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Engineering Explained. This is bad.

fadooly said:
based on the info I am gather here and there

There is big software overhaul coming in less than 12 months for both cars to align with the mid size … this is speculation from my side

But what is not speculation is

I just met 4 days ago someone who actually saw the mid size and she told me that the car is shaping to be much better than air and gravity in every way … she said it is amazing 🤩 with her eyes glowing

And the design of the car is not a shrink down version of the gravity but a brand new design of its own with of course lucid DNA

in fact, she told me to skip the gravity all together and get the 3rd model
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If I slide you a dollar, can you tell me if this person could confirm a sapphire midsize?

Just kidding, unless... 🤣

But in all seriousness, if Lucid fixes their software for midsize and makes a sapphire hatchback, that would be my dream come true. Even outside of a sapphire, given that the bill of materials for midsize is meant to be lower, I wouldn't be surprised if they did a complete software overhaul for it.

If anything I hope all the learning from midsize can find their way back up to Air and Gravity, including a lower bill of materials and improved software.
 
Need4Sleep said:
Even outside of a sapphire, given that the bill of materials for midsize is meant to be lower, I wouldn't be surprised if they did a complete software overhaul for it.
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I really, REALLY hope you are wrong. Lucid haven't demonstrated that they can write decent software. Complete overhauls won't teach them how to do that. Fix what you have first, THEN you'll know how to make it better.

They did an overhaul once with the Gravity software? How did that go?
 
socktucker said:
Its too late though, they already whiffed the Gravity launch. Every single one seems to have problems. Reviews say it drives great but is poorly thought out and badly made.

...
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I dispute your summary of the reviews. I've been watching them closely since I have a Gravity on order. The consistent critique is the software is riddled with bugs. Beyond that, reviewers seem to like the design, and the hardware side of the car often gets rave reviews. The problem is that being riddled with bugs is a showstopper for most people.
 
Need4Sleep said:
If I slide you a dollar, can you tell me if this person could confirm a sapphire midsize?

Just kidding, unless... 🤣

But in all seriousness, if Lucid fixes their software for midsize and makes a sapphire hatchback, that would be my dream come true. Even outside of a sapphire, given that the bill of materials for midsize is meant to be lower, I wouldn't be surprised if they did a complete software overhaul for it.

If anything I hope all the learning from midsize can find their way back up to Air and Gravity, including a lower bill of materials and improved software.
Click to expand...
My sense is that the Gravity's software is intended to be a common platform for all their vehicles, and so hopefully software improvements for any Lucid model will usually be an improvement for all of them. But a BOM improvement of the level they've talked about for the mid-size vehicles is impossible to bring to the Air and Gravity without a complete redesign of the vehicles. Maybe the Air is getting old enough that they'll consider a massive revision after the mid-size launch is complete. Hard to see such a model update occurring before the 2029 model year Air. The Gravity design is presumably something that they'll stick with for significant number of years before spending the money to redesign and retool it.
 
Almost a million views in 2 days, 99% of comments hating on the car, company and management……great job Lucid management!

They will -probably lose couple of thousand sales if lucky…maybe 10k if unlucky…..
 
TahoeMichael said:
My sense is that the Gravity's software is intended to be a common platform for all their vehicles, and so hopefully software improvements for any Lucid model will usually be an improvement for all of them. But a BOM improvement of the level they've talked about for the mid-size vehicles is impossible to bring to the Air and Gravity without a complete redesign of the vehicles. Maybe the Air is getting old enough that they'll consider a massive revision after the mid-size launch is complete. Hard to see such a model update occurring before the 2029 model year Air. The Gravity design is presumably something that they'll stick with for significant number of years before spending the money to redesign and retool it.
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yeah I agree, I wouldn't be surprised if Air will get a complete ground-up redesign once midsize is done ramping up. Maybe even the Gravity could some some improvements given they use a similar LEAP architecture
 
tarator said:
I really, REALLY hope you are wrong. Lucid haven't demonstrated that they can write decent software. Complete overhauls won't teach them how to do that. Fix what you have first, THEN you'll know how to make it better.

They did an overhaul once with the Gravity software? How did that go?
Click to expand...
Developing software for a product that has two completely different BOMs is a nightmare, which is why I'm hoping that a the learnings of a lower BOM help set the groundwork for better software from the get-go.
 
