Savage Geese Takes a Long Look

[TahoeMichael]

They picked Android auto for the base OS. It’s fairly stable, except for device specific drivers.

Not exactly. The base OS is QNX, an embedded systems OS. Then they run instances of Android in virtual machines, for the kinds of functionality where an embedded systems OS would be a pain in the butt. On top of that they've layered their platform functionality, which includes software module management, encrypted in-vehicle communication, etc. On top of all that are individual apps.

 

[TahoeMichael]

An interesting nugget from the video is that the optional rear-wheel steering is helpful for controlling toe-in, and vehicles without that option can be expected to suffer worse efficiency. I wouldn't have guessed that to be the case. Knowing whether that option is on a vehicle is thus an important part of real-world range tests.

 

[Takeshi]

That Statement from the Video is a totally different from what I heard in person. I was at the San Jose Lucid Studio & Service Center Grand Opening on the 11th. One of their Director / VP of software said they are working on combining both systems into one code base which could take years and acknowledge that they are TWO different products / code bases.
Someone asked a question "Is CCCv2 needed?" ; he said that their are feature that would be made possible with more computing power, memory, and storage.

 

[MSH2]

I have had my GT for a little over three years or about nine months after launch. I lived thru some of the early glitches but none stopped the car from working safely. They were very good in fixing them and the regional service person was extremely responsive. I have no problems now and I am sold on Lucid but they have to expand their showroom network. This car has to be driven. They took my GT in for its thee year service as I had the tires replaced after 20,000 miles. They left a loaner with me when they picked it up in Naples and so I drove it back to Miami to drive the Gravity and pick my car up. I loved the Gravity but for me the Air is perfect. I have now driven almost 500 miles to drive a GT and a Gravity. Having no showroom on the west Coast of Florida is crazy. Since day one I have felt their marketing sucked and I don’t see any improvement in the near turn. They will fix the software because they have to. But if they don’t expand their show rooms and service centers it won’t matter much unless the Saudi’ really don’t care how much money they lose. Mike

 

[allenmhc]

That Statement from the Video is a totally different from what I heard in person. I was at the San Jose Lucid Studio & Service Center Grand Opening on the 11th. One of their Director / VP of software said they are working on combining both systems into one code base which could take years and acknowledge that they are TWO different products / code bases.
Someone asked a question "Is CCCv2 needed?" ; he said that their are feature that would be made possible with more computing power, memory, and storage.

View attachment 33725

Remember that these are the heads of design and infotainment, who:

1. Are certainly referring to the state of the software from a different point of time, months/years earlier
2. Are likely referring to different parts of the software stack; "common codebase" can apply to everything from UI components to display modules to frameworks to Android itself
3. May not know what they're actually talking about (this is more common than you think when listening to execs talk, if you know the details yourself)

 

[Xminus6]

I think I'm getting through this in part because of my experience with owning an early Air (December 2021 delivery). The first ten months with the UX 1.0 UI suite was a nightmare, but once UX 2.0 came along and Lucid started issuing rapid-fire OTA updates, the issues began to die away fairly quickly. For most of the past couple of years the car has been relatively problem-free, leaving me to enjoy what a great driving machine it is without recurrent torment.

Also, the Air, like the Gravity, had to have a new rear drive unit installed (along with a new battery pack). But the service experience was so seamless, if a bit lengthy, that the drive unit failure with the Gravity didn't completely unnerve me. (We also had to have a rear drive unit and battery pack replaced in our 2015 Tesla Model S, so it's a rodeo I've been to three times now with EVs.)

As near as I can tell, the automotive engineering end of the Gravity and its structural solidity give the Gravity seriously good bones. If the software improvements travel the same trajectory as the Air's, then I think we'll end up with two truly superior vehicles.

What most annoys me, though, is that Lucid did no better with the introductory software of the Gravity than with the Air but is still continuing to put it into customers' hands. And my fear is they will do the same thing with the Earth mid-size, which might be the death knell of the company.

Yeah. My 2014 Model S85 also had a rear drive unit replacement. Not the battery though. Even though I did live through many of the software generations of early Teslas like you, I don’t remember them being as buggy on the “working as a car” part of the software. Lucid really needs to get the basic functions of a car solid as a rock. The other stuff I’m willing to deal with until it get fixed. But not being able to get in the car and actually drive when I need to is a problem that the general public market won’t forgive.

 

[electric]

Pretty much what one would expect if you had spent much time on the forums here. EXCEPT, he seemed to be pretty thumbs down on the audio quality. That I haven't seen any comments about, other than the equalizer. Most people who have commented about the sound system have been pretty glowing (when it works). He was not. Comments appreciated.

I have the same opinion about audio system. I’m not an audiophile, but can appreciate a good sound system and while Gravity audio is not bad at all, it is not as great as I expected. What makes otherwise average audio system stand out is how quiet the car is and how much interior space it has, making for a better listening experience.

 

[electric]

referring to the state of the software from a different point of time, months/years earlier

I think you mean they were dreaming about the state of the software from long in the future, when it will bring unicorn farts OTA (out of band of course, we don't want whole OS reload).
I can't believe I just saw faces of 2 guys I've been giving all the grief here
But I admit, their dreams are inspiring, I wish them great success and hope to be a part of, if only I can get a basic stable version right now and ability to reject updates for a while.

 

[electric]

Hey, they have virtualization, so maybe release a basic stable CAR v1.0 and side load unicorn farts version in the VM when sitting parked and have nothing better to do than play with a PC on wheels. Switch to stable when brake pedal is touched.

 

[socktucker]

I have the same opinion about audio system. I’m not an audiophile, but can appreciate a good sound system and while Gravity audio is not bad at all, it is not as great as I expected. What makes otherwise average audio system stand out is how quiet the car is and how much interior space it has, making for a better listening experience.

It’s not a luxury system. I can’t believe they disregarded EQ and better quality but added Atmos which is mostly useless.

 

[minivanasatruck]

It’s not a luxury system. I can’t believe they disregarded EQ and better quality but added Atmos which is mostly useless.

They probably should have went with Bose, Burmester, Harmon Kardon, B&W instead of trying to designing the sound in-house. Tesla does a good job on the model 3, but that is rare in the car industry and took them 2 models (s,x) before they got it right.

 

[minivanasatruck]

Savagegeese really nailed this review. I can't say there's anything more to add besides the range tests that others will do. Lucid will continue to lose customers until they can get the software up to an acceptable level.

 

[borski]

The Atmos is a great example. Why? Nobody wants that

Speak for yourself

 

[borski]

For the software engineers and developers on here: Based on what the Lucid software team members said in the video, do you hear or get the sense that the software skillset/knowledge currently exists in-house for Lucid to have software that matches its engineering?

Fwiw, I haven't watched this yet but will sometime this weekend and I'll make sure to post my thoughts. It's a really busy week, heh

 

[borski]

I think he did it to get his bonus and this is the result. I love Rawlinson; but I think it was a big mistake. He put Lucid under unnecessary pressure. A delay would have been better.

He didn't need the bonus; he had already done quite well. That man lived and breathed Lucid. I'm not saying he made the right choice; I have no idea. I am saying he definitely didn't make the choice solely for selfish financial reasons.

 

[borski]

Rewatching that bit, I guess they aren't being entirely clear. I interpret what they say to mean that they've tried to build a new platform that could be used to operate the Air, Gravity, and future mid-sized, but they didn't say that new platform has already rolled out to the Air. Considering the problems they're currently having with the Gravity, it would seem quite premature to try rolling it out to the Air. But it's possible your interpretation is correct. Not being an Air owner, I haven't paid much attention to Air software versions to see if there's signs of a new platform being released.

That's my understanding based on people I've spoken to at Lucid as well.

 

[borski]

Not exactly. The base OS is QNX, an embedded systems OS. Then they run instances of Android in virtual machines, for the kinds of functionality where an embedded systems OS would be a pain in the butt. On top of that they've layered their platform functionality, which includes software module management, encrypted in-vehicle communication, etc. On top of all that are individual apps.

Totally simple stuff. I don't get why they can't get simple button pushes right. Ughhhhhhhhh

 

[borski]

That Statement from the Video is a totally different from what I heard in person. I was at the San Jose Lucid Studio & Service Center Grand Opening on the 11th. One of their Director / VP of software said they are working on combining both systems into one code base which could take years and acknowledge that they are TWO different products / code bases.
Someone asked a question "Is CCCv2 needed?" ; he said that their are feature that would be made possible with more computing power, memory, and storage.

View attachment 33725

This is my understanding as well

 

[Bunnylebowski]

I need to add that I think a key problem people are not identifying, isn’t so much software operations or features, but the integration of the software with vehicle hardware. I bet the system works perfect on their little desks and tests screens and then all hell breaks loose when it’s tasked with communicating with and verifying the status of various vehicle hardware components. We’ve seen this repeatedly. Owners seats lying flat so the car software didn’t recognize what state the hardware was in, same for windows being stuck down, same for keycard not being recognized, same for key fob, same for not being able to put car in reverse, or button push for auto on the HVAC not putting HVAC into auto, or rear climate coming on even though you turned it off. I think the actual software is just fine but it’s failing at multiple reproducible point when it comes to accurately communicating with and controlling vehicle hardware. False alerts galore, like headlight errors, dynamic handling errors, the list goes on. It’s like the car and software aren’t talking the same language to eachother.

 

[borski]

It’s not a luxury system. I can’t believe they disregarded EQ and better quality but added Atmos which is mostly useless.

I couldn't disagree more. Having produced music for quite some time, the Gravity (and the Air before it, but the Gravity in particular) has one of the best sounding reference systems I've ever heard. And Atmos is most definitely not useless. It literally provides opportunities to do things that were impossible before, and done well, it is downright beautiful.

It's fine that you don't like it, lol - we all have different ears.

But it's definitely a luxury system. But some people like the AKG sound and some people like the Audio-Technica sound and some people like Grado.