Lucid Air charging rate on 350 KW fast charger

[Kfederico]

Keep in mind that the newer EA stations share the transformers across the chargers like Tesla does. I'm not saying this is what is happening to you, but it can limit your speeds.

Understood and agreed. Most of my sessions, I was the only one at any of the charge stations.

 

[larry]

While you are doing better than I am, falling off fast from 300 is a sign of a problem. Your remaining charge sessions are very sub-standard.

Interesting. Could you explain how we know that falling off fast from 300 is a sign of a problem or that my remaining charge sessions are very sub-standard?

 

[Kfederico]

Interesting. Could you explain how we know that falling off fast from 300 is a sign of a problem or that my remaining charge sessions are very sub-standard?

Mine charges typically at 160 to 180, but on two occasions it started at 220, but fell off within seconds. Even Lucid does not think that is good and is finally paying attention. Your 300 figure should persist for more than seconds. The fact that it hit that would tend to indicate the charger was capable, but your car stopped accepting the charge. Really, just open a ticket to discuss this with Lucid.
I am not there and not Lucid support. If you choose to ignore the symptoms, that also is your choice.

 

[Bill55]

Interesting. Could you explain how we know that falling off fast from 300 is a sign of a problem or that my remaining charge sessions are very sub-standard?

This curve is expected. Even under optimal conditions car will only charge at 300 kW for a short period.

 

[Slam08]

Looks like most of the 300 kW charging is from 0-20 percent, when most people don’t normally charge. So the peak isn’t really to be expected on normal charges

 

[Bunnylebowski]

Looks like most of the 300 kW charging is from 0-20 percent, when most people don’t normally charge. So the peak isn’t really to be expected on normal charges

Yep. I hit 301kw at 16% SOC with pre-conditioned battery. Haven’t got remotely close to that since.

 

[Bill55]

EA the 150s are really 175. So many 360s don’t work or don’t go much above 200 that I am fine just plugging into a 150. Going from 30-40 to 80 it’s about the same.

 

[Bus Driver]

This curve is expected. Even under optimal conditions car will only charge at 300 kW for a short period.
View attachment 6511

So, just as with with many things EV, it’s a bragging right, and not much more than that in real world applications. You know, “rated range versus what you actually get when driving normally; high charge speed for sure but it’s only available at the very low end of battery capacity, and only for a very limited time.

I’ve gotten accustomed to the the hype versus reality dichotomy that is the world of EV ownership.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

EA the 150s are really 175. So many 360s don’t work or don’t go much above 200 that I am fine just plugging into a 150. Going from 30-40 to 80 it’s about the same.

Yeah the 150s do 172kw and hold it better, I’m convinced if you were to do a real world 20-80% charge on a 350 vs 150, the 150 would be faster.

 

[DJL]

Yeah the 150s do 172kw and hold it better, I’m convinced if you were to do a real world 20-80% charge on a 350 vs 150, the 150 would be faster.

I have never gotten more than 158 kW from the EA 350kW stations up here in Bellingham, even at a starting charge level of 40% and batteries preconditioned. I am looking forward to see what I get from the 11 to 12 EA stations I plan on stopping at during our trip to Denver this week. Fingers crossed...

 

[HC_79]

I have never gotten more than 158 kW from the EA 350kW stations up here in Bellingham, even at a starting charge level of 40% and batteries preconditioned. I am looking forward to see what I get from the 11 to 12 EA stations I plan on stopping at during our trip to Denver this week. Fingers crossed...

Because you’re plugging in with a too high SoC to take advantage of the higher speeds. You should be getting more than 158Kw but won’t see the real value of a 350Kw charger unless plugging in 20% or lower.

Don’t be afraid to run the car down people! The lower the SoC the faster your charging speed will be. You have the range, push the car to its limits

 

[Kfederico]

I have never gotten more than 158 kW from the EA 350kW stations up here in Bellingham, even at a starting charge level of 40% and batteries preconditioned. I am looking forward to see what I get from the 11 to 12 EA stations I plan on stopping at during our trip to Denver this week. Fingers crossed...

At 40%, your charge rate should still be above 200. Lucid is now tracking an issue on this. Open a ticket. As to EA not having the stated charge capacity, A time where I was charging a 165 (should have been above 200) and in the 35% range, I had a Rivian follow me on the same charger, and he was able to get 200 KW/Hr, which is about what they are rated. Lucid likes to blame the chargers, but the low charge rate is on certain Lucids and across many different chargers.

 

[Slam08]

My understanding of charging is that is dependent on many factors other than state of charge and the charger kW.

I don’t understand why charging at 160 instead of >200 is a big deal. How much time does that add to the charge? Is it a lot?

 

[Kfederico]

My understanding of charging is that is dependent on many factors other than state of charge and the charger kW.

