When will Gravity be available to test drive (Northern NJ)

[Blue Lectroid]

While Rawlinson has explained why the deliveries will come slowly, he has not explained what the main differences will be between the Grand Touring and the Touring, although final pricing has been announced for both. As we've seen from some posts on this forum, that is a real issue for some potential buyers who, for whatever reason, are facing an imminent buying decision. They can't or don't want to pay the price of a Grand Touring, but don't know whether the Touring will have the range and other features they want -- or even have any idea when those answers will be coming. Surely by now, in order to set final pricing for the Touring, Lucid must at least know what size battery pack and motor configuration it will have, two factors that will loom large for many buyers in deciding whether the Touring will fit their needs or if they need to move on now with another brand.

With regard to customers trying to decide between a Grand Touring and Touring? If there is any doubt in their minds, they can simply wait for the Touring to be announced later this year. The Grand Touring will STILL be available after the Touring is announced, so how doe it impose on anyone to not know what that feature set will be in the future? If they want / need a Gravity sooner, they need to get a GT. If they are concerned enough about the GT's cost and/or that it's over featured for them, they wait.

Some may argue that this will make Lucid lose sales -- and that may be true. However, it will also likely have many folks get the higher margin GT now because they do not want to wait even though they might ultimately be just fine with a Touring when the specs are announced. ALL the manufacturers play this game these days and I'd assume that through analysis they have learned that the lost sales are worth less economically than the additional sales of GTs (that might "only" be Touring's in the future if the specs were known today) from folks who either do not want to or cannot wait -- otherwise they would not all do things this way, right?

 

[borski]

That's decidedly odd for a launch as closely watched as this one both by this forum and by the press, leading to assumptions they must be under an information embargo.

Just thinking about numbers - if the forum represents 2% of owners, and if there were 9 deliveries, most of which were to employees that were not going to say anything publicly anyway - what are the chances that the few customer deliveries aren't just ... enjoying their cars and not posting on forums?

 

[hmp10]

With regard to customers trying to decide between a Grand Touring and Touring? If there is any doubt in their minds, they can simply wait for the Touring to be announced later this year. The Grand Touring will STILL be available after the Touring is announced, so how doe it impose on anyone to not know what that feature set will be in the future? If they want / need a Gravity sooner, they need to get a GT. If they are concerned enough about the GT's cost and/or that it's over featured for them, they wait.

I think you missed the point of my post. I was referring to potential buyers who do not want or cannot afford to pay the price of a Grand Touring. If they are dealing with issues such as lease terminations on their current car or a spouse who is pressing to buy something quickly -- both situations related by posters on this forum -- they might want to know whether it's worth the expense to extend a lease or make the effort to convince an impatient spouse to wait for more to be known about the Touring.

I simply do not believe that Lucid could announce final pricing for the Touring without at least having already decided the size of its battery pack (thus impacting range) and whether it will be single- or dual-motor (relevant to those who need 4-wheel drive). And those are probably the two most important factors in deciding whether or not a Touring will fit your needs and is worth waiting for.

 

[hmp10]

Just thinking about numbers - if the forum represents 2% of owners, and if there were 9 deliveries, most of which were to employees that were not going to say anything publicly anyway - what are the chances that the few customer deliveries aren't just ... enjoying their cars and not posting on forums?

Could be. But I really don't know how much time a few posts here or on social media would take away from driving time. Plus, as so many of us know, half the enjoyment of owning a Lucid is posting about it on this forum.

 

[Blue Lectroid]

I think you missed the point of my post. I was referring to potential buyers who do not want or cannot afford to pay the price of a Grand Touring. If they are dealing with issues such as lease terminations on their current car or a spouse who is pressing to buy something quickly -- both situations related by posters on this forum -- they might want to know whether it's worth the expense to extend a lease or make the effort to convince an impatient spouse to wait for more to be known about the Touring.

I simply do not believe that Lucid could announce final pricing for the Touring without at least having already decided the size of its battery pack (thus impacting range) and whether it will be single- or dual-motor (relevant to those who need 4-wheel drive). And those are probably the two most important factors in deciding whether or not a Touring will fit your needs and is worth waiting for.

And I believe that you missed my point. OF COURSE Lucid already has the feature set and specs for the Touring! They probably had those set in stone a year ago at least. They are deliberately NOT sharing them at this time because it makes more sense financially for them to approach things this way...as MANY other major manufacturers do when initiating new products that will be de-featured and sold for less down the road.

BTW, Rawlinson DID say in two interviews that the second spec for Gravity was going to be a "Touring, not a Pure." To me that telegraphs dual motor, AWD all the way...

