Cruise Control Issue

[LucidvsTeslaS]

Correct, unlike almost every other car with ACC that can handle stopped traffic!

I wonder if the 9000 ( old price) I paid for the "upcoming" advanced drivers' assistance package, something similar to FSD, will ever become a reality in a car with Lidar and multiple cameras, which is not able to detect stationary vehicles. Or did I lose 9000? I did ask many times before committing to purchase the Lucid, and each time the answer mentioned government regulations and was rather vague. At that point, I stated that Tesla must be subject to the same regulations. Nevertheless, it changes lanes, has FSD, or "navigate on autopilot" (requiring human assistance if needed), etc. Does Lucid use AI and neural networks to improve the DreamDrive PRO, any opinions? Do they crunch a lot of data? I remember Tesla was "hesitant" a few years ago while changing lanes, but it does it without a glitch these days, most of the time. I am still having some phantom-breaking issues sometimes, rarely, though.

 

[hydbob]

I wonder if the 9000 ( old price) I paid for the "upcoming" advanced drivers' assistance package, something similar to FSD, will ever become a reality in a car with Lidar and multiple cameras, which is not able to detect stationary vehicles. Or did I lose 9000? I did ask many times before committing to purchase the Lucid, and each time the answer mentioned government regulations and was rather vague. At that point, I stated that Tesla must be subject to the same regulations. Nevertheless, it changes lanes, has FSD, or "navigate on autopilot" (requiring human assistance if needed), etc. Does Lucid use AI and neural networks to improve the DreamDrive PRO, any opinions? Do they crunch a lot of data? I remember Tesla was "hesitant" a few years ago while changing lanes, but it does it without a glitch these days, most of the time. I am still having some phantom-breaking issues sometimes, rarely, though.

No one knows the answer to that, only time will tell! With regards to using AI, only Lucid knows but since they are partnering with NVIDIA my guess would be probably!

As far as what's been reported here by other owners, all systems warn about ACC not working when approaching stopped vehicles.

 

[Adnillien]

I wonder if the 9000 ( old price) I paid for the "upcoming" advanced drivers' assistance package, something similar to FSD, will ever become a reality in a car with Lidar and multiple cameras, which is not able to detect stationary vehicles. Or did I lose 9000? I did ask many times before committing to purchase the Lucid, and each time the answer mentioned government regulations and was rather vague. At that point, I stated that Tesla must be subject to the same regulations. Nevertheless, it changes lanes, has FSD, or "navigate on autopilot" (requiring human assistance if needed), etc. Does Lucid use AI and neural networks to improve the DreamDrive PRO, any opinions? Do they crunch a lot of data? I remember Tesla was "hesitant" a few years ago while changing lanes, but it does it without a glitch these days, most of the time. I am still having some phantom-breaking issues sometimes, rarely, though.

Take a look at this thread for some background on why the Lucid Dream Drive is different than many other systems.

ADAS Systems and Limitations

I see a lot of criticism of Lucid’s Dream Drive ADAS system. Some of which is well deserved, some if which also shows an incomplete understanding of how ADAS systems work. The biggest criticism seems to be reaction, or lack of reaction, to stopped cars. Lucid does seem worse than other systems...

lucidowners.com

 

[fyellin]

I’m really trying to find a non-rude way to say this. But before operating a 5,000+ lb death machine, it behooves one to read the instruction manual carefully. This limitation of ACC and HA is spelled out plain as day there.

I agree, we all look forward to Traffic Jam Assist, which will indeed be able to detect stopped traffic ahead. And I also agree that a few other car manufacturers have already implemented this feature. But I wouldn’t get into someone’s BMW or Ford and expect it to steer me through city traffic like a Tesla can. I’d read up on what that specific car could do and set my expectations accordingly.

Sorry, I completely disagree. There's a big difference between not knowing what a feature does, and a feature not quite doing what you expect it to do.

My mental model of ACC is that it keeps me a certain distance from the object in front of me. I'm sure others have a similar mental model. I've watched the ACC slow me down in traffic until I come to a complete halt, always maintaining a distance between me and the car in front of me. Why should the behavior be in different whether I'm approaching a 30mph car at 60mph (my car slows down) or whether I'm approaching a stopped car at 60mph (my car slows down and then stops)?

 

[joec]

Sorry, I completely disagree. There's a big difference between not knowing what a feature does, and a feature not quite doing what you expect it to do.

My mental model of ACC is that it keeps me a certain distance from the object in front of me. I'm sure others have a similar mental model. I've watched the ACC slow me down in traffic until I come to a complete halt, always maintaining a distance between me and the car in front of me. Why should the behavior be in different whether I'm approaching a 30mph car at 60mph (my car slows down) or whether I'm approaching a stopped car at 60mph (my car slows down and then stops)?

Because it's fundamentally different technology to "follow" a moving object that's 10-30 feet in front of you, vs. tracking a stationary object that's hundreds of yards ahead. Two very different software problems.

I've driven dozens of cars that do not adjust speed at all when cruising. Set it to 60, and it will gladly go 60 right into a wall. I've also driven some that adjust speed exactly as Lucid's does.

