Air Version 2.9.0

[joec]

Great insights! Thank you! Did Air's future iterations get better based on the lessons learned so far? Also curious if you think a future model-year Air will be revised to simplify and follow a path similar to the midsize. I surely hope investment in the Air continues, as it is becoming one of the few options in this segment with Model S getting canned, for example. My 2024 Air Pure has been trouble-free, and we absolutely love it. I hope Lucid will find a way to keep the Air alive and make it more consistent. Very interested in your thoughts.

I don't know what Lucid has in store for the future of the Air.

I will repeat: I have no inside information on this matter.

I know what I'd like to see. And I know what would be smart from a business perspective. And those two things don't match.

What I'd love to see is a fully refreshed Air that shares its computer systems and wiring with Midsize, maybe even along with its screen layout. But otherwise, keep the size, the packaging, the incredible driving dynamics, the range, and the luxury of the current Air. Make it NACS while you're at it, and make sure it has Gravity's rear-motor up-voltage charging.

I'd like nothing more than to see exactly that, even if it's not for a few more years.

What would be smart from a business perspective, though, would be to discontinue the Air. Make the future all about Midsize.

Why? Because fixing what ails Air would essentially be a "clean-sheet" redesign. Maybe not quite that, but pretty close. Air is just too hard to build. Too hard to write software for. Too hard to maintain and service. So you'd have to start over. Otherwise, you are just kicking the can down the road, making slight improvements to a system that's never going to be easy or trouble-free.

A clean-sheet car costs about a billion dollars to develop. Lucid knows this. They've done it three times now.

Spending a billion dollars to sell maybe 6-10 thousand units a year best-case is not something you want to walk into a room and try to convince investors is a good idea.

Therefore, I think Air's days are numbered, unfortunately. It's the same reason why Model S was discontinued. And as much as I hated that decision, because the S was the one Tesla I actually thought was a good car, it was a smart business decision.

Where does that leave us Air enthusiasts?

Well, we'll get UX 3.0. We'll get a few more years of production in its current form, with maybe some minor improvements, color choices, etc. And we'll continue to get some ADAS improvements and other software fixes. But then once Midsize is well underway, I would not be surprised if the Air just gets quietly discontinued. It'll forever have a place in Lucid's heart, but it has no place in its profitable future.

That doesn't mean Lucid would be "abandoning" Air customers, by the way. This is just business. They'll support the Airs on the road for as long as is appropriate. They will just stop making new ones eventually.

Does that mean all hope is lost?

Well, here's my silver lining. Lucid does have the Midsize platform. And it is a platform. They already plan to make at least three different cars on that platform.

Why not a few more?

What if Lucid could make a midsize sedan? An M3 killer? An RS4 killer? Or maybe first a decent competitor to Model 3, and then add a "sport" version of that for people willing to pay?

This would not be a clean sheet. It would be a different body on an already well established platform. With almost zero overhead for new software. And an addressable market that's not huge, but is certainly bigger than Air's.

Spend a little more money. Sell a lot more cars. This makes business sense, perhaps? I don't know. I don't have the numbers in front of me.

But I could see that happening. Not for at least another four or five years. But it does make some sense.

I'd jump all over a super-high-end Midsize sedan. That's my dream Lucid, to be honest. Along with a roadster. (But that's another story.)

In the meantime, it's Gravity or Cosmos for me in the short term. Or one more Air before they let it go.

I'm sure Earth will be the best-seller. And Stay Tuned will likely be a niche off-roader. But if that niche proves successful, all the more reason to try a sedan next.

Or maybe I'm wrong, and an all-new Air will come along soon and blow all our minds? I wouldn't make that bet, though.

 

[tonybot]

I don't know what Lucid has in store for the future of the Air.

I will repeat: I have no inside information on this matter.

I know what I'd like to see. And I know what would be smart from a business perspective. And those two things don't match.