 

[hmp10]

ALL the manufacturers play this game these days and I'd assume that through analysis they have learned that the lost sales are worth less economically than the additional sales of GTs (that might "only" be Touring's in the future if the specs were known today) from folks who either do not want to or cannot wait -- otherwise they would not all do things this way, right?

I'm not sure that all manufacturers do this. Rivian announced plans for eventual dual-motor versions of the R1T and R1S along with unveiling the 4-motor version. VW did something similar by announcing at the outset that the launch single-motor ID.4 would soon be followed by a dual-motor version. They also announced upfront that the short-body ID.Buzz would not be coming to the U.S. market at all. The list goes on.

As for what games other carmakers might play, few of them are under the pressure Lucid is to show how quickly they can fill the order books. Trying to play the high-margin-first game -- if that's even what Lucid is playing -- might not be the best strategy when more attention is focused on whether Lucid can really pull in buyers from the larger SUV market, especially when its high price point can be even more of a drag than it was in the luxury sedan market.

 

[HC_79]

I'm not sure that all manufacturers do this

You’re correct. I know Audi releases all the versions with specs at the same time. When I ordered the e-Tron the Prestige and Premium Plus were both available to choose the day the reservations opened.

 

[Blue Lectroid]

I'm not sure that all manufacturers do this. Rivian announced plans for eventual dual-motor versions of the R1T and R1S along with unveiling the 4-motor version. VW did something similar by announcing at the outset that the launch single-motor ID.4 would soon be followed by a dual-motor version. They also announced upfront that the short-body ID.Buzz would not be coming to the U.S. market at all. The list goes on.

As for what games other carmakers might play, few of them are under the pressure Lucid is to show how quickly they can fill the order books. Trying to play the high-margin-first game -- if that's even what Lucid is playing -- might not be the best strategy when more attention is focused on whether Lucid can really pull in buyers from the larger SUV market, especially when its high price point can be even more of a drag than it was in the luxury sedan market.

Lucid is very clearly playing the "long game." They are not in a rush even though many wish they would move faster. They are well financed, have a very deep-pocket, long term investor and I believe that they are executing a business plan built around being a dominant force in the EV space for decades to come and are less worried about this month or even this Quarter. If the products are truly world class (and that DOES involve getting their UX to the same level as the physical engineering / driving aspects of the cars), there will be plenty of growth and profits to come.

That said, part of this will necessarily include sync'ing all aspects of marketing efforts better such that corporate and field sales are all marching to the same drummer and communicating clearly (and regularly) across all platforms (including directly with existing and prospective customers).

 

[DrLucid]

Most of the people who ordered GGTare the ones who love the driving dynamics handling and luxury in the air and the confidence they have in the company after experiencing the air.
There’s always the 5-10% who always have complaints about any product. But there’s a difference between people asking for help on this forum by raising an issue and those who just complain. The complainers will never be satisfied how much ever any company does.
Because somebody raises an issue it to seek help from fellow lucid owners doesn’t mean that they are complaining about the car/product.

If gravity Is fully ready and gets delivered tomorrow or if it’s delivered a few months later there will still be people who will put posts positive and negative. distinguishing between people asking for suggestions and minuscule group who complain is very important.

Just because me and some other’s have an issue with the communication from lucid that doesn’t mean we are trying to put down lucid or have anything against Lucid. Most of us love the product we have and I for sure will take the GGT even without test driving it. ( Blind faith)

I hope you know how tough it is to convince the home minister to buy a car. I worked hard to convince her and told her it would be a gift for her birthday. On her birthday they released 9 cars. That day I could see the non verbal response in her eyes. Then I told her it will be delivered by the anniversary ( not happening). Now if it gets delivered in April then the only thing I’ve left is to tell her is it’s my birthday gift that I’ll give her and then I’ll drive it. In the mean while she asked me about two other cars for which I showed her the bad aspects and convinced her with logic.

Communication does help in a lot of ways including the above scenario

 

[HC_79]

Lucid is very clearly playing the "long game." They are not in a rush even though many wish they would move faster. They are well financed, have a very deep-pocket, long term investor and I believe that they are executing a business plan built around being a dominant force in the EV space for decades to come and are less worried about this month or even this Quarter. If the products are truly world class (and that DOES involve getting their UX to the same level as the physical engineering / driving aspects of the cars), there will be plenty of growth and profits to come.

That said, part of this will necessarily include sync'ing all aspects of marketing efforts better such that corporate and field sales are all marching to the same drummer and communicating clearly (and regularly) across all platforms (including directly with existing and prospective customers).

lol! if that’s the case then maybe they should’ve remained private and not become publicly traded. I’m sure investors would love being told “we don’t care about this month or quarter”

Just because Lucid has deep pockets it doesn’t mean they can just play the “who cares” card when it comes to sales and new owners etc.