There are a few manufacturers who have developed systems for stopped traffic. And Lucid has such a system (Traffic Jam Assist) in development. But it is not currently available.

There is no "standard of expectation" in other words. This varies quite a bit from car to car.

Lucid has been crystal clear on this topic. ACC is for cruising on uninterrupted highways. It's not for roads with stoplights.

Any cop will be happy to tell you it's the responsibility of the driver to learn the features and limitations of any vehicle before operating it. If you went to court with "I expected it to do X" you'd lose. Every time.

 

[Adnillien]

My mental model of ACC is that it keeps me a certain distance from the object in front of me. I'm sure others have a similar mental model. I've watched the ACC slow me down in traffic until I come to a complete halt, always maintaining a distance between me and the car in front of me. Why should the behavior be in different whether I'm approaching a 30mph car at 60mph (my car slows down) or whether I'm approaching a stopped car at 60mph (my car slows down and then stops)?

Since cruise control on every car that I have looked at has a warning about stationary objects, maybe your mental model is not correct.

 

[hydbob]

WARNING: Adaptive Cruise Control
is designed for your driving comfort
and convenience and is not a collision
warning or avoidance system. It is
your responsibility to stay alert, drive
safely, and be in control of the
vehicle at all times. Never depend on
Adaptive Cruise Control to adequately
slow down the vehicle. Watch the
road in front of you and be prepared
to take corrective action at all times.
Failure to do so can result in serious
injury or death.

WARNING: Never depend on Adaptive
Cruise Control to brake for
pedestrians, animals, or other objects.
Always watch the road and be
prepared to take corrective action.
Failure to do so can result in serious
injury or death.

WARNING: Do not use Adaptive
Cruise Control on city streets or on
roads where traffic conditions are
constantly changing.

WARNING: Adaptive Cruise Control
may not detect or brake for
narrow vehicles, such as bicycles or
motorcycles.

WARNING: Adaptive Cruise Control
may not detect stationary or slow-
moving vehicles below 6 mph (10
km/h).

WARNING: Do not use Adaptive
Cruise Control on winding roads with
sharp curves, on icy or slippery road
surfaces, or when weather conditions,
(e.g., heavy rain, snow, or fog), make it
inappropriate to drive at a consistent
speed. Adaptive Cruise Control does
not adapt driving speed based on
road and driving conditions.
WARNING: Temporarily turn off
Adaptive Cruise Control when driving
in areas where you must reduce
speed, (e.g., turn lanes, entering
and exiting highways, or construction
zones). This prevents the vehicle from
accelerating to the stored speed in
such situations.

 

[LucidvsTeslaS]

WARNING: Adaptive Cruise Control
is designed for your driving comfort
and convenience and is not a collision
warning or avoidance system. It is
your responsibility to stay alert, drive
safely, and be in control of the
vehicle at all times. Never depend on
Adaptive Cruise Control to adequately
slow down the vehicle. Watch the
road in front of you and be prepared
to take corrective action at all times.
Failure to do so can result in serious
injury or death.

WARNING: Never depend on Adaptive
Cruise Control to brake for
pedestrians, animals, or other objects.
Always watch the road and be
prepared to take corrective action.
Failure to do so can result in serious
injury or death.

WARNING: Do not use Adaptive
Cruise Control on city streets or on
roads where traffic conditions are
constantly changing.

WARNING: Adaptive Cruise Control
may not detect or brake for
narrow vehicles, such as bicycles or
motorcycles.

WARNING: Adaptive Cruise Control
may not detect stationary or slow-
moving vehicles below 6 mph (10
km/h).

WARNING: Do not use Adaptive
Cruise Control on winding roads with
sharp curves, on icy or slippery road
surfaces, or when weather conditions,
(e.g., heavy rain, snow, or fog), make it
inappropriate to drive at a consistent
speed. Adaptive Cruise Control does
not adapt driving speed based on
road and driving conditions.
WARNING: Temporarily turn off
Adaptive Cruise Control when driving
in areas where you must reduce
speed, (e.g., turn lanes, entering
and exiting highways, or construction
zones). This prevents the vehicle from
accelerating to the stored speed in
such situations.

So can we all agree that Tesla autopilot/ Tesla FSD is vastly superior since it detects stationary cars, cars merging into the lane, etc., virtually 99.9999 % of the time?
For people who do not own a Tesla, watch some youtube Videos and see what it can do.

I wonder how Lucid will ever achieve FSD if it cannot detect stopped vehicles; that is all.

I would love to see all vehicles surrounding my own on the screen when I drive the Lucid, just like in my Tesla.
My Lucid is soon getting towed to Richmond, Virginia since the mobile tech cannot resolve the numerous issues I am having with the car ( poor quality control ).

 

[hydbob]

So can we all agree that Tesla autopilot/ Tesla FSD is vastly superior since it detects stationary cars, cars merging into the lane, etc., virtually 99.9999 % of the time?
For people who do not own a Tesla, watch some youtube Videos and see what it can do.

