7500 EV tax credit update with new bill

[DeaneG]

Not a lot of straight up EVs that will still get the credit on that list. Way too many PHEVs, if you ask me. And cars like the Model 3 are only eligible at the base model. Few people don't go for the middle long-range models or the performance.

I'll bet the credit gets used on many more SUVs than sedans.

 

[joec]

I'll bet the credit gets used on many more SUVs than sedans.

Which makes sense, given the popularity of SUVs. But it also means higher average weight, and thus less efficiency. We're back to incentivizing the wrong thing again.

 

[Tesla2.0]

Found this chart on Reddit

View attachment 3836

Looks like GM and Tesla has more powerful lobbyists.

 

[LCIDdreams]

Looks like GM and Tesla has more powerful lobbyists.

The big unknowns for all of these are the battery materials sourcing and (maybe to a lesser degree) battery assembly. I have a feeling a lot of the “maybe/possibly” might not currently meet requirements so the eligible list could be a lot shorter.

 

[LCIDdreams]

Which makes sense, given the popularity of SUVs. But it also means higher average weight, and thus less efficiency. We're back to incentivizing the wrong thing again.

Right- take a perfectly good hatchback or wagon, beefen up & jack up suspension a couple inches, add bigger wheels and tires and suddenly the price cap increases by 45%.

Not sure what the logic is there. Maybe Ford made a smart move to get away from cars and go all in on trucks/SUVs a few years back.

 

[Yugi]

Looks like GM and Tesla has more powerful lobbyists.

Only Tesla Model 3 SR qualifies.

 

[joec]

Right- take a perfectly good hatchback or wagon, beefen up & jack up suspension a couple inches, add bigger wheels and tires and suddenly the price cap increases by 45%.

Not sure what the logic is there. Maybe Ford made a smart move to get away from cars and go all in on trucks/SUVs a few years back.

My guess is the legacy automakers had a lot of sway on this bill, and most of their EVs are SUVs. So why not throw a kick in the crotch to upstarts like Lucid? Even if that means letting Tesla back into the fold on the Y. (The majority of Model 3s still won't qualify, anyway.)

One thing we can be sure of, actually doing the best thing for the environment is not the main goal here. Or, I should say, it is for some folks, surely, but the only way to get it passed is to throw a bone to the big money donors.

 

[joec]

Only Tesla Model 3 SR qualifies.

The Y outsells the 3. And it will once again qualify with these new rules, as an SUV.

 

[noobzilla]

The Y outsells the 3. And it will once again qualify with these new rules, as an SUV.

Oh sweet! I didnt think Y was considered an SUV. Might tip me back to getting a Y instead.

 

[MadeInAZ]

Since these bills are often modified before being signed into law, it’s probably a good time for us to get in touch with our representatives. I’m in Arizona and I think our lawmakers would hate to see the car that’s made here lose its tax credit before getting anywhere near 200,000 in sales.

 

[joec]

Since these bills are often modified before being signed into law, it’s probably a good time for us to get in touch with our representatives. I’m in Arizona and I think our lawmakers would hate to see the car that’s made here lose its tax credit before getting anywhere near 200,000 in sales.

Kyrsten Sinema has specifically not publicly supported this bill as-is. I'd be shocked if Lucid doesn't have someone on the phone to her office pushing for changes to get the Lucid back into qualifying territory. Who knows if they will succeed, though. Can't hurt to call her office yourself, too, if you live in AZ.

As far as Colorado goes, Hickenlooper is rumored to be the one who helped bring Manchin back to the table on this one. I'm sure he doesn't want to see it get blown up. But I guess it can't hurt me to try, either.

 

[Rob Stark]

Looks like GM and Tesla has more powerful lobbyists.

Tesla asked its lobbyist to write legislation to exclude 3 of the 4 models it currently sells.

 

[joec]

Tesla asked its lobbyist to write legislation to exclude 3 of the 4 models it currently sells.

Well, in fairness, they currently have no models that are eligible. Having their best-seller back in the mix would be a huge win for them.

 

[Pragmatic]

Biggest lobbying was Telsa (for model Y), Ford (running low on credits), GM (out of credits) and Toyota (for hybrids and electrics since they were running out of credits.). I can see the price limits (voters get annoyed at their taxes subsidizing expensive vehicles) and the income limits (ditto the voters perceptions). I can't see giving more price leeway based on vehicle type (SUV or Sedan) nor as large a rebate for hybrids. But if the hybrids have a high enough minimum required all electric range, it may move a good number of miles to all electric. It will also allow households who are overly range concerned to try an electric vehicle without the range anxiiety.

 

[Yugi]

Well, in fairness, they currently have no models that are eligible. Having their best-seller back in the mix would be a huge win for them.

I am sure it benefits them, they might even increase the price a little bit to make it close to the max and profit as much as they can.

 

[Rob Stark]

Well, in fairness, they currently have no models that are eligible. Having their best-seller back in the mix would be a huge win for them.

It really isn't.

It is serendipity that Model Y and Lyriq align so Model Y gets the credit.

Especially when GM will have everything eligible save for premium trims of Silverado EV and Hummer EV . And obviously Celestiq.

Even base trim Hummers will have the credit. But not base Model 3 or long range Model 3.

 

[Rob Stark]

BTW It is a dereliction of duty if Sen Sinema and Sen Kelly of Arizona allow the only automaker in their State to go from having all their vehicles eligible for the credit to Zero.

 

[DJL]

Tesla asked its lobbyist to write legislation to exclude 3 of the 4 models it currently sells.

What is your source of this information? Sounds interesting.

 

[joec]

It really isn't.

It is serendipity that Model Y and Lyriq align so Model Y gets the credit.

Especially when GM will have everything eligible save for premium trims of Silverado EV and Hummer EV . And obviously Celestiq.

Even base trim Hummers will have the credit. But not base Model 3 or long range Model 3.

The model Y will outsell all of GMs EVs models combined, regardless. And base model 3 comes in under 55k. Not that many buy that. Lucid is the biggest loser here, by far.

 

[Rob Stark]

What is your source of this information? Sounds interesting.

Ha ha ha.

That is me being a sarcastic smartass.

Obviously, Tesla didn't ask Schumer and Manchin to exclude Model 3, Model S , and Model X from the Federal subsidy.