Brand new Lucid owner, serious range concerns after first trip 2025 AT

[Tym]

3 posts, not verified owner, comparing Tesla to lucid. I bet this is Elon Musk himself trolling

 

[ROT]

I am a new Lucid Air Touring owner. I have previously owned 3 Tesla's (Model X, Model S x 2).

Yesterday I went on my first work trip. Car was charged to 370 miles. When I arrived at my destination, I had gone 182 miles and had 71 miles of range left. I had 117 miles of range evaporate.

Temp was in the 30's, average speed 75-78 MPH, 20" wheels, 2.5 software update.

Is this normal? Is there a good rule of thumb to hedge? I have experienced range degradation previously but not at this level.

Also, this was my first time charging at Electrify America. My car was telling me that a stall was available but there wasn't. Is that common? Also, this may be a stupid question, but at a different charging station there was a charger with two plugin cords. If one cord is being utilized, is the other disabled? Finally, I went to two different 350kW chargers yesterday and the max I got was 201kW- is that normal?

Also, in DreamDrive Pro mode, I rarely was able to utilize the auto lane change on a major interstate. The display would show the dotted center line- as soon as I put the blinker on, the center line would change to solid.

Trying to adjust to the switch from the Tesla ecosystem- any suggestions or insights would be greatly appreciated!

I am coming over from Tesla as well and on my first trip I had the same experience. Second trip to the same destination but monitored my speed better and did much better. Still felt a little inefficient to me but much better. I think maybe I am more likely to speed in my Lucid as it just drives so much better.

FYI, love the Lucid and it is a much better car, but I have a whole host of other gripes.

 

[dscafetta]

I am a new Lucid Air Touring owner. I have previously owned 3 Tesla's (Model X, Model S x 2).

Yesterday I went on my first work trip. Car was charged to 370 miles. When I arrived at my destination, I had gone 182 miles and had 71 miles of range left. I had 117 miles of range evaporate.

Temp was in the 30's, average speed 75-78 MPH, 20" wheels, 2.5 software update.

Is this normal? Is there a good rule of thumb to hedge? I have experienced range degradation previously but not at this level.

Also, this was my first time charging at Electrify America. My car was telling me that a stall was available but there wasn't. Is that common? Also, this may be a stupid question, but at a different charging station there was a charger with two plugin cords. If one cord is being utilized, is the other disabled? Finally, I went to two different 350kW chargers yesterday and the max I got was 201kW- is that normal?

Also, in DreamDrive Pro mode, I rarely was able to utilize the auto lane change on a major interstate. The display would show the dotted center line- as soon as I put the blinker on, the center line would change to solid.

Trying to adjust to the switch from the Tesla ecosystem- any suggestions or insights would be greatly appreciated!

Get used to it. I will take heat for this, but the range claims by Lucid are no where near reality. In my driving experience over 16,000 miles, you would have to go downhill with a 50MPH wind at your back to realize the advertised range by Lucid. EA is a total joke. I stopped trying after about a year (with 3 years free).

 

[dscafetta]

I would also add that regardless of automaker, any of those factors impact range on EVs. Driving fast, cold weather, elevation changes, etc. Not exclusive to Lucid.

I've averaged 3.1 m/kwh over last 2 years on my GT. Have definitely gotten EPA performance on longer drives or when I've been conscious about efficiency. Having said that, I do a lot more stop-and-go/city driving which doesn't help. To be honest, I'm not that concerned about efficiency given all the extra range the car already has.

How did you get EPA performance? I would like to see if my touring is capable of getting 4.6.

 

[borski]

That must be one nice chest! Now, if I had a new Gravity, I'd do that drive for a dozen peaches and some OJ...

Definitely old, and definitely looks like a pirate chest. It's my wife's and is like two hundred years old or something (I made that up, I haven't done any carbon dating lol). I don't really get the appeal of having a big wooden box, but apparently it's a thing, haha

 

[Buffalo Bob]

Definitely old, and definitely looks like a pirate chest. It's my wife's and is like two hundred years old or something (I made that up, I haven't done any carbon dating lol). I don't really get the appeal of having a big wooden box, but apparently it's a thing, haha

Well, just take this advice from personal experience... If your wife starts wanting to measure both you AND the big wooden box, beware!

 

[borski]

Well, just take this advice from personal experience... If your wife starts wanting to measure both you AND the big wooden box, beware!

Noted!

 

[Sid432]

How did you get EPA performance? I would like to see if my touring is capable of getting 4.6.

I have gotten 4.3 miles/Kwh on my touring... No kidding
speed, ambient temperature, AC/heat, and elevation.. It all effects the range. I haven't gotten EPA range ICE either

 

[Bobby]

How did you get EPA performance? I would like to see if my touring is capable of getting 4.6.

There are several videos on YouTube, including mine, showing how to achieve EPA. Essentially you need to duplicate their test conditions, which I believe is under 60mph without accessories, etc., etc. Now is that realistic? No way. But that is a basis for comparison since all cars use the exact same test conditions.

 

[borski]

I have gotten 4.3 miles/Kwh on my touring... No kidding
speed, ambient temperature, AC/heat, and elevation.. It all effects the range. I haven't gotten EPA range ICE either

I have gotten 3.8-4.2 *in my DE on my 21s* which is EPA (or better), to prove a point; but driving that way is boring, and not why I bought a 1111HP car. I have also made the drive from Cupertino to San Diego before without a charge, on the 19s, to prove to myself I could. It was extremely boring.

On the regular? 1.8-2.5

We should start a separate thread sometime to see who can get it the lowest.

 

[illopp00]

I have gotten 3.8-4.2 *in my DE on my 21s* which is EPA (or better), to prove a point; but driving that way is boring, and not why I bought a 1111HP car. I have also made the drive from Cupertino to San Diego before without a charge, on the 19s, to prove to myself I could. It was extremely boring.

On the regular? 1.8-2.5

We should start a separate thread sometime to see who can get it the lowest.

I believe in the winter I could use Pre-Conditioning and max out all the heating and turn off regen and drive 12 mph probably might do it

 

[Leftlane]

People who pay $100k plus for 800+ horsepower super sedans and then drive 70 or under because they worry about efficiency are missing the plot. These high power EVs are such an incredible blast to drive, and generate speed so easily, that hypermiling would drive me insane. Enjoy the car and charge when it needs it - easy peasy.

 

[kort6776]

There are several videos on YouTube, including mine, showing how to achieve EPA. Essentially you need to duplicate their test conditions, which I believe is under 60mph without accessories, etc., etc. Now is that realistic? No way. But that is a basis for comparison since all cars use the exact same test conditions.

which returns us to the remark that the lucid claims of 500+ miles on the GT model needs to be taken with a large lump of salt. nobody who owns any vehicle is willing to sacrifice speed and comfort to achieve getting the range that Lucid claims. hence my comment to discount the range estimate by 10-20% when driving. in addition you can knock another 15 miles or so of range because when the car gets down to that level it begins to turtle, so drivers need to be aware of that as well.
this remark should not be construed as an attack on Lucid, it is just a statement of my reality and experience of driving my air GT on longer road trips.

 

[Steveinarizona]

which returns us to the remark that the lucid claims of 500+ miles on the GT model needs to be taken with a large lump of salt. nobody who owns any vehicle is willing to sacrifice speed and comfort to achieve getting the range that Lucid claims. hence my comment to discount the range estimate by 10-20% when driving. in addition you can knock another 15 miles or so of range because when the car gets down to that level it begins to turtle, so drivers need to be aware of that as well.
this remark should not be construed as an attack on Lucid, it is just a statement of my reality and experience of driving my air GT on longer road trips.

You are absolutely correct but the same would apply to a BMW M car, Mercedes AMG car, Cadillac Blackwing, etc. I doubt very many of these cars are regularly driven at or near the speed limit and I doubt that the owners actually get anything near the EPA scores.

I think what is important is what each vehicle gets in realistic testing for the vehicles (e.g., compare the Lucid Air, Porsche Taycan, BMW I5, Mercedes EQS, etc. at the same environmental conditions). Does the Lucid Air still get sufficiently higher range than the rest of the cars? And then add in some kind of factor for speed of charging which in many ways is as important as total range (and will eventually be even more important as the number of fast chargers increases).

 

[Blue Lectroid]

which returns us to the remark that the lucid claims of 500+ miles on the GT model needs to be taken with a large lump of salt. nobody who owns any vehicle is willing to sacrifice speed and comfort to achieve getting the range that Lucid claims. hence my comment to discount the range estimate by 10-20% when driving. in addition you can knock another 15 miles or so of range because when the car gets down to that level it begins to turtle, so drivers need to be aware of that as well.
this remark should not be construed as an attack on Lucid, it is just a statement of my reality and experience of driving my air GT on longer road trips.

Agreed, but really what else should Lucid advertise? “You’re never gonna actually see 512 miles, but hey, we can legally brag that our unrealistic mileage estimates are larger than everyone else can legally say theirs are!”

I have been driving EV’s for well over a decade now (since 2011) and I could consistently get EPA or better on all three of the ones I’ve owned (Gen 1 Volt, Gen 2 Volt and Tesla M3P)…when I decide to drive for range, which I do about 50% of the time.

It’s nice to know that the ability is there in the car if I need / want it. With my M3P and my forthcoming Air GT? That other 50% is about being a longtime driving enthusiast and having FUN doing it.

Cheers!

 

[BS8899]

Agreed, but really what else should Lucid advertise? “You’re never gonna actually see 512 miles, but hey, we can legally brag that our unrealistic mileage estimates are larger than everyone else can legally say theirs are!”

I have been driving EV’s for well over a decade now (since 2011) and I could consistently get EPA or better on all three of the ones I’ve owned (Gen 1 Volt, Gen 2 Volt and Tesla M3P)…when I decide to drive for range, which I do about 50% of the time.

It’s nice to know that the ability is there in the car if I need / want it. With my M3P and my forthcoming Air GT? That other 50% is about being a longtime driving enthusiast and having FUN doing it.

Cheers!

I share many of @kort6776's concerns and frustrations. And I also think Lucid can do better in their communications and guidance regarding the interpretation of the EPA rating, which is done under lab conditions on a dynamometer and not representative of real-life situations.

Some owners/moderators took the position that this is an "EPA Problem", not a Lucid problem. Bit reality is:
> Lucid's claimed (EPA) range is not achievable under realistic highway roadtrip conditions. Yes, I am aware of the OoS 70mph test. The deviation (between Lucid's EPA claim) and my AGT is about 25-30% in moderate weather on multiple AZ/CA 780 mile roadtrips.
> the suggestion that "ALL EVs have the same deviation vs their EPA rated ranges" is simply not true. Various reviewer testing suggest Lucid and Tesla deviate more than other EVs. Some EVs exceeded their EPA rated ranges.
> is the Lucid AGT still the leader in range? Probably, but barely....the range margin vs other EVs are MUCH smaller than you think in real life driving.
> are there EVs that actually meet or exceed their rated EPA range? The answer is YES. I regularly drive the same route (I-10/I-5) from/to AZ to CA (780 miles) on my Lucid AGT and my Rivian R1S. The Lucid is about 25% off its EPA rated range and the Rivian meets and slightly exceeds (say 5-10%) of its rated range. As cited by other reviewers, some German EVs routinely exceed their EPA rated ranges. Not every EV is tested to the same EPA cycles as Lucid's.
> there is a new EPA testing cycle. I have not studied it and don't have an option. Other forum readers who are much smarter than I can weigh-in. Should Lucid revise its range/efficiency specs?

I won't repeat all the back-and forth of this topic. I'd suggest the interested readers go read this thread.

I

Thread 'Real world range touring 19 inch wheels'

May 11, 2024

Can anyone share real world range for touring with 19 inch wheels either from personal experience or link to a test ?
Thanks !

• ISOI
• Replies: 193
• Forum: Efficiency and Mileage

 

[borski]

Some owners/moderators took the position that this is an "EPA Problem", not a Lucid problem.

It is. Lucid followed the EPA testing procedures.

Bit reality is:
> Lucid's claimed (EPA) range is not achievable under realistic highway roadtrip conditions. Yes, I am aware of the OoS 70mph test. The deviation (between Lucid's EPA claim) and my AGT is about 25-30% in moderate weather on multiple AZ/CA 780 mile roadtrips.

This is true for every single EV that uses the 5-cycle EPA test and for every single gas car.

> the suggestion that "ALL EVs have the same deviation vs their EPA rated ranges" is simply not true. Various reviewer testing suggest Lucid and Tesla deviate more than other EVs. Some EVs exceeded their EPA rated ranges.

The ones that exceed their stated range use the 2-cycle EPA test. Why are there two tests? Ask the EPA.

The ones that use the 2-cycle test don’t do it because it’s better or they’re more honest. They do it because it’s cheaper. The end.

> is the Lucid AGT still the leader in range? Probably, but barely....the range margin vs other EVs are MUCH smaller than you think in real life driving.

Not small. I get 100 miles over the next closest EV, even after a 20% loss. Source: I have multiple EVs.

> are there EVs that actually meet or exceed their rated EPA range? The answer is YES. I regularly drive the same route (I-10/I-5) from/to AZ to CA (780 miles) on my Lucid AGT and my Rivian R1S. The Lucid is about 25% off its EPA rated range and the Rivian meets and slightly exceeds (say 5-10%) of its rated range. As cited by other reviewers, some German EVs routinely exceed their EPA rated ranges. Not every EV is tested to the same EPA cycles as Lucid's.

Right. And this is because the EPA provides two different testing methodologies. This is dumb. But it isn’t Lucid’s fault.

> there is a new EPA testing cycle. I have not studied it and don't have an option. Other forum readers who are much smarter than I can weigh-in. Should Lucid revise its range/efficiency specs?

It already has. The 2025 ranges are different, plus they have made additional efficiency gains.

I won't repeat all the back-and forth of this topic. I'd suggest the interested readers go read this thread.

I

Thread 'Real world range touring 19 inch wheels'

May 11, 2024

Can anyone share real world range for touring with 19 inch wheels either from personal experience or link to a test ?
Thanks !

• ISOI
• Replies: 193
• Forum: Efficiency and Mileage

 

[hmp10]

Agreed, but really what else should Lucid advertise? “You’re never gonna actually see 512 miles, but hey, we can legally brag that our unrealistic mileage estimates are larger than everyone else can legally say theirs are!”

Exactly. I think people have to take into account what Lucid was confronting in deciding how to advertise its range. Although Peter Rawlinson constantly said that Lucid was aiming at the luxury German sedan market, he and everyone else knew that the Air would be instantly and widely compared to the Model S for two reasons: Rawlinson had engineered both cars, and Tesla had become synonymous in many consumers' minds with electric vehicles.

So Rawlinson had a choice: use the more conservative 2-cycle EPA testing protocol that most German manufacturers were using to publish ranges that more closely approximated what you would see in highway driving, or use the 5-cycle EPA protocol that Tesla used to produce a higher EPA rating but that fell further short than the 2-cycle method when it came to highway mileage.

To my mind, it would have been marketing malpractice not to choose the 5-cycle method that Tesla was using, because Lucid was going to be scored against Tesla in the minds of most buyers and a wide swath of the automotive press, anyway.

Bottom line . . . regardless of testing method, every single journalist who has done independent testing of the Lucid Air's range at highway speeds (both 70- and 75-mph tests) has found that it is the longest-range EV on the market, and by a considerable margin.

If you want the longest-range road-tripper in the world, buy a Lucid.

If you insist on having a car whose EPA range is what you'll see driving at sustained highway speeds, you might get close in a couple of German cars. But you're still going to be charging 100 miles earlier than you would have to in a Lucid.

 

[BS8899]

Exactly. I think people have to take into account what Lucid was confronting in deciding how to advertise its range. Although Peter Rawlinson constantly said that Lucid was aiming at the luxury German sedan market, he and everyone else knew that the Air would be instantly and widely compared to the Model S for two reasons: Rawlinson had engineered both cars, and Tesla had become synonymous in many consumers' minds with electric vehicles.

So Rawlinson had a choice: use the more conservative 2-cycle EPA testing protocol that most German manufacturers were using to publish ranges that more closely approximated what you would see in highway driving, or use the 5-cycle EPA protocol that Tesla used to produce a higher EPA rating but that fell further short than the 2-cycle method when it came to highway mileage.

To my mind, it would have been marketing malpractice not to choose the 5-cycle method that Tesla was using, because Lucid was going to be scored against Tesla in the minds of most buyers and a wide swath of the automotive press, anyway.

Bottom line . . . regardless of testing method, every single journalist who has done independent testing of the Lucid Air's range at highway speeds (both 70- and 75-mph tests) has found that it is the longest-range EV on the market, and by a considerable margin.

If you want the longest-range road-tripper in the world, buy a Lucid.

If you insist on having a car whose EPA range is what you'll see driving at sustained highway speeds, you might get close in a couple of German cars. But you're still going to be charging 100 miles earlier than you would have to in a Lucid.

The issue herein is not the marketing bragging rights. As you witness from several new Lucid owners, people are surprised by the magnitude of the deviation of the realizable range vs the advertised EPA range.

Obviously some manufacturers (e.g., the German EVs) took the high-road and used the more conservative 2 cycle, whilst Lucid decided to benchmark against Tesla.

Let's leave the marketing arena for a moment and ask the more practical questions:

> having already purchased a Lucid, as the new owner plans road trips, what should be his/her assumptions about the efficiency and realizable range?
> let's acknowledge that the realizable efficiency range is a complex amalgamation of many factors such as, speed, elevation change, temperature, wind, acceleration, regen, use/not-use of HA, cabin heating/cooling etc. etc.. Perhaps there is no simple formula, right?!
> if so, should Lucid say/do more of the following:
....the EPG range is likely an upper limit of efficiency when the vehicle is operated at moderate highway speed and under favorable climatic and driving conditions. Under actual driving conditions, your realizable efficiency and range can degrade by as much as 20-50%.
....your realizable efficiency (hence range) depends on many factors. In order to assist your trip planning, we provide the following metrologies:
>>>a trip planner that initially estimate and continues to updates your miles remaining at the end of your projected trip
>>>>a "real-time" (as in Rivian/Tesla) Efficiency Meter that informs the driver and enables you to optimize your tradeoff between speed and range.

All of these metrology are already in the car. No new hardware is needed to implement. All can be accomplished over OTA.

As a tangential issue, the recent I-90 surge outcome gave me a lot of pause RE: range and battery size as they manifest themselves in real-life road tripping.

Even without the drained battery/tow episode on the Lucid, the Lucid would have been beaten by the Taycan, which has lower range and battery size. Furthermore, the Lucid is likely to finish behind the Ionque and the Tesla 3, both have significantly lower range and smaller batteries.

So, marketing and battery size aside, I wonder how much the EPA range really matters once you can do more than 250 mile range!

 

[HariK]

Just a different perspective. How many of you want to stop before Lucid needs to charge? In my case it is max 3hrs and 70mph.