Thanks. I'll add.
Exclusive First Look | 2021 Lucid Air Dream Edition
- Thread starter LUCID
- Start date
I just sent the list of questions to my sales rep (Liddy Peters), telling her it was a consolidated list that her colleagues might also see coming in from their clients. I'll let you know what I hear back.
Here it is if you want the final version:
Hi, Liddy. The three most frequent posters on the Lucid forum (myself included) have put together a consolidated list of questions that weren’t covered in the reveal last evening or on the new website. We’re each going to send them to our sales associates, so maybe you can all pow-wow at your end to give us a consolidated set of answers? Some of the questions relate to things that were teased in earlier presentations from Lucid going back as far as 2017 (such as active noise cancellation and acoustic glass) but that weren’t taken up in yesterday’s information.
NVH (Noise, Vibration, Harshness)
- Is there active noise cancellation (through the audio system)?
- Is acoustic glass used? If so, where?
- What are “semi-active dampers”?
Glass Canopy & Windows
- All glass blocks UV-B radiation. How much UV-A radiation is blocked by the canopy?
- Same question for windshield and side windows.
- What is the IR (infrared radiation) rejection of the canopy?
- What is the visible light transmission percentage of the canopy?
- What is the TSER (Total Solar Energy Rejection) rating of the canopy?
Regenerative Braking
- Will the car have one-pedal driving (like Tesla), or will the brake pedal have to be depressed to activate regenerative braking (like the Taycan)?
Home Charging
- If you don’t want to install the Lucid V2G charging rig, what type of home outlet is needed to plug in the car (FEMA 14-50 or something else)?
- Voltage (240)?
- Amperage?
Rear Seat Foot Room
- How is the rear floorboard configured?
- Does the battery pack in the Dream Edition allow for any foot well recesses?
- We need a definitive photo of the rear foot wells in the Dream, as the photo on the new website is suspect, in that it does not seem to comport with the graphic of the Dream Edition battery back that puts battery modules in the footwell space.
Warranty
- What are the drivetrain and battery warranties?
- What are the warranties on other elements of the car?
Dashboard & Convenience Features
- Will the lower screen display Google Maps or Google Earth images?
- What about USB ports and older media (CD player)?
- Does the rear seat have a fold-down center armrest? If so, what is in it (cupholders, USB ports, battery charging pads)?
Technical Data
- What is the gross vehicle weight?
- What are the differences in the HVAC with the Cold Weather package? I assume the Cold Weather heater is a heat pump instead of a resistance coil. What difference in range and vehicle weight does the heating choice make?
- What is the weight of the 21” forged wheels?
- What is the bolt pattern?
- What are the front and rear wheel offsets?
Here it is if you want the final version:
Hi, Liddy. The three most frequent posters on the Lucid forum (myself included) have put together a consolidated list of questions that weren’t covered in the reveal last evening or on the new website. We’re each going to send them to our sales associates, so maybe you can all pow-wow at your end to give us a consolidated set of answers? Some of the questions relate to things that were teased in earlier presentations from Lucid going back as far as 2017 (such as active noise cancellation and acoustic glass) but that weren’t taken up in yesterday’s information.
NVH (Noise, Vibration, Harshness)
- Is there active noise cancellation (through the audio system)?
- Is acoustic glass used? If so, where?
- What are “semi-active dampers”?
Glass Canopy & Windows
- All glass blocks UV-B radiation. How much UV-A radiation is blocked by the canopy?
- Same question for windshield and side windows.
- What is the IR (infrared radiation) rejection of the canopy?
- What is the visible light transmission percentage of the canopy?
- What is the TSER (Total Solar Energy Rejection) rating of the canopy?
Regenerative Braking
- Will the car have one-pedal driving (like Tesla), or will the brake pedal have to be depressed to activate regenerative braking (like the Taycan)?
Home Charging
- If you don’t want to install the Lucid V2G charging rig, what type of home outlet is needed to plug in the car (FEMA 14-50 or something else)?
- Voltage (240)?
- Amperage?
Rear Seat Foot Room
- How is the rear floorboard configured?
- Does the battery pack in the Dream Edition allow for any foot well recesses?