What I'd love to see is a fully refreshed Air that shares its computer systems and wiring with Midsize, maybe even along with its screen layout. But otherwise, keep the size, the packaging, the incredible driving dynamics, the range, and the luxury of the current Air. Make it NACS while you're at it, and make sure it has Gravity's rear-motor up-voltage charging.

I'd like nothing more than to see exactly that, even if it's not for a few more years.

What would be smart from a business perspective, though, would be to discontinue the Air. Make the future all about Midsize.

Why? Because fixing what ails Air would essentially be a "clean-sheet" redesign. Maybe not quite that, but pretty close. Air is just too hard to build. Too hard to write software for. Too hard to maintain and service. So you'd have to start over. Otherwise, you are just kicking the can down the road, making slight improvements to a system that's never going to be easy or trouble-free.

A clean-sheet car costs about a billion dollars to develop. Lucid knows this. They've done it three times now.

Spending a billion dollars to sell maybe 6-10 thousand units a year best-case is not something you want to walk into a room and try to convince investors is a good idea.

Therefore, I think Air's days are numbered, unfortunately. It's the same reason why Model S was discontinued. And as much as I hated that decision, because the S was the one Tesla I actually thought was a good car, it was a smart business decision.

Where does that leave us Air enthusiasts?

Well, we'll get UX 3.0. We'll get a few more years of production in its current form, with maybe some minor improvements, color choices, etc. And we'll continue to get some ADAS improvements and other software fixes. But then once Midsize is well underway, I would not be surprised if the Air just gets quietly discontinued. It'll forever have a place in Lucid's heart, but it has no place in its profitable future.

That doesn't mean Lucid would be "abandoning" Air customers, by the way. This is just business. They'll support the Airs on the road for as long as is appropriate. They will just stop making new ones eventually.

Does that mean all hope is lost?

Well, here's my silver lining. Lucid does have the Midsize platform. And it is a platform. They already plan to make at least three different cars on that platform.

Why not a few more?

What if Lucid could make a midsize sedan? An M3 killer? An RS4 killer? Or maybe first a decent competitor to Model 3, and then add a "sport" version of that for people willing to pay?

This would not be a clean sheet. It would be a different body on an already well established platform. With almost zero overhead for new software. And an addressable market that's not huge, but is certainly bigger than Air's.

Spend a little more money. Sell a lot more cars. This makes business sense, perhaps? I don't know. I don't have the numbers in front of me.

But I could see that happening. Not for at least another four or five years. But it does make some sense.

I'd jump all over a super-high-end Midsize sedan. That's my dream Lucid, to be honest. Along with a roadster. (But that's another story.)

In the meantime, it's Gravity or Cosmos for me in the short term. Or one more Air before they let it go.

I'm sure Earth will be the best-seller. And Stay Tuned will likely be a niche off-roader. But if that niche proves successful, all the more reason to try a sedan next.

Or maybe I'm wrong, and an all-new Air will come along soon and blow all our minds? I wouldn't make that bet, though.

In my opinion, you are spot on. Thanks for your sharing your thoughts!

 

[borski]

I don't know what Lucid has in store for the future of the Air.

I will repeat: I have no inside information on this matter.

I know what I'd like to see. And I know what would be smart from a business perspective. And those two things don't match.

What I'd love to see is a fully refreshed Air that shares its computer systems and wiring with Midsize, maybe even along with its screen layout. But otherwise, keep the size, the packaging, the incredible driving dynamics, the range, and the luxury of the current Air. Make it NACS while you're at it, and make sure it has Gravity's rear-motor up-voltage charging.

I'd like nothing more than to see exactly that, even if it's not for a few more years.

What would be smart from a business perspective, though, would be to discontinue the Air. Make the future all about Midsize.