 

[037]

Touring is probably going to be 95-105kw with 350 range and a max of 628hp. Just basic comparison of touring vs GT on air applied into the GGT space.

Are they going to cut the air suspension? Probably, not much else to cut from basic formula.

Going to assume all the expensive add ons will still be available to improve profit margin.

 

[Blue Lectroid]

lol! if that’s the case then maybe they should’ve remained private and not become publicly traded. I’m sure investors would love being told “we don’t care about this month or quarter”

Just because Lucid has deep pockets it doesn’t mean they can just play the “who cares” card when it comes to sales and new owners etc.

Let's both agree that we have very different views of how this is being handled. Viva la difference! BTW, I have purchased a fair number of shares EXACTLY because I believe in companies that play the long game...

 

[hmp10]

Lucid is very clearly playing the "long game." They are not in a rush even though many wish they would move faster.

I have posted many times that Lucid -- and particularly the Saudis -- are playing a very long game. However, there's a difference between expecting Lucid to move faster In engineering and manufacturing and expecting them to communicate to customers more clearly after they start taking orders. Part of the "long game" should be avoiding a reputation for timing announcements to align more with earnings calls and stock market windows -- which is a quintessential "short game" play -- than with customer needs and reasonable expectations.

I'm not as exercised about this issue as @HC_79, but he raised an interesting point about that year-end delivery event. What really was the point? By last summer Lucid had already pulled back from earlier talk about late-year deliveries and changed the public messaging to talking only about start of production by year end. So I don't know that there were any expectations of year-end deliveries. The stock hit $3.30 on December 26, closed 8% lower the day of the delivery announcement, and is currently trading around $2.80. So there was certainly no stock bump from the delivery event.

What there was from the delivery event was an increased expectation by many order holders that demo and test drive Gravities would soon start showing up at Design Studios. But it's been a month now and there are no such cars to be found in Design Studios. Even more to the point, except for one we've heard about, most Design Studios are still telling callers that it might be March before they show up. And let's face it: Lucid really doesn't have that many Design Studios. It would take only about 14 Gravities to put one in every major U.S. metropolitan center where Lucid has one or more Design Studios.

So, back to @HC_79's point . . . might it not have been better to get those nine early delivery cars to the highest-volume Design Studios where the broader public could see them, drive them, get excited about them, and talk about them in public media instead of to nine mostly insiders who can't or won't talk publicly about them?

What, really, was the point of a tiny delivery event that snagged only a couple of days of press buzz and, if it moved the market at all, seems to have moved it down?

 

[msaunders9430]

Most of the people who ordered GGTare the ones who love the driving dynamics handling and luxury in the air and the confidence they have in the company after experiencing the air.
There’s always the 5-10% who always have complaints about any product. But there’s a difference between people asking for help on this forum by raising an issue and those who just complain. The complainers will never be satisfied how much ever any company does.
Because somebody raises an issue it to seek help from fellow lucid owners doesn’t mean that they are complaining about the car/product.

If gravity Is fully ready and gets delivered tomorrow or if it’s delivered a few months later there will still be people who will put posts positive and negative. distinguishing between people asking for suggestions and minuscule group who complain is very important.

Just because me and some other’s have an issue with the communication from lucid that doesn’t mean we are trying to put down lucid or have anything against Lucid. Most of us love the product we have and I for sure will take the GGT even without test driving it. ( Blind faith)

I hope you know how tough it is to convince the home minister to buy a car. I worked hard to convince her and told her it would be a gift for her birthday. On her birthday they released 9 cars. That day I could see the non verbal response in her eyes. Then I told her it will be delivered by the anniversary ( not happening). Now if it gets delivered in April then the only thing I’ve left is to tell her is it’s my birthday gift that I’ll give her and then I’ll drive it. In the mean while she asked me about two other cars for which I showed her the bad aspects and convinced her with logic.

Communication does help in a lot of ways including the above scenario

Well said.

Key statement you made: "distinguishing between people asking for suggestions and minuscule group who complain is very important".
Very important yet very challenging.
Your post gets at the main challenge with most online forums; intent, perspective, and reason for participation.

The reasons people are on this forum can range from they love their Lucid, are shareholders, and want to share their experiences as well has help others like them or potential owners to they enjoy trolling whether for themselves or as part of an affiliation with a competing brand. And then you have all the reasons in between. Such as "I don't feel like reading the owner's manual to try to solve my issue or I shouldn't have to, so I'm just gonna ask or vent my frustration". Distinguishing the people and their intentions sometimes takes deciding to let the conversation play out through multiple posts or not. Letting the conversation play out can be rewarding, but sometimes disappointing. You can't get back that time with a troll.

