Will EA be the death of EVs?

[hydbob]

I don’t think that’s happening. There were reports that said it will happen before end of the year but there is no news about it. Tesla instead came up with an open connector so the onus is on the car manufacturer to use them.

They JUST came out with it to try and milk the government for more money. Let's not kid ourselves into thinking Tesla was trying to be open to the public this whole time.

 

[borski]

They JUST came out with it to try and milk the government for more money. Let's not kid ourselves into thinking Tesla was trying to be open to the public this whole time.

That won’t work. The bill requires the CCS connector*, so that Tesla opened up their connector is irrelevant. If they want the federal funds, they will *have* to build CCS stations, by definition.

They’ve built a home EVSE with a J1772 plug, so I wouldn’t be surprised if they do actually open up their stations for CCS.

* edit: it didn’t explicitly require CCS, but it did require that the charging stations receiving funding work with EVs “from more than one automaker.” Today, the NACS Tesla plug is not available on any other automaker; they’d have to convince another one to use the NACS plug.

 

[hellolucid]

That won’t work. The bill requires the CCS connector*, so that Tesla opened up their connector is irrelevant. If they want the federal funds, they will *have* to build CCS stations, by definition.

They’ve built a home EVSE with a J1772 plug, so I wouldn’t be surprised if they do actually open up their stations for CCS.

* edit: it didn’t explicitly require CCS, but it did require that the charging stations receiving funding work with EVs “from more than one automaker.” Today, the NACS Tesla plug is not available on any other automaker; they’d have to convince another one to use the NACS plug.

Solar electric vehicle (sEV) maker Aptera Motors has announced it will integrate the newly opened North American Charging Standard or NACS (formerly the Tesla connector) into its ultra-efficient vehicles. The NACS charging inlet and EV charging equipment will be built by Lectron, an industry leader dedicated to the widespread adoption of sustainable transportation.

Aptera To Integrate Tesla Charging | Aptera

Aptera Motors is First EV Maker to Integrate Tesla Charging built by Lectron -Ultra-Efficient Solar Vehicles will Feature Newly Opened North American Charging Standard- San Diego, CA, November 30, 2022 — Solar electric vehicle |

aptera.us

Looks like Tesla found another automaker to make use of their NACS plug. Insideevs report.

edit: looks like a solar powered vehicle. it wouldn't surprise me if Elon is behind this because afterall he's good at stalling government projects for his "hyperloop".

 

[borski]

Aptera To Integrate Tesla Charging | Aptera

Aptera Motors is First EV Maker to Integrate Tesla Charging built by Lectron -Ultra-Efficient Solar Vehicles will Feature Newly Opened North American Charging Standard- San Diego, CA, November 30, 2022 — Solar electric vehicle |

aptera.us

Looks like Tesla found another automaker to make use of their NACS plug. Insideevs report.

edit: looks like a solar powered vehicle. it wouldn't surprise me if Elon is behind this because afterall he's good at stalling government projects for his "hyperloop".

either way, there will be plenty more CCS stations getting built.

 

[Lucken]

either way, there will be plenty more CCS stations getting built.

And that will be great...as long as they're functional.

 

[hmp10]

It seems to me the [EA] network is actually deteriorating and not improving.

Last night I posted a lengthy review of our 4-day road trip that was plagued by problems at every one of the six Electrify America stopovers at four different sites. It was a far worse experience than with EA charging on a similar road trip (using two of the same charging locations) six months ago. This was not unique to Lucid. Drivers of Mach-E's, ID.4's, EV6's, Ioniq 5's, and R1T's were also having problems at these stopovers.

At several stopovers, customers gathered in small groups to grumble or rant about Electrify America. This brand is in a tailspin.

We have decided our next road trip will have to be in our Tesla Model S instead of our Lucid Air -- and we're not happy about it.

 

[moytoyx]

OK, just a bit of an exaggeration, but...

My wife and I took a ride out to East Brunswick, NJ, to visit her sister, about 110 miles from us. Coming back, although I could have easily made it on my i4's initial charge, I decided to try an EA station very close to my wife's sister's house. The experience here was not unlike our experience on Thanksgiving day, with multiple inoperative EA chargers.

