For those who think there's tiny market for expensive & luxury EVs

[Grnr92663]

As of Nov 2022, Porsche has sold more than 100K of the Taycan. The Taycan has not been sold in the Middle East and just started in China 12 months ago - but pretty much stay muted due to China COVID shutdown. As for Q4 2022, the Taycan outsold both the 911 and the Caynne models

As for the Taycan EV:

- Beautiful look (subjective)
- Fantastic handling
- Great build quality
- Awfullllll software, still no OTA
- Almost NO space
- Range in the low 200s miles
- MSRP from $86K - $190K (and still have tons of options for extra costs at the TurboS $190K level)
- 0-60mph from 5.1 - 2.6 sec, depends on models
- Source major components (motors, inverters, transmission, BMP, battery) all from outside vendors

Porsche marketcap is currently at $94B ...

Porsche has produced its 100,000th Taycan electric car

Porsche announced today that it has produced its 100,000th Taycan electric car, and it is highlighting some of the highest-mileage ones.

electrek.co

 

[RM-S8]

As of Nov 2022, Porsche has sold more than 100K of the Taycan. The Taycan has not been sold in the Middle East and just started in China 12 months ago - but pretty much stay muted due to China COVID shutdown. As for Q4 2022, the Taycan outsold both the 911 and the Caynne models

As for the Taycan EV:

- Beautiful look (subjective)
- Fantastic handling
- Great build quality
- Awfullllll software, still no OTA
- Almost NO space
- Range in the low 200s miles
- MSRP from $86K - $190K (and still have tons of options for extra costs at the TurboS $190K level)
- 0-60mph from 5.1 - 2.6 sec, depends on models

Porsche marketcap is currently at $94B ...

Porsche has produced its 100,000th Taycan electric car

Porsche announced today that it has produced its 100,000th Taycan electric car, and it is highlighting some of the highest-mileage ones.

electrek.co

Are you a Porsche dealer?

 

[HC_79]

The market is tiny......

Compared to Tesla, those numbers from 2 well established automakers is low......

 

[HC_79]

The above also shows Lucid needs to get its butt into gear with more models below $100K as selling cars purely over the $100K price point isn't sustainable and the billions they're spending on that big ass factory will just gather dust on the production line.

 

[Grnr92663]

The above also shows Lucid needs to get its butt into gear with more models below $100K as selling cars purely over the $100K price point isn't sustainable and the billions they're spending on that big ass factory will just gather dust on the production line.

Lucid seems to go with the right direction by cutting price on the GT and make some features option. It would help if they just simplify the model line up (as for now, they have 7 !!!, whoever worked on the model lineup should be fired). I think it would just just few model lineups

- Pure: shorter range
- Grand Touring: long range
- Sapphire: crazy performance

Just look at Porsche (regular and Turbo), Tesla (long range, Plaid), Mercedes (450, 580, AMG). What was in Lucid mind when they created 7 model line up (Pure, Touring, GT-Range, GT-P, Dream-Range, Dream-P, Sapphire) ????

Lucid should be known for making the long range luxury EVs for $85-90K, and simply add more from there. As for now, people associate it with $150K cars, not gona help.

Hope they don't screw up with the model line up on their SUV.

Even among Lucid's staff (engineering & middle management level), they think the top exec as clever in engineering, but awful in marketing & strategy ... Everyone quietly wish for a savvy & gifted COO .....like Facebook had with Sheryl Sandberg

 

[nevadagame]

Lucid seems to go with the right direction by cutting price on the GT and make some features option. It would help if they just simplify the model line up (as for now, they have 7 !!!, whoever worked on the model lineup should be fired). I think it would just just few model lineups

- Pure: shorter range
- Grand Touring: long range
- Sapphire: crazy performance

Just look at Porsche (regular and Turbo), Tesla (long range, Plaid), Mercedes (450, 580, AMG). What was in Lucid mind when they created 7 model line up (Pure, Touring, GT-Range, GT-P, Dream-Range, Dream-P, Sapphire) ????

Lucid should be known for making the long range luxury EVs for $85-90K, and simply add more from there. As for now, people associate it with $150K cars, not gona help.

Hope they don't screw up with the model line up on their SUV.

Apparently the moderators don’t mind comparing lucid to other models when it puts lucid in a favorable light.

 

[Bobby]

Apparently the moderators don’t mind comparing lucid to other models when it puts lucid in a favorable light.

I'm not sure your comment is meant in the best of spirit. I'm actually not sure where it came from it all, since there is not a single moderator comment on this thread until this one.