TahoeMichael said:
I dispute your summary of the reviews. I've been watching them closely since I have a Gravity on order. The consistent critique is the software is riddled with bugs. Beyond that, reviewers seem to like the design, and the hardware side of the car often gets rave reviews. The problem is that being riddled with bugs is a showstopper for most people.
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I totally agree. I have read/watched virtually all of the Gravity reviews. Some may have some minor mechanical issues but the vast majority of them follow the same general finding of great hardware, solid design, fantastic driving dynamics but glitchy software. My personal experience with my Gravity is similar. If they can fix the software, Gravity is an absolute winner.
 
I've read through all 15 pages of this thread so far, and a few of the comments on Youtube. Well done to the forum members (99% of the posts here on this thread) who have maintained objectivity and have ignored the fanboys which basically seem to hijack any thread critical of our almighty car brand. It IS possible to love our cars and our car brand while ALSO admitting that the software is riddled with bugs, some of which have been around for years now. One of the most insightful posts was one of you suggesting that the programmers all be given fleet Lucids to drive - and experience. It was clear that Tesla did this early on as they not only fixed the big bugs, but also little things that only someone who drove the car would even notice or care about.

I think it's good news that this video has gotten so much attention. I don't know if this is a "will or skill" issue but hoping that Lucid has both the will and the skill to make this the #1 priority in the company. Vehicles, especially ones like this, are computers on wheels now, and it's not a valid excuse to say "early adopters will experience..." when some of the bugs are just so basic to the functionality of the vehicle. Lucid Motors needs to create a Manhattan Project internally to address this and give that team 90 days to fix the top 10 bugs, track against it, and publish revision notes to show us which bugs they are fixing. Let some of us click "early updates" option on our updates screen and provide feedback in real time on upcoming updates. That would likely prevent disasters like 2.8.7.

For the fanboys who defend any criticism of this brand, shame on you. We need to hold this company to a higher standard or there WON'T BE a Lucid Motors in 3 years. I truly wonder if some of you actually work for the company, but regardless, you're not doing the company any favors by blindly defending failure. If they can get this software issue fixed, there will be no stopping this brand because the cars are phenomenal.
 
Need4Sleep said:
Developing software for a product that has two completely different BOMs is a nightmare, which is why I'm hoping that a the learnings of a lower BOM help set the groundwork for better software from the get-go.
Click to expand...
And I am asking again, did that work when they did it for Gravity?
 
goldengate said:
I've read through all 15 pages of this thread so far, and a few of the comments on Youtube. Well done to the forum members (99% of the posts here on this thread) who have maintained objectivity and have ignored the fanboys which basically seem to hijack any thread critical of our almighty car brand. It IS possible to love our cars and our car brand while ALSO admitting that the software is riddled with bugs, some of which have been around for years now. One of the most insightful posts was one of you suggesting that the programmers all be given fleet Lucids to drive - and experience. It was clear that Tesla did this early on as they not only fixed the big bugs, but also little things that only someone who drove the car would even notice or care about.

I think it's good news that this video has gotten so much attention. I don't know if this is a "will or skill" issue but hoping that Lucid has both the will and the skill to make this the #1 priority in the company. Vehicles, especially ones like this, are computers on wheels now, and it's not a valid excuse to say "early adopters will experience..." when some of the bugs are just so basic to the functionality of the vehicle. Lucid Motors needs to create a Manhattan Project internally to address this and give that team 90 days to fix the top 10 bugs, track against it, and publish revision notes to show us which bugs they are fixing. Let some of us click "early updates" option on our updates screen and provide feedback in real time on upcoming updates. That would likely prevent disasters like 2.8.7.

For the fanboys who defend any criticism of this brand, shame on you. We need to hold this company to a higher standard or there WON'T BE a Lucid Motors in 3 years. I truly wonder if some of you actually work for the company, but regardless, you're not doing the company any favors by blindly defending failure. If they can get this software issue fixed, there will be no stopping this brand because the cars are phenomenal.
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You know you can make your point without calling anybody name (fanboys), right?
 
I do not mean to argue against myself (post above) but I did laugh out loud as I read this thread on the Rivian forum... my friend just bought a Rivian so it will be interesting to compare.


"I've really hit my wall with the Rivian software.

I don't care about the Carplay arguments. I like Carplay and I understand why it's not a perfect fit for Rivian. This isn't about that.