- We need a definitive photo of the rear foot wells in the Dream, as the photo on the new website is suspect, in that it does not seem to comport with the graphic of the Dream Edition battery back that puts battery modules in the footwell space.
Warranty
- What are the drivetrain and battery warranties?
- What are the warranties on other elements of the car?
Dashboard & Convenience Features
- Will the lower screen display Google Maps or Google Earth images?
- What about USB ports and older media (CD player)?
- Does the rear seat have a fold-down center armrest? If so, what is in it (cupholders, USB ports, battery charging pads)?
Technical Data
- What is the gross vehicle weight?
- What are the differences in the HVAC with the Cold Weather package? I assume the Cold Weather heater is a heat pump instead of a resistance coil. What difference in range and vehicle weight does the heating choice make?
- What is the weight of the 21” forged wheels?
- What is the bolt pattern?
- What are the front and rear wheel offsets?
Interesting tidbit. This article says the Lucid is currently using Sony Murata batteries. When Lucid announced its recent sourcing contract with LG Chem, it explicitly said it was for the "standard version" of the Air.
www.autoweek.com
Lucid Air Could Be the Next Must-Have Coolness For Silicon Valley Billionaires
First Lucid Air model available will be loaded, sticker for $161,500
www.autoweek.com
I've been doing some digging on how rear legroom is measured, and it's a quagmire.
One auto exec reported:
"There are two different SAE standards for measuring rear legroom, the L33 'Effective legroom' test, in which the front seat is placed at the appropriate distance for a driver in the 95 percentile of height, and the L34 'Maximum driver legroom' test, in which the front seat is placed all the way [back?] before measuring."
This does seem to suggest the distance measured is from the back of the front seat to the front of the back seat vertical cushion. However, one problem is that one 95th-percentile driver might prefer to be closer to for further from the steering wheel than another 95th-percentile driver . . . so it still seems somewhat subjective.
The other problem is that Lucid gives two different rear legroom figures depending on the battery pack. That wouldn't seem to change the distance from the front seat back to the rear seat back, but rather a measurement in which the vertical leg drop is a factor.
In summary . . . I have no freaking idea.
St Bernard
New Member
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2020
- Messages
- 16
What do people think about the Dash not being full Leather? They are using(it appears) Alcantara for the front 50% of the Dash with, I think, Leather for the back part of the Dash. I think it’s strange to have Alcantara on the dash.
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Interesting. So it seems, under either standard, the height / drop is not taken into consideration.
How were the Ghiardelli brownies last evening?
Overdone. I'm not much of a cook.
I just looked at the video more carefully that is posted at the head of this thread. At about the 14:10 mark you start to see clearly that the rear floorboard has no recess or foot garage. This guy says he is 6'0, and his knees are jacked way up. In fact, he comments on how uncomfortable it is, combined with the lack of space to push your foot even a bit under the front seat.
If Lucid thinks this makes the interior of this car a competitor with the spaciousness of the S Class or 7 Series, they're smoking crack. Why they couldn't at least have engineered a bit of an arch under the base of the front seat to make a little foot room is beyond me.
That, coupled with Lucid's putting a photograph of a recessed footwell on the configuration tab for the Dream Edition, smacks either of incompetence or deception, especially for a $169,000 car that many buyers will have to decide upon on the basis of the website.
The more I think about this, the angrier I'm getting. I'm at the point that I'm considering bailing on the car and just sticking with my Tesla until I see the Mercedes EQS.
If Lucid thinks this makes the interior of this car a competitor with the spaciousness of the S Class or 7 Series, they're smoking crack. Why they couldn't at least have engineered a bit of an arch under the base of the front seat to make a little foot room is beyond me.
That, coupled with Lucid's putting a photograph of a recessed footwell on the configuration tab for the Dream Edition, smacks either of incompetence or deception, especially for a $169,000 car that many buyers will have to decide upon on the basis of the website.
The more I think about this, the angrier I'm getting. I'm at the point that I'm considering bailing on the car and just sticking with my Tesla until I see the Mercedes EQS.