Long live the Lucidowners.com forum!!!

BTW @DrLucid I hope things go well with the home minister and logic wins.

 

[WeighingGravity]

might it not have been better to get those nine early delivery cars to the highest-volume Design Studios where the broader public could see them, drive them, get excited about them, and talk about them in public media instead of to nine mostly insiders who can't or won't talk publicly about them?

What, really, was the point of a tiny delivery event that snagged only a couple of days of press buzz and, if it moved the market at all, seems to have moved it down?

The car isn't finished. The mfg line may not be finished either. To the extent that they said they would deliver some orders by YE2024, they get to say they kept the promise (which IMO was the point of the event). But I think it's obvious (though I have no smoking guns obviously, I am just a dude with a pre-order and what I read on the internet) from a massive preponderance of the evidence that there are still elements of the car that need work or parts of manufacturing that haven't come together enough for them to want to put these cars in front of anyone who might have something to say about them on the internet. I guess the hope is that soon they'll be able to do that, but the fact that they built 9 cars and then apparently shut the line down (or they're hoarding vehicles inside the factory where the guy who's doing the flyovers can't see them) suggests strongly (to me) that they're still working on things that make them not want to run any more just yet. (Does that intimate more than software, since software should be OTA adjustable?)

FWIW my sales advisor did just reach out to me last week. It was with kind of a nothing-burger from an information standpoint (same email I think others have received about how I'll be reached out to when demo drives are available) but hey, at least it was a touchpoint, and I appreciated it.

 

[hmp10]

The car isn't finished. The mfg line may not be finished either. To the extent that they said they would deliver some orders by YE2024, they get to say they kept the promise (which IMO was the point of the event). But I think it's obvious (though I have no smoking guns obviously, I am just a dude with a pre-order and what I read on the internet) from a massive preponderance of the evidence that there are still elements of the car that need work or parts of manufacturing that haven't come together enough for them to want to put these cars in front of anyone who might have something to say about them on the internet. I guess the hope is that soon they'll be able to do that, but the fact that they built 9 cars and then apparently shut the line down (or they're hoarding vehicles inside the factory where the guy who's doing the flyovers can't see them) suggests strongly (to me) that they're still working on things that make them not want to run any more just yet. (Does that intimate more than software, since software should be OTA adjustable?)

FWIW my sales advisor did just reach out to me last week. It was with kind of a nothing-burger from an information standpoint (same email I think others have received about how I'll be reached out to when demo drives are available) but hey, at least it was a touchpoint, and I appreciated it.

You may be right. I just got an email from my delivery advisor telling me that a Gravity was coming to Montreal for a viewing. (He and I are both in south Florida.) I opened the link, and it was the same prototype Gravity that I've already seen twice at the Miami Brickell and the Miami Worldcenter Design Studios several months ago. No mention of when a production Gravity will be available to view or to test drive.

 

[msaunders9430]

You may be right. I just got an email from my delivery advisor telling me that a Gravity was coming to Montreal for a viewing. (He and I are both in south Florida.) I opened the link, and it was the same prototype Gravity that I've already seen twice at the Miami Brickell and the Miami Worldcenter Design Studios several months ago. No mention of when a production Gravity will be available to view or to test drive.

Wait a minute ... Montreal, QC?
And you live in Florida.
What am I missing?

He just wanted you to know that a Gravity was coming to that studio even though it's miles away?

Maybe he knows you'd fly up for a production Gravity? Didn't think you'd open the link.

 

[hmp10]

And you live in Florida.
What am I missing?

Humidity.
Hurricanes.
Sea level rise.
Book bans.
Yard Gators (which I really enjoy, actually).

He just wanted you to know that a Gravity was coming to that studio even though it's miles away?

Maybe he knows you'd fly up for a production Gravity? Didn't think you'd open the link.

It was just a pro-forma message with a link to a Lucid corporate publicity flyer that showed all the locations that had a Gravity prototype on view over the past few months. I have no idea why Florida-based sales reps would be sending it to Florida residents when Montreal was the only location showing an upcoming viewing event.

I wouldn't go to Montreal to see even a production Gravity. A test drive, though . . . ?

Naaaah. Not in winter.

 

[HC_79]

I have no idea why Florida-based sales reps would be sending it to Florida residents when Montreal was the only location showing an upcoming viewing event.

Probably because they’ve been told to communicate with customers even when they’ve got nothing valuable to communicate.

 

[WeighingGravity]

I got the same form letter, I think. Strangely, I just got a second copy of the same note I got on Friday.