Out of Spec roadtrips Gravity and DDP2 has some issues

[Bdr100]

Kyle takes his long term Gravity loaner on a road trip and had some issues with handsfree DDP2. His experience is very similar to mine from a recent road trip. Off and on zig-zag behavior, sudden disengagements and occasional sh*t the bed on lane keeping. I almost think things have gone backwards from old hands-on DDP2. To the point where I now drive with hand on wheel so I am ready for sudden disengagements or other issues. Can’t wait for NVIDIA system to come on board as I do not have a whole lot of confidence in current system.

 

[erigion]

Every Lucid already uses some form of Nvidia's ADAS.

 

[Bdr100]

Every Lucid already uses some form of Nvidia's ADAS.

Was refering to the NVIDIA Alpamayo self driving system (similar to Tesla FSD) that is supposed to come to Lucid at end of year (probably more like early to mid next year).

 

[RandomDesign]

Off and on zig-zag behavior, sudden disengagements and occasional sh*t the bed on lane keeping.

I don't see the disengagements much (and I just did probably at least 2k miles on DDP) but the couple times I've had the ping-ponging cleaning the front and rear facing cameras seemed to clear it up.

 

[socktucker]

I don't see the disengagements much (and I just did probably at least 2k miles on DDP) but the couple times I've had the ping-ponging cleaning the front and rear facing cameras seemed to clear it up.

My Tesla likes to do that on some freeway spots

 

[kkumar99]

I've said this before, but the lucid dream drive system is similar to a 2019 or so Tesla before they had "navigate on autopilot." Obviously Tesla was one of the first, so people were just mostly impressed. All the car companies have a long way to go to catch Tesla and realistically some should just consider using Tesla's system if it actually is available for licensing. Unfortunately everyone considers the data to be too valuable and no one wants to give it to Tesla. It is a step hill to climb but eventually the car companies will figure it out. I can tell you that all my friends who get new Teslas are absolutely amazed by the self driving and often swear they will never get a car without it. I still have the model x and understand this sentiment. I do believe FSD is eventually going to be a must have feature for many people to even consider buying a car....

 

[kkumar99]

Today I took the model x and there was a tree cutting crew blocking one lane. They had 2 guys directing traffic only with their hands, no stop/slow signs or anything like that. Impressively the model x stopped when he put his hand up standing there. More impressively, it started automatically when he have the wave to go.... What Tesla has done with fsd is truly impressive and regardless of what people's thoughts are on it, it is going to be the standard to which all autonomous systems are going to be compared to...

 

[gaskiller]

Kyle takes his long term Gravity loaner on a road trip and had some issues with handsfree DDP2. His experience is very similar to mine from a recent road trip. Off and on zig-zag behavior, sudden disengagements and occasional sh*t the bed on lane keeping. I almost think things have gone backwards from old hands-on DDP2. To the point where I now drive with hand on wheel so I am ready for sudden disengagements or other issues. Can’t wait for NVIDIA system to come on board as I do not have a whole lot of confidence in current system.

Every autonomous system has issues like this on occasions. Even Tesla…..nothing burger. YAWN……

 

[gaskiller]

Today I took the model x and there was a tree cutting crew blocking one lane. They had 2 guys directing traffic only with their hands, no stop/slow signs or anything like that. Impressively the model x stopped when he put his hand up standing there. More impressively, it started automatically when he have the wave to go.... What Tesla has done with fsd is truly impressive and regardless of what people's thoughts are on it, it is going to be the standard to which all autonomous systems are going to be compared to...

Did you try driving across train crossings ?

 

[gaskiller]

I've said this before, but the lucid dream drive system is similar to a 2019 or so Tesla before they had "navigate on autopilot." Obviously Tesla was one of the first, so people were just mostly impressed. All the car companies have a long way to go to catch Tesla and realistically some should just consider using Tesla's system if it actually is available for licensing. Unfortunately everyone considers the data to be too valuable and no one wants to give it to Tesla. It is a step hill to climb but eventually the car companies will figure it out. I can tell you that all my friends who get new Teslas are absolutely amazed by the self driving and often swear they will never get a car without it. I still have the model x and understand this sentiment. I do believe FSD is eventually going to be a must have feature for many people to even consider buying a car....

No….do not use Teslas cameras….that was a short cut by Musk. Eventually, Tesla will be overtaken by those using radar/lidar/cameras. Just a matter if time. Do not put our lives in a system without redundancy. Do not drink the kool aid…..

 

[krupawan5618]

I joined the forum to simply reiterate that this is likely more than minor inconvenience, but rather a dangerous issue.

I drove across the state of Ohio without any issues with hands free driving, but on the way back it was swaying left to right. I tried a soft reset which didn’t help. I wondered if there is a sensor blocked, or a chip is overheating, or something?

I hadn't tried cleaning the front and rear facing cameras, but if that is the issue the system should notify the end user that is the likely fix OR simply not allow for hands free driving in suboptimal conditions.

When it worked though, it was awesome!

 

[prgarg]

I joined the forum to simply reiterate that this is likely more than minor inconvenience, but rather a dangerous issue.

I drove across the state of Ohio without any issues with hands free driving, but on the way back it was swaying left to right. I tried a soft reset which didn’t help. I wondered if there is a sensor blocked, or a chip is overheating, or something?

I hadn't tried cleaning the front and rear facing cameras, but if that is the issue the system should notify the end user that is the likely fix OR simply not allow for hands free driving in suboptimal conditions.

When it worked though, it was awesome!

Wonder what causes it... I agree the system should warn you about the error or the cause.
For what it's worth, I have driven (or been driven ) lots of miles on DDP2 and have yet to experience that.

 

[Aka-none]

No….do not use Teslas cameras….that was a short cut by Musk. Eventually, Tesla will be overtaken by those using radar/lidar/cameras. Just a matter if time. Do not put our lives in a system without redundancy. Do not drink the kool aid…..

And lest we forget Tesla is NOT hands free it’s L2 assisted driving.
Right there front page:

https://www.tesla.com/

Yes they show happy people dancing in the car, right before they get T boned because the car didnt see the truck failing to stop. Or the idiot in rush hour cut in front of you while being tailgated.

Personally if you are behind the wheel of 6000 pounds of metal and plastic going down the highway then you should be paying attention. If you want fad then get a Waymo or a chauffeur. We aren’t there yet and neither is Tesla, it’s good but it isn’t as perfect as people think and dancing drivers doesn’t help with that perception.

 

[RajD]

Wonder what causes it... I agree the system should warn you about the error or the cause.
For what it's worth, I have driven (or been driven ) lots of miles on DDP2 and have yet to experience that.

I have at least 1000 miles on DDP and never had that occur. It’s improved as a system significantly since hands free DA was first released though. Used to disengage frequently and in bright sunlight in morning. Now on same daily commute, it’s rock solid. Just waiting for Level 2++ to get me to remember to take my exit!

 

[sgrenald]

Last Christmas I was in LA visiting folks. My buddy lent me his 2023 Model S with FSD. Even though I know my way around SoCal, I let FSD chauffeur me and it did a pretty amazing job. I took over from time to time, but nothing egregious happened.

 

[The_Don]

FSD is really good. I recently test drove a MYP to try to understand the hype and FSD felt reliable. I'm still confused about savage geese's review of it because I found the car very underwhelming dynamically, which differs from the feedback they provided.

To be fair, I don't critically drive cars in that price range often so I can't judge if this is commonplace for this category, but the steering felt very numb, suspension was just ok in terms of comfort, cornering was ok at best, and it didn't feel all that fast. Altogether, it was just a very boring car, even when pushed.

And to be clear, I was actually very excited to test drive the latest generation because Savagegeese had raved about it. I truly felt disappointed with my experience.

 

[BEV-ICE]

I wrote this about FSD about a month ago and I have a few more errors I remember since then. It’s not what people think/claim it is.

I had a loaner MY with the latest FSD one month ago. I used it every single day for two weeks, highway and surface streets. Over 600 miles total as we had to pick up kids from two camps. It made two critical errors of wanting to drive the wrong way. Three times made the minor error of getting in the turning lane while needing to go straight. Cannot avoid potholes. Highway was down to one lane and barely moving, it tried every 10 seconds to get in the exit lane to pass cars, even when I changed the profile to chill. Stops at stop signs where the sign is and then creeps out (that's the law, but not natural). Gets into the right most lane (when three or more lanes) on the highway to prepare for an exit way too early. In the center of my town the speed limit is 20MPH. It would recognize it but after about 50 yards it would think it was 35MPH. Did it every single time, in both directions Could not get through two construction zones with a person controlling traffic without me taking over. Plus phantom braking. It never respects the 20MPH school zone when the lights on the speed limit sign were flashing.

Like I said before, these systems need more of my attention than when I’m driving.

 

[Aka-none]

FSD is really good. I recently test drove a MYP to try to understand the hype and FSD felt reliable. I'm still confused about savage geese's review of it because I found the car very underwhelming dynamically, which differs from the feedback they provided.

To be fair, I don't critically drive cars in that price range often so I can't judge if this is commonplace for this category, but the steering felt very numb, suspension was just ok in terms of comfort, cornering was ok at best, and it didn't feel all that fast. Altogether, it was just a very boring car, even when pushed.

And to be clear, I was actually very excited to test drive the latest generation because Savagegeese had raved about it. I truly felt disappointed with my experience.

Yesterday I stopped at the Tesla dealer in Woodbury Minnesota and looked at and sat in a MY, 2027. In my opinion I’d just as rather drive my old Yaris. The front seats were less comfortable than my GT and the back were like sitting on a box. Third row seats, well less said the better.
The car driving to the phone was a nice party trick.

 

[TahoeMichael]

To me, I'm not that interested in autonomous driving tech until it's so good that it doesn't need supervision. And I think that autonomous driving that works 99.99% of the time is worse than a system that works 99% of the time. The 99% system fails frequently enough that the driver is likely to stay alert and intervene early. The 99.99% system risks lulling drivers into complacency and not supervising at all. But even if you try and stay alert, you're fighting the way human attention works when you try to supervise a system that rarely fails.

Until full autonomy becomes available, I pretty much just want the features that are easy to make highly reliable, such as adaptive cruise control. And features that might save your life when you screw up while driving, like lane departure warnings, antilock brakes, automatic emergency braking, etc.

My mother died in a car crash, and I could be more concerned about the safety issues around vehicles than most people. To me, Lucid is making the same error that Tesla did. They're starting with unreliably autonomy, and planning to steadily improve it as time goes by. I believe Waymo's approach is much better, in that they decided early that they needed to be building a system that didn't expect a human to intervene, and work on the hardest part of the problem right from the start.

 

[mobada]

Did you try driving across train crossings ?

FSD v14 works just fine with train crossings.

No….do not use Teslas cameras….that was a short cut by Musk. Eventually, Tesla will be overtaken by those using radar/lidar/cameras. Just a matter if time. Do not put our lives in a system without redundancy. Do not drink the kool aid…..

There's a reason tesla is operating more than 200 cars in texas with no one in them. Using camera only. The safety level tesla needs to do that is ridiculous. Tesla is basically #3 in the world in self driving right now behind Waymo and Baidu.

If you look at ODD, geofence size, number of vehicles, the speeds that tesla is driving, etc.

If you look at other companies using E2E neural networks, no HD maps, no 4000w supercomputer onboard, etc. it doesn't matter whether they have lidar or not. They are not even close to ever having driverless operations. If you look at any consumerish cars with lidar/radar there is no evidence of the lidar ever preventing an accident that tesla cameras would not see and usually it's the opposite where the accident avoidance and object recognition is nonexistent. I think the issue is it is very expensive to process lidar data with E2E neural networks and we are compute limited

nvidia alpanmayo, chinese cars, etc. You can see safety tests of them and it is night and day compared to FSD. They barely have a safety level of FSD 12 f. Even with lidar.

There is no universe in which they blow past tesla and there is currently nobody who is behind tesla in autonomy who is clearly going to blow past tesla. Tesla seems to be operating almost 150-200 in austin and I bet waymo already feels it. If they do the same in atlanta, waymo will definitely notice.