Why? Because fixing what ails Air would essentially be a "clean-sheet" redesign. Maybe not quite that, but pretty close. Air is just too hard to build. Too hard to write software for. Too hard to maintain and service. So you'd have to start over. Otherwise, you are just kicking the can down the road, making slight improvements to a system that's never going to be easy or trouble-free.

A clean-sheet car costs about a billion dollars to develop. Lucid knows this. They've done it three times now.

Spending a billion dollars to sell maybe 6-10 thousand units a year best-case is not something you want to walk into a room and try to convince investors is a good idea.

Therefore, I think Air's days are numbered, unfortunately. It's the same reason why Model S was discontinued. And as much as I hated that decision, because the S was the one Tesla I actually thought was a good car, it was a smart business decision.

Where does that leave us Air enthusiasts?

Well, we'll get UX 3.0. We'll get a few more years of production in its current form, with maybe some minor improvements, color choices, etc. And we'll continue to get some ADAS improvements and other software fixes. But then once Midsize is well underway, I would not be surprised if the Air just gets quietly discontinued. It'll forever have a place in Lucid's heart, but it has no place in its profitable future.

That doesn't mean Lucid would be "abandoning" Air customers, by the way. This is just business. They'll support the Airs on the road for as long as is appropriate. They will just stop making new ones eventually.

Does that mean all hope is lost?

Well, here's my silver lining. Lucid does have the Midsize platform. And it is a platform. They already plan to make at least three different cars on that platform.

Why not a few more?

What if Lucid could make a midsize sedan? An M3 killer? An RS4 killer? Or maybe first a decent competitor to Model 3, and then add a "sport" version of that for people willing to pay?

This would not be a clean sheet. It would be a different body on an already well established platform. With almost zero overhead for new software. And an addressable market that's not huge, but is certainly bigger than Air's.

Spend a little more money. Sell a lot more cars. This makes business sense, perhaps? I don't know. I don't have the numbers in front of me.

But I could see that happening. Not for at least another four or five years. But it does make some sense.

I'd jump all over a super-high-end Midsize sedan. That's my dream Lucid, to be honest. Along with a roadster. (But that's another story.)

In the meantime, it's Gravity or Cosmos for me in the short term. Or one more Air before they let it go.

I'm sure Earth will be the best-seller. And Stay Tuned will likely be a niche off-roader. But if that niche proves successful, all the more reason to try a sedan next.

Or maybe I'm wrong, and an all-new Air will come along soon and blow all our minds? I wouldn't make that bet, though.

I agree with you. A midsize Sapphire would get me to sell my DE, probably.

 

[joec]

I agree with you. A midsize Sapphire would get me to sell my DE, probably.

Keeping the Sapphire brand, as Lucid's AMG, Audi's RS, BMW M, etc. makes perfect sense. So long as they offer it in colors other than blue, I'd be good with that.

If you're listening Lucid, that's two sales right there. Even if we're talking Air GT pricing here.

 

[MoniputerLM]

After the 2.9.0 update, and for the first time in a long time, I can get in my car and drive without one of several "daily" software issues. SiriusXM is working fairly well. ACC/HA is working fairly well and after more than 4 years of software hell I feel like I now have decent V1 production software. I look forward to some needed UI changes in V2.

 

[ironhideonline]

Got the 2.9.0 update last night in my 2023 AGT (Netherlands). Plugged it in to charge, scheduled the install during the night, installed without any issue. I’ll give it a drive later to see if there are any issues to report

So I’ve had the update for a few days. Everything on the car works great, the only issue I have faced is that the app battery drain had increase from 3-5% per day (with background activity being around 15-20 mins per day) up to almost 20% per day (with background activity being more than 16 hours per day). Since I don’t use passive unlock (I’m old fashioned, I just click the key), I don’t really need to run it in the background, so I turned of background refresh on the app, as well as disabling location services. I’ll have a look how that affects things, and I’ll report back once I have more.

 

[Truthlesshunter]

Apply this to literally every update Lucid has ever released.

Some people report it fixes things the update didn’t even address.