I don’t understand why charging at 160 instead of >200 is a big deal. How much time does that add to the charge? Is it a lot?

Wow? I am surprised that you think that. We are talking time here. I assume you consider your time valuable. In my case, getting 60% of the published charge rate means an additional 66% of my time sitting and waiting to charge while on long trips. At that point, the car becomes less desirable for long distance travel, adding a full hour to a trip with multiple charge stops. If you Bought a pound of steak, but it only measured .6 pounds, would you say the same thing. It is a big deal for many of us that we bought something that is not measuring up to what we bought.

Another issue is that there is something broken in the car. impacting reliability. So far, they have found poorly connected cables in my car. At one point, the car completely bricked and had to be towed to the service center. I do not want other issues, such as early battery failure on charging component failures, based on me not trying to force Lucid to correct early performance problems. When something is not matching specifications, it very well may be a significant problem at a later point.

 

[Bill55]

Going from 20% to 80%.
From ~46%-80% there will be no difference between a 350kW and a 175kW.
Going from 20-45% the 350kW optimally takes about 9 minutes and a 175kW would take ~ 12 minutes.
At 20% charge the max the Air can pull is ~273 and it goes down from there. At ~46% your at 175kW.

31 minutes vs 34 minutes. At this point in time

A Rivian there would be no difference for a 20-80% charge. 37 minutes on a 350kW or a 175kW. At 20% of charge Rivian can only pull 160kW.

 

[Kfederico]

Going from 20% to 80%.
From ~46%-80% there will be no difference between a 350kW and a 175kW.
Going from 20-45% the 350kW optimally takes about 9 minutes and a 175kW would take ~ 12 minutes.
At 20% charge the max the Air can pull is ~273 and it goes down from there. At ~46% your at 175kW.

31 minutes vs 34 minutes. At this point in time

A Rivian there would be no difference for a 20-80% charge. 37 minutes on a 350kW or a 175kW. At 20% of charge Rivian can only pull 160kW.. I agree that teh 150 KW charger is just as goo

Not sure where you got your numbers. Perhaps you can show your math. Agreed that if just topping off from as 55% is as good on a 150KW charger. What you are not taking into account is that my charge rate is low across the board and the whole 300 miles in 20 minutes is a myth for me. There are some I have talked to whose cars charge properly.

 

[Slam08]

Wow? I am surprised that you think that. We are talking time here. I assume you consider your time valuable. In my case, getting 60% of the published charge rate means an additional 66% of my time sitting and waiting to charge while on long trips. At that point, the car becomes less desirable for long distance travel, adding a full hour to a trip with multiple charge stops. If you Bought a pound of steak, but it only measured .6 pounds, would you say the same thing. It is a big deal for many of us that we bought something that is not measuring up to what we bought.

Another issue is that there is something broken in the car. impacting reliability. So far, they have found poorly connected cables in my car. At one point, the car completely bricked and had to be towed to the service center. I do not want other issues, such as early battery failure on charging component failures, based on me not trying to force Lucid to correct early performance problems. When something is not matching specifications, it very well may be a significant problem at a later point.

I’m sorry. But your response makes you looks uninformed

We are talking a difference of 3 min because it charges 40 kW less from 20-40%

 

[Bill55]

Not sure where you got your numbers. Perhaps you can show your math. Agreed that if just topping off from as 55% is as good on a 150KW charger. What you are not taking into account is that my charge rate is low across the board and the whole 300 miles in 20 minutes is a myth for me. There are some I have talked to whose cars charge properly.

InsideEVs.com did the testing and they have the graphs on their site.

 

[TCGT]

Here’s a good description:

Lucid Air Dream Edition Fast Charging Comparison: 350 kW vs 150 kW

We charge a 2022 Lucid Air Dream Edition from zero to 100% on both a 150 kW and a 350 kW DC fast charger and analyze the differences.

insideevs.com

 

[Bill55]

Not sure where you got your numbers. Perhaps you can show your math. Agreed that if just topping off from as 55% is as good on a 150KW charger. What you are not taking into account is that my charge rate is low across the board and the whole 300 miles in 20 minutes is a myth for me. There are some I have talked to whose cars charge properly.

I find talking charging in miles reduces clarity even further as some people are getting 3.7miles per kWh and others like myself are averaging 2.96.
Optimally, from 10% state of charge you could go to 60% in 19 minutes. That would be 59kWhs in an Air DE. For me that would be ~175 miles for someone getting 3.7 miles it would be ~218 miles. 300 miles in 20 minutes would require over 5 miles kWh, so I will agree you are not going to get 300 miles of range in 20 minutes.

Some real work examples from my road trips
74 kWh in 43 minutes
56 kWh in 30 minutes
41 kWh in 25 minutes
52 kWh in 28 minutes