Two drivers, who absolutely needed a charge, were beyond furious. One driver had a similar story to one I heard on Thanksgiving day. This was his third EA charger location in NJ he had tried. At the other two, one location was totally inoperative and the other had only 2 of 8 units working, with both functioning units occupied. He told me he regretted buying an EV. This is an absolutely dismal state of affairs for this horrid network of chargers.

I haven't really experienced this on Long Island, but it seems New Jersey is an entirely different story. As I always do when I encounter a bad charger, I called EA to report it as a courtesy to the next driver that might use this location. The agent told me they had the infamous 'trouble ticket' out on the two chargers I tried and it would be tended to shortly. Right.

My wife, who had always been a strong advocate of having 1 EV and one ICE vehicle, turned to me while I was being connected to the EA agent and said, "This is precisely why I don't want two EVs". Who can argue with that logic? Given the circumstances of our last 2 visits to NJ EA chargers, certainly not me.

It seems to me the network is actually deteriorating and not improving. Perhaps I'm wrong. However if these kinds of charging experiences get around, it will have a sobering effect on EV sales. I might think twice or three times taking a trip from NY to Florida. I used to think it would be a piece of cake given all the EA chargers off of i95, but now I wonder.

This EA charging station is convenient off NJ Turnpike exit 9 and about 10 minutes from me. This is the one our friends use when they visit between DC and Long Island. They've never had issues at this one. I'm not sure from your post whether there was an issue at this particular station. These friends have an ID.4 and have made many trips between Long Island to DC and to NC. Being an ID.4 owner they have 2 free years of EA charging and they take that i95 route without complaints.

 

[Lucken]

This EA charging station is convenient off NJ Turnpike exit 9 and about 10 minutes from me. This is the one our friends use when they visit between DC and Long Island. They've never had issues at this one. I'm not sure from your post whether there was an issue at this particular station. These friends have an ID.4 and have made many trips between Long Island to DC and to NC. Being an ID.4 owner they have 2 free years of EA charging and they take that i95 route without complaints.

It was this station. We decided to charge for about 10 minutes before getting on the turnpike. At least 2 of the chargers were down (#4 & #6). I'm not sure how the others were doing. One driver I spoke with at another spot said he was experiencing extremely slow charging. So hopefully it was just a bad day here and not a sign of things to come.

 

[whywar]

One other large EA problem is that charging speed is often limited by EA's software. For instance, I went to a large, 10 charger EA location at a Ft. Lauderdale Walmart, with large 350Kw signs on all the chargers. I plugged in with a 37% full battery and promptly pulled a measly 66Kw. There was a message both in the car and on the EA screen indicating that charging speed is software limited by EA. I looked around at 8 empty stalls , one other vehicle charging, at 22Kw. After 5 minutes of charging, I was pulling only 44Kw. I called EA and they said they would investigate. At most EA chargers I start at 180Kw quickly dropping to around 95Kw and then a steady decline in throughput until it reaches L2 levels. This software limitation on charging speed can only make road trips more time consuming and unpleasant.

 

[MoniputerLM]

I don't think EVs will fail, but it just prolongs the life of ICE phaseout. EVs are still much better for any in town stuff where you can charge at home. I wonder how many of these new EV owners have bought one expecting to only use fast chargers, only to discover, it's not reliable enough and get frustrated. Obvious, they did not do enough research into EVs in general.

My DE-P was our first EV, several Teslas in the family, any I guess that I bought into the Lucid PR that I would get 460 miles of range. The reality is that I love driving my car and just charge at home a couple time per week but have kept my ICE Navigator for long trips. I am OK with this and assume that batteries and chargers will get better in a few years.

 

[tmwong]

There doesn’t seem to be any rhyme or reason to why an EA charger limits the charge rate. Of the dozen times I’ve used EA 150 kW chargers, I’ve gotten limited once… but with no explanation beyond “charging limited by charger”, which is largely uninformative.

- T

 

[RichMalden]

The charging station limitation has been inconstant but common for me. Just yesterday when I was doing a longer charge, it started in the upper 80's kwh but then after maybe 10-15 minutes dropped to the 50's. I unplugged and started a new session and it jumped back into the 80s for about 10-15 more minutes then dropped to the 50s showing the message it was limited by the station again. Restarted 1 more time, got another 10-15 minutes at high speeds and it dropped again but at that point I was pretty much done.

Would have been a nuisance if I hadn't been hanging in my car and wanted/needed to wander during charging.

