Thoughts on Sitting in a Gravity

[borski]

I didn't check that out, but maybe those who've been in later cars did?

If I recall correctly, it was a 2 and 1 situation; middle and left, and right.

 

[hmp10]

So ingress/egress isn’t…great. What about when you’re actually seated? Your world back there as an adult would have to far better than the torture you’re subjected to in the third row of a Tesla Model X.

I found the reports and videos from reviewers to be accurate -- i. e., good third-row head and legroom, even for very tall adults. The second-row seats have quite a range of fore/aft movement. It took running the second row all the way back to touch my knees in the third row. But there is plenty of room in the second row to keep those seats well forward, which left plenty of legroom in the third row.

However, the bottom seat cushions were extraordinarily short in terms of thigh support. This is probably the price of folding those seats into the cargo floor. But since so many EVs jack the knees up due to battery modules under the floorpan, EV rear passengers are often used to not much thigh support. The leg drop in the Gravity third row, however, was actually pretty good. The short cushions might make the seats less comfortable on a long ride but are probably not an issue for shorter durations.

I no longer know what to think about the ingress/egress issue. I certainly found it challenging in this prototype, but posts by @borski and @hydbob, who have been in later production versions, found it less daunting. And, as I noted earlier, with only one exception the reviewers have been notably silent on this issue. This might have been quite an early beta prototype. It didn't even have the bronzed glass cover in the front console that showed up in the L.A. show cars almost a year ago.

It's been a while since I test drove a Model X. Even so, I still remember the third-row seating as abyssmal. In fact, the second row was no great shakes and, confoundingly, its bench seat was more comfortable than its captains chairs. (You didn't ask, but the Gravity second row absolutely blows the Model X out of the water.) The Gravity third row is actually usable for adults. I'd put it on a sliding scale. For starters, everybody fits. But the smaller and younger you are, the longer the third row will be comfortable on a trip.

 

[Bus Driver]

I found the reports and videos from reviewers to be accurate -- i. e., good third-row head and legroom, even for very tall adults. The second-row seats have quite a range of fore/aft movement. It took running the second row all the way back to touch my knees in the third row. But there is plenty of room in the second row to keep those seats well forward, which left plenty of legroom in the third row.

However, the bottom seat cushions were extraordinarily short in terms of thigh support. This is probably the price of folding those seats into the cargo floor. But since so many EVs jack the knees up due to battery modules under the floorpan, EV rear passengers are often used to not much thigh support. The leg drop in the Gravity third row, however, was actually pretty good. The short cushions might make the seats less comfortable on a long ride but are probably not an issue for shorter durations.

I no longer know what to think about the ingress/egress issue. I certainly found it challenging in this prototype, but posts by @borski and @hydbob, who have been in later production versions, found it less daunting. And, as I noted earlier, with only one exception the reviewers have been notably silent on this issue. This might have been quite an early beta prototype. It didn't even have the bronzed glass cover in the front console that showed up in the L.A. show cars almost a year ago.

It's been a while since I test drove a Model X. Even so, I still remember the third-row seating as abyssmal. In fact, the second row was no great shakes and, confoundingly, its bench seat was more comfortable than its captains chairs. (You didn't ask, but the Gravity second row absolutely blows the Model X out of the water.) The Gravity third row is actually usable for adults. I'd put it on a sliding scale. For starters, everybody fits. But the smaller and younger you are, the longer the third row will be comfortable on a trip.

Excellent. Thank you. I’m hoping if Lucid gets enough feedback from impromptu testers like yourself, they’ll lengthen the third row seat cushions.

No, I didn’t ask, but I’m very glad you brought it up. You’re absolutely correct. The middle row captain’s chairs in the Model X are nothing to write home about. They slide forward and aft electrically, they tip forwward to allow entry into the third row, and that’s about it. No recline, no inside armrest, no outboard overhead grabhandle, no seatpocket, no coat hook, no storage areas, no much of anything.

I got the middle row captain’s chairs in our Model X because I was enamoured of their pedestal design and their electrical function. Sometimes I think if I had it to do all over again I would have ordered the middle three-seat bench instead, allowing for seating for seven. On the other hand, legroom in that configuration would have gone from parsimonious to nonexistent, leaving you as I’ve griped before, with a space fit only for housepets, small children and leg amputees.

 

[hmp10]

Getting more curious about what that mysterious fifth interior color palette might be. Here's hoping it will be the Santa Monica interior of the Air Dream. It was way too nice a color to be abandoned after just 520 cars.

Given that two of the four palettes already announced are carryovers from the Air . . . .

 

[xponents]

Getting more curious about what that mysterious fifth interior color palette might be. Here's hoping it will be the Santa Monica interior of the Air Dream. It was way too nice a color to be abandoned after just 520 cars.

Given that two of the four palettes already announced are carryovers from the Air . . . .

I hope its the long lost "Big Basin" colorway that was abandoned for the Air (for unknown reasons)!

 

[hmp10]

I hope its the long lost "Big Basin" colorway that was abandoned for the Air (for unknown reasons)!

"Big Basin"

"Santa Monica"

 

[levsha]

There is pretty simple "family car" test for the 2nd row for me: put 2 IsoFix child seats into the second row and ask an adult to also seat there. Surprisingly many cars fails it ...

 

[Kevin P]

Hello Lucid Family. Great review in Gravity. I have a Lucid Air and it is a great car. Ask me how many times I have sat in the back and it is either once or twice for less than 30 seconds. I plan on getting a gravity and the wife and kids can figure out the third row issue.

 

[hmp10]

. . . the wife and kids can figure out the third row issue.

Yep, that'll work. If the kids aren't old enough to care where they sit, they'll fit just fine. If they're old enough to find it a bit tight on a long trip, they'll still roll with it, as they'll want to sit as far away from their parents as they can, anyway.

 

[hmp10]

I hope its the long lost "Big Basin" colorway that was abandoned for the Air (for unknown reasons)!

Hard to tell from the photo, but the darker tone in "Big Basin" doesn't look far off from the Gravity "Ojai".

 

[BS8899]

Let me share some thoughts on 3-row SUV, Gravity, and MiniVans.

Disclosure: Over the years, I’ve owned a 3-row station wagon (MB E320), a VW Eurovan (seats 7, captain’s chair 2nd row, 3 seats on 3rd row bench seat), and my current Rivian R1S. I’ve transported 7 passengers in these vehicles for long trips. And I am about to take 6 adult passengers for a 450-mile trip from Marin to OC in the coming week in the Rivian.

Without going into nuances, subjective arguments and advocacies, let me make the following observations:

• If you want to transport 7 passengers in comfort on long trips, mini van is the only way to go. This is especially relevant for older or over-sized passengers where contortion is not comfortable. A mini-van has the height, wide rear entry doors (e.g., sliding doors on the Odessey and VW Eurovan), plenty of headroom and legroom, comfortable seat heights, etc. You can’t beat that. Ingress/egress of the 3rd row is a cinch.
• 
  
• No matter how big the SUV is or how clever the design, 3rd row SUV seating and ingress/egress are always compromised. The second-row doors are never wide enough to comfortably access the 3rd row. You will have to contort to get in and out. It is only a question of degree.
  
  I have no direct experience with the Tesla Model-X. However, from what I saw on pictures and videos, while the 3rd row seats look pathetic for adults, the ingress/egress looked good with the “Falcon Wings” as the 3rd row passenger can access the 3rd row readily and you don’t have to contort yourself as much at entry or exit. Seated in the 3rd row of the Model X for an extended trip is another matter.
  
  
• When assessing “legroom”, you can’t just look at the space between edge of the 2nd or 3rd row and measure its distance to the back of the row in front of it. Seat height and seat depth can make huge differences in the seated comfort on longer trips.
  
  I don’t have actual data on the Gravity seats. Comparing my Lucid AGT and my R1S, I am seated considerably higher in the R1S. Thus, I need LESS leg room for the same comfort. This, in turn, opens more leg room for the 2nd and 3rd row passengers. Point is, visually, the Lucid (AGT) has globs of legroom for both driver and passengers but the low seated posture requires more legroom to get the same comfort. Similar considerations apply to t Gravity, though not necessarily to the same degree. Don’t just assume that the Gravity ahs a “stupid amount legroom” and that automatically translate to seated comfort.
  
  
• As for the 3rd row, again, I have no actual experience with the Gravity. Both my son and I are 5ft 11in. I weigh ~196lbs. My son weighs ~220lbs. We can both be seated comfortably in the 3rd row of the R1S. I wouldn’t want to ride the 3rd row for a 6-hour non-stop strip. A couple of hours is OK. That said, the ingress-egress from the 3rd row of the R1S is doable but not great. My son (25 years old) has no problem with it whilst I am not crazy about getting in-and-out of the 3rd row.
  
  Once seated, the R1S 3rd row’s seat height, seat depth, and headroom are good. The 3rd row seats on the R1S are “full-sized”, same width and depth as the 2nd row. Seat height of the 3rd row is ~1” shorter than the 2nd row.
  
  The low height of the Gravity 3rd row concerns me, but I have no actual experience with it.

In summary, my take is:

• An SUV is really a 4-5 passenger car with an occasionally usage for up to 7 passengers. If you regularly transport 5-7 passengers, get a mini-van.
• The 3rd row is always a compromise. Ingress/egress will always be problematic.
• I am sure Gravity has excellent designs for space utilization. That said, the low height and shorter length (compared to other 3-row SUVs) are concerning. Getting six or seven 6ft passengers into it is one metric. Transporting these passengers in comfort for 2hr-plus trips is a whole different mater.

 

[Bus Driver]

Let me share some thoughts on 3-row SUV, Gravity, and MiniVans.

Disclosure: Over the years, I’ve owned a 3-row station wagon (MB E320), a VW Eurovan (seats 7, captain’s chair 2nd row, 3 seats on 3rd row bench seat), and my current Rivian R1S. I’ve transported 7 passengers in these vehicles for long trips. And I am about to take 6 adult passengers for a 450-mile trip from Marin to OC in the coming week in the Rivian.

Without going into nuances, subjective arguments and advocacies, let me make the following observations:

• If you want to transport 7 passengers in comfort on long trips, mini van is the only way to go. This is especially relevant for older or over-sized passengers where contortion is not comfortable. A mini-van has the height, wide rear entry doors (e.g., sliding doors on the Odessey and VW Eurovan), plenty of headroom and legroom, comfortable seat heights, etc. You can’t beat that. Ingress/egress of the 3rd row is a cinch.
• 
  
• No matter how big the SUV is or how clever the design, 3rd row SUV seating and ingress/egress are always compromised. The second-row doors are never wide enough to comfortably access the 3rd row. You will have to contort to get in and out. It is only a question of degree.
  
  I have no direct experience with the Tesla Model-X. However, from what I saw on pictures and videos, while the 3rd row seats look pathetic for adults, the ingress/egress looked good with the “Falcon Wings” as the 3rd row passenger can access the 3rd row readily and you don’t have to contort yourself as much at entry or exit. Seated in the 3rd row of the Model X for an extended trip is another matter.
  
  
• When assessing “legroom”, you can’t just look at the space between edge of the 2nd or 3rd row and measure its distance to the back of the row in front of it. Seat height and seat depth can make huge differences in the seated comfort on longer trips.
  
  I don’t have actual data on the Gravity seats. Comparing my Lucid AGT and my R1S, I am seated considerably higher in the R1S. Thus, I need LESS leg room for the same comfort. This, in turn, opens more leg room for the 2nd and 3rd row passengers. Point is, visually, the Lucid (AGT) has globs of legroom for both driver and passengers but the low seated posture requires more legroom to get the same comfort. Similar considerations apply to t Gravity, though not necessarily to the same degree. Don’t just assume that the Gravity ahs a “stupid amount legroom” and that automatically translate to seated comfort.
  
  
• As for the 3rd row, again, I have no actual experience with the Gravity. Both my son and I are 5ft 11in. I weigh ~196lbs. My son weighs ~220lbs. We can both be seated comfortably in the 3rd row of the R1S. I wouldn’t want to ride the 3rd row for a 6-hour non-stop strip. A couple of hours is OK. That said, the ingress-egress from the 3rd row of the R1S is doable but not great. My son (25 years old) has no problem with it whilst I am not crazy about getting in-and-out of the 3rd row.
  
  Once seated, the R1S 3rd row’s seat height, seat depth, and headroom are good. The 3rd row seats on the R1S are “full-sized”, same width and depth as the 2nd row. Seat height of the 3rd row is ~1” shorter than the 2nd row.
  
  The low height of the Gravity 3rd row concerns me, but I have no actual experience with it.

In summary, my take is:

• An SUV is really a 4-5 passenger car with an occasionally usage for up to 7 passengers. If you regularly transport 5-7 passengers, get a mini-van.
• The 3rd row is always a compromise. Ingress/egress will always be problematic.
• I am sure Gravity has excellent designs for space utilization. That said, the low height and shorter length (compared to other 3-row SUVs) are concerning. Getting six or seven 6ft passengers into it is one metric. Transporting these passengers in comfort for 2hr-plus trips is a whole different mater.

Upon clapping his eyes for the first on the Gravity, and absolutely meaning to be derisive, my partner exclaimed - “it’s a minivan!”

To this day he has no idea how happy he made me.

 

[hmp10]

• If you want to transport 7 passengers in comfort on long trips, mini van is the only way to go. This is especially relevant for older or over-sized passengers where contortion is not comfortable. A mini-van has the height, wide rear entry doors (e.g., sliding doors on the Odessey and VW Eurovan), plenty of headroom and legroom, comfortable seat heights, etc. You can’t beat that. Ingress/egress of the 3rd row is a cinch.

For carrying 6-7 passengers, minivans are definitely the benchmark. However, the Gravity actually has a fractionally longer wheelbase than our Honda Odyssey, which gives Lucid the room they needed to rival fore/aft legroom. They succeeded in this metric. In fact, they may have slightly beaten our Odyssey.

The Odyssey is a taller vehicle than the Gravity by 4.4 inches (although I don't know the ride height at which the Gravity measure is given). However, the headroom in our Odyssey is actually excessive, and the Gravity had plenty. My 6'1" partner had plenty of headroom in the rear seat, and a 6'7" staffer of "Throttle House" was able to sit in the third row and tap the top of his head with his hand. At 5'8", I had to look up at the roof even to notice it.

• No matter how big the SUV is or how clever the design, 3rd row SUV seating and ingress/egress are always compromised. The second-row doors are never wide enough to comfortably access the 3rd row. You will have to contort to get in and out. It is only a question of degree.

I am a fan of sliding rear doors and was disappointed Lucid decided not to take that route. However, the Gravity rear doors are fairly wide -- enough to pose issues in parking spaces -- and the door opened as close to the rear wheel well as it does in our Odyssey. Although a bit better than the Gravity, our Odyssey is no piece of cake when it comes to third-row ingress/egress. The door openings in both vehicles extend all the way back to the rear wheel well, which is the source of the impediment.

• When assessing “legroom”, you can’t just look at the space between edge of the 2nd or 3rd row and measure its distance to the back of the row in front of it. Seat height and seat depth can make huge differences in the seated comfort on longer trips.

True, which is why I noted in an earlier post that the third-row "leg drop" is pretty good in the Gravity third row. I use that term for brevity instead of the term Lucid uses to capture this metric: angle of knee bend. In fact, in all three rows the Gravity offered the relaxed knee angle this is more typical of ICE cars than EVs with underfloor battery packs. The seating position in the Gravity was as comfortable as our Odyssey -- and possibly with even more second-row space.

Access aside, the real issue once seated was the short bottom cushion. It did not reflect lack of fore/aft legroom or affect knee angle, but it did create an odd sensation of lack of thigh support. This is why I think it is the result of needing to fold the seat into the cargo floor instead of dealing with too little legroom. The Odyssey folds its third row the same way, but the Odyssey doesn't have to clear a rear motor and rear axle as Lucid must.

BTW . . . I'm glad of that rear motor. The one thing that drives me crazy about the Odyssey is its poor traction in rain. With its weight, front-wheel drive, and skinny tires, I hate when a red light turns green and I sit there trying to feather the throttle as weight shifts backward and the wheels spin and chatter while other cars accelerate smoothly away. There was a discussion elsewhere on this board about whether a single-motor Gravity should be front- or rear-wheel drive. Rear wheel. No question for a vehicle of that weight.

 

[BS8899]

Upon clapping his eyes for the first on the Gravity, and absolutely meaning to be derisive, my partner exclaimed - “it’s a minivan!”

To this day he has no idea how happy he made me.

Go for the VW Buzz!

Seriously, the Buzz is a bit expensive and not enough range....I hope it gets better, or an EV Odessey?!

 

[hmp10]

Go for the VW Buzz!

Seriously, the Buzz is a bit expensive and not enough range....I hope it gets better, or an EV Odessey?!

Ever since we got our Air almost three years ago, my dream vehicle has been a Honda Odyssey on a Lucid platform. Fortunately, the Gravity gets close enough -- and in a much sexier package.

 

[levsha]

Go for the VW Buzz!

Seriously, the Buzz is a bit expensive and not enough range....I hope it gets better, or an EV Odessey?!

I was waiting for ID.Buzz, but then our friends bought it, and the real world range is completely disappointing.

 

[Bus Driver]

I was waiting for ID.Buzz, but then our friends bought it, and the real world range is completely disappointing.

Oh, that’s disappointing. We’ve been spoiled now by the likes of Lucid and Tesla. Nothing less than 300 miles/480 kilometres of real world range will do.

 

[BS8899]

Oh, that’s disappointing. We’ve been spoiled now by the likes of Lucid and Tesla. Nothing less than 300 miles/480 kilometres of real world range will do.

As a "fun recreation vehicle", I think a realizable (not EPA) range of 300 miles is not unreasonable. A VW Buzz with an 86kWh battery is supposed to have a 293-mile range. I have not seen actual range test results on this configuration. Most Germany cars meet/exceed their claimed range rating. If the VW Buzz does that, it is not too far off.

 

[levsha]

As a "fun recreation vehicle", I think a realizable (not EPA) range of 300 miles is not unreasonable.

Agree. I'd even say something like "200 miles on 80% -> 10% range" - that would be a reasonable step between two fast chargers.

A VW Buzz with an 86kWh battery is supposed to have a 293-mile range. I have not seen actual range test results on this configuration. Most Germany cars meet/exceed their claimed range rating. If the VW Buzz does that, it is not too far off.

It doesn't. I've tried several MEB platform cars and none meet their claimed range, especially on the highway. The real world range on the highway for ID.Buzz is 200 miles. And this is with 120km/h (~75mph) speed limit that is in Switzerland. It becomes even worse in Italy with 130km/h speed limit (and everyone speeding) or especially in Germany with no speed limit.

 

[BS8899]

Agree. I'd even say something like "200 miles on 80% -> 10% range" - that would be a reasonable step between two fast chargers.

It doesn't. I've tried several MEB platform cars and none meet their claimed range, especially on the highway. The real world range on the highway for ID.Buzz is 200 miles. And this is with 120km/h (~75mph) speed limit that is in Switzerland. It becomes even worse in Italy with 130km/h speed limit (and everyone speeding) or especially in Germany with no speed limit.

I hope VW get there (i.e., >300 mile-range @75mph) sometime. We had our Eurovan for 25 years and loved it! It won't break any land-speed record. But it is a great road trip vehicle with kids and dogs!