New Lucid Air Pure

[borski]

As a counterpoint, I hate Chargepoint. They’re the only ones that are constantly in a state of “broken in some way” in my experience. And whether the wifi hooks up easily is a BIG question, haha, though evidently @Worldwide Beagle has had good experiences so YMMV.

For chargers, a few great options:
1. Grizzl-E: https://grizzl-e.com/products-overview/grizzl-e-ultimate-48/
2. Wallbox Pulsar Plus: https://shop.wallbox.com/products/pulsar-plus
3. OpenEVSE: https://store.openevse.com/products/advanced-station
4. Emporia Classic: https://shop.emporiaenergy.com/products/emporia-ev-charger?variant=44861002088703
5. Emporia Pro: https://shop.emporiaenergy.com/products/emporia-pro-ev-charger?variant=46762104914175 (this one comes with energy management for your panel, etc., so you can track usage and electricity throughout your home)

These may be cheaper on Amazon, Costco, or elsewhere.

I *highly* recommend installing it hardwired, so you get the full 48A of charging speed, and because it is safer. If you use it as a plug-in, you will only get 40A (by electrical code) and it is slightly more hazardous (and you must get a commercial or EV-ready outlet).

Some will have more or fewer features than others, you’ll have to do the research and see if those features matter for you.

For example, depending on the size of your panel, the Wallbox can adjust the charging current in real-time using a meter that measures the current in your panel, using as much as it can, or as much as is available at the time. That’s a feature we use, but you may not need; you may just have the spare capacity in your panel for the full 48 amps.

OpenEVSE is neat because it is fully open; you get schematics and everything else you might want. You can even build it yourself from a kit, which is fun to do: https://store.openevse.com/collections/all-products/products/advanced-bundle

But what it really means is just that if a component fails you can replace it yourself instead of having to deal with the whole company and send back the whole charger, etc. I know @segbrk uses one and likes it.

But yeah, stick to well-known brands.

 

[L-Dude]

I have a Chargepoint Home Flex. It is a nice unit, and has a bunch of features that I thought I would need but never use. One day, it just stopped working. I called Chargepoint, they did some online diagnostics, and told me the unit needed to be replaced. It was warranted for three years, and I was three weeks out of warranty. They sent me a new unit anyway. I am always surprised when a product with no moving parts breaks, but obviously that's my own baggage.

If I had it to do over again, I would find a much cheaper model from a reputable company. I would like a little more juice, but my electrician refused to install conduit so I'm stuck at 40a. That's ok for my 84kW Audi. It could be an issue with my 112kW AGT. I'm always forgetting to plug in the damn car.

 

[Steveinarizona]

I have a Chargepoint Home Flex. It is a nice unit, and has a bunch of features that I thought I would need but never use. One day, it just stopped working. I called Chargepoint, they did some online diagnostics, and told me the unit needed to be replaced. It was warranted for three years, and I was three weeks out of warranty. They sent me a new unit anyway. I am always surprised when a product with no moving parts breaks, but obviously that's my own baggage.

If I had it to do over again, I would find a much cheaper model from a reputable company. I would like a little more juice, but my electrician refused to install conduit so I'm stuck at 40a. That's ok for my 84kW Audi. It could be an issue with my 112kW AGT. I'm always forgetting to plug in the damn car.

I have the chargepoint also. The fact that after the warranty expired, and after three eyars of ownership, the company still gave you a new one suggests that you might want to stay with Chargepoint.

Why did your electrician refuse to install conduit? Mind did from the electric panel on one side of the house to the garage on the other side.

 

[Adnillien]

As a counterpoint, I hate Chargepoint. They’re the only ones that are constantly in a state of “broken in some way” in my experience.

I think you are confusing the Chargepoint home products from the commercial products. On the commercial side, Chargepoint sells EVSE equipment to business owners and provides payment processing. Since the equipment is owned by the individual businesses, Chargepoint has little control over maintenance. I agree this hurts Chargepoint's brand but is not really a reflection off the quality of their equipment. Chargepoint offers maintenance and equipment monitoring and businesses that use that service do not have an equipment availability issue.

 

[Batteryman]

There are half dozen highly regarded, independent ones. Stick to major brand. The Chargepoint and others have been out years before the Lucid expensive overkill finicky charger.

I like Chargepoint. Big, well financed American company. I have two of them, home and vacation house. They get wifi updates to insure compatibility. Work flawlessly. And it texts you when charging is done. Wifi hooks up easily, unlike the Lucid.

The home charger is not really a charger. Charging is done in the car for AC. The box is really a just fancy switch box and handshake device.

Chargepoint had issues talking to my Lucid….if they didn’t fix this, I wouldn't recommend Chargepoint.

 

[Worldwide Beagle]

FWIW, my electric utilities gave me the CP two units for free and pay me to use them. They track usage. And, I got them two years ago. And the customer service has been quick and intelligent. My experience has been flawless. Several clients have Level 2 CP pedestals, which I use, and have been great. I have never used a Level 3 CP. So, just my experience.

 

[Worldwide Beagle]

Chargepoint had issues talking to my Lucid….if they didn’t fix this, I wouldn't recommend Chargepoint.

That is true. More than a year ago, I think. Has been trouble free for a long time.

 

[Worldwide Beagle]

I think you are confusing the Chargepoint home products from the commercial products. On the commercial side, Chargepoint sells EVSE equipment to business owners and provides payment processing. Since the equipment is owned by the individual businesses, Chargepoint has little control over maintenance. I agree this hurts Chargepoint's brand but is not really a reflection off the quality of their equipment. Chargepoint offers maintenance and equipment monitoring and businesses that use that service do not have an equipment availability issue.