 

[CapHillDC]

I'm not sure if this is the right tread for this, but since it is about EA it's probably OK here.
This morning my daughter and I drove from DC to Virginia Beach to visit family. Even though I don't have a Lucid yet, I like to try and visit EA sites when possible.
Attached are some pics from Stafford, VA at a Walmart just off Interstate 95. There are 10 stalls, all of which were empty. I don't think there were mechanical issues with them all so I was just surprised that no cars were there charging! The last pic just shows the two 350 kWh stalls. The rest were all 150 with one being 50.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

I'm not sure if this is the right tread for this, but since it is about EA it's probably OK here.
This morning my daughter and I drove from DC to Virginia Beach to visit family. Even though I don't have a Lucid yet, I like to try and visit EA sites when possible.
Attached are some pics from Stafford, VA at a Walmart just off Interstate 95. There are 10 stalls, all of which were empty. I don't think there were mechanical issues with them all so I was just surprised that no cars were there charging! The last pic just shows the two 350 kWh stalls. The rest were all 150 with one being 50.

Interesting, those are the older ABB units which supposedly they’re replacing. Did they appear to be online? The Wal-Mart by me has those, and my car will not charge on any of them. EA says they have service tickets out for 2/4 chargers there but my problem has happened since early October. My car seems to work ok at most other EA sites though it’s mostly much slower than advertised, but it’s then same for other EVs and not just Lucid. I’ve found the most reliable network to be EVGo, but they don’t have as many chargers and the fastest I’ve ever had was 201kw on a 350kw at a low SOC% on a preconditioned battery.

 

[CapHillDC]

I'm not sure how to tell if the units are online. I looked at the 350s and one of the 150s and did not see error messages.

 

[SDHacker]

I'm not sure how to tell if the units are online. I looked at the 350s and one of the 150s and did not see error messages.

Use the EA app to see if they show as available. If the screen is off or there is an error msg, that's the easy pain free way of knowing it isn't working. The problem is that some chargers will look fine but either fail to connect to your car or fail to start charging or start charging then immediately stop. I usually give it 2 shots then move to another charger. A station can be full of cars then 30 minutes later, empty. I'll check the EA app, it shows all 4 chargers are empty and 10 minutes later, I get there and it's full.

 

[Bunnylebowski]

Use the EA app to see if they show as available. If the screen is off or there is an error msg, that's the easy pain free way of knowing it isn't working. The problem is that some chargers will look fine but either fail to connect to your car or fail to start charging or start charging then immediately stop. I usually give it 2 shots then move to another charger. A station can be full of cars then 30 minutes later, empty. I'll check the EA app, it shows all 4 chargers are empty and 10 minutes later, I get there and it's full.

What’s interesting is I’ve found the Lucid navigation more accurate than the EA app as to what stations are actually available. I’ve had the EA app say they were working/available but then when I arrived they were actually in service mode and not working. Another time EA said one was not available and in use but the Lucid nav said they were free and sure enough when I got there the stall was free. Very confusing! At the EA site I couldn’t charge at the EA rep on the phone also said her thing was saying the station was available even though it was obviously in service mode with a DOS looking boot screen. . EA very truly has no clue what’s going on.

 

[CapHillDC]

This morning I drove from Virginia Beach back to DC. I stopped by the EA charging station in Newport News, VA. When I got there only 1 of the 10 stalls were in use. Just before the guy in his BMW I4 left, I asked him about about his EA experience so far. He said he has never had any issues. After coming out of Walmart a half hour later, there were two Ioniq 5s and one VW ID.4. I stopped to talk with the guy in the ID.4 with NC plates to ask him about his EA experiences so far. He too said that he has had no issues with EA. That's great to hear!

 

[Negan1000]

This morning I drove from Virginia Beach back to DC. I stopped by the EA charging station in Newport News, VA. When I got there only 1 of the 10 stalls were in use. Just before the guy in his BMW I4 left, I asked him about about his EA experience so far. He said he has never had any issues. After coming out of Walmart a half hour later, there were two Ioniq 5s and one VW ID.4. I stopped to talk with the guy in the ID.4 with NC plates to ask him about his EA experiences so far. He too said that he has had no issues with EA. That's great to hear!

Maybe there’s hope that we will be able to plug and charge at any EA Station on first try.

 

[joec]

Maybe there’s hope that we will be able to plug and charge at any EA Station on first try.

Worked for me. Second try worked, too.