Some people swear it breaks things the update didn’t even address.

Some people report nothing feels any different.

Rinse and repeat.

The Air is a quirky piece of wiring. I’m convinced It’s never going to be consistent for all owners. Sometimes a simple reset will fix what ails you. Sometimes there’s a faulty component or a communication somewhere that fails and causes bizarre behavior for just a select few cars. And that fault is triggered incidentally by an update that wasn’t even changing anything related to that component.

This is what we refer to politely in the industry as “gremlins.” The Air has gremlins. Some more than others.

What can you do? It was their first attempt at making a car, and they got all the other details spot on. But the computer configuration (I’m talking the hardware here, not the software, which has been a long series of bandaids trying to address this mess since day one) is just never going to be fixable for every car in the fleet. It’s never going to get that one magic update that gets everything “just working” all of the sudden. That’s a pipe dream at this point. Let it go.

The sooner folks get that into their heads, the better off we’ll all be.

The Air will go down in history as being an engineering marvel, years ahead of its time, with a devoted small group of followers who loved it.

But man, was it an adventure to live with.

Lots of famous classic cars fit this description, come to think of it.

The best Lucid can hope is that they learned what to avoid with Midsize, and that they now have a hardware configuration and a platform that’s maintainable and consistent across the fleet. Time will tell.

If they got Midsize right, they can make any number of products on that platform and profit from it for years to come.

And it will be the lessons learned from shortcomings of the Air that made it possible.

I'll go one further...apply this to literally every update to nearly every car. If you have other car(s) that receive OTAs, this happens on every update, with varying degrees of success.

 

[goldengate]

So I’ve had the update for a few days. Everything on the car works great, the only issue I have faced is that the app battery drain had increase from 3-5% per day (with background activity being around 15-20 mins per day) up to almost 20% per day (with background activity being more than 16 hours per day). Since I don’t use passive unlock (I’m old fashioned, I just click the key), I don’t really need to run it in the background, so I turned of background refresh on the app, as well as disabling location services. I’ll have a look how that affects things, and I’ll report back once I have more.

To fix this, delete the app (assuming iPhone) and reinstall. The battery drain will return to normal on your phone. This also periodically happens with Instagram.

 

[WildRide47]

I agree with you. A midsize Sapphire would get me to sell my DE, probably.

Also agree. A midsize sapphire, I would put my order in today.

 

[smorvay]

So how long should we wait for 2.9.0 update before calling in? My car is attached to WiFi 16 hours a day, and I still haven't received the update.

 

[borski]

So how long should we wait for 2.9.0 update before calling in? My car is attached to WiFi 16 hours a day, and I still haven't received the update.

Feel free to contact customer care and ask them to push it to you. It’s been over a week or two, which is the usual “ask”

 

[smorvay]

Feel free to contact customer care and ask them to push it to you. It’s been over a week or two, which is the usual “ask"

I just called them, apparently they won't push an update any longer. :-(

 

[socktucker]

I just called them, apparently they won't push an update any longer. :-(

well don't wait more than 30 days then

 

[borski]

well don't wait more than 30 days then

30 days after the update is offered to you, not after announced. Also, please stay on topic.

 

[MorganB]

well don't wait more than 30 days then

That’s not a thing. Waiting for several months with an update available in your vehicle or ignoring outreach from lucid saying you must update by a certain date would be problematic. The 30 days is simply legalese. They haven’t been presented the update, nor have I for that matter.

The person that is having to pay for the TCU is in a different situation where the original owner ignored the updates and outreach from Lucid and once the car lost connection with the old update system it now shows up to date because there is no update available on the old update platform because it does not exist.

 

[Haggy]

Aside from installation, download and other things, there's not much talk about the update itself. I found that it did a good job with a lot of things, including ones that weren't explicitly mentioned. Things were considerably better for me after the prior update that added hands free, before which the car constantly claimed that it could not recognize that I was paying attention. After that update, it could recognize me if I tilted the steering wheel down so far that I couldn't read the top of the display. After this update, the car seems to be able to see me fine, even with the steering wheel in what I'd call a normal position.