As a GT owner, I certainly compared the vehicle to all of the other vehicles in the class before purchasing. Of course, I purchased the one that came out ahead in the most categories. Software notwithstanding (and it's getting better for sure), I don't think there's anything else that can touch it in the luxury sport sedan class. I really enjoyed the Taycan/Audi RS etron GT but the range is too low for my needs.

That said, this forum welcomes objective comparisons of the Lucid to any other vehicle, whether Lucid comes out on top or not.

As a moderator, I am a volunteer here to help keep the forum orderly and friendly, like the neighborhood it is intended to be. We don't want to end up like other social media platforms that often have comments that are rude or unnecessary.

 

[joec]

Apparently the moderators don’t mind comparing lucid to other models when it puts lucid in a favorable light.

I have no idea what this even means. But if you want some clarification into our process:

- Let's start with giving the group of mods (who are all volunteers, by the way, with day jobs) more than 6 minutes to even notice a post.
- Then, let's take a few seconds to understand what the post is about, and quickly realize while this is someone comparing two different brands, it's not a particularly favorable comparison, as it is saying Porsche is doing a way better job than Lucid at the moment. (Why you thought this was favorable to Lucid, I have no idea.)
- Finally, let's ask ourselves a basic question about intent: Is this person making a constructive suggestion for Lucid, which could be interesting fodder for a debate? Or is this person being an elitist, entitled jerk wad who thinks because they spent some money, they somehow deserve to be treated better than other humans? Not seeing any evidence of jerkwadery here.

See. Super easy to moderate.

 

[Cosmo Cruz]

Apparently the moderators don’t mind comparing lucid to other models when it puts lucid in a favorable light.

I'm far from moderate, but let's you and me compare Lucid to other models that make Lucid look unfavorable.

You start.

 

[xponents]

I'm far from moderate, but let's you and me compare Lucid to other models that make Lucid look unfavorable.

You start.

Sorry, google showed no results.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

I have no advice to give Lucid or Porsche, but Porsche’s number of cars delivered in the US for 2022 model year is only like double what Lucid is. Also here’s a newsflash: this forum is probably biased in favor of Lucid because most of us chose to buy this car over other cars. I think I’m being objective but it’s also colored by my personal preferences and requirements that other auto makers didn’t quite meet, but Lucid did. So because of that I’ll be a little more forgiving if they make a mistake then a car I wasn’t crazy about anyway makes a mistake. Big deal.

 

[scharnhorst]

All small potatoes... look how many F150s are sold each year.

 

[nevadagame]

I'm far from moderate, but let's you and me compare Lucid to other models that make Lucid look unfavorable.

You start.

This request sure seems like not so subtle baiting me so you can jump on me for being too negative! ( which in fact I am not). Why do you even remotely think I would want to do that. I withdrew a bank check today for 166k to pay for my 2023 AGT delivered one week from today. I’m quite excited and bought the car because I like its looks and it checks my performance, range and prestige and luxury desires. Few other cars ( that I can afford) will do all of those things…in spite of the fact that it has more than its share of glaring shortcomings and flaws which I’m not afraid or embarrassed it admit or complain about. It very tedious and disappointing to be jumped on for being critical about things that to any objective person would not be upset to hear. I know this is an expensive car and many its buyers aren’t happy with those who criticize the car which in some way seems like a personal criticism. I never intended to make anything I say personal, but I really wish we could just lighten up and not be so dam serious.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

Criticisms of Lucid in order of importance:

1: complaining about the car before you have it.
2- no CarPlay (coming very soon, unlike the most popular EV maker in the world)
3- no mi/KWh in dash (available in Pilot panel, probably coming back soon)
4- no ability to make DD PRO warning only without intervention (my only big complaint with DD pro, I do hate this about the car)
5- Sirius XM BETA acts like a Beta version (why is this a complaint?)
6- Mediocre efficiency below freezing temps (see every other EV…although some are definitely better than Lucid in this category)
7- plug and charge not flawless on EA (see every other EV, but maybe the recent OTA has improved this some?)
8- Alexa isn’t very good (see Alexa on many other devices like my home FireCube that frustrated me so much I got rid of it for AppleTV, so now Siri frustrates me as much as Alexa…though maybe 2.0.47 OTA improved it?)
9- car rolls backwards in drive very rarely in specific circumstances (not anymore thanks to OTA)
10- very very rarely Car may die for as of yet no universal reason (this is serious but they’re working on it)
11- service in Florida is mostly bad (they’re working on it)
12- service in a few other locales may or may not be bad (majority of owner service experience almost everywhere else has been positive)
13- cup holder location and size is wrong (this is objective fact)
14- navigation is inadequate for some owners, fine for other owners (Me)
15- trim may have issues/some cars may have minor squeaks or rattles (mine had trim issues, car has zero squeaks/rattles)
16 - text service is slow to respond (the longest it ever took them to reply to me was 45 minutes and they apologized without me complaining)
17 - USB jack location is painful to access (objective fact)
18 - visor mirror covers folding mechanism is…creative/annoying?
19 - 21” tires look amazing….right before they explode when they run over a pebble (this should have been a recall in my opinion)
20 - people who mention the price of the car in many of their posts (money neither buys flawless engineering, software, manufacturing or service, but talking about money a lot is….?)
21 - Peter Rawlinson not commenting on every bears workshop video or having the beverages I like in the service center because I own the company.
….Ok I’m getting off track here, sorry.

That’s all this fanboy who takes personal offense to complaints about the car can think of.

 

[RM-S8]

Criticisms of Lucid in order of importance:

1: complaining about the car before you have it.
2- no CarPlay (coming very soon, unlike the most popular EV maker in the world)
3- no mi/KWh in dash (available in Pilot panel, probably coming back soon)
4- no ability to make DD PRO warning only without intervention (my only big complaint with DD pro, I do hate this about the car)
5- Sirius XM BETA acts like a Beta version (why is this a complaint?)
6- Mediocre efficiency below freezing temps (see every other EV…although some are definitely better than Lucid in this category)
7- plug and charge not flawless on EA (see every other EV, but maybe the recent OTA has improved this some?)
8- Alexa isn’t very good (see Alexa on many other devices like my home FireCube that frustrated me so much I got rid of it for AppleTV, so now Siri frustrates me as much as Alexa…though maybe 2.0.47 OTA improved it?)
9- car rolls backwards in drive very rarely in specific circumstances (not anymore thanks to OTA)
10- very very rarely Car may die for as of yet no universal reason (this is serious but they’re working on it)
11- service in Florida is mostly bad (they’re working on it)
12- service in a few other locales may or may not be bad (majority of owner service experience almost everywhere else has been positive)
13- cup holder location and size is wrong (this is objective fact)
14- navigation is inadequate for some owners, fine for other owners (Me)
15- trim may have issues/some cars may have minor squeaks or rattles (mine had trim issues, car has zero squeaks/rattles)
16 - text service is slow to respond (the longest it ever took them to reply to me was 45 minutes and they apologized without me complaining)
17 - USB jack location is painful to access (objective fact)
18 - visor mirror covers folding mechanism is…creative/annoying?
19 - 21” tires look amazing….right before they explode when they run over a pebble (this should have been a recall in my opinion)
20 - people who mention the price of the car in many of their posts (money neither buys flawless engineering, software, manufacturing or service, but talking about money a lot is….?)
21 - Peter Rawlinson not commenting on every bears workshop video or having the beverages I like in the service center because I own the company.
….Ok I’m getting off track here, sorry.

That’s all this fanboy who takes personal offense to complaints about the car can think of.

Great summary. But, you realize, people will bitch no matter what.

 

[Cosmo Cruz]

I’m quite excited and bought the car because I like its looks and it checks my performance, range and prestige and luxury desires. Few other cars ( that I can afford) will do all of those things…

which few ?

 

[JJ_5]

Criticisms of Lucid in order of importance:

1: complaining about the car before you have it.
2- no CarPlay (coming very soon, unlike the most popular EV maker in the world)
3- no mi/KWh in dash (available in Pilot panel, probably coming back soon)
4- no ability to make DD PRO warning only without intervention (my only big complaint with DD pro, I do hate this about the car)
5- Sirius XM BETA acts like a Beta version (why is this a complaint?)
6- Mediocre efficiency below freezing temps (see every other EV…although some are definitely better than Lucid in this category)
7- plug and charge not flawless on EA (see every other EV, but maybe the recent OTA has improved this some?)
8- Alexa isn’t very good (see Alexa on many other devices like my home FireCube that frustrated me so much I got rid of it for AppleTV, so now Siri frustrates me as much as Alexa…though maybe 2.0.47 OTA improved it?)
9- car rolls backwards in drive very rarely in specific circumstances (not anymore thanks to OTA)
10- very very rarely Car may die for as of yet no universal reason (this is serious but they’re working on it)
11- service in Florida is mostly bad (they’re working on it)
12- service in a few other locales may or may not be bad (majority of owner service experience almost everywhere else has been positive)
13- cup holder location and size is wrong (this is objective fact)
14- navigation is inadequate for some owners, fine for other owners (Me)
15- trim may have issues/some cars may have minor squeaks or rattles (mine had trim issues, car has zero squeaks/rattles)
16 - text service is slow to respond (the longest it ever took them to reply to me was 45 minutes and they apologized without me complaining)
17 - USB jack location is painful to access (objective fact)
18 - visor mirror covers folding mechanism is…creative/annoying?
19 - 21” tires look amazing….right before they explode when they run over a pebble (this should have been a recall in my opinion)
20 - people who mention the price of the car in many of their posts (money neither buys flawless engineering, software, manufacturing or service, but talking about money a lot is….?)
21 - Peter Rawlinson not commenting on every bears workshop video or having the beverages I like in the service center because I own the company.
….Ok I’m getting off track here, sorry.

That’s all this fanboy who takes personal offense to complaints about the car can think of.

What, no Tidal complaints?

 

[MoniputerLM]

Criticisms of Lucid in order of importance:

1: complaining about the car before you have it.
2- no CarPlay (coming very soon, unlike the most popular EV maker in the world)
3- no mi/KWh in dash (available in Pilot panel, probably coming back soon)
4- no ability to make DD PRO warning only without intervention (my only big complaint with DD pro, I do hate this about the car)
5- Sirius XM BETA acts like a Beta version (why is this a complaint?)
6- Mediocre efficiency below freezing temps (see every other EV…although some are definitely better than Lucid in this category)
7- plug and charge not flawless on EA (see every other EV, but maybe the recent OTA has improved this some?)
8- Alexa isn’t very good (see Alexa on many other devices like my home FireCube that frustrated me so much I got rid of it for AppleTV, so now Siri frustrates me as much as Alexa…though maybe 2.0.47 OTA improved it?)
9- car rolls backwards in drive very rarely in specific circumstances (not anymore thanks to OTA)
10- very very rarely Car may die for as of yet no universal reason (this is serious but they’re working on it)
11- service in Florida is mostly bad (they’re working on it)
12- service in a few other locales may or may not be bad (majority of owner service experience almost everywhere else has been positive)
13- cup holder location and size is wrong (this is objective fact)
14- navigation is inadequate for some owners, fine for other owners (Me)
15- trim may have issues/some cars may have minor squeaks or rattles (mine had trim issues, car has zero squeaks/rattles)
16 - text service is slow to respond (the longest it ever took them to reply to me was 45 minutes and they apologized without me complaining)
17 - USB jack location is painful to access (objective fact)
18 - visor mirror covers folding mechanism is…creative/annoying?
19 - 21” tires look amazing….right before they explode when they run over a pebble (this should have been a recall in my opinion)
20 - people who mention the price of the car in many of their posts (money neither buys flawless engineering, software, manufacturing or service, but talking about money a lot is….?)
21 - Peter Rawlinson not commenting on every bears workshop video or having the beverages I like in the service center because I own the company.
….Ok I’m getting off track here, sorry.

That’s all this fanboy who takes personal offense to complaints about the car can think of.

Yeah, Lucid has a lot of things to work on!

 

[RM-S8]

Great summary. But, you realize, people will bitch no matter what.

Yeah, Lucid has a lot of things to work on!

Here we're go.

 

[SaratogaLefty]

I don't think comparing the Lucid to the Taycan is inappropriate. I will offer my thoughts since I actually wrote out a check for the Taycan 4S but wound up walking when the Dealer tried to jack me up for an additional $9k. I am/was a Porsche FanBoy (I've owned four). Anyway, I am thankful he did that since that led to my purchase of the Dream P. Here are my thoughts comparing the 4S with the Air GT which with similar options (leather interior, 21" wheels, upgraded stereo, massaging seats, etc.) are very close in price. Lucid GT is much faster and handling is very close; Lucid has much more interior room and storage (back seat of Taycan sedan is very low on headroom and who really wants a station wagon (Turismo)); external looks are a matter of choice but both look very nice in my opinion; GT has had software issues (steadily improving) Taycan software is lacking with little improvement thus far; Range isn't in the same ballpark; Lucid comfort for long drives definitely superior. There are many other comparisons I can make, but suffice it to say I am overall very pleased with my decision to pass on the Taycan and opt for the Lucid. To each his own.