Good catch. That makes perfect sense. I could not understand what @borski meant by "broken in some way.". Was scratching my head. But For commercial level 3 units, it now fits. EA deja Vu.

None of the people I know with CP home units have had issues that were not quickly resolved. I even called their CS at night.

And after Enel Juice box abandoned the USA, staying with a Tier One company is required, unless you enjoy soldering.

 

[L-Dude]

I have the chargepoint also. The fact that after the warranty expired, and after three eyars of ownership, the company still gave you a new one suggests that you might want to stay with Chargepoint.

Why did your electrician refuse to install conduit? Mind did from the electric panel on one side of the house to the garage on the other side.

Well I don't plan to replace the Chargepoint, but if/when it goes, I'm getting something cheaper. I really don't need all those bells and whistles.

This technically wasn't my electrician. He worked for the company that did our house renovation, and I didn't have direct access to him, so I couldn't work things out. It was a huge renovation and I had bigger fish to fry.

 

[DeaneG]

Well I don't plan to replace the Chargepoint, but if/when it goes, I'm getting something cheaper. I really don't need all those bells and whistles...

ChargePoint reduced the price of the Home Flex a couple years ago - it's now in line with most others at $549, not bad for a 48 amp unit.

 

[Pragmatic]

The Grizz-E Ultimate 48 is $440.

 

[johnse]

I *highly* recommend installing it hardwired, so you get the full 48A of charging speed, and because it is safer. If you use it as a plug-in, you will only get 40A (by electrical code) and it is slightly more hazardous (and you must get a commercial or EV-ready outlet).

I concur with @borski. I wanted to clarify one thing that he alludes to here.

Continuous use circuits (any load run for 4 hours or more) are not allowed to use more than 80% of the rated ampacity of the circuit.
* NEMA 14-50 can have either a 40A or 50A circuit breaker, meaning one can use with 32A or 40A. This ability to use a 40A (There are no 40A-specific NEMA receptacles, but 40A is a common breaker for things like ovens) means the EVSE cannot tell what the maximum allowable current is. This is why Tesla de-rated their mobile EVSE to 32A.
* Any branch circuit rated higher than 50A must be hardwired. A 60A circuit can charge at 48A.

The maximum current a particular EVSE is allowed to use is the lower of the ability designed into the EVSE, and the Circuit breaker (and associated wiring).

For example, my first EVSE was a Clipper Creek 32A (40A circuit) unit. I had that installed on a 50A circuit (wanting to future-proof the wiring and outlet), so 32A is the max I can use

The Gen3 wall connectors I have now can charge at 48A on a 60A circuit, but they could do up to 80A if on a 100A circuit.

(BTW, Clipper Creek is another brand that has been around forever it seems.)

 

[L-Dude]

I don't think that wiring requirements get mentioned enough in these threads. It is pretty complicated, and you (or your electrician) needs to know exactly what wiring size, type and capacity are required for your charger. Everyone talks about circuit amperage, but you also need to be very sure your wiring is rated to handle that kind of load.

 

[Worldwide Beagle]

I don't think that wiring requirements get mentioned enough in these threads. It is pretty complicated, and you (or your electrician) needs to know exactly what wiring size, type and capacity are required for your charger. Everyone talks about circuit amperage, but you also need to be very sure your wiring is rated to handle that kind of load.

Actually, wiring requirements have be mentioned over and over - years ago. Trust me on this...

BUT your point is still excellant and valid. Some of us old timers here talk on and on about amperage ratings.

@DeaneG and have done hundreds of posts on wiring, derating, hardwiring vs receptacles, continuous grade receptacles, since we both have backgrounds in mains electricity and electronics. This was back in late 2023 when Lucid sales picked up and the issues with melting Leviton NEMA oven 15-50 receptacles started occurring. And this was way before the Lucid 80 amp charger came out.

People on this forum would scream at @DeaneG and me that the $9 Leviton HD NEMA 15-50 receptacle for a stove was PERFECT for their new AGT and that the $50 Hubbell continuous rated, industrial NEMA 15-50 receptacle was simply marketing bullshit. I remember the comments all to well: The cheap plug worked on my Prius/Volt/Audi Hybrid, so it should be fine for my Lucid.

But, judging by the all the new members, including yourself, i find your point just as valid today as before. I DO think the culture here has changed. Now, new owners want to know HOW to do the wiring correctly. @Deane and I now rarely get yelled at. If were to guess why, its because most new BEV owners get a real, component master or journeyman electrician, and not some handyman bloke.

In sum. your reminder is appropriate and a good reminder.

 

[DeaneG]

...(BTW, Clipper Creek is another brand that has been around forever it seems.)

Clipper Creek has been acquired by Enphase. They're still making the same bulletproof, limited-functionality EVSEs at a high price. I owned one in my Kia Soul EV days, replacing a Blink unit that Nissan installed for my very early Leaf.

Enphase modified the Clipper Creek HCS series to add smarts, so that they could be configured to charge using only excess solar PV power. That's what I'm using now.
We really miss the small size, easy cable handling and self-aligning connector holster of our ChargePoint.

 

[Pragmatic]

I'm hardwired, but if you buy a plug-in unit from Grizz-E they include the Hubbel receptacle with the unit. Yes it's that important.

 

[DeaneG]

I'm hardwired, but if you buy a plug-in unit from Grizz-E they include the Hubbel receptacle with the unit. Yes it's that important.

Enphase / Clipper Creek does as well. I'm glad to see companies being proactive about this, in self-defense I suppose.

 

[borski]

Sounds like others have had good experiences with Chargepoint; I and people I know haven’t, but I agree their CS was solid. All the brands I listed are fine, though - they’re all “tier 1” brands that are very highly rated.

I’m glad CP seems to be solid now.