BlindPass
Member
Not really a new development, but from the YouTube channels, I really like the layout and design style of the front of the cabin. A similar feel of the future S Class and other new Mercedes layouts. We looked at a GLE recently and going back to the Model S seemed very 2012 (where does time go?). The Air was clean but not cheap or lacking. Now, the rear cabin...it’s lucky the Model S is so bad.
I think I’m going to need to wait until I can drive and sit in one.
Edit: the Model S, and it’s 2012 design is still better than most interior layouts, but Mercedes has nailed the aesthetics recently.
I think I’m going to need to wait until I can drive and sit in one.
Edit: the Model S, and it’s 2012 design is still better than most interior layouts, but Mercedes has nailed the aesthetics recently.
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Alcantara has been a design "thing" for a while now. My Tesla has alcantara panels on its leather dash. I'm not a big fan, but it's hard not to find it on premium cars these days.
I mentioned that very observation and comparison in my post last evening and, I actually added it to your / our list of questions prior to emailing to my Sales Reps. The anger you are feeling now I felt last evening. I actually discussed requesting a refund of our Lucid deposit with my wife and waiting for the EQS to be revealed. This morning I decided to wait and evaluate the responses we receive to our questions, together with deciding if we like and can live with any of the three exterior color options offered, before making a final decision. We have been putting off the color issue simply because if any of our other "deal breakers," e.g. the rear seat footwell / garage are in fact real issues then we don't need to deal with the color choice. The ball is in Lucid's court as they say.
BlindPass
Member
I’m conflicted on the Air. And it’s mostly due to value over the S.
One thing that is clear is that Lucid has spent a lot of time and money on the EV drive train, which manifests in range and performance.
On one hand, this focus did lead to an impressive 500 mile range and 9.9. And it bodes well that this is their base and they have the technical chops. To compete in upper market EV, you better get this part down before moving on. The Formula E DNA will serve them well.
Performance. 9.9 is noteworthy, but it didn’t really gain any 0-60. In fact, listed as slower than the S (but so too was the Taycan Turbo S). Now, if that’s a Porsche-like conservative 2.5, without any launch mode, and with added acceleration at freeway speeds, I see value.
One thing that is clear is that Lucid has spent a lot of time and money on the EV drive train, which manifests in range and performance.
On one hand, this focus did lead to an impressive 500 mile range and 9.9. And it bodes well that this is their base and they have the technical chops. To compete in upper market EV, you better get this part down before moving on. The Formula E DNA will serve them well.
Performance. 9.9 is noteworthy, but it didn’t really gain any 0-60. In fact, listed as slower than the S (but so too was the Taycan Turbo S). Now, if that’s a Porsche-like conservative 2.5, without any launch mode, and with added acceleration at freeway speeds, I see value.
I agree with all that.
However, one of the things I have most regretted with the Tesla -- which is a blast to drive -- is that when we take day trips with friends and family who visit from afar we have to switch to our Honda Odyssey because the Tesla back seat was just too uncomfortable for people in their 60's and older. Ingress and egress was difficult, and there was no room to move your legs around when they got cramped.
I'm just not sure I want to pay $169k for a car that serves no better than the Tesla for road trips. I have kept my Rivian reservation and am back to thinking about getting the R1S along with a Tesla Roadster when (if) it comes out next year. I'm also toying with a BMW M760 if I decide I really want to keep a sedan for hauling friends. The only problem with it is that, with its miserable gas mileage, you have to stop for gas every ~200 miles . . . but 60-70 year-old bladders may need to, anyway.
However, one of the things I have most regretted with the Tesla -- which is a blast to drive -- is that when we take day trips with friends and family who visit from afar we have to switch to our Honda Odyssey because the Tesla back seat was just too uncomfortable for people in their 60's and older. Ingress and egress was difficult, and there was no room to move your legs around when they got cramped.
I'm just not sure I want to pay $169k for a car that serves no better than the Tesla for road trips. I have kept my Rivian reservation and am back to thinking about getting the R1S along with a Tesla Roadster when (if) it comes out next year. I'm also toying with a BMW M760 if I decide I really want to keep a sedan for hauling friends. The only problem with it is that, with its miserable gas mileage, you have to stop for gas every ~200 miles . . . but 60-70 year-old bladders may need to, anyway.