Another big change is that it no longer penalizes me for looking in the side view mirrors before a lane change. It used to change the dashed lines to solid if I looked away long enough to see if things were clear. I can now make sure that things are clear and then turn on the signal.

The signal no longer stays on as long as it used to. It used to give me at least one extra blink, sometimes several. Now it might give one extra blink but more likely stops on time.

Lane changes are much more decisive and better overall.

Let's also not forget that cellular connectivity was supposed to be free for a limited time (first 12 months or something like that), yet Lucid still provides this for free. I haven't heard if they have changed course and are going to keep it free for Air/Gravity.

Tesla started off the same way and told me that they planned to charge for it eventually but still didn't have a firm answer. Eventually, they came up with something concrete and it went from "a sales person told me that maybe..." to "the app said that I have free connectivity until this date, after which..." For those who bought a car in the "a sales person might have mentioned" days, they kept it free for life.

Lucid is still in the "the sales person told me...or told somebody I knew, but I didn't get anything in writing with a cutoff date."

I would hope that Lucid would do something similar for early adopters who bought a car when the company needed it the most and who paid premium prices. They could decide to charge anyway, despite the ambiguity, and if they still allow full functionality with WiFi tethering, a lot of people might be fine with it.

Update was successful! I no longer own a brick.

If it could be updated, it wasn't bricked. I don't know where this trend of calling something bricked when it's merely temporarily inoperable came from, but if we refer to that as bricked, it doesn't leave a word for something that's actually bricked. A device, such as a phone, that fails during an update, and leaves it in a state that won't let anybody get to a state that allows an update to be installed is bricked. The device is effectively like a brick in that case because it can't be fixed. Nobody's car was bricked.

The way I see it, it’s when the car “announces” that the software is available for that specific car.

"Announced" is pretty vague. In the one situation when it actually mattered, Lucid did make a concerted effort to notify people. It's not the same as merely seeing a message on the phone or in the car. But in general, any ambiguity is on the maker, and that's Lucid. It's reasonable to say that you weren't notified if you didn't see a notification. If you don't normally use an app, you might not see one. Email doesn't always make it through. Things get lost in the mail. And some people leave their cars parked when they are out of town. But Lucid took a multi pronged approach. I wouldn't think that this would be a general problem, and unless they can say that your lack of action caused actual harm, and a repair is the result of the harm from the lack of your action, they aren't going to void any warranty.

I think that people who are worried about losing warranty coverage if they wait too long in general are reading too much into things. Lucid can't say that something failed for reasons unrelated to anything you did or didn't do, but they won't cover it based on what you did or didn't do.

 

[tmichael]

If it could be updated, it wasn't bricked. I don't know where this trend of calling something bricked when it's merely temporarily inoperable came from, but if we refer to that as bricked, it doesn't leave a word for something that's actually bricked. A device, such as a phone, that fails during an update, and leaves it in a state that won't let anybody get to a state that allows an update to be installed is bricked. The device is effectively like a brick in that case because it can't be fixed. Nobody's car was bricked.

Opinions are just that and we're all entitled to our own. I consider something bricked if it won't work without the company intervening. Apple phones are bricked when it is in a state the customer can't bring it out of, however Apple stores can often bring it back to life.

When the Air RWD Pure vehicles were unusable until Lucid intervened, I will continue to consider them "bricked". YMMV

 

[MorganB]

Opinions are just that and we're all entitled to our own. I consider something bricked if it won't work without the company intervening. Apple phones are bricked when it is in a state the customer can't bring it out of, however Apple stores can often bring it back to life.

