from the policy required under
the Lease. If the Vehicle is a Total Loss and the requirements of this Section are not satisfied, you will owe the Standard Early
Termination Liability less the Turn-in Fee. During the period between the report of expected Total Loss and the final settlement of
your account, you will be required to continue to make Monthly Payments but you will be credited for all payments made after the
date of Total Loss.
>>

 

[AirHead]

Sure, here you go... (Spoiler alert - it's unchanged since you last checked)

<<
B. EARLY TERMINATION.
In the event you terminate this Lease prior to the end of the Lease Term, the Standard Early Termination Liability will apply unless
you choose the Voluntary Early Termination Liability.
STANDARD EARLY TERMINATION LIABILITY is calculated as follows:
1. The Turn-In Fee;
2. Plus any past due Monthly Payments and any other amount due under this Lease;
3. Plus any official fees and taxes related to early termination;
4. Plus all costs of repossession, storage, recovery, and preparation for sale, including attorneys’ fees to the extent permissible
under applicable law;
5. Plus the greater of zero or the Adjusted Lease Balance minus the Realized Value.
VOLUNTARY EARLY TERMINATION LIABILITY is calculated as follows:
1. The Turn-In Fee;
2. Plus any past due Monthly Payments and any other amount due under this Lease;
3. Plus any official fees and taxes related to early termination;
4. Plus the Base Monthly Payment times the number of Monthly Payments not yet due;
5. Plus Excess Wear and excess mileage charges.
Total Loss/GAP Waiver. You agree to notify the Lessor and your insurer immediately in the event the Vehicle is lost, stolen, or
damaged beyond repair and you agree to coordinate with your insurer and take all steps necessary to ensure payment to Lessor by the
insurer on the claim. You agree to cooperate fully and to refrain from accepting a cash settlement without our consent. If you have
complied with all provisions of this Lease and the Vehicle is declared a Total Loss by the insurer, you will have no further liability
once we have received (1) all amounts due under the Lease as of the date of Total Loss, (2) an amount equal to the deductible and
any other subtractions from the actual cash value made by the insurer, and (3) the insurance proceeds from the policy required under
the Lease. If the Vehicle is a Total Loss and the requirements of this Section are not satisfied, you will owe the Standard Early
Termination Liability less the Turn-in Fee. During the period between the report of expected Total Loss and the final settlement of
your account, you will be required to continue to make Monthly Payments but you will be credited for all payments made after the
date of Total Loss.
>>

Thank you. I hope they change it. I want to lease the car, but also don't want to be stuck with it or super under if I decide to get rid of it early.

 

[JoshG]

I just leased for 2 years and the residual value is $65K.

The DDs were: 24 months @ 12k miles pa/$1567 pcm with $10K down/adj cap cost=$86,045/residual=$64,898.

If the residual had been zero, the payment would have been ~$3500, even before considering time value of money (or sales/use tax).

So can you finish the math for us and tell what MF or interest rate you got? Thanks!

 

[BerkeleyLeaser]

So can you finish the math for us and tell what MF or interest rate you got? Thanks!

Hi Josh, I'm not a leasing expert, but I backed out the monthly rate of interest on the lease as 8.3%* for the 24 month and 7.5%* for the 36/48 month. I did the calc by plugging in different down payments on the lease and calculating (using Excel goal seek) what interest rate gives the same present value. (*Note: Not an APR, but an annual rate by compounding the monthly rate of interest. Also ~1 month out of date, since I took delivery on 4/21/2023. In other words, my analysis is worth every penny you paid for it! ).

 

[gimim]

Im not trying to compare the idea of financing vs leasing. There are pros and cons to both.



My confusion is the pricing. For example, if I lease for 36 months in Washington, their calculator gives me $2,641.31/mo. I did $0 down for arguments sake.

That's $95,076 for a 3 year lease. Is Lucid telling us the residual after 3 years is around $45,000 through finance calculator? Even with a high lease factor (interest rate), that's almost 70% depreciation in 3 years vs a $154,000 MSRP, or ~65% vs a $139,000 MSRP.

Huh?

I made a leasing calculator - plug in the numbers and get the lease payment. Who can help me test it out!?

 

[momo3605]

I made a leasing calculator - plug in the numbers and get the lease payment. Who can help me test it out!?

CALCULATOR | LEASEHACKR

Leasehackr Calculator is the most powerful consumer research tool for car leases and car financing. It integrates lease, finance, and cash purchase programs for virtually all car models in the US and Canada.

leasehackr.com

This works as well. For 18 month lease, use 72% residual and MF of 0.0002 and it matches pretty close to Lucid’s calculator