Heat Pump Technology

[tjhappel]

I am basing this on several tech-related articles I read back when Tesla switched to heat pumps in the Model 3’s, combined with having access to and regularly driving both a pre and post heat pump Model 3 (mine was pre and my dad’s was post) so, yes, some of this is conjecture, certainly for the Air. That said, I am averaging 3.88 miles / kWh in my 25 AGT over its first 500 miles and that includes lots of time in low 30’s temps and rain. In the one day I was able to drive on dry roads and 50+ degree temps, I averaged over 5 miles / kWh…

And we do know that the 2025’s are more efficient than earlier models. Although there are multiple reasons for that, the heat pump is supposedly the single most important.

That’s huge numbers that I’ll never see. Best case if I drive super slow would maybe approach 3.8

 

[Amster]

The heat pump is only in Airs 2024 and newer, right? I was talking to one of the sales guys at the Lucid Studio in San Diego last night, and he said all the GTs had a heat pump, even my 2022. I told him I didn't think so.

 

[Pragmatic]

I believe it's 2024 GT and Sapphires, and later production 2025 Touring.

 

[Blue Lectroid]

The heat pump is only in Airs 2024 and newer, right? I was talking to one of the sales guys at the Lucid Studio in San Diego last night, and he said all the GTs had a heat pump, even my 2022. I told him I didn't think so.

Pretty sure the GT got the heat pump in 2024 (NOT the Touring or Pure) and then ALL in 2025. I am not, however, certain about the 2024 GT. That MAY have still been resistive heat.

 

[Steveinarizona]

That is NOT the heat pump that heats / cools the car. That is purely the pump that circulates coolant through the inverter IIRC from Eric Bach’s Tech Talk in Inverters…

In the Scottsdale Fashion Mall where Lucid has its Phoenix area showroom, Tesla also has a showroom and the Tesla showroom has its heat pump on display in the window. It is a much more substantial unit.

 

[Adnillien]

Pretty sure the GT got the heat pump in 2024 (NOT the Touring or Pure) and then ALL in 2025. I am not, however, certain about the 2024 GT. That MAY have still been resistive heat.

This is correct.

 

[Pragmatic]

So is this thread incorrect?

Thread 'Early production 2025 Air Pures without DDPremium standard -- and some with no heat pumps?'

Oct 8, 2024

In prepping for my 2nd visit to my regional Studio, I called the national Lucid sales line to run through a few preliminary questions. While browsing and mocking up some 2025 Air Pure packages and lease duration options, I'd noticed that sometimes (fairly often) the "Available Cars" showing up had simply DreamDrive listed as among its features, rather than DreamDrive Premium, which is now standard on new '25 car orders. When I asked about this -- with the stated assumption that the description must just be wrong -- the sales associate on the phone confirmed that early production 2025s...

• jedwin
• Replies: 2
• Forum: Ordering / Pricing / Production / Delivery

• 

 

[Grewsome]

One of my biggest Lucid regrets is not waiting for the 2025 model year to get the heat pump. Seeing range loss of 40-50% in colder weather.

I wouldn't feel regrets if I were you.

I've only had my 2025 touring (with heat pump) since November, so I can't compare to warm weather, but what I can say is I use about 10% of the battery to go 22 miles. That is way lower than estimated range. I know that I can't expect to get epa range in the real world, but wondering if it will be better once warmer weather hits.

However, the only issue I have had with the car so far is related to the heat pump. It doesn't get the car very warm in very cold weather and I would assume a resistive heater would work better. This morning it was 1 degree F on my drive in. In spite of me preheating the car and putting on max heat, 30 minutes into the ride, I'm still seeing my breath.

 

[uieo563]

I wouldn't feel regrets if I were you.

I've only had my 2025 touring (with heat pump) since November, so I can't compare to warm weather, but what I can say is I use about 10% of the battery to go 22 miles. That is way lower than estimated range. I know that I can't expect to get epa range in the real world, but wondering if it will be better once warmer weather hits.

However, the only issue I have had with the car so far is related to the heat pump. It doesn't get the car very warm in very cold weather and I would assume a resistive heater would work better. This morning it was 1 degree F on my drive in. In spite of me preheating the car and putting on max heat, 30 minutes into the ride, I'm still seeing my breath.

Any better luck the rest of the week in the cold weather?

I've seen a few anecdotes now about the heat pump cars not able to provide adequate heat in the cold weather. I've been staring at a 25' GT but that's going to be a hard sell to the wife if it can't keep the cabin at 68-70 degrees in the winter when the temps drop into the single digits.

 

[larrycpa]

Any better luck the rest of the week in the cold weather?

I've seen a few anecdotes now about the heat pump cars not able to provide adequate heat in the cold weather. I've been staring at a 25' GT but that's going to be a hard sell to the wife if it can't keep the cabin at 68-70 degrees in the winter when the temps drop into the single digits.