When the Air RWD Pure vehicles were unusable until Lucid intervened, I will continue to consider them "bricked". YMMV

The cars didn’t need to be taken into Lucid however. They rolled out a fix in 24 hours. The comparison to a bricked phone from Apple that requires you to take it to the store would be the same as Lucid flatbedding the car to the service center. This would be similar to Apple pulling an update then creating a bug fix for those that installed it prior to it being pulled.

 

[mwscan]

Aside from installation, download and other things, there's not much talk about the update itself. I found that it did a good job with a lot of things, including ones that weren't explicitly mentioned. Things were considerably better for me after the prior update that added hands free, before which the car constantly claimed that it could not recognize that I was paying attention. After that update, it could recognize me if I tilted the steering wheel down so far that I couldn't read the top of the display. After this update, the car seems to be able to see me fine, even with the steering wheel in what I'd call a normal position.

Another big change is that it no longer penalizes me for looking in the side view mirrors before a lane change. It used to change the dashed lines to solid if I looked away long enough to see if things were clear. I can now make sure that things are clear and then turn on the signal.

The signal no longer stays on as long as it used to. It used to give me at least one extra blink, sometimes several. Now it might give one extra blink but more likely stops on time.

Lane changes are much more decisive and better overall.



Tesla started off the same way and told me that they planned to charge for it eventually but still didn't have a firm answer. Eventually, they came up with something concrete and it went from "a sales person told me that maybe..." to "the app said that I have free connectivity until this date, after which..." For those who bought a car in the "a sales person might have mentioned" days, they kept it free for life.

Lucid is still in the "the sales person told me...or told somebody I knew, but I didn't get anything in writing with a cutoff date."

I would hope that Lucid would do something similar for early adopters who bought a car when the company needed it the most and who paid premium prices. They could decide to charge anyway, despite the ambiguity, and if they still allow full functionality with WiFi tethering, a lot of people might be fine with it.


If it could be updated, it wasn't bricked. I don't know where this trend of calling something bricked when it's merely temporarily inoperable came from, but if we refer to that as bricked, it doesn't leave a word for something that's actually bricked. A device, such as a phone, that fails during an update, and leaves it in a state that won't let anybody get to a state that allows an update to be installed is bricked. The device is effectively like a brick in that case because it can't be fixed. Nobody's car was bricked.


"Announced" is pretty vague. In the one situation when it actually mattered, Lucid did make a concerted effort to notify people. It's not the same as merely seeing a message on the phone or in the car. But in general, any ambiguity is on the maker, and that's Lucid. It's reasonable to say that you weren't notified if you didn't see a notification. If you don't normally use an app, you might not see one. Email doesn't always make it through. Things get lost in the mail. And some people leave their cars parked when they are out of town. But Lucid took a multi pronged approach. I wouldn't think that this would be a general problem, and unless they can say that your lack of action caused actual harm, and a repair is the result of the harm from the lack of your action, they aren't going to void any warranty.

I think that people who are worried about losing warranty coverage if they wait too long in general are reading too much into things. Lucid can't say that something failed for reasons unrelated to anything you did or didn't do, but they won't cover it based on what you did or didn't do.

I put the word announced in quotes because I couldn’t think of a better word. It would’ve been better if I had said that when the update appears the specific car’s pilot panel as being available, that’s when I think the clock would start. But I also agreed at 30 days is legalese.

 

[mwscan]

Opinions are just that and we're all entitled to our own. I consider something bricked if it won't work without the company intervening. Apple phones are bricked when it is in a state the customer can't bring it out of, however Apple stores can often bring it back to life.

When the Air RWD Pure vehicles were unusable until Lucid intervened, I will continue to consider them "bricked". YMMV

I agree. If I want to go somewhere and the car won’t let me because it is incapable of moving, then its value as an automobile has been reduced to the value of a brick. It is very clearly stated and completely understood that the car is inoperable while it is being updated. Just as the phone is inoperable while it’s being updated. But in either case, the device should work after the update.