(This is definitely off topic, but since you’ve written it this way a few times, I’d like to politely point out the name of the model is Cosmos, not Cosmo <3)
Point taken that this is not Lucid’s first rodeo. But if they whiffed on the Air and Gravity launches - for various reasons - and then fired the teams that contributed to those mistakes, why would we believe that someone there is actually running the show that knows what they’re doing? I’m not convinced Lucid is going to position a persona and brand for Lucid properly for mass market adoption. I have yet to see a marketing campaign that would establish that brand to appeal to those customers. Timothy Chalamet and NBA stars is not it. Has anyone seen anything else?
Again, this is an American-centric perspective. Rivian R2 and Lucid Cosmos are meant to take up the competition on an international scale. On that end, Europe, for example, is adopting 800V chargers and developing chargers beyond that. With Chinese EVs being exported to Europe (and now including Canada), alongside charging stations that will accommodate the higher voltage chargers coming out of China, consumers are more likely to take into account battery voltage.
Let's not forget, the R2 is a mass-market targeted vehicle. If you normalize the R2's charging curve vs Air and Gravity, I'd think (I haven't done the work yet) Gravity would be best, but R2 beats the Air (in charging curve). My take is, R2 stayed with 400V for cost reasons. Most mid-size buyers care about how fast it charges (miles gain per min), how long to get to 70%) but not the voltage.
And voltage plays a role in how fast it can charge, and we have yet to see how fast the Cosmos charges. This charging curve will be different once you factor in the international market's higher voltages.
It’s not bad for high end luxury EV buyers. It’s practically non-existent for mass market buyers. All the engineering and production success in the world won’t solve an utter lack of awareness that lucid even makes a $50k car.
Not under-estimating how fast Cosmos (thanks @borski) might charge. Please remember this is a mid-market product selling @$45k to $55k. And there are few native 800V charge stations around in the today. In my opinion, it is not a technology issue per se. I am sure Rivian know how to do an 800V R2, but they chose not to. Spending extra $ to future-proof a mid-size might not be the right (economic) choice! +
I think that Cosmos' introduction will see a lot of interest from EV journalists/influencers. Hoping Lucid has set aside a hefty ad budget.
It will when consumers are facing that choice.
I'm curious how well Lucid and existing EV makers could compete against Chinese imports if there were no import volume restrictions at all. Seems difficult.
Given that Cory Steuben has stated they've benchmarked against Chinese EVs as well, I'd like to think Lucid thought of that well ahead of time. Especially since they're expanding their presence in Europe. They'll need to prove they've got what it takes to compete against Chinese EVs
Fair enough. But I'll point out that Lucid is a seller of high end luxury EVs today, so I don't know that they've screwed anything up. They do need to pivot and establish more awareness in the new market they'll be targeting with the next three vehicles. But I'm not convinced that it's a good use of their resources to be trying to do that at this time. Obviously we have examples of companies hyping cars well ahead of time. But do we have any evidence that such hype is effective at selling more vehicles?
As I understand it:
Yes, and on top of that BYD are currently in negotiations to use Canadian labour as part of their rollout here in Canada. They're also studying the possibility of opening a plant in Canada.
I don't think this is true.
AI says, native 800V public chargers is approx 1.5% of the total. I don't know if that's correct. If you have different data, share them.
That being so, does that mean any EV can be designed to charge at 800+ volts without having the added encumbrance of added circuitry to boost the voltages internally?
I've observed several hundred focus groups in my career, and I can't really think of an instance where senior management hasn't paid attention to a well constructed, well conveyed focus group. It is pretty sobering to listen to a group of people rip your product to shreds. No one ignores that.
Practically all DC fast charging stations in the USA are 920V capable other than Tesla superchargers. A 400V DC fast charging station would limit the Air to 47kW charging. I've never run across one, and have never heard someone in this forum complaining of plugging an Air into a CCS station and getting only 47kW.
I think their brand identity is eminently practical cars that strive to have class leading engineering on every front, whether it be range, driving dynamics, packaging, or anything else. For all that it's problematic, the whole "no compromises" slogan actually does a decent job of capturing what their vehicles go for, and it's why I'm hanging out here. When I did my Gravity test drive, a Porsche driving (ICE) friend tagged along, and immediately understood the appeal.
