Should I order 5 or 7 seats?

[Andretex]

I ordered the 5 seat. Here is why:

1) I never take more than a couple people in my car and I have not owned a 7 seater since my kids were small.
2) the car will be lighter and thus range should be slightly better.
3) it is cheaper!

 

[brianman]

Our "travel" vehicle is a 5 seat (2 row) 2017 Tesla Model X.

The second row is 60/40. We have a half dog crate (that is occupied by our 65 lb. German Shepherd) using roughly 70% of that row, so a small/thin passenger can fit in the second row "somewhat uncomfortably" but well enough for a quick outing for lunch.

In the "trunk" we always have an electric wheelchair and, on trips, a decent amount of luggage. The rest of the luggage goes in the back seat footwells.

We have a Gravity reservation and I'm trying to get a feel for the height, width, and depth of the cargo space behind the 2nd row. We have a portal electric wheelchair that's a bit larger than an airline carry-on. Ours isn't the newest model but it looks pretty close to this:

MagSHOCK® (Red) | FOLD & GO Wheelchairs®

www.foldandgowheelchairs.com

Specifically, I'm curious about
1. usable depth behind the 2nd row
2. the height (and width?) differences between configs for the 5 and 7 seat (with the 3rd row folded down)
3. is the 3rd row removable (by customer or Lucid service)? If yes, how does the space compare of a 3-1 row (7 seat with 3rd row removed) vs 2 row (5 seat)

Info and advice welcome. Hopefully this is on-topic enough for this thread. I can start a new one if that's preferred.

Aside: We happen to be in Silicon Valley for this week and met with our SA at Lucid HQ. Looks like if we were about a week later we might have gotten to actually measure the "fit" for our "stuff" in a production intent vehicle. So close.

 

[WeighingGravity]

I'm firmly on Team 7 even though I will rarely need all 7 seats (probably just a handful of times each year). The amount of space I'm giving up is trivial compared to the advantages of having essentially another blade in the swiss army knife that is the Lucid Gravity. I guess there is a range penalty too but I consider it pretty minor. I'm actually surprised it's that much of a penalty? For the weight, my fat ass is probably dragging down the EPA number lol.

I think the question I'd ask people on Team 5 is "how much of the resale market do you think you're turning your back on if you ever want/need to sell or trade?" I'm not advocating one way or the other - some may not care at all - but I do think most people who would be interested in a Gravity wouldn't even consider a 5-seat version - they'd be more likely to buy a mid-size vehicle that is standard with 5 seats, and spend a lot less money to begin with.

 

[hmp10]

I'm firmly on Team 7 even though I will rarely need all 7 seats (probably just a handful of times each year). The amount of space I'm giving up is trivial compared to the advantages of having essentially another blade in the swiss army knife that is the Lucid Gravity. I guess there is a range penalty too but I consider it pretty minor. I'm actually surprised it's that much of a penalty? For the weight, my fat ass is probably dragging down the EPA number lol.

I think the question I'd ask people on Team 5 is "how much of the resale market do you think you're turning your back on if you ever want/need to sell or trade?" I'm not advocating one way or the other - some may not care at all - but I do think most people who would be interested in a Gravity wouldn't even consider a 5-seat version - they'd be more likely to buy a mid-size vehicle that is standard with 5 seats, and spend a lot less money to begin with.

If many of the people who have reviewed the Gravity are right, customers for the Gravity are going to be people who find its supposed minivan vibe acceptable. And those are exactly the kinds of customers who are probably looking for 3-row accommodations in the first place. The same would probably apply to used car buyers, too.

 

[borski]

Specifically, I'm curious about
1. usable depth behind the 2nd row

@TribbleTrouble can probably measure this for you.

2. the height (and width?) differences between configs for the 5 and 7 seat (with the 3rd row folded down)

No height/width differences. With the 3rd row folded down, it's as if there was never any 3rd row at all; no hardware or anything is left up top, and it is covered by the flat board. The only remnant of the third row is the under floor storage space, which is what you lose.

3. is the 3rd row removable (by customer or Lucid service)? If yes, how does the space compare of a 3-1 row (7 seat with 3rd row removed) vs 2 row (5 seat)

No.

Aside: We happen to be in Silicon Valley for this week and met with our SA at Lucid HQ. Looks like if we were about a week later we might have gotten to actually measure the "fit" for our "stuff" in a production intent vehicle. So close.

If you're still around, we live in Cupertino. Happy to meet up and you can 'test fit' your 'stuff' into our Gravity.

 

[brianman]

Many thanks, @borski and @TribbleTrouble. It was a real pleasure meeting you guys tonight to get some measurement info and geek out.

 

[TahoeMichael]

Many thanks, @borski and @TribbleTrouble. It was a real pleasure meeting you guys tonight to get some measurement info and geek out.

Okay, you can't leave it at that, you have to report how the fit test worked out! I too travel with dogs. And while I'm not a wheelchair user myself, my sister has one. So I'm very curious. But I'm also assuming it went well. I currently drive an ICE Toyota Highlander, and can make that work with the wheelchair, although it's tighter than I'd like. For me, a big potential win of the Gravity is lower lifting height to get a wheelchair into the back of the vehicle. My sister's chair is a manual style chair, but it has powered wheel hubs, which ups the weight of the chair quite a lot.

 

[TahoeMichael]

The way I see it, I wouldn't ever buy a mid/large SUV (or minivan, to tweak the other thread) if I didn't need an occasional third row.

I sort of fall into that thinking, but I'd put it a different way: if you never need the carrying capacity, whether for cargo or people, does the vehicle make sense? In my case, the carrying capacity need is more about cargo than people, which is why the 2 row config makes sense.

On the flip side, the range and driving experience of the Gravity is said to be so good, I'm not sure there's a comparable vehicle that's smaller. So maybe I'd buy one just for that. My Toyota Highlander is 192.5" long, compared to the Gravity's 198.2" length. When in San Francisco, the size of the Highlander is sometimes troublesome, so if there was a 6" shorter version of the Gravity, I'd jump on that. Put perhaps that's what the next round of "mid market" Lucid vehicles will offer. I just worry that there will be no 400+ mile range version of those vehicles.

 

[brianman]

Okay, you can't leave it at that, you have to report how the fit test worked out! I too travel with dogs. And while I'm not a wheelchair user myself, my sister has one. So I'm very curious. But I'm also assuming it went well. I currently drive an ICE Toyota Highlander, and can make that work with the wheelchair, although it's tighter than I'd like. For me, a big potential win of the Gravity is lower lifting height to get a wheelchair into the back of the vehicle. My sister's chair is a manual style chair, but it has powered wheel hubs, which ups the weight of the chair quite a lot.

Hehe, I was wondering who was going to call me on it.

Ok, first of all @borski and @TribbleTrouble were very generous in letting us try things out and (the normal stuff) show us some of the nooks and crannies and magic tricks of the vehicle.

Now, to what you asked about...

My earlier post has a link that shows the kind of wheelchair we're talking about. It's not huge, but it can be challenging for cars with "relatively shallow" trunk depth. For example, the wheelchair just couldn't fit easily in the back of a Mach-E with the seats up. It fits easily in the back of a Model 3 -- even with rear seats up -- and (ofc) our Model X.

For sizing, the dog crate width almost completely fills the width of the Model 3 backseat (and roughly 70% of the Model X 2nd row). Using "rough arm measurement" it looks to be more like 60% of the 2nd row width for the Gravity. Additionally, I'm pretty confidence the crate will easily fit in the 3rd row (when present) of the Gravity. So for the dog I feel like we have two options with a 3 row Gravity: (a) crate on the driver side of 2nd row or (b) crate in the 3rd row. In both cases, the dog can enter the passenger side and should be able to easily get into the crate. There's also a slightly more unusual option "b2" (courtesy of the AMA picture: https://lucidowners.com/threads/gravity-owner-ama-4-5-25-12pm-2pm-pt.11822/post-263326) -- crate in 3rd row and dog enters either side and then reaches crate through the middle, in between the "window" seats of the 2nd row.

Now for the wheelchair. With the 3rd row down it's cavernous compared to the X; that will work fine. Also, much to my surprise -- but we ofc had to test it -- with the 3rd row up and the "above groceries cavity" (again referring to the AMA) cover removed, the wheelchair fits vertically. Astonishing that there's enough depth and height there -- and the trunk closed easily with no "special anchoring or pushing".

 

[boydracing]

An 85-90%-sized Gravity would be my dream too! My ideal vehicle in terms of size and form factor is the Subaru Outback--a "tall wagon" that is a little bigger than a typical mid-size 2-row SUV, with 75 cubic feet of cargo space behind the front seats. Gravity is the closest thing out there to a luxury electric Outback, but it's bigger than I really want or need.

My wife has the brand new Subaru Outback Wilderness and loves it. However, road trips and skiing, she has a storage box on top for stuff. Road trips will be the Gravity. Outback is just the Goldie locks syndrome - just a little too small for what we need. Gravity is 4" wider and 5" longer than the new Outback.

 

[brianman]

Also, much to my surprise -- but we ofc had to test it -- with the 3rd row up and the "above groceries cavity" (again referring to the AMA) cover removed, the wheelchair fits vertically. Astonishing that there's enough depth and height there -- and the trunk closed easily with no "special anchoring or pushing".

This picture might help clarify. If the left side is "made upright" and the cover is removed then the wheelchair fits behind the rear sits easily with ~1/3rd of the wheelchair folded height within the storage cavity.

Put another way:
If the seats are stowed, wheelchair + luggage goes on top of the seat storage cover.
If the seats are not stowed, the designed space for the seat storage aids in the wheelchair fitting behind.
Kind of awesome.

 

[DeaneG]

The way I see it, I wouldn't ever buy a mid/large SUV (or minivan, to tweak the other thread) if I didn't need an occasional third row.

I'd agree, but I need Gravity's range and ground clearance, and there are very very few alternatives. I'd be all-in on an 85-90% scale Gravity with 400 miles EPA range and adjustable air suspension. The Macan EV is too small, too expensive for what it is, and no 1-pedal driving. The Polestar 3 isn't bad, 2/3 the car at 4/5 the price of Gravity.

 

[jered]

I'd agree, but I need Gravity's range and ground clearance, and there are very very few alternatives. I'd be all-in on an 85-90% scale Gravity with 400 miles EPA range and adjustable air suspension. The Macan EV is too small, too expensive for what it is, and no 1-pedal driving. The Polestar 3 isn't bad, 2/3 the car at 4/5 the price of Gravity.

That's fair... what's your use case for the ground clearance?

It's weird; I wouldn't consider the Polestar 3 in the same class. I haven't sat in one but rented a 2 and *hated* it. The interior was weirdly unusable, and the Google experience was so painfully bad. (I also blogged about how after I returned the rental, I was able to track the next month of renters and could have unlocked and started the car at any time. I hope they fixed that.)

Obviously the other options are the R1S and the X, but they are also 3-row SUVs and not as engaging right now.

 

[jered]

More to the point, for 8cf on 120cf -- less than 7% -- it feels like the option of having the seats is a win.