I wonder how Lucid will ever achieve FSD if it cannot detect stopped vehicles; that is all.

I would love to see all vehicles surrounding my own on the screen when I drive the Lucid, just like in my Tesla.
My Lucid is soon getting towed to Richmond, Virginia since the mobile tech cannot resolve the numerous issues I am having with the car ( poor quality control ).

Well, Lucid has never said they've wanted to achieve FSD and marketed that DreamDrive Pro would eventually become a Level 3 ADAS system. So, of course it'll never be FSD because that was not their goal and they've never said it was their goal, ever. But, here is some food for thought as well.

Note
Traffic-Aware Cruise Control is a BETA feature.

Traffic-Aware Cruise Control determines when there is a vehicle in front of you in the same lane. If the area in front of Model S is clear, Traffic-Aware Cruise Control maintains a set driving speed. When a vehicle is detected, Traffic-Aware Cruise Control is designed to slow down Model S as needed to maintain a selected time-based distance from the vehicle in front, up to the set speed. Traffic-Aware Cruise Control does not eliminate the need to watch the road in front of you and to manually apply the brakes when needed.

Traffic-Aware Cruise Control is primarily intended for driving on dry, straight roads, such as highways.

Warning
Traffic-Aware Cruise Control is designed for your driving comfort and convenience and is not a collision warning or avoidance system. It is your responsibility to stay alert, drive safely, and be in control of the vehicle at all times. Never depend on Traffic-Aware Cruise Control to adequately slow down Model S. Always watch the road in front of you and be prepared to take corrective action at all times. Failure to do so can result in serious injury or death.

Warning
Although Traffic-Aware Cruise Control is capable of detecting pedestrians and cyclists, never depend on Traffic-Aware Cruise Control to adequately slow Model S down for them. Always watch the road in front of you and be prepared to take corrective action at all times. Failure to do so can result in serious injury or death.

Warning
Do not use Traffic-Aware Cruise Control on winding roads with sharp curves, on icy or slippery road surfaces, or when weather conditions (such as heavy rain, snow, fog, etc.) make it inappropriate to drive at a consistent speed. Traffic-Aware Cruise Control does not adapt driving speed based on road and driving conditions.


Warning
Traffic-Aware Cruise Control may not detect all objects and, especially when cruising over 50 mph (80 km/h), may not brake/decelerate when a vehicle or object is only partially in the driving lane or when a vehicle you are following moves out of your driving path and a stationary or slow-moving vehicle or object is in front of you. Always pay attention to the road ahead and stay prepared to take immediate corrective action. Depending on Traffic-Aware Cruise Control to avoid a collision can result in serious injury or death. In addition, Traffic-Aware Cruise Control may react to vehicles or objects that either do not exist, or are not in your lane of travel, causing Model S to slow down unnecessarily or inappropriately.


Warning
It is the driver's responsibility to determine and maintain a safe following distance at all times. Do not rely on Traffic-Aware Cruise Control to maintain an accurate or appropriate following distance.

Warning
Never depend on Traffic-Aware Cruise Control to adequately slow down Model S to avoid a collision. Always watch the road in front of you and stay prepared to take immediate corrective action.

 

[borski]

So can we all agree that Tesla autopilot/ Tesla FSD is vastly superior since it detects stationary cars, cars merging into the lane, etc., virtually 99.9999 % of the time?
For people who do not own a Tesla, watch some youtube Videos and see what it can do.

I wonder how Lucid will ever achieve FSD if it cannot detect stopped vehicles; that is all.

I would love to see all vehicles surrounding my own on the screen when I drive the Lucid, just like in my Tesla.
My Lucid is soon getting towed to Richmond, Virginia since the mobile tech cannot resolve the numerous issues I am having with the car ( poor quality control ).

I’ve used FSD. It tried to hit a trash can three times and successfully tapped one on a turn before I could stop it. This was about six minutes before it dead-stopped in the middle of a road instead of turning right because apparently a 90 degree right turn is just too difficult for a “full self driving” system.

Yeah, I’m perfectly fine with my Lucid not doing that.

(Autopilot is fine, but I find HA superior as it had never phantom braked for me)

 

[openball]

So can we all agree that Tesla autopilot/ Tesla FSD is vastly superior since it detects stationary cars, cars merging into the lane, etc., virtually 99.9999 % of the time?
For people who do not own a Tesla, watch some youtube Videos and see what it can do.

I wonder how Lucid will ever achieve FSD if it cannot detect stopped vehicles; that is all.

I would love to see all vehicles surrounding my own on the screen when I drive the Lucid, just like in my Tesla.
My Lucid is soon getting towed to Richmond, Virginia since the mobile tech cannot resolve the numerous issues I am having with the car ( poor quality control ).

Are you really comparing 15 years of autopilot/FSD development to 2 years of High Way Assist? You rightly said Tesla autopilot/Tesla Full Self Driving both of which Lucid has not claimed to release. My opinion is that Lucid has better hardware for FSD so if/when it is developed, it should be better.