Gravity Orders Discussion

[borski]

Here, read about some cool new single photon lidar innovations: https://phys.org/news/2025-02-photon-lidar-3d-images-distances.amp

Fun stuff!

 

[EVCar]

Here, read about some cool new single photon lidar innovations: https://phys.org/news/2025-02-photon-lidar-3d-images-distances.amp

Fun stuff!

Amazing.
I hope this will trickle down to other disciplines. I certainly can envision its application in my field.
Thanks for posting.
On another note, do we know when the Airs will have access to Tesla Superchargers? Any speculation/explanation on why Gravity and Air seem to be on separate tracks here?

 

[HC_79]

On another note, do we know when the Airs will have access to Tesla Superchargers?

More info and access is coming Q2 for Air apparently.

 

[borski]

Amazing.
I hope this will trickle down to other disciplines. I certainly can envision its application in my field.
Thanks for posting.
On another note, do we know when the Airs will have access to Tesla Superchargers? Any speculation/explanation on why Gravity and Air seem to be on separate tracks here?

from https://lucidmotors.com/media-room/lucid-gravity-450-miles-epa-range-superchargers:

“Furthermore, in addition to the Lucid Gravity, access to the Tesla Supercharger network for Lucid Air is planned for Q2 2025, with more information to follow.”

I have no knowledge other than what’s public. But my guess would be that it probably takes time for Tesla and Lucid to integrate, and the setup between a Gravity and an Air are different. I don’t know how, and that’s just a guess.

 

[BS8899]

Again: for what purpose? To satisfy your curiosity? I mean, I’m fine with that, since I’m curious too… but it doesn’t actually serve a purpose to any consumer.

You seem to care very much about understanding why and how LiDAR is used. The general consumer does not; they only care that DDP works well. The end.

I’m also curious. And would love a tech talk on it.

But it serves Lucid little relatively purpose in selling the car; I have no doubt most people who buy it don’t know what lidar is, where to find it, or anything other than “it uses lasers,” if they even know that at all. That isn’t because consumers are dumb, but because the implementation detail isn’t the point.

When you buy an iPhone that is touch sensitive, most people don’t care about how it keeps fingerprints away using an oleophobic coating and how the glass doesn’t bend, or why there are multiple layers so you don’t destroy the capacitative surface, etc. They only care that the phone works, and works well.

It’s not like Lucid makes the lidar a central point of their marketing. It’s just a sensor in a suite of sensors. The *ADAS* features are the point.

I am always curious about claims vs reality.

I agree with you that ultimately, demonstrated functionality is what matters. In this context, the safety, features, and robustness of ADAS is the key, no matter how it is achieved.

Recent updates has improved Lucid's DA features. That's good. But don't kid yourself, Lucid's offering ais about what other manufacturers (e.g., my Lexus) offered 8 years ago!.

 

[borski]

Recent updates has improved Lucid's DA features. That's good. But don't kid yourself, Lucid's offering ais about what other manufacturers (e.g., my Lexus) offered 8 years ago!.

I understand that is your experience. Respectfully, that has not been mine. My Air’s ADAS whips my wife’s Hyundai, and is miles better than the Tesla FSD I’ve had the “pleasure” of using. I’m okay disagreeing on this, and I also agree that there are better ADAS solutions at the moment; notably Mercedes.

But don’t kid yourself, your experience does not define everyone else’s.

 

[Blue Lectroid]

Yes you bought up the point. I was about to book Porsche and then decided to wait for lucid gravity. This was just before lucid presented gravity.
Now you mentioned something about gravity promises, we’ll start deliveries by end of 2024 and then we see them only being delivered to family and employees. Totally fine. You deliver it to your people to fine tune things. Totally acceptable. But then you just take paying customers for granted without regular updates as to what’s happening and just assume people are id**s and will just bear with your cabal and inefficiency in delivering your promises. Thats beyond.
This maybe odd coming from a person who owns two lucid airs. I know many people who approached lucid too buy their own after seeing mine. Lucid is awesome and I love it but I’m done. I feel cheated and taken for granted.

It’s really sad that you feel this way. I, like @borski, have processed exactly the same data as you completely differently. I have read the same press releases, seen the same ads, watched all of the available reviews and I have not seen Lucid miss deadlines yet with Gravity.

I understand that you want more direct, proactive communication from Lucid and it is absolutely your right to vote with your feet and pocketbook. Of course, you’ll be trading down from a best in class product to whatever else you end up buying, but that calculus is entirely yours. Now that you are done with Lucid, I assume you’ll be on here less and so I want to wish you all the best.

 

[Blue Lectroid]

Lucid's offering ais about what other manufacturers (e.g., my Lexus) offered 8 years ago!.

But cars, like people, are not one dimensional. Think of all the things your Lucid does that BLOW AWAY the capabilities of your 8 year-old Lexus!

Lucid is WAY ahead of the competition in so many areas and, yes, behind in others. I don’t trash my friends who happen to have trouble in one area of their functioning when they are, overall, exceptional human beings.

Lucid is an incredibly well put together company producing fantastic, ground breaking products. They are not perfect. Can we all stop assuming that every flaw we find in something is earth shattering news that the world must immediately know about.

Straight up, if you drive a Lucid, you are one of the very lucky few. We are, by definition, privileged. I’d rather spend time counting my lucky stars for the things I have — and the things my Lucid does that I love — rather than dwelling on the things in my life (or my car) that are not perfection or best in class.

In closing, everyone gets to do their own math. If the sum of the features in your Lucid doesn’t add up for you? Sell it and move on. In the meantime? Enjoy the ride, you’re darn lucky to have it.

 

[DeaneG]

...Similarly, I've driven my Lucid Air and my Rivian R1S on the same routes. Lucid had gotten better, but nothing above and beyond the other vehicles, and it took more time to get to the same performance.

I'd be interested in how well Lucid's system performs against stationary objects compared to the others during the daytime, and separately against stationary dark objects at night, like a disabled vehicle or sofa in the middle of a dark country road.

 

[DeaneG]

...Any speculation/explanation on why Gravity and Air seem to be on separate tracks here?

Complete speculation:
1) Starting with Gravity allows a soft start to NACS usage, and time to debug things if necessary
2) NACS to CCS adapters for the Air need to be qualified, sourced, and stocked

 

[BS8899]

I'd be interested in how well Lucid's system performs against stationary objects compared to the others during the daytime, and separately against stationary dark objects at night, like a disabled vehicle or sofa in the middle of a dark country road.

Driving in the dark, on a country road, with your headlights off, and relying on the LIDAR to scan and pick up the obstruction with its IR?

 

[DeaneG]

Driving in the dark, on a country road, with your headlights off, and relying on the LIDAR to scan and pick up the obstruction with its IR?

Lidar has much greater range than headlights, and can work better in fog. It could make the difference between hitting that deer or stopping.

Myths about LiDAR Sensor

LiDAR technology has been a revelation for many sensor-based applications. But there also have been many myths about LiDAR! We have rounded up and debunked the most common misconceptions in this blogpost

www.blickfeld.com

 

[BS8899]

Lidar has much greater range than headlights, and can work better in fog. It could make the difference between hitting that deer or stopping.

Myths about LiDAR Sensor

LiDAR technology has been a revelation for many sensor-based applications. But there also have been many myths about LiDAR! We have rounded up and debunked the most common misconceptions in this blogpost

www.blickfeld.com

While IR on the LIDAR (as a beam) is less prone (not immune) to visible light scattering and can potentially "see" better, but forgive my ignorance:

> isn't the LIDAR sensors on the Lucid a scanning beam as opposed to a camera?
> does Lucid's LIDAR actually produce a 2D image on its own or simply ranging?
> in order to detect/discern an object just with the LIDAR beam, doesn't it require post-processing of the signal?
>Is the Lucid's computer equipped to do this kind of image processing in "real-time" (i.e., with acceptable lag) for collision avoidance?
> or, is Lucid using LIDAR mostly for ranging (as opposed to image rendering, which requires a lot more post-processing power)?

Be good if some knowledgeable owners or Lucid Engineering educate us on this subject.

 

[BS8899]

While IR on the LIDAR (as a beam) is less prone (not immune) to visible light scattering and can potentially "see" better, but forgive my ignorance:

> isn't the LIDAR sensors on the Lucid a scanning beam as opposed to a camera?
> does Lucid's LIDAR actually produce a 2D image on its own or simply ranging?
> in order to detect/discern an object just with the LIDAR beam, doesn't it require post-processing of the signal?
>Is the Lucid's computer equipped to do this kind of image processing in "real-time" (i.e., with acceptable lag) for collision avoidance?
> or, is Lucid using LIDAR mostly for ranging (as opposed to image rendering, which requires a lot more post-processing power)?

Be good if some knowledgeable owners or Lucid Engineering educate us on this subject.

Just to be clear,
> we are NOT talking about autonomous vehicles such as Waymo. Those vehicles are clearly using 360 degree scanning LIDAR and imaging to make them aware of their surroundings.
> the question herein is about EVs with a front-facing LIDAR array and its capabilities. Presumably, LIDAR in these application are for "front-looking" DA/collision avoidance.

 

[EVCar]

Complete speculation:
1) Starting with Gravity allows a soft start to NACS usage, and time to debug things if necessary
2) NACS to CCS adapters for the Air need to be qualified, sourced, and stocked

It's a very gentle start with 9 Gravities (or 9+50 now)
No idea on what hoops MB had to jump through with Tesla, but as of last week, all MB EVs now can use Tesla SC.
Hope the "announced/promised" Q2 access will be true as range anxiety is still a discussion in my household.
For long trips, I'd rather drive Lucid with the spacious frunk, as opposed to the frunkless MB.
MB was said to use Lectron adapters and just slaps on their logo.
Within a short time after the release, the price went up from $180 to $250, so I just bought directly from Lectron and even got a 5% welcome discount.
I assume I can use it for Lucid, too.

 

[DeaneG]

...I assume I can use it for Lucid, too.

I'd think so. FWIW, Ford required one adapter vendor to redesign their product before they'd use it. I forgot if that was A2Z or Lectron. Tom Moloughney's video explains it.

 

[EVCar]

I'd think so. FWIW, Ford required one adapter vendor to redesign their product before they'd use it. I forgot if that was A2Z or Lectron. Tom Moloughney's video explains it.

Surely hope I don't have to buy a 3rd one, in addition to the Lectron and Tesla destination adapters.

 

[DeaneG]

Surely hope I don't have to buy a 3rd one, in addition to the Lectron and Tesla destination adapters.

The CCS<->NACS adapters are all dumb and don't know or care which car they are used with. The main thing is to get an adapter that's rated for 1000V and 500A, has a proper locking mechanism, and correct placement of thermal switches (again, see Tom Moloughney's video). Hyundai/Kia's adapter isn't rated for 500A. Don't know about the other OEMs. Personally, I'd wait for Lucid's.

 

[EVCar]

The CCS<->NACS adapters are all dumb and don't know or care which car they are used with. The main thing is to get an adapter that's rated for 1000V and 500A, has a proper locking mechanism, and correct placement of thermal switches (again, see Tom Moloughney's video). Hyundai/Kia's adapter isn't rated for 500A. Don't know about the other OEMs. Personally, I'd wait for Lucid's.

The Lectron Tesla Supercharger (NACS) to CCS Adapter | Vortex Plug | is rated for 500A | 1000V.
I would have waited for Lucid but their timeline on other things has been elastic. Plus we might drive the EQS for the next trip.
Would be interesting to find out the actual manufacturing cost for these dumb adapters , and the home chargers, too.

 

[BS8899]

The Lectron Tesla Supercharger (NACS) to CCS Adapter | Vortex Plug | is rated for 500A | 1000V.
I would have waited for Lucid but their timeline on other things has been elastic. Plus we might drive the EQS for the next trip.
Would be interesting to find out the actual manufacturing cost for these dumb adapters , and the home chargers, too.

maybe I am missing something...

> is Lucid going to provide a Lucid adaptor for free or for purchase?
> I have a Rivian adapter that's rated to 1000V. Rivian sent it out to all is owners for free. I haven't used it on either my Rivian or my Lucid.