There's no reason in late 2025 for a car that has been in production for a few years now to continue to have these basic software problems. This morning I get in my R1S and all of my Sirius favorites are gone - no history, no favorites, nothing.

things like this happen all the time. The car will forget my contacts. I'll have to reconnect a bluetooth device. It will log out of audio services. The maps will lock up and I can't enter a destination on the screen.

Stuff like this over and over and over and over. Why am I rebooting a car like it's Windows XP?

Fucking fix your shit Wassym or the folks at Rivian need a new software lead dev. Instead of a Gary that changes faces in the energy screen, how about audio that actually works when I start the car? Or how about stopping the random "internet connection slow" disconnections when I'm in the middle of a city with full cellular signal?

I'm not asking for new services like FSD, or super deluxe hands free driving, or any of that. I'm just asking for the most basic of shit that is supposed to work to actually work.

/rant"

Full thread here... https://www.rivianforums.com/forum/threads/just-fix-the-software.51303/
 
fadooly said:
I just met 4 days ago someone who actually saw the mid size and she told me that the car is shaping to be much better than air and gravity in every way … she said it is amazing 🤩 with her eyes glowing
Click to expand...
The midsize is going to be running the same software stack as Gravity according to the Savage Geese video. I’m sure just like the Gravity the major issues won’t be with build quality or driving ability but if they deliver the same software woes they rolled out with Gravity it will doom Lucid.
 
goldengate said:
I do not mean to argue against myself (post above) but I did laugh out loud as I read this thread on the Rivian forum... my friend just bought a Rivian so it will be interesting to compare.


"I've really hit my wall with the Rivian software.

I don't care about the Carplay arguments. I like Carplay and I understand why it's not a perfect fit for Rivian. This isn't about that.

There's no reason in late 2025 for a car that has been in production for a few years now to continue to have these basic software problems. This morning I get in my R1S and all of my Sirius favorites are gone - no history, no favorites, nothing.

things like this happen all the time. The car will forget my contacts. I'll have to reconnect a bluetooth device. It will log out of audio services. The maps will lock up and I can't enter a destination on the screen.

Stuff like this over and over and over and over. Why am I rebooting a car like it's Windows XP?

Fucking fix your shit Wassym or the folks at Rivian need a new software lead dev. Instead of a Gary that changes faces in the energy screen, how about audio that actually works when I start the car? Or how about stopping the random "internet connection slow" disconnections when I'm in the middle of a city with full cellular signal?

I'm not asking for new services like FSD, or super deluxe hands free driving, or any of that. I'm just asking for the most basic of shit that is supposed to work to actually work.

/rant"

Full thread here... https://www.rivianforums.com/forum/threads/just-fix-the-software.51303/
Click to expand...
Yeah, but that doesn’t mean Lucid can deliver crappy software as well. Rivian has a better branding and more known. Lucid midsize is also a year behind Rivian. Lucid needs to up its game , or they will be in very big trouble next year and even midsize won’t save the company.
 
I can’t believe Lucid executives thought bad software is ok! I’m sure these issues came up in testing. And the Air has been out 4 years- every car should be almost perfect!
 
fadooly said:
based on the info I am gather here and there

There is big software overhaul coming in less than 12 months for both cars to align with the mid size … this is speculation from my side

But what is not speculation is

I just met 4 days ago someone who actually saw the mid size and she told me that the car is shaping to be much better than air and gravity in every way … she said it is amazing 🤩 with her eyes glowing

And the design of the car is not a shrink down version of the gravity but a brand new design of its own with of course lucid DNA

in fact, she told me to skip the gravity all together and get the 3rd model
Click to expand...
Lucid has many speculations and they didnt deliver on time what they promised.. no V2H, no dashcam stuff as they announced and bugs fixes and the list goes…
 
HC_79 said:
The midsize is going to be running the same software stack as Gravity according to the Savage Geese video. I’m sure just like the Gravity the major issues won’t be with build quality or driving ability but if they deliver the same software woes they rolled out with Gravity it will doom Lucid.
Click to expand...
I read this as good news for the Gravity. Last thing we want is an orphaned stack that they let flounder while they focus on their volume model. This should force them to live or die based on getting this right.

Providing the result isn't "die", of course.
 
tarator said:
And I am asking again, did that work when they did it for Gravity?
Click to expand...
Gravity has a significant BOM difference to midsize, and I'd bet it has an even higher BOM compared to Air
 
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