BlindPass
Member
Well said.
Besides the performance value-added being unclear, the added range is nice, but not if at the expense of other qualities.
500 is better than 400 in isolation, but I bought an S when it was 200. Give me 400 if it gains me better trim, space, handling, etc. Heck, give me 300 miles and knock out the drive/ride quality, then start adding miles. But I seem to be an outlier in my weighting on range.
I know ardent Tesla fans and new-to-EV buyers mandate any new premium EV be equal or better than Tesla’s range, but that’s becoming a fool’s errand. Sure EA isn’t great now, but that will change quickly and a vast majority of charging in America is at home or work. Plus fast charging and battery degradation improvements will marginalize range advantages.
Just received a call from my Sales Rep. They are being inundated with calls concerning the inconsistencies, inaccuracies, and missing /omitted information on their new site and configurator. I shared with him our observations and frustrations which he freely acknowledged were real issues. Instead of taking reservations they are listening to the frustrations of prospective customers and most likely losing a number of them. They are hearing from others exactly the same issues we have raised.
They do not have responses to our questions, however, he promised to have them by next week or the week thereafter. We agreed to hold our scheduled conference call this coming Monday and he would provide whatever responses he could then. Sounds like none of the Sales Reps have any of the info and are having a very difficult time getting the info. Which leads me to wonder if there aren't other major issues going on that we are unaware of.
Given the absence of a Studio in Florida prior to December (hopefully), I specifically requested that I receive exterior paint chips / samples to help choose a color.
He also told me that the info he had previously provided on my potential delivery timeframe was not correct. He doesn't know why (although he brought up COVID as a possible explanation) but, deliveries will most likely not begin until Spring of 2021.
My impression is that they launched the Air without full knowledge of many of their final specs. And, they launched a new site and configurator that are woefully inadequate and lacking clarity.
They do not have responses to our questions, however, he promised to have them by next week or the week thereafter. We agreed to hold our scheduled conference call this coming Monday and he would provide whatever responses he could then. Sounds like none of the Sales Reps have any of the info and are having a very difficult time getting the info. Which leads me to wonder if there aren't other major issues going on that we are unaware of.
Given the absence of a Studio in Florida prior to December (hopefully), I specifically requested that I receive exterior paint chips / samples to help choose a color.
He also told me that the info he had previously provided on my potential delivery timeframe was not correct. He doesn't know why (although he brought up COVID as a possible explanation) but, deliveries will most likely not begin until Spring of 2021.
My impression is that they launched the Air without full knowledge of many of their final specs. And, they launched a new site and configurator that are woefully inadequate and lacking clarity.
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One journalist said he was told yesterday that the first Dream deliveries wouldn't be until Q2, so that squares.
First I had to adjust to the disappointment that there would be no electrochromic glass in south Florida. Now my worry about rear seat foot room is apparently bearing out. Then came those huge, hideous sun visors glued to the windshield. (I'm mystified why no journalists have commented on them.)
The list of things I would have to tolerate or on which I would have to compromise is getting very long for a $169k car.
Given this chaos in September, I can't imagine what was on their minds in planning to launch the car at the April New York Auto Show.
One of the journalists today said the car revealed last night was a beta car that was about 95% production-representative. In one close-up I thought I could faintly make out a canopy dimming button over the rearview mirror. With another 3-month delay in rolling out the first production cars, maybe a couple of the shortcomings can still be addressed. I hold little hope, though, for the floorboard issue.
First I had to adjust to the disappointment that there would be no electrochromic glass in south Florida. Now my worry about rear seat foot room is apparently bearing out. Then came those huge, hideous sun visors glued to the windshield. (I'm mystified why no journalists have commented on them.)
The list of things I would have to tolerate or on which I would have to compromise is getting very long for a $169k car.
Given this chaos in September, I can't imagine what was on their minds in planning to launch the car at the April New York Auto Show.
One of the journalists today said the car revealed last night was a beta car that was about 95% production-representative. In one close-up I thought I could faintly make out a canopy dimming button over the rearview mirror. With another 3-month delay in rolling out the first production cars, maybe a couple of the shortcomings can still be addressed. I hold little hope, though, for the floorboard issue.