The seat heat helps a lot

 

[uieo563]

The seat heat helps a lot

Seat heat, unfortunately, doesn't help a whole lot with young kids in car seats. To be blunt: it would be ridiculous to accept that you have to be completely bundled up because a car that costs 6 figures can't maintain heat and a huge regression from the older heating model. I'm hoping it's a firmware issue, or Grewsome discovered it was a one-off.

 

[Grewsome]

Any better luck the rest of the week in the cold weather?

I've seen a few anecdotes now about the heat pump cars not able to provide adequate heat in the cold weather. I've been staring at a 25' GT but that's going to be a hard sell to the wife if it can't keep the cabin at 68-70 degrees in the winter when the temps drop into the single digits.

Some days it works after 30 to 45 minutes. Other days not at all. Yesterday I couldn't get it the defroster warm enough to melt the ice on my windshield that was accumulating as I was driving.

But i think mine is defective and not just poor design. Twice now after a long time of cold air, I hear a crunch under the car and then all of a sudden the heat is working great. Have to turn it down from 86. I have a service appr next week. I'll let you know what they say.

 

[Blue Lectroid]

Some days it works after 30 to 45 minutes. Other days not at all. Yesterday I couldn't get it the defroster warm enough to melt the ice on my windshield that was accumulating as I was driving.

But i think mine is defective and not just poor design. Twice now after a long time of cold air, I hear a crunch under the car and then all of a sudden the heat is working great. Have to turn it down from 86. I have a service appr next week. I'll let you know what they say.

Absolutely is a problem with your heat pump. I can bake myself in my car if I turn the heat up to high…good luck!

 

[ColonelBadger]

Some days it works after 30 to 45 minutes. Other days not at all. Yesterday I couldn't get it the defroster warm enough to melt the ice on my windshield that was accumulating as I was driving.

But i think mine is defective and not just poor design. Twice now after a long time of cold air, I hear a crunch under the car and then all of a sudden the heat is working great. Have to turn it down from 86. I have a service appr next week. I'll let you know what they say.

Is there not an auxiliary heat (resistive heat) that kicks in at really low teams? A heat pump can't produce heat at really low temps, no matter how good it is. Houses have an auxiliary heater that kicks in to help. Doesn't the Air have that?

 

[Blue Lectroid]

Is there not an auxiliary heat (resistive heat) that kicks in at really low teams? A heat pump can't produce heat at really low temps, no matter how good it is. Houses have an auxiliary heater that kicks in to help. Doesn't the Air have that?

Modern heat pump technology can produce heat down as low as -20 to -30 degrees F. That said, they get much less efficient at those temperatures and I have no idea what the specs are for the heat pump Lucid uses or whether they also have an additional resistive heat back-up / auxiliary system.

 

[Adnillien]

Some days it works after 30 to 45 minutes. Other days not at all. Yesterday I couldn't get it the defroster warm enough to melt the ice on my windshield that was accumulating as I was driving.

But i think mine is defective and not just poor design. Twice now after a long time of cold air, I hear a crunch under the car and then all of a sudden the heat is working great. Have to turn it down from 86. I have a service appr next week. I'll let you know what they say.

It sounds like the deicer on the evaporator is not working. When the ice falls off, the heat pump begins to work again.

 

[Grewsome]

It sounds like the deicer on the evaporator is not working. When the ice falls off, the heat pump begins to work agan

I agree it sounds something like that. But my garage is usually not below freezing, so I'm not sure why it's a problem in the morning when the car has been in the garage all night.

 

[Adnillien]

I agree it sounds something like that. But my garage is usually not below freezing, so I'm not sure why it's a problem in the morning when the car has been in the garage all night.

The evaporator will be significantly colder than the outside air but I would not expect it to ice up very fast. It may well be some other issue.

 

[uieo563]

Some days it works after 30 to 45 minutes. Other days not at all. Yesterday I couldn't get it the defroster warm enough to melt the ice on my windshield that was accumulating as I was driving.

But i think mine is defective and not just poor design. Twice now after a long time of cold air, I hear a crunch under the car and then all of a sudden the heat is working great. Have to turn it down from 86. I have a service appr next week. I'll let you know what they say.

Thank you for following up! I'll be interested to hear what service has to say.

 

[FurryOne]

However, the only issue I have had with the car so far is related to the heat pump. It doesn't get the car very warm in very cold weather and I would assume a resistive heater would work better. This morning it was 1 degree F on my drive in. In spite of me preheating the car and putting on max heat, 30 minutes into the ride, I'm still seeing my breath.

I've been looking for Lucid to explain their Heat Pump technology - possibly in one of their tech videos. My questions would be "are they using inverter tech?" and "what about vapor injection tech?" - both cutting edge for heat pumps. Also the F type used.

While we're not likely to see a Lucid resistive vs heat pump test anytime soon, Out of Spec did a comparison in Model